Topic: Retiring my iPod....... (Read 52585 times)

GuitRdone · « **on:** October 03, 2015, 05:36:19 pm »

I've decided to *stop* partying like it's 1999! The iPod must GO!

I need to get a highly portable machine to run MC20... well I think. And I need suggestions. Think middle seat on an airplane kind of portable.

And it's not going to be my JRiver ID (a NUC). There's no battery! I don't think it should be a raspberry like device either, since you would have to tote around a screen and IO devices. I'm thinking self-contained-- a tablet!

I have some Polk earbuds that I like, a nice iFi Nano USB DAC, and a USB drive full of hi-rez. So by my calculations I need a device that has 2 USB ports. That leaves out my iPad 2 and my Kindle Fire HD, which I don't think can run MC20 anyway.

JRiver says they recommend an i5 with 4GB RAM, and I don't see those specs in the new crop of cheap Windows tablets (most have Atom processors and 2GB RAM). Might be nice if I could check my email with it, or watch a video too, but I'm not looking for a desktop replacement here. Ultra portable is the goal.

If you have any suggestions I would appreciate your input very much!

GuitRdone · « **Reply #1 on:** October 03, 2015, 08:29:30 pm »

Has anyone tried an ASUS transformer with MC20?

http://www.amazon.com/Asus-Transformer-10-1-inch-Detachable-Keyboard/dp/B00PHIWOAO/ref=sr_1_18?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1443915883&sr=1-18&keywords=asus+tablet

ferday · « **Reply #2 on:** October 04, 2015, 01:48:44 pm »

The most impressed I've ever been with a tablet sized device is the surface pro but it's too much $ for me

The Lenovo miix and dell xps are supposedly surface-killers, the Lenovo is a lot cheaper don't know about the dell

I think the next couple years are going to finally bring the true "laptop tablet" but IMO it's not there yet

GuitRdone · « **Reply #3 on:** October 04, 2015, 10:11:49 pm »

Thanks, Ferday.

I agree that the laptop killer remains to be produced, but the more expensive machines are getting closer all the time. i5 and i7 tablets with keyboard docks that come with 8GB RAM and 128 and 256 SSDs are below $1k now.

I think the ASUS I posted about will do everything else I might want to do with the device, so I'm very interested to know if anyone has tried to use a similar Atom / 2GB device to run MC with a USB DAC and a USB media archive.

Let me know what you think.

blgentry · « **Reply #4 on:** October 05, 2015, 10:30:24 am »

You seem to have conflicting requirements. On the one hand you want it to be small, but you don't want to have it in multiple pieces (like the Pi). But then you say you want to use a portable drive and an external DAC. You mention touch screen also. But native MC (on Windows or Mac) isn't touch optimized. Which means you really want a tablet running JRemote. Which brings us back to multiple devices!

I think these two configurations are worth considering:

1. Pi2 in a custom enclosure, with your drive and DAC integrated into the enclosure. So it's all one "brick". Plug in headphones and it's ready. Add a medium sized tablet running JRemote, Gizmo, EOS (or another) remote app, and you're set.
2. Macbook Air 11", used or refurbished. All in one. Pretty much the same size as the tablet/laptop you posted. It's got a real screen, a touch pad, USB ports, and a headphone out.

Just my thoughts.

Brian.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #5 on:** October 05, 2015, 03:49:41 pm »

Ya, good catch. Not touch optimized. And I just assume that everything IS touch enabled anymore!

But the ASUS transfomer DOES come with a keyboard and touchpad. Wouldn't that do the trick?

Could I run MC on it but controlled it with jremote, like, with my phone? Is there a touch remote for windows?

RoderickGI · « **Reply #6 on:** October 05, 2015, 05:40:54 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 05, 2015, 03:49:41 pm

Is there a touch remote for windows?

The list of available remotes is here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=67831.0

There are three windows Phone remotes in total, but two look to almost be abandonware, MC Remote and mcEffect.

This is the only reference to a Windows Remote I'm aware of: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=87522.msg689024#msg689024

Though I think Jim included it in his future possible plans for MC.

So one remote that has commenced development, converting from Windows Phone, and a vague idea of future plans. Plus of course just using Web Gizmo, or MC on a Windows tablet run as TRemote (which is just a normal MC Client).

For a touch remote for Windows, it looks like nMedium will be the first to deliver.

beats_works · « **Reply #7 on:** October 05, 2015, 08:04:26 pm »

Seems like you would be much better off with something like the Fiio X5(Gen 2) and simply using JRiver to sync it for on-the-go listening. As a plus it can operate as a USB DAC so you can play everything from MC via the x5 and apply any DSP before syncing. X5 + E12 is pretty darn satisfying

I've tried several tablets as media server for my car with external DAC and it was ultimately more frustrating then just using a purpose built device.

FYI:

http://www.amazon.com/Generation-Resolution-Player-Titanium-NEWEST/dp/B00ZWAC25E/?ie=UTF8

All new digital audio architecture: JZ4760B + SA2000 + PCM1792A + PGA2311A. Native DSD64/128 support and SACD ISOs.
High gain reaches 14V (+/-7V), 40% higher than the 1st gen X5, putting the op amps in their best working range, greatly increasing dynamics.
Top shelf PCM1792A from Texas Instrument coupled with new OPA1652 gives great dynamic performance
The X5-II makes use of two crystal oscillators, one each for the 44.1kHz and 48kHz frequency multiples.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #8 on:** October 06, 2015, 09:48:11 pm »

Thanks for your suggestions!

I see the Windows remotes are designed for phones. Not sure how it might play on a Windows tablet. I was planning on running a touch remote on the same machine that I have MC on. Just a work-around until MC itself is "touchable".

The FiiO is a marvelous device! Very tempting! But max storage would only be about 1/6 of what I will have after resampling my CDs. And I expect I won't stop adding to it!

I keep coming back to a tablet/keyboard combo or an ultrabook to run my USB stuff. Not as portable as an iPod or a FiiO, but a more versatile solution that would not require me to carry another computer. And storage would be effectively unlimited.

I'm very interested to see if anyone has tried MC on one of the new crop of 2GB Atom based computers. If that just isn't a practical platform for MC, I've got this new version of a Click 2 Pro I'm ~~looking~~ drooling at!

Thanks again!

beats_works · « **Reply #9 on:** October 06, 2015, 10:24:00 pm »

Well - your solution was announced today but it's $1500

http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/devices/surface-book

GuitRdone · « **Reply #10 on:** October 08, 2015, 12:49:32 pm »

Microsoft is an Apple wannabe. They want Apple's short technology refresh cycles, like the fact that there is a new iOS every other week and a new iPhone every year, and they want way more money for their devices than should be charged. I'm a pro IT guy, and I don't know anyone who has a Surface. I'm sure that the Surface Book is a nice computer, but I didn't buy a gold plated Apple Watch, either. What utter DREK!

The Toshiba P35W-B3226 Click 2 Pro, at $700, is a comparable machine at less than half the price:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RWKR6O4?colid=35Q0DJ3L429LD&coliid=I33OHF4CEBAIOV&ref_=wl_it_dp_o_pd_S_ttl

But I wonder if I even need to spend that much. The refurbished ASUS transformer that I previously posted a link for is $225. A number of factors make this a viable machine for most needs:

1. You can get a free upgrade to Win 10.
2. If you are an Office 365 subscriber, you can stream Office to just about anything, including a transformer.
3. If you have USB 3 throughput, you can use a port replicator or "dock" to run the machine as a full desktop productivity machine.
4. Even USB 2 can support huge media libraries, effectively providing unlimited local storage. Sorry, iPad.
5. Being a Windows machine, it will (probably) run MC and can support a USB DAC.
6. Browse, stream audio or video, and work. So there's really no need for another computer.

The last question I have is whether the Atom processor and 2GB RAM is enough. If no one at JRiver and no one on the forum knows, I think I will do a live-in, long-term, hands-on test of this type of machine at my local Best Buy and report back to the forum.

Does anyone know the answer?

Thanks again to everyone who has chimed in!

blgentry · « **Reply #11 on:** October 08, 2015, 03:04:27 pm »

If you have the ability to do so, what you would want to do is run the JRiver benchmark on the machine in question. Help > Benchmark.

I don't know what the low water mark is, but I see posts all the time of benchmark numbers starting around 1500 or so that seem to give acceptable performance. Numbers below 1000 are often said to be questionable for transcoding high bitrate files and/or DSD.

Run the benchmark on a machine you use MC21 on all the time and that will give you some idea of how powerful your main machine is by comparison to the one you are targeting.

Brian.

beats_works · « **Reply #12 on:** October 08, 2015, 03:31:00 pm »

Quote from: blgentry on October 08, 2015, 03:04:27 pm

If you have the ability to do so, what you would want to do is run the JRiver benchmark on the machine in question. Help > Benchmark.

I don't know what the low water mark is, but I see posts all the time of benchmark numbers starting around 1500 or so that seem to give acceptable performance. Numbers below 1000 are often said to be questionable for transcoding high bitrate files and/or DSD.

Run the benchmark on a machine you use MC21 on all the time and that will give you some idea of how powerful your main machine is by comparison to the one you are targeting.

Brian.

I have Asus Transformer and can run benchmark. With low-mid tablets my experience has been:

1) 2 Gig of RAM is just not adequate for multi-tasking programs meant for desktop and not tablet optimized apps. So yes you can optimize what's running but don't have visions of bouncing between MC and other apps without lag as Swap File is accessed.
2) DAC recognition and staying connected is a bit flaky with tablet chipset drivers, power configuration needed to get reasonable usage out of battery etc.

Gimme a few to load and run ....

beats_works · « **Reply #13 on:** October 08, 2015, 05:30:26 pm »

End of Benchmark showed Score of 1025 but System summary shows JRMark: 938 (version 21.0.6) ??

Sorry I'm not seeing "Spoiler" function to condense Log below.

Code: [Select]

__________________________________
Library

    Total files: 0

    Audio files: 0

    Image files: 0

    Video files: 0

    Other files: 0

Processing

    Thumbnails built: 0% (0 of 0)

    Audio analyzed: 0% (0 of 0)

Background Tools Running

    No tools currently running

Power

    No entries that affect the system power state

Media Center

    Version: 21.0.6

    Install path: C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 21\

    Interface plug-ins: Interface Plugins: TiVo Server (not running)

    JRMark: 938 (version 21.0.6)

    Memory used: 26.8 MB memory

    Handles used: 333 handles

Advanced System Info

    Memory & CPU

        CPU features: MMX, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, SSE4.1

        Free Physical Memory: 592 MB

        Total Memory: 1.9 GB

    Operating System

        Microsoft Windows 10 32-bit

    Audio inputs and outputs

        JRiver Media Center 21 (JRiver Media Center 21) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microphone (Intel SST Audio Device (WDM)) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Speakers (Intel SST Audio Device (WDM)) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Battery

        Microsoft AC Adapter (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Bluetooth

        Bluetooth Radio (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

    Computer

        ACPI x86-based PC (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Serial IO DMA Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Serial IO DMA Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    DiskDrive

        Generic SA16G SD Card (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Hynix HBG4e (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Display

        Intel(R) HD Graphics (driver 10.18.10.4276)

    Firmware

        System Firmware (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    HIDClass

        GPIO Buttons Driver (driver 10.0.10240.16425)

        GPIO Laptop or Slate Indicator Driver (driver 10.0.10240.16425)

        HID-compliant consumer control device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant consumer control device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant system controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant system controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant touch screen (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant vendor-defined device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant vendor-defined device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant vendor-defined device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID-compliant wireless radio controls (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        I2C HID Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Sideband GPIO Buttons Injection Device (driver 10.0.10240.16425)

        USB Input Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        USB Input Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        USB Input Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Image

        EPSON41D507 (WF-3640 Series) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Imaging Signal Processor 2400 (driver 603.9600.1948.31252)

    Keyboard

        HID Keyboard Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        HID Keyboard Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    MEDIA

        Intel SST Audio Device (WDM) (driver 603.9600.1948.40494)

        JRiver Media Center 21 (driver 21.0.6.0)

        Realtek I2S Audio Codec (driver 6.4.10041.4257)

    Monitors

        Generic PnP Monitor (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Mouse

        ASUS Touchpad (driver 8.0.0.17)

    Net

        Broadcom 802.11abgn Wireless SDIO Adapter (driver 5.93.103.4)

    Print queues

        EPSON41D507 (WF-3640 Series) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Fax (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Print to PDF (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft XPS Document Writer (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Root Print Queue (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Send To OneNote 16 (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Printer

        EPSON Universal Print Driver (driver 2.60.0.0)

    Processors

        Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU  Z3735F @ 1.33GHz (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU  Z3735F @ 1.33GHz (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU  Z3735F @ 1.33GHz (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU  Z3735F @ 1.33GHz (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    SCSIAdapter

        Microsoft Storage Spaces Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        SD Storage Class Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        SD Storage Class Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    SDHost

        Intel SD Host Controller (deprecated) (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

        Intel SD Host Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

        Intel SD Host Controller (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

    SecurityDevices

        Trusted Platform Module 2.0 (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Sensor

        Broadcom GNSS 4752 Geolocation Sensor (driver 20.23.2393.18)

        Capella Micro CM3218x Ambient Light Sensor (driver 1.1.6.0)

        InvenSense Sensor Collection (driver 84.86.1.19)

        Sdo Sensor V2 (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    Software devices

        Bluetooth (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        EPSON41D507 (WF-3640 Series) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Lightweight Sensors Root Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Device Association Root Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft IPv4 IPv6 Transition Adapter Bus (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Radio Device Enumeration Bus (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Wi-Fi (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    System

        ACPI Lid (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        ACPI Processor Aggregator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        ACPI Sleep Button (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        ACPI Thermal Zone (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        ASUS Wireless Radio Control (driver 1.0.0.4)

        bcmfn2 Device (driver 5.93.103.4)

        bcmfn2 Device (driver 5.93.103.4)

        Broadcom GNSS Bus Driver - 4752 (driver 20.23.2393.18)

        Broadcom Serial Bus Driver over UART Bus Enumerator (driver 12.0.1.530)

        Camera Sensor MT9M114 (driver 603.9600.1948.31252)

        Composite Bus Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        GPIO Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.30590)

        GPIO Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.30590)

        GPIO Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.30590)

        GpioVirtual Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.30590)

        High precision event timer (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        I2C Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.29470)

        I2C Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.29470)

        I2C Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.29470)

        I2C Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.29470)

        I2C Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.29470)

        Intel(R) Atom(TM)/Celeron(R)/Pentium(R) Processor Platform Control Unit - LPC: Bridge to Intel Legacy Block - 0F1C (driver 10.1.1.9)

        Intel(R) Atom(TM)/Celeron(R)/Pentium(R) Processor SoC Transaction Router - 0F00 (driver 10.1.1.9)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Display Participant Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Generic Participant Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Generic Participant Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Power Participant Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Dynamic Platform & Thermal Framework Processor Participant Driver (driver 7.1.0.169)

        Intel(R) Power Engine Plug-in (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Intel(R) Power Management IC Device (driver 603.9600.2801.45187)

        Intel(R) Sideband Fabric Device (driver 603.9600.2067.15591)

        Intel(R) Trusted Execution Engine Interface  (driver 2.0.0.1067)

        IWD Bus Enumerator (driver 4.5.65.0)

        Legacy device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft ACPI-Compliant System (driver 10.0.10240.16397)

        Microsoft Basic Display Driver (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Basic Render Driver (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

       Microsoft System Management BIOS Driver (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft UEFI-Compliant System (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Virtual Drive Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Microsoft Windows Management Interface for ACPI (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Motherboard resources (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Motherboard resources (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Motherboard resources (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        NDIS Virtual Network Adapter Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        PCI Express Root Complex (driver 10.0.10240.16390)

        Plug and Play Software Device Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Programmable interrupt controller (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Remote Desktop Device Redirector Bus (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        System CMOS/real time clock (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        System timer (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        UART Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.32979)

        UART Controller (driver 603.9600.1948.32979)

        UMBus Root Bus Enumerator (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        Volume Manager (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    USB

        Generic USB Hub (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

        Intel(R) USB 3.0 eXtensible Host Controller - 1.0 (Microsoft) (driver 10.0.10240.16461)

        USB Composite Device (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

        USB Root Hub (xHCI) (driver 10.0.10240.16515)

    VolumeSnapshot

        Generic volume shadow copy (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    WPD

        D:\ (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

    WSD Print Provider

        EPSON41D507 (WF-3640 Series) (driver 10.0.10240.16384)

JimH · « **Reply #14 on:** October 08, 2015, 06:21:35 pm »

A JRMark of 938 isn't great. No heavy lifting.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #15 on:** October 08, 2015, 06:28:01 pm »

Well thank you so much, Brian and Beats!

Apparently I am now in the market for a Click 2 Pro. Any other recommendations (other than Surface) are welcome. If I'm going to spend that much on a computer, it had better be able to replace my carry laptop, currently a Sony FIT14, which is effective but *not* middle seat portable.

If the FiiO people would only make a player that has a USB port for storage. That would certainly be a hi-rez iPod replacement.

But Beats also touched on another potential spoiler-- battery life. DRAT! Thankfully, my iFi Nano DAC has it's own battery. My storage, however operates on USB power. I guess I'll test the setup with one of the Samsung ATIV 2 tablets we have at work to see how they do battery-wise.

I'll let the forum know what I find out.

My very modest MC20 home PC was originally built from high-end parts in 2007. Yes! But now it has a Samsung 850 SSD and it performs very well running Win 8.1. It streams to my Sony STR-DA5800ES reliably (although I do have another topic open on the forum about streaming DSD). It scored 1464 on the benchmark.

I think I know much better now what I am looking for in a portable hi-rez rig. Thanks everyone!

beats_works · « **Reply #16 on:** October 08, 2015, 06:42:43 pm »

Quote

f the FiiO people would only make a player that has a USB port for storage. That would certainly be a hi-rez iPod replacement.

Q: What USB storage are supported via OTG by the X5?

A: Owing to some limitations of the controller board, the X5 currently only supports USB storage utilizing USB controllers from specific brands, specifically: Skymedi, ITE, Innostor, SiliconGo, Phison, and CBM. If you are not sure of what brand of USB controller your USB driver utilizes, you can directly download the PC utility (Identification tool for the main control chip of the U Flash Disk) for checking, and here is the link for download:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fn80ej65ljjs7mt/ChipGenius_v4_00_0027_pre2.exe?dl=0

blgentry · « **Reply #17 on:** October 08, 2015, 06:49:03 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 08, 2015, 06:28:01 pm

If the FiiO people would only make a player that has a USB port for storage. That would certainly be a hi-rez iPod replacement.

But.. ummm... the X5 has two micro SD slots. So you can put as much as 256 GB of storage in it. ...and it's very, very portable. Maybe you need a BUNCH more storage? Like 1TB + ?

I have the X1, which has one micro-SD slot. For the $100 that the X1 goes for, it's a fine player. It lacks refinement. The controls are wonky. The screen is REALLY small. I mean, smaller than you'd think based on pictures. But it plays everything, including FLAC, and it has decent battery life. ...and no spinning disk to fail. All in all, I give the X1 something like 6 out of 10. I wouldn't buy one again, but it's been a nice player and has taught me more about what I want in a portable.

Brian.

beats_works · « **Reply #18 on:** October 08, 2015, 07:02:43 pm »

I'm with you Brian but hey if he just has to have every possible variant of every Beatles song ever recorded on the go then apparently a USB drive is an option 😉

GuitRdone · « **Reply #19 on:** October 08, 2015, 08:27:56 pm »

Well Beats, I DO have every Beatles song ever published! But it's much worse than that. I have been collecting digital audio and video media since 1983. I am still able to sing the entire Billy Joe Royal (recently passed) record "Down in the Boondocks". I was alive when Sheb Wooley's hit "The Purple People Eater" was being played on the radio. I have every single CD issued for the Time-Life "Classic Rock" series. Then there's the hi-rez material. Yes, it's THAT bad!

And I see no reason not to have it all available! My goal is to live within 3TB for now.

One of the many beautiful things about having your library under the control of MC is that playlists can span your entire library! Why leave any of it out?

Did I hear you say the X5-II works with some USB storage? How would that work?

beats_works · « **Reply #20 on:** October 08, 2015, 09:05:46 pm »

OTG is short for On The Go. For an OTG capable device you can connect an external USB drive with a cleverly named "OTG Cable".

If the USB drive is self powered then you can use simplest OTG capable like this one http://www.amazon.com/Adapter-Samusung-Android-Windows-Function/dp/B00LN3LQKQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=wireless&ie=UTF8&qid=1444355659&sr=1-1&keywords=otg+cable

If the external drive is normally powered by USB connection then you will need a cable like this and "inject" power
http://www.amazon.com/AFUNTA-Micro-Cable-Samsung-Galaxy/dp/B00EB70PXA/ref=sr_1_22?s=wireless&ie=UTF8&qid=1444355659&sr=1-22&keywords=otg+cable

Now I have not researched thoroughly, and X5 Gen 2 may have broader support, but what they were saying is that Gen 1 at least would only work with external USB drive with these controllers Skymedi, ITE, Innostor, SiliconGo, Phison, and CBM.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #21 on:** October 10, 2015, 12:54:57 pm »

Well Beats, thanks for the lesson on OTG.

Couple more questions. There isn't anything on the X5-2 page about OTG support, so I'm still having trouble understanding how a run of the mill ESATA/USB expansion drive will connect to the device. What orifice does the device use for this connection?

The totally portable type of USB drive I use for media runs on USB 5v. So I would need a separate USB battery or powered device port to make the OTG rig work?

Thanks!

beats_works · « **Reply #22 on:** October 10, 2015, 01:49:12 pm »

OTG cable connects to micro-USB port.

A tablet MAY supply enough voltage/amps to power external SSD or 2.5" drive but don't count on it. So yes if you are using a portable USB drive without it's own battery then plan on using the y-split OTG cable and you will need to plug other end of cable in to portable power bank such as http://www.amazon.com/Kinps%C2%AE20000mAh-3-Smart-USB-Capacity-Portable-Technology/dp/B012A48UXM/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1444502817&sr=8-7&keywords=power+bank+usb

GuitRdone · « **Reply #23 on:** October 10, 2015, 05:11:46 pm »

Well, I'm already schlepping a USB battery, so this rig looks to be the most portable solution. I have contacted the people at FiiO to find out what drives can be used with the X5-2. Thanks, Beats!

I'm getting about 4 hours running MC, my USB drive and my iFi Nano iDSD from a Sumsung ATIV-2 tablet. JRiver score 2464 with i5 and SSD, currently running Win 8.1. Mebee I'll just use that for my travel computer.

You guys are spot on about MC being difficult with a touch UI. So far so good though since using a Bluetooth mouse and board to get the view set up for the display.

Now I'm sure that one way, or the other, I will be retiring my iPod Classic very soon.

Don't you love it when a plan starts coming together? No more lossy music on the airplane!

GuitRdone · « **Reply #24 on:** October 12, 2015, 07:03:48 pm »

Well the support response received today from FiiO simply refers me to the web page, which has no information at all about "On the Go". I've asked for clarification but I doubt anything useful will be forthcoming. I plan to continue to pursue the computer/DAC/USB archive trilogy and I will report back to the forum.

beats_works · « **Reply #25 on:** October 12, 2015, 11:34:23 pm »

Long thread on OTG support with X5 here http://www.head-fi.org/t/766456/fiio-otg-support-thread

GuitRdone · « **Reply #26 on:** October 13, 2015, 08:37:56 am »

Thanks, Beats. Here is the one that FiiO forwarded overnight. http://fiio.me/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=39949&extra=

There are just way too many limitations using external storage with the X5. It's a shame, really. Such a device would be so valuable to people like myself that it makes me want to modify X5s and sell revved up versions that support USB storage. Period. I bet I'd make a killing!

For now, I'm happy with the combination of MC, the i5, 8GB RAM, 128GB SSD Samsung ATIV-2 combo tablet, my Seagate 3TB, GPT partitioned NTFS formatted, USB 3 media archive, and the iFi Nano iDSD USB 3 DAC. Though more to carry than an X5, it is a very capable and flexible solution for mobile hi-rez.

This flexibility will next become apparent when I have to swap out the 3TB drive for a 5TB drive. This would be inconceivable with an X5, and even if you could get the X5 to see the storage space, apparently anything attached via OTG will not be scanned into the X5 library.

The Samsung ATIV-2 is a temporary solution. I'm going to look at similar computers for their battery life, which I think is the only weak point of this triple device solution. When I have a final config I will post again.

The re-sampling of my CDs via MC to flac files is coming along nicely. I'm being re-introduced to the wonderful collection I have, and the files sound soooo much better than their iPod versions. Well worth the work.

beats_works · « **Reply #27 on:** October 13, 2015, 04:06:00 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 13, 2015, 08:37:56 am

There are just way too many limitations using external storage with the X5. It's a shame, really. Such a device would be so valuable to people like myself that it makes me want to modify X5s and sell revved up versions that support USB storage. Period. I bet I'd make a killing!

Cool? Yes. Rich? Hmmm, SharkTank "and the potential worldwide market for people needing more than 256gb of music on the go is?" Don't forget that 256gb is only current limit of 2x 128gb SD cards. If/when 512gb/1TB cards become mainstream (you know they will eventually) I'm sure they'll upgrade firmware (Or at least I hope they will

)

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 13, 2015, 08:37:56 am

This flexibility will next become apparent when I have to swap out the 3TB drive for a 5TB drive. This would be inconceivable with an X5, and even if you could get the X5 to see the storage space, apparently anything attached via OTG will not be scanned into the X5 library.

That part actually makes some sense to me as even if you did sometimes connect external drive there would be times you only wanted to carry the minimum necessary. I suppose they could tweak library feature to ignore all entries stored on an external device when it's disconnected as a solution. Practically speaking I also don't know at what point maintaining database might become a bit much for device with limited memory and horsepower

Anyhoo, I can live with 256gb for now but good luck with your quest.

FYI - handy site if you want to optimize that tablet by disabling unnecessary Services running in background http://www.blackviper.com/windows-services/

GuitRdone · « **Reply #28 on:** October 14, 2015, 02:20:14 pm »

Well, Beats, you are always right.... about something.

The consequences of Microsoft's latest licensing strategies and intervention in the tablet and laptop markets is this: you can either get a totally anemic Atom tablet (some are i3) on the cheap (because Windows is free to manufacturers for screens below 9"), or a horribly overpriced tablet/combo or ultrabook because the Surface product line has established the new (higher) price points. And in the latter class of machines the poorly reviewed M series processors are beginning to be substituted for the Core i series processors.

I don't view any of these changes as positive for the PC market. Nor are they conducive to a TOTALLY spoiled audiophile like myself who wants to have it ALL in my day bag!

Unless something changes I believe I will stick with the 2 year-old Samsung ATIV-2 tablet/combo (no longer available) I have been testing. If I'm on a longer flight I can just use the internal Realtek DAC and save battery instead of running my external DAC. And they run Windows 10 very nicely from my testing experience.

What brats like me REALLY need is a JRiver X5 style player that can be used with USB drives. Hey JRiver, can you make MC for embedded devices? MC-CE? Think about it. The best media software on truly portable hardware with the most flexible storage options. It would make the totally insane like myself very happy.

mwillems · « **Reply #29 on:** October 14, 2015, 02:31:48 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 14, 2015, 02:20:14 pm

What brats like me REALLY need is a JRiver X5 style player that can be used with USB drives. Hey JRiver, can you make MC for embedded devices? MC-CE? Think about it. The best media software on truly portable hardware with the most flexible storage options. It would make the totally insane like myself very happy.

There's an ongoing port to android which is not complete.

Also MC already runs on ARM devices, and can be run on (for example) a Raspberry Pi2. A Pi2 can both operate a usb hard-drive, an external DAC, and run off a battery. I know because I'm sitting next to one doing those three things right now. It's also the size of a deck of cards, and can be controlled from a phone app (or you can add a touchscreen if you want). You just have to build the device yourself and take the time to tweak it. It's not quite as convenient as a "real" appliance, but it can be close if you put in the time.

Hilton has a megathread over on the Linux boards with lots of awesome pics of his portable Pi player which has a 1TB drive in it: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=96172.0. My setup is much less polished than his (and less portable), but was much easier

So If you're willing to put in the time/effort, you could probably get 9/10 of the way there right now. Or you can wait for the android port.

beats_works · « **Reply #30 on:** October 14, 2015, 02:55:26 pm »

I forsee no problems travelling with such home made device.

mwillems · « **Reply #31 on:** October 14, 2015, 05:39:59 pm »

Quote from: beats_works on October 14, 2015, 02:55:26 pm

I forsee no problems travelling with such home made device.

Well if you make it look like Hilton's, it shouldn't look any different than a little computer or DAC. Now if it looks like mine, you might have a bit of trouble

GuitRdone · « **Reply #32 on:** October 14, 2015, 06:07:24 pm »

OK. Does Hilton sell his devices?

mwillems · « **Reply #33 on:** October 14, 2015, 06:14:44 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 14, 2015, 06:07:24 pm

OK. Does Hilton sell his devices?

You should ask him over in his thread (linked above) or via PM. He's talked about potentially marketing it, but I'm not sure where in the process he is at this point.

beats_works · « **Reply #34 on:** October 15, 2015, 10:07:37 am »

If you're comfortable with Linux you could also try something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856158045&cm_re=beebox-_-56-158-045-_-Product

It MAY run Windows but I didn't dig that far ...

GuitRdone · « **Reply #35 on:** October 15, 2015, 08:09:47 pm »

Hi Beats. This unit might be good for some experiments if someone knows where there is a good battery for the 12vdc power supply for this one.

In speaking with Hilton today about his "Brick" project, it certainly looks like that device will easily be the best player style device out there for my purposes. Until he's ready to ship some of those, I will likely stick with my i5 tablet/DAC/USB storage solution.

beats_works · « **Reply #36 on:** October 15, 2015, 08:23:26 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 15, 2015, 08:09:47 pm

Hi Beats. This unit might be good for some experiments if someone knows where there is a good battery for the 12vdc power supply for this one.

Oh come on, throw me something challenging

http://www.amazon.com/Talentcell-Rechargeable-6000mAh-Battery-Portable/dp/B00MF70BPU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1444958501&sr=8-1&keywords=12+volt+rechargeable+battery+pack+portable

beats_works · « **Reply #37 on:** October 15, 2015, 08:24:30 pm »

Or this http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NFLYWP0?psc=1

GuitRdone · « **Reply #38 on:** October 15, 2015, 08:48:15 pm »

Looks like the last example might have the right connector for the bee box. I'll keep it in mind for something to do in the dead of the winter. Remember, though that I already have a NUC based Id.

beats_works · « **Reply #39 on:** October 21, 2015, 02:56:32 pm »

This is getting interesting again. $180 Android tablet with Wolfson Master HiFi audio processing built in. Haven't found any meaningful reviews on audio quality though.

http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/tablets/lenovo/yoga-tablet-series/yoga-tablet-2-8

GuitRdone · « **Reply #40 on:** October 21, 2015, 08:35:06 pm »

My questions are, is this Atom CPU and 16GB enough to support the Android port of MC, and can the OTG USB support large expansion drives?

beats_works · « **Reply #41 on:** October 21, 2015, 09:14:40 pm »

Quote from: GuitRdone on October 21, 2015, 08:35:06 pm

My questions are, is this Atom CPU and 16GB enough to support the Android port of MC, and can the OTG USB support large expansion drives?

Same processor and memory as Asus - Processor Intel(R) Atom(TM) CPU Z3735F @ 1.33GHz, 1329 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s) with 2gb RAM. Android probably has lower system overhead so might edge out Windows based tablet BUT MC is being ported to Android so I don't know what that means in terms of it being compiled for maximum efficiency. So my guess at this point is that it would be just dandy for playback of FLAC but if you want to apply resampling and processor intensive DSP it might be laggy?

GuitRdone · « **Reply #42 on:** October 22, 2015, 10:31:17 am »

Let's see if maybe someone from the Android port team can let us know.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #43 on:** October 23, 2015, 12:06:36 pm »

Middle Seat Airline Hi-Rez Kit 10/23/15:

Samsung ATIV-2 Tablet running MC21 Windows, i5, 8GB, 128GB SSD
BATTOP Bluetooth Keyboard/Touchpad (with integrated tablet stand. Nice!)
iFi Nano iDSD USB 3 DAC
Seagate 3TB USB 3 HD
Polk UltraFocus 6000i phones

This kit sounds very nice and operates on battery for more than 4 hours before the tablet gives up. It will play your music or video without interruption while also doing your work (or play!), so no second computer is required on a business trip. With the RCA outs on this DAC, it will also rock your office or let you DJ a dance. Pretty much any regular laptop running i5 and 4GB RAM would do this work, too. Not shown is JRemote on iPhone.

But the pic shows that the additional equipment over what a normal business traveler would carry is not much bigger than an X5. Just the DAC and the HD. I'm an IT guy so the cables for this are part of my normal carry. All of this fits easily in a carry-on along with water, a sandwich and a book.

This 2 year old tablet has issues with the original keyboard dock, which has no extra battery, so I've replaced it with the BATTOP Bluetooth unit. It's smaller, lighter, has it's own battery, and it even includes some supports to hold up the tablet. Pretty nice for $23.

The Polk UltraFocus 6000i ear buds are just spectacular. I really can't tell much difference between these and the over-the-ear Polk UltraFocus 8000 I also frequently use.

syndromeofadown · « **Reply #44 on:** October 23, 2015, 01:32:41 pm »

Quote

If you have any suggestions I would appreciate your input very much!

I use MC on a "Dell Venue 8 Pro". I use MC with touch screen and it works well.
It has 64 GB storage plus 128GB sdcard. I think I paid 240 for it and it came with a license for MS Office.
I connect it to different DACs depending on where I am. I have a couple Fii0 DACs that I like.
I have a cable that lets me charge the tablet while the DAC is connected. In my car I have a powered USB hub that lets me connect a portable hardrive and DAC at the same time. You can get 2.5 inch wifi hardrives with built in batteries that would work too.

My suggestion is to wait a month for an new Skylake tablet to be released from Dell or ASUS.
Pair it with a Fii0 X5 or X3 which can be used as a DAC as well as a stand alone player.

GuitRdone · « **Reply #45 on:** October 24, 2015, 11:19:25 am »

Hi Syndrome. Thanks for chiming in. What does your Venue show for a JRiver benchmark?

syndromeofadown · « **Reply #46 on:** October 24, 2015, 02:47:38 pm »

Quote

What does your Venue show for a JRiver benchmark

880
The screen is 1280x800
It has one micro usb port that has to be used for connecting devices as well as charging.
Keep in mind it's 2 years old and cheap.

It is fast and has no issue running MC with a library of photos, ebooks, digital comics, dvd rips, and music.

MC is not perfect on touch but is always improving
https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=96968.0

Here is a cord I use
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1094775787/port-power-usb-at-the-same-time

Here are DACs I use
http://www.fiio.net/en/products/20
http://www.fiio.net/en/products/38
Notice they are battery powered.

Here is my soon to arrive stereo that I will pair with my tablet
http://air.axiomaudio.com/

I am hoping to upgrade to a skylake tablet by Christmas
Ideally it would have:
1600 vertical resolution
latest intel graphics
more than one usb port
LTE capable
less than $500

I want to upgrade for a better screen because I read a lot on it.
My current tablet is fine for audio and video.
Unless you are just looking for something super cheap I would definitely wait a couple months for new models to come out.

I happy to help you with any other information I can provide

GuitRdone · « **Reply #47 on:** October 24, 2015, 03:53:34 pm »

Well I'm glad that's working so well for you. It must have better I/O plumbing than most tablets.

I'm thinking I should get something that will play my media and let me work. Otherwise I'll be carrying a laptop with me for work, too. For an IT guy like myself, that means at least an i5, and I don't even see an i5 Venue offered anymore at Dell.

I've done quite a bit of poking around recently and it looks like the only Skylake processors in your price range will be Core M, which trade performance for longer battery life. It looks like Core i processors will be more expensive in tablets now, because of the expensive price points set by the Surface 4s.

In fact I'm wondering if I shouldn't get a refurbished Venue 11 i5 tablet (around $350) while they are still available.

Of course, being the IT boss, I could just have the company assign me this Samsung ATIV-2!

GuitRdone · « **Reply #48 on:** October 24, 2015, 08:52:47 pm »

Anyone have a Core M machine they can benchmark? Something like the Dell Venue 11 Pro 7000?

bhampster · « **Reply #49 on:** July 22, 2016, 02:09:07 pm »

I'm not retiring my iPod (classic 160GB) but I am still craving a Hi Rez portable player and I have possibly found the solution.

Basically it's = iPhone 6 -> Apple USB adapter -> DragonFly 1.5 Black -> Headphones.

Software wise Onkyo HF Player will play back songs from my iTunes library on the phone and also my own 24/96 files that I've collected over time.

I have been wanting a portable hi rez player for a long time and the other day I realized I already had some parts of it.

INTERACT FORUM

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