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Author Topic: The Prodigal Son Returns  (Read 3162 times)

Doof

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The Prodigal Son Returns
« on: April 27, 2007, 09:19:20 am »

So about a week or two ago I installed Vista Ultimate on my home PC, and then realized that I could now use Windows Media Center and my Xbox 360 as a Media Center Extender. I set it up, turned it on and was blown away by how good the interface looked and responded.

I quickly (hastily?) made the decision to switch over to MCE from JRiver's Theater View. I figured that, on top of the shiny interface, I could also get rid of a PC in my living room. The only problem with this was that I had a lot of files in a lot of different formats and I knew that MCE wouldn't support them all. No biggie. WMA has a lossless version and a quick test showed that MCE could even handle gapless playback of WMA Lossless. The Media Center Extender, on the other hand, couldn't. Oh, well, it's a small price to pay for the flashiness of MCE's interface. I vowed that once I had everything else figured out, I would task my PC with the lengthy process of converting all of my APE files to WMA. But there were other hurdles to tackle first.

I quickly noticed that, unlike MC, there was no customizing the views in MCE. Not a big deal for music, as my needs there are really simple, but trading in all of my image and video based view schemes for a simple folder structure based view was going to take some getting used to. I glanced up at that beautiful screen full of animated goodness and decided I could live without my view schemes. But strangely enough, no videos were showing up.
 
I realized, of course, that MCE wasn't going to handle Quicktime or some of the oddball codecs that my collection utilized, but I knew for a fact that I at least had some WMV's in my collection. After some running back and forth to my Vista PC, I found that, while they were WMV files, they were using an audio codec that the Xbox didn't understand. So unless I could convert them somehow, they would be unavailable. Well, no big loss. They weren't that important anyway. But what of the rest?
 
I scanned through my video collection, identifying videos would absolutely need to be converted and began downloading video conversion utilites in hopes of finding one that was capable of converting all of my videos to WMV. After a few attempts, success! Now I just had to experiment with it to find the settings that would convert my videos over and not lose too much quality, while also balancing drive space requirements. Once I found those settings I could start my PC on the long, laborious task of converting my videos and hope for the best.
 
At some point in my odyssey to migrate to MCE I took a look back at everything I'd have to sacrifice in order to make this transition. In order to lose an extra PC in the living room and gain the pretty interface I'd have to give up gapless playback and customizable view schemes and spend countless hours converting music and videos over to Windows Media format and more than likely have to give up half of my collection that wouldn't make the transition to a suitable format. Not to mention the other things I was starting to dabble in, like RSS bitorrent downloading of TV shows in HD that I could only get in SD through my cable provider. These videos are all encoded in DivX or Xvid, so they'd have to then be converted to WMV so I could watch them.
 
After careful consideration of the facts, I could only say one thing. "Screw that."
 
So now I'm back to my "ugly" Betty, MC's Theater View. Proving once again that I'm the type to ultimately pick brains and personality over beauty any day of the week. Sometimes I think I'm bound and determined to find a better alternative to MC out there, but there just isn't one.
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Matt

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2007, 10:43:40 am »

This is like meeting a girl from your graduating class and saying, "You look great -- did you lose some weight since high school?"
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SwellGuy

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2007, 11:27:40 am »

After witnessing some sappy exchange between a father and son in a movie, my little brother, fishing for a compliment, asked my dad, "Hey dad, how come you never pay me any compliments?"

My dad thought about it for a minute and replied, "Well, you don't sweat much for a fat kid."
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Doof

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2007, 12:58:05 pm »

Well, I did put "ugly" in quotes, because Theater View isn't actually ugly, but let's face facts here, it's not exactly as fancy as MCE.

I kind of view MCE like Britney Speares. Sure, she looks hot, but once you shave her head and delve a little deeper, you realize she's just trailer trash.

Meanwhile, MC's TV is more like Sarah Silverman. She's cute, but not centerfold hot. Meanwhile you're definitely going to have a fun time with her because she's smart and extremely funny.

Or something like that.

Jeez... try to give some props and I'm reduced to poor metaphors in a desperate attempt to defend myself. :P
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JimH

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2007, 01:00:37 pm »

Jeez... try to give some props and I'm reduced to poor metaphors in a desperate attempt to defend myself. :P
But plenty entertaining.  Thanks for the laughs.
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raym

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2007, 07:13:49 pm »

Hey Doof, very informative AND entertaining!

A quick question please, does Vista MC really need all videos to be in WMV format? Does it not still use directshow and therefore allow you to install and use third pardy codec packs to handle this stuff?

Thanks.
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Doof

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2007, 09:23:47 pm »

Vista MC itself can play any video format that WMP can play.

The Xbox 360, as a Media Center Extender, is limited to only WMV, however.
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ThoBar

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2007, 10:57:47 pm »

I only mention this to ensure you get the most out of your XBOX investment...

There is an MCE extender out there (my mate has it, so I dont actually know its name) that will do real time conversion of AVI's etc to WMV or whatever the XBOX uses. It works seemlessly and flawlessly... at least, from what I have seen.

At the end of the day though, MC is always going to be better in the long run for large, complicated libraries (and lets face it, the libraries are only ever going to get larger and more complicated). I too would love to use a 360 as a HTPC replacement, but at this point I refuse to switch the the MCE showpony.

Maybe JR is progessing with the Windows Media Connect option?  ;)

Cheers,
C.

[Edit] MS's Home Server (with built in Media Connect) may make the Media Connect-ability issue a bit more desirable and possibly even important...
       http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/windowshomeserver/default.mspx
       http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/whs_preview.asp
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hit_ny

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2007, 10:54:52 am »

So now I'm back to my "ugly" Betty, MC's Theater View.
You just identified the niche that MC operates in.

All the majors give you free players to support their own wares only. The all-rounder niche is an area that i would have thought open source could really shine in, but the various efforts to date are several yrs behind MC.
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johnnyboy

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2007, 07:41:06 pm »

Doof - if you really want to loose that extra PC then X-Box 360 isn't the way to go - get a Gen 1 X-Box, XBMC on it and it can stream pretty much any format under the sun from MC to it and will fullfill your every little wish (except TV).

It's an incredible HTPC setup straight out the box, highly configurable and easy to use with support for pretty much all formats.

Use XBMC as your client with MC as your back end server running from your main PC.
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InflatableMouse

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2007, 03:23:39 pm »

Vista MC itself can play any video format that WMP can play.

The Xbox 360, as a Media Center Extender, is limited to only WMV, however.

Not exactly true. You can play *most* videos, including divx. You just have to find the right tools to install, like transcode360.

Natively the Xbox even plays TS files (Transport Streams, just rename 'em to MPEG) and with a little luck and (again) the right tools you can stream X264 and H264 streams.

I totally agree though that its far from ideal and MCE's views and schemes basically suck. Also, MCE (which is actually just Windows Media Player) use of tags suck too and your albums will never look 100% right (especially compilations) and you'll undoublty miss some album art.

Man wouldn't you want MC12 to be extended to your xbox360  ;D
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JustinChase

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Re: The Prodigal Son Returns
« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2007, 11:34:17 pm »

Doof - if you really want to loose that extra PC then X-Box 360 isn't the way to go - get a Gen 1 X-Box, XBMC on it and it can stream pretty much any format under the sun from MC to it and will fullfill your every little wish (except TV).

It's an incredible HTPC setup straight out the box, highly configurable and easy to use with support for pretty much all formats.

Use XBMC as your client with MC as your back end server running from your main PC.

Sounds really close to what I'm looking for, but a couple of questions...

Is there any way to use XBMC with an external hard drive connected directly to it?  in other words, can I attach my music/videos/photos (external drive) to the xbox and have access to all of them from whatever machine happens to be connected to the network?  I don't want to have to rely on a separate server for attaching the media files.

Both the wife and I sometimes take our laptops out of the house for work, so whatever happens to be connected to them (the external drive is normally connected to my laptop) is no longer available on the network (the wife can't listen to music while I'm gone).

Also, I'd love to hook up a USB hub to the xbox and hook up my 2 printers in addition to the external drive and have them available for whoever needs them at the time.

I've seen the Linux distro for xbox, but I don't think it will work for actually playing the media like xbmc will (I could be wrong on that)

I'd still like to use MC to manage it all, I just need it all available on the network all the time, no matter who's connected.

Hope that makes sense.
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