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[jjkale]

Mojave and other Gurus,
Mojave, I found a thread from 2013 where you wrote about using a Steinberg UR824 to synch multiple DACs for multichannel purposes.
Can you review how you accomplished this with the 824?
I am interested in the soon-to-be-released Gustard 9028Pro.
I know this was accomplished a couple years ago using Myteks.  They have word clock capability so I guess it might have been "relatively" easier.
Will JRiver support this type of arrangement?
I have an Oppo 105D now, so mch works well with hdmi, but I am looking to possibly upgrade.  The new Exasound is a player and the upcoming Oppo UDP-205 is also an option.
Thanks very much,
jjk43

[mwillems]

To sync DACs, you need the "slave" DACs to have a digital input that carries the clock or a dedicated word clock input.  Digital inputs that carry the clock are ADAT, I2S, and SPDIF; USB or HDMI digital inputs do not carry the clock. 

I have a Steinberg UR824, and it can act as a master for at least one other DAC because it has, for example, an ADAT output.  Your other DAC would need an ADAT input to be synced that way.  While SPDIF will work, it only carries 2 channels of information whereas ADAT can carry eight.  In that configuration the Steinberg is the only device JRiver sees and you handle the channel routing via the Steinberg.  I'm not familiar with the Gustard, but if it lacks a word clock input, it will need an ADAT or SPDIF *input* to have a chance of working in that kind of arrangement.

[jjkale]

To sync DACs, you need the "slave" DACs to have a digital input that carries the clock or a dedicated word clock input.  Digital inputs that carry the clock are ADAT, I2S, and SPDIF; USB or HDMI digital inputs do not carry the clock. 

I have a Steinberg UR824, and it can act as a master for at least one other DAC because it has, for example, an ADAT output.  Your other DAC would need an ADAT input to be synced that way.  While SPDIF will work, it only carries 2 channels of information whereas ADAT can carry eight.  In that configuration the Steinberg is the only device JRiver sees and you handle the channel routing via the Steinberg.  I'm not familiar with the Gustard, but if it lacks a word clock input, it will need an ADAT or SPDIF *input* to have a chance of working in that kind of arrangement.

mw,
Thanks very much for the reply.
The Gustard has an I2S port.  So "theoretically" would you guess that 3 x Gustards could be synched?
And the driver...do you think the standard Gustard driver would identify and manage 3 Gustards as well, or would the manufacturer have to upgrade the notional driver to accomplish that?

Steinberg UR824:  So is your configuration something like
JRiver PC/MAC>>>ADAT>>>UR824>>>3 x SPDIF>>>3 x DAC???

Thanks for the help,
jjk

[mwillems]

mw,
Thanks very much for the reply.
The Gustard has an I2S port.  So "theoretically" would you guess that 3 x Gustards could be synched?
And the driver...do you think the standard Gustard driver would identify and manage 3 Gustards as well, or would the manufacturer have to upgrade the notional driver to accomplish that?

I can't speak, but it's theoretically possible.  I know nothing about the brand, but I wouldn't invest in anything like that without confirmation that it would actually work.

Steinberg UR824:  So is your configuration something like
JRiver PC/MAC>>>ADAT>>>UR824>>>3 x SPDIF>>>3 x DAC???

Not quite, it's JRiver PC >>> USB >>> Steinberg >>> ADAT >>>> other multi-channel DAC with ADAT input (in this case a second Steinberg, but any dac with an ADAT input would work).    The Steinberg doesn't have six SPDIF outputs (and I don't know any device that does), you generally have to use ADAT or daisy chain the second DAC to the third if you want serious expansion.  The first DAC can have any kind of input, but to sync other DACs you need an output that carries the clock if that makes sense.

[jjkale]

I can't speak, but it's theoretically possible.  I know nothing about the brand, but I wouldn't invest in anything like that without confirmation that it would actually work.

Not quite, it's JRiver PC >>> USB >>> Steinberg >>> ADAT >>>> other multi-channel DAC with ADAT input (in this case a second Steinberg, but any dac with an ADAT input would work).    The Steinberg doesn't have six SPDIF outputs (and I don't know any device that does), you generally have to use ADAT or daisy chain the second DAC to the third if you want serious expansion.  The first DAC can have any kind of input, but to sync other DACs you need an output that carries the clock if that makes sense.

It does make sense and thanks.
Gustard is blowing up in certain circles and apparently lends itself to mods.
Agreed that establishing a certain outcome prior to purchase is mandatory.  The "science experiment" part appeals to me, but it has to be reliable!
I'm interested in the 3 x Gustard or the soon-to-be-released Oppo ?UDP 205? (2 x ESS 9038?) in the next 6 months or so.
best wishes and thank you
jjk
Check out Gustard. 

[jjkale]

mw,
Do you happen to have any contacts or references that might know more about synching DACs together?  Anything from any other blogs or forums?
thanks, good weekend
jjk

[jjkale]

To sync DACs, you need the "slave" DACs to have a digital input that carries the clock or a dedicated word clock input.  Digital inputs that carry the clock are ADAT, I2S, and SPDIF; USB or HDMI digital inputs do not carry the clock. 

I have a Steinberg UR824, and it can act as a master for at least one other DAC because it has, for example, an ADAT output.  Your other DAC would need an ADAT input to be synced that way.  While SPDIF will work, it only carries 2 channels of information whereas ADAT can carry eight.  In that configuration the Steinberg is the only device JRiver sees and you handle the channel routing via the Steinberg.  I'm not familiar with the Gustard, but if it lacks a word clock input, it will need an ADAT or SPDIF *input* to have a chance of working in that kind of arrangement.

mw,
Would you mind expanding on the "wiring diagram" on how the Steinberg might be used to create a MCH DAC to three different DACS, say with SPDIF connections?
And, unrelated question; can you confirm that "Copy Bass" in Room Correction would retain full signal in that channel and then send the same bass below the selected frequency to the subwoofer?
thanks very much for the help,
jjk

[mwillems]

mw,
Would you mind expanding on the "wiring diagram" on how the Steinberg might be used to create a MCH DAC to three different DACS, say with SPDIF connections?

I'm not sure I fully understand your question; the Steinberg only has a pair of SPDIF outs so it can't be directly connect to three other DACs via SPDIF.  The Steinberg also has 8 channels out analog, so it is itself already a multichannel DAC.  In my case I just have an ADAT output from the Steinberg to the ADAT input of another Steinberg, for 16 total analog channels out.

It might help if I understood what you're trying to achieve and how many channels you need.  Far and away the easiest thing to do is to buy an interface with the number of channels you need.  Daisy chaining multiple DACs is not a great solution unless you legitimately need >8 channels, as interfaces with more than eight analog outs exist but are less common.

If you're just looking for a way to feed three DACs with SPDIF inputs, you might be better off looking at a Lynx AES 16 or something than a Steinberg. 

And, unrelated question; can you confirm that "Copy Bass" in Room Correction would retain full signal in that channel and then send the same bass below the selected frequency to the subwoofer?
thanks very much for the help,
jjk

I can't comment from experience as I don't use the "room correction" module, I only use the parametric EQ to accomplish bass management.  FWIW, my understanding is that it works the way you describe.  What do you see when you look at the analyzer?

[jjkale]

It might help if I understood what you're trying to achieve and how many channels you need.  Far and away the easiest thing to do is to buy an interface with the number of channels you need.  Daisy chaining multiple DACs is not a great solution unless you legitimately need >8 channels, as interfaces with more than eight analog outs exist but are less common.

Yes, I agree.
I want to upgrade my multichannel DAC rig.  I currently have an Oppo 105D.  It is very good but I think I can do better for sonics (at the expense of complexity and, well, expense).
I am interested in Gustard 9028Pro DACS which are new to market and, I believe very good.  They can be modded to be really, really good.
I want to drive three of them for a 5.1 system.  I need a common clock for all three and a way to send the data, properly split to appropriate channel to all three.
They have these inputs:  Coax/BNC, Optical, AES/EBU, i2S, usb.
I need to do more research if a regular USB driver will work or whether it would need to be modified.

What do you think and thanks very much again.
jjk

[mattkhan]

I would think you should be able to use asio4all, assuming you use windows, to create an aggregate audio device.

[mwillems]

I would think you should be able to use asio4all, assuming you use windows, to create an aggregate audio device.

ASIO4All's sync has been spotty for me, but some folks have reported success with it, so it may be worth exploring.

Yes, I agree.
I want to upgrade my multichannel DAC rig.  I currently have an Oppo 105D.  It is very good but I think I can do better for sonics (at the expense of complexity and, well, expense).
I am interested in Gustard 9028Pro DACS which are new to market and, I believe very good.  They can be modded to be really, really good.
I want to drive three of them for a 5.1 system.  I need a common clock for all three and a way to send the data, properly split to appropriate channel to all three.
They have these inputs:  Coax/BNC, Optical, AES/EBU, i2S, usb.
I need to do more research if a regular USB driver will work or whether it would need to be modified.

What do you think and thanks very much again.
jjk

Ok, there's no reason to by something like a Steinberg with that setup.  What you want is something like this http://www.lynxstudio.com/product_detail.asp?i=16.  Forum user mojave had one for a while (may still) and it's for exactly this (syncing multiple devices with spdif or AES/EBU inputs).