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Lightroom Hierarchical Subject - How can I create a tag in JRiver

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GlennAlt:
I have seen a few posts on this topic, but I haven't been able to find a solution to what I want to do, which is use  lightroom hierarchical subject tags in JRiver instead of the keywords in my photos. After reading other topics I have checked that:

The photos in the library are tagged with the hierarchicalSubject keyword, albeit in a Lightroom-specific schema.  I have looked at the raw tags in the tag editor.

My understanding is that I now need to name a custom field with exactly the same identifier as the Hierarchical keywords tag. The problem is that I'm not sure what the identifier should be: I've tried XMP:HierarchicalSubject, XMP-lr:HierarchicalSubject, h(H)ierarchical subject and a few others, but none of them work.

Can someone tell me the exact custom field identifier I need, or confirm it can't be done.

If anyone has proceeded to use the HierarchicalSubject in a viewer instead of keywords and can explain how to do that it will be even better.

Matt:
Is the problem that Media Center doesn't see your hierarchical keyword tags in the file?

Or does Media Center see them, but you just can't use them?

I might be more help if you'd email me a file with the tags.  I'm matt at jriver dot com.

Thanks.

marko:
The issue I found with mine was that if the option in Lightroom to "recognise forward slash and backslash as keyword hierarchies instead of flat keywords" was turned on, then indeed, we get a nice, nested keywords list in Lightroom, as we do in MC, but...

Going the other way, from Lightroom to MC, made a real mess.

"This/is/a/keyword" became "This; is; a; keyword" even though it was shown as a hierarchy in Lightroom. I couldn't find it just now, but I was sure there was also a Lightroom option to "include the entire keyword heirarchy when exporting" or something along those lines. If not selected, only the tail end of the heirarchy is exported, and if it is enabled, all the branches are written to metadata as separate, individual keywords, which is pretty rubbish really :)

I turned the feature off in Lightroom, keeping "This/is/a/keyword" as a single flat keyword so that when exported to MC, the keywords came in nested, the way I want them.

I'll keep an eye on this with interest. If there's no sample file by tomorrow morning, I'll try and make one with a temp lightroom library.

marko:
Morning Matt,

I've imported a file to lightroom that contains the following keywords:

!Events/Rome 2017
!Places/Rome

Now, with Lightroom set to recognise the slash as an heirarchical separator, here's what I get in Lightroom's keywording panels:

Keywords applied:
Rome 2017
Rome

While in the keywords list, they are nested:
!Events > Rome 2017
!Places > Rome

I then added a "Test Group" to the list, and added a "Test Keyword" inside that group and applied it to the file.

By default, Lightroom sets all groups and containing keywords to be saved in the file when exporting. This can be turned off, but at a tag at a time, tedious, no?

So when exported, the IPTC keywords become:
!Events, !Places, Rome, Rome 2017, Test Group, Test Keyword

Unless there's something in the XMP data that can be used to rebuild the heirarchy, I don't see a way around this, hence the reason my Lightroom keywords list is full of forward slashes. I can live with this because I generally only edit in Lightroom, then export to MC where all the cataloguing happens. If I was more Lightroom orientated though, I might find this difficult to live with.

I've sent you a PM with a dropbox link to an archive that contains an original and export, it's just over 3Mb
It seems that on export, Lightroom removes the <MJMD> tag block, which is rather rude :)

-marko

GlennAlt:
Thank you both for responding on this. My original post was probably not clear enough.

I use Lightroom for photo editing and cataloguing. It is the master catalogue, and I would like for MC to be able to browse the pictures I have exported to the MC library by their hierarchical keywords.  i.e. to import the tags in the files into the MC library and do whatever processing is required, by custom fields or an equivalent, to be able to browse hierarchically.

So I will always be going from a file exported from Lightroom, containing hierarchical values in the XMP:HierarchicalSubject, to MC. Never from MC to Lightroom.

I will send a file to Matt with the keywords. I don't have any problem with the keywords being generated properly, in a Lightroom sense. They are in a proprietary format containing | characters in the hierarchy, that would certainly need to be modified to be meaningful to MC. My initial problem is that I cannot import the hierarchical values into MC. My next problem is to find a way to convert the value to a meaningful MC hierarchy. I presume that can be performed using the scripting language once I have the tag in the MC catalogue. My final problem will be to use the MC-friendly hierarchy to view the media. I think the problems become progressively easier.

Thanks again for your responses. Let me know if you can enlighten me further.

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