Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[kiwi]

Hello,

I am in the process of figuring out what hardware to get to create a PC Based HiFi Source:

High Quality Output from MC
http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=MediaCenter;action=display;num=1054250816

MC on a Hush Mini-ITX PC (for HiFi Audio Device)
http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=MediaCenter;action=display;num=1054063559

Now, the next piece of the puzzle is the sound card.  I'm looking for the highest quality output from the device, both analog so I can listen to it now, and digital, so that eventually, I could get a better external DAC.

I figured that other nooBs might be interested in this and if all the various sound card information was consolidated into once place then people would have a place to got and look for it.


I tried to find sound cards/devices ranging in price from $100 to $800.  Initially, it was going to be a list of 6 devices, however, I found quite a few more that look to fit the bill.  Here's the list in no particular order:

{Note: All prices were just found on the web, and meant to give a ball park figure for each device. Also, sorry this is such a long thread.}

PCI Sound Cards
1) LynxTWO
2) LynxL22
3) LynxONE
4) RME DIGI96/8 PAD
5) DAL CardDeluxe
6) Aardvark Direct Pro 2496
7) Creamware Luna II
8) Digigram VX222
9) Echo Layla 24 PCI
10) Terratec DMX 6 Fire 2496
11) M-Audio Delta 1010LT
12) M-Audio Delta 410
13) M-Audio Audiophile 2496

External Audio Devices, USB and Firewire
14) M-Audio Audiophile USB
15) M-Audio Duo
16) Digidesign MBox
17) M-Audio Sonica
18) M-Audio Sonica Theater
19) M-Audio Firewire 410

PC Card Devices:
Digigram VX Pocket v2
Echo Indigo



PCI Devices:

1) LynxTWO
Price: A 4i/4o ($899), b 2i/6o ($799), c 6o/2i ($975)
These cards seem to be a bit out of the price range, but have gotten stellar reviews.  Many comments along the lines of "This card shows that PC Audio can compete with audio exotica." {This was a bit out of the range, but I figured I'd include it since it is supposed to be so good.}

Product Home Page:
http://www.lynxstudio.com/lynxtwo.html

Reviews:
http://www.pcavtech.com/soundcards/LynxTWO/
http://www.lynxstudio.com/news.html {look in reviews section}


2) LynxL22
Price: $625
This card is supposedly a 2 channel varient of the LynxTWO.  i.e. the LynxTWO with only 2 inputs and 2 outputs.

I can't find any separate reviews, and am in the process of finding out from Lynx whether or not it is just the LynxTWO w/o the extra channels.

Product Info:
http://www.lynxstudio.com/lynxl22.html[/ur]


[b]3) LynxONE[/b]
Price: $419
This card is supposed to be really good, but not the sonic equal of the LynxTWO.  It has stereo inputs and outputs.

Product Info:
[url]http://www.lynxstudio.com/lynxone.html

Reviews:
http://www.pcavtech.com/soundcards/LynxONE/index.htm
http://www.lynxstudio.com/news.html {look in reviews section}


4) RME DIGI96/8 PAD
Price: $345 ($379 w/ AES/EBU Cable)

This card is supposed to be an excellent card, with extremely good digital I/O capabilities.  It was reviewed in stereophile a couple times, however, they didn't really comment on its analog output.  
This card seems to have quite a number of inputs and outputs, with an expansion board giving access to even more outputs.

Product Info:
http://www.rme-audio.de/english/digi96/digi96pa.htm

Reviews:
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?299
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?541
http://www.rme-audio.de/english/review/reviews.htm
http://www.io.com/%7Ekazushi/audiocard/


5) DAL CardDeluxe
Price: $399
According to the AVSForums, this is one of the defacto standards for high quality audio.  Stereophile gave it a good review saying that it sounded comparable to a Musical Fidelity X-24K D/A.  This board has stereo inputs and outputs, along with a digital input and output.

Product Info:
http://www.digitalaudio.com/

Reviews:
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?280
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?280:8
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?280:9
http://www.digitalaudio.com/what_others_say.htm


6) Aardvark Direct Pro 2496
Price: $499
I/O: 4 inputs, 6 outputs
Don't know a lot about this device.  I've heard its name thrown around a bit.  I believe the Aardvark Direct Pro LX6 is a cheaper version of the card, missing only the mic preamps. This has an external breakout box for the connections.

Product Info:
http://www.aardvarkaudio.com/aasd-v1/products/lx6-main.html
http://www.aardvarkaudio.com/aasd-v1/products/2496-main.html

Reviews:
http://www.aardvark-pro.com/direct_pro_review_2496.html
http://www.pcrecording.com/aardvark.htm


7) Creamware Luna II
Price: $425

From their site:
Actually, Luna II is two audio cards in one. Featuring the most complete and up-to-date set of ultra-low-latency drivers available, combined with uncompromising 24-bit / 96 kHz quality I/Os, Luna II is the ideal cutting-edge adapter for all native software applications. Its high reliability and sensational price make Luna II possibly the most desirable audio card for computers running Cubase VST, Logic, Nuendo, GigaStudio and all other popular audio software.
But that's not all. Luna II is also the only I/O card in a wide price range that provides you with all the important benefits of a solid DSP architecture! Luna’s unique latency-free routing capabilities and the on-board "live" digital mixer (with advanced surround capabilities and effects) make Luna a valuable enhancement for every audio computer. Luna II is even compatible to the huge DSP plug-in library of the SCOPE Fusion Platform.


This could be interesting with their built-in dsp.

Their list of Plug-ins: http://www.creamware.de/en/products/sfp/scope/software/default.asp

Some comments about keys needing to be installed when the drivers are installed, but that may be for the software products.

Product Info:
http://www.creamware.de/en/products/sfp/Luna/default.asp

Reviews:
http://www.sonicstate.com/articles/article.cfm?id=20
http://remixmag.com/ar/remix_luna_landing_creamware/
http://www.musiciansnews.com/92/creamware_discloses_luna_ii_new_generation_audio_i_o_card.shtml

[kiwi]

8) Digigram VX222
Price: $479

Product Info:
http://www.ca-online.de/ No English translation on the page, so I wasn't able to read through it.

May have linux drivers http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/200304090823NS4949558129.html


9) Echo Layla 24 PCI
Price: $750?

This appears to be a PCI card interface to an external 19" rack mount device.

Product Info:
http://www.arbitermt.co.uk/echo/echolayla24.htm

Reviews:
http://www.soniccontrol.com/tech/midi/articles/110100/layla24.shtml


10) Terratec DMX 6 Fire 2496
Price: $249
This card seems to be aimed at the consumer market. It is designed for home theater playback and games.  6 Outputs for surround sound.  I also believe that it has a 5.25" front panel with various connectors on it.

Product Info:
http://productsen.terratec.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=3&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

Reviews:
http://www.sospubs.co.uk/sos/apr02/articles/terratecdmx6.asp
http://compreviews.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tech-report.com%2Freviews%2F2003q1%2Fsoundcards%2Findex.x%3Fpg%3D1
http://compreviews.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tomshardware.com%2Fgame%2F200302081%2Findex.html


M-Audio Cards/Devices {There are quite a number, so I only picked that ones that seem to get mentioned more in forums.}

Review links on M-Audio's Site:
http://www.m-audio.com/company/reviews.php

11) M-Audio Delta 1010LT
Price: $279
This board seems to have lots of i/o's, 10 each. One review said that the sound quality was quite good and similar to that of the Delta 1010, with its external analog stages and data converter?  Supposedly, there are drivers that may let you do some low frequency management and other stuff with this device.  Don't know, just read about it on the AVS forum.

Product Info:
http://www.midiman.com/products/m-audio/1010lt.php?site=sonicstate
http://www.midiman.com/support/manuals/pdf/DELTA1010LTr3.pdf

Reviews:
http://www.sonicstate.com/articles/article.cfm?id=41


12) M-Audio Delta 410
Price: $199

This board has 4 in/10 out.  It seems to have good support and be well received.  Similar to the 1010LT, it has drivers that supposedly give you quite a bit of control over the card.

2 dig in, 2 dig out
2 analog in, 8 analog out

Product Info:
http://www.midiman.com/products/m-audio/delta410.php

Reviews:
http://www.viaarena.com/?PageID=237
http://www.pcplus.co.uk/media/pcplus/pdf/195/195.review.midiman%20oxygen%208%20+%20m-audio%20delta%20410.pdf


13) M-Audio Audiophile 2496
Price: $149

This card seems to be one of the standard upgrade cards for anyone looking for better audio. At $149, it is cheap enough for people to experiment with.  And for many it may well be enough of an upgrade.  Especially, that given the rest of the components in a system, it might not make a difference if you went to a more expensive device. Worth thinking about whether it makes more sense to spend the extra money on a really good external DAC instead of the sound card. And just use this for digital output.

Product Info:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/m-audio/audiophile.php

Reviews:
http://www.digit-life.com/articles/maudioaudiophile/index.html
http://www.m-audio.com/company/media/reviews/computermusic_ap2496/cmreview.html
http://www.io.com/%7Ekazushi/audiocard/


Reviews:
http://www.pcrecording.com/audiophile.htm


USB Audio Devices
One big question about these USB devices is how they sound with respect to the PCI devices.  Since they are outside the electrically noisy PC environment, it should be easier for them to should better.  However, the USB latencies and/or driver issues could cause problems.  I don't know, but I'd really like to find out.  If one of these devices did sound as good as say the Lynx, it would make for easy auditioning of devices at Music stores.  Just bring in a Laptop with your APE files and play away.

14) M-Audio Audiophile USB
Price: $199

This appears to be a USB version of the Audiophile 2496, I wasn't able to find any reviews of this device.  I'd love to hear from anyone who has it, or has listened to it.

This device seems to have the limitation that it cannot play higher bitrates through all channels.  This is probably a USB Limitation

Product Info:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/m-audio/audiophileusb.php
http://www.m-audio.com/support/manuals/pdf/Audiophile-USB_Manual.pdf


15) M-Audio Duo
Price: $259
Looks like an pro-sumer device.  

One note, it can only handle 96KHz data either in or out, but not both at the same time.  Probably a USB limitation.

Reviews:
http://www.m-audio.com/company/media/reviews/hr_usb_audio_rev_0602.pdf


16) Digidesign MBox
Price: $449

Product Info:
http://www.digidesign.com/products/mbox/

Reviews:
http://www.macworld.com/2002/08/reviews/mbox/
http://www.amug.org/amug-web/html/amug/reviews/articles/digi/mbox.html
http://www.creativesynth.com/reviews/047_MBox/rev_mbox.html
http://emusician.com/ar/emusic_digidesign_mbox_mac/
http://www.digitalplayroom.com/digidesign/mboxaudiomediareview.htm


17) M-Audio Sonica
Price: $59
Consumer USB Device.  For getting good sound out of a laptop.  Only outputs.

Product Info:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/consumer/sonica_page1.php


18) M-Audio Sonica Theater
Price: $99
Same as the sonica, but with multiple outputs and inputs.  Appears to run at 24/96, or at least has the ability to run at those rates.  Again, it is probably limited as far as playing and recording at the same time at those rates.

Product Info:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/consumer/sonicaTheatre_page1.php


19) M-Audio Firewire 410
Price: $399

Presumably, similar to the Delta 410 PCI card, but in a nice external case, with a firewire interface.  Again, 4 in, 10 out.  Has software for base management.

With the Firewire interface, it should have no problems sampling the data at the higher rates and playing back data at the same time.  Unlike the USB devices.

2 dig in, 2 dig out
2 analog in, 8 analog out

This appears to be a very new device, and as such, I have not been able to find any reviews... and have found some comments that it may have been delayed again.

Product Info:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/m-audio/fw410.php


While we're at it, I thought that I'd list some devices for laptops:

Digigram VX Pocket v2
Price: $459

Product Info:
http://www.digigram.com/products/getinfo.htm?prod_key=9000


Echo Indigo
Price: $99

http://compreviews.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tomshardware.com%2Fgame%2F200302081%2Findex.html



General Questions:
Have I missed any cards worth noting?
If you have any of these cards, is there a reason that you picked it?
What else were you looking at?
How do they sound?  
What have they been compared with and against?
How are their drivers?
What OS's are they being run under?
Are there any other relatively inexpensive firewire devices or USB 2.0 devices?
Are there any High Quality Network Devices ( i.e. Ethernet to Audio) that are in the same class as the above cards?
Any inaccuracies that I may have made?

Other links:
http://www.pcavtech.com/soundcards/compare/index.htm
http://www.avsforum.com/ {look in their HTPC, home theater PC forum.}

I hope that people find this useful.

kiwi

[rocketsauce]

I have an Echo Audio MIA card. I had planned on getting the Audiophile 2496, but three differernt sales people at two different Guitar Centers recommended the MIA (it was about $20 more than the 2496). Two said they actually returned their 2496s and got MIAs instead. I use it for outputting audio to my hi-fi and for recording vinyl to the hardrive. I bought it before I started using MJ/MC and the only problem is that MC doesn't recognize it as a recording device, but I use CoolEdit2000 for recording/editing anyway.

Rob

[knickelfarz]

I always was quite sure that the best audio connection between PC and HiFi would be optical SPDIF. Since a lot of cheap soundcards and even motherboards offer SPDIF output and most HiFi Amps offer SPDIF input (since surround sound is getting popular...) this is also quit affordable - I would spend the money for better speakers...

On the other hand, those "cheap" soundcards and motherboards mostly have a fixed 48kHz SPDIF output, maybe resulting in the mentioned "issues with 44.1KHz to 48KHz upsampling" ... perhaps i was lucky, but I never had those issues - the sound was better and cleaner than analog output. I made this comparison with
- Terratec DMX 6FIRE, which has very good DACs
- Creative Audigy, where analog output is a little bit noisy...
- Onboard coaxial SPDIF output of a VIA EPIA-M ITX motherboard (converted to optical via a cheap adapter), the analog outputs of this board are only average...

The digital output of all three devices seem to sound equal with my Onkyo Amp (I guess It's DAC is quite good, but I have no comparison to another amp with digital input).
The analog sound of the three devices had the mentioned restrictions, the digital variant always sounded better...

I would like to hear, if anybody made comparable or maybe contrary experiences, especially with "cheap" SPDIF outputs, and especially concerning the 44.1KHz to 48KHz upsampling  

[knickelfarz]

Oups, sorry, this should be placed in the "High Quality Output " thread http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=MediaCenter;action=display;num=1054250816 , but maybe it's not that wrong around here  

[jam]

Thank you for making the quite interesting list of those cards.

My favorite card is Digi96/8 series (mine is 96/8 PST).  The reason I tried this card is the review on stereophile.  They reviewed both Digi96/8 and CardDeluxe.  I chose Digi96/8 because of its very low jitter SPDIF signal output regarding to stereophile review.  If I owned reclocking / dejittering DAC, this jitter stuff was not concerned.  My idea is not bad.  Digi96/8 sounds much better than Audiophile 2496 with DAC w/o dejittering.  On the other hand, I heard other people who owned dejittering DAC was claiming there is no differences between them.

Audiophile 2496 is good and cheap sound card.  Its digital has much more jitter but it's not a problem if u own dejittering device.  It works well with DirectSound too.  If you want to use SPDIF, you can choose Dio 2496 instead.

I don't own CardDeluxe but heard it is one of the best analogue quality sound card.  I heard its analogue signal quality is better than Digi96/8.  I'm not sure about the comparison of digital signal quality.

I'm not sure about other cards.

On the other hand, if I was making a system using Hush Mini-ITX PC, I use a firewire sound device.  I don't use PCI cards because Hush is using a raiser card, so that sound card is placed very close to a mother board and it may cause noticeable noise.  I don't use USB devices because many USB devices took power from USB line but it is not enough to drive op-amp well in general.  This is not matter if I use only digital, though.

[LisaRCT]

One problem I had with the Terratec was that, as mentioned, it is often not seen as a soundcard or as a recording device . . .
thus simple things such as volume sliders or tome controls may fail to work.
I went with the Terratec for recording guitar tracks, but for listening (unless using straight digital) I normally just use my old SoundBlasterLive with the Kx Project drivers, thus making a remote control easily workable.
Then again I am still learning as my system evolves  

[sirshambling]

I'm using the Terratec DMX Fire 96/24. I chose this one as it was the only vaguely quality/affordable card that I could find which had RCA analogue input and output stereo connectors.

I run sound both into and out of my hi-fi amp so I can record vinyl to my hard drive and output music from the PC all over the house via the amp.

As Lisa says the controls can be a bit hit and miss but the sound quality is very good - but I'm used to listening to scratchy old US and Jamaican vinyl so what do I know about it...

Also my wife and the kids can (just about) use it for gaming.

John

[kiwi]

Thanks guys for all the posts.  They are very helpful.

Yeah, I haven't heard back from M-Audio about whether or not the Firewire device is available.  I hadn't thoght about the PCI Riser issues and the board being right next to the cpu board.

I just remembered seeing this device:
http://home.swbell.net/ronsuthe/

This is a USB DAC with a 12dax7 tube on it.  

It's a bit pricy at $1300.

Unfortunately their site doesn't mention anything about the DACs they use...  but it does look cool.

-kiwi

[kiwi]

I just looked at one of the review sites for the Hush.  It appears that with the riser, the sound card is actually moved away from the board, and not over it.  Which should put it further from the electrical noise.

http://www.mini-itx.com/reviews/hush/?page=2

Dang it...  it would have been nice to have some "disqualifying features" to make the choice of a card easier.

-kiwi

[kiwi]

I was going to edit my above posts to include the Echo Audio Mia, but by adding lines to it, it became too long

edit: rocketsauce pointed out the Echo Audio MIA so it's been added to the list.

Echo Audio Mia (and Mia Midi, w/ midi interface)
Price: $179

Product Info:
http://www.echoaudio.com/Products/Mia/index.php

Reviews:
http://www.neoseeker.com/Articles/Hardware/Reviews/echomia/
http://www.soniccontrol.com/tech/midi/articles/080101/mia.shtml

[ThomasB]

Hi there,

I'm using the Hoontech DSP 24 Value and I'm very satisfied with it.

Features:
- 2 channel ADC (dynamic range 100dB[A]) via RCA input connectors
- 2 channel DAC (dynamic range 110dB[A]) via RCA output connectors
- optional bracket with digital I/O (coaxial and optical S/PDIF) and MIDI I/O
- systemsound-/monitor-output (1/8" mini-jack)
- internal analog input for CD or aux signals
- direct monitoring for input signals (zero latency, by hardware)
- internal mixing, routing and monitoring software provided
- Logic SoundTrack 24 (24-bit/96kHz powerful recording software from Emagic) included  
- drivers for Windows 9x/Me/NT/2000/XP, ASIO 2.0 (typical latency can be lowered to 2ms or lower), multiclient-GSIF (GigaSampler/-Studio)

Controller Chip & Converters:
- DSP24 Value card uses the IC Ensemble Envy24 I/O controller chip (ICE1712)
- AKM 24bit/96kHz Codec for analog in- and outputs  
- DSP24 internal I/O for standard windows system sounds (mini-jack on card) uses SigmaTel STAC97xx 18bit AC-97 Codec (ADC & DAC) 95dB output S/N ratio (a-weighted)

MSRP (DSP24 Value): $128 US
MSRP (optional bracket): $50 US

For this price I believe there is little or no alternative out there.

Check it out at http://www.Hoontech.com

Rgds, Thomas

Listening to: 'Walkin'' from 'Walkin'' by 'Miles Davis All Stars' on Media Center 9.0

[kiwi]

ThomasB - Dang!  It looks like another card that I need to add to the list of cards to look at.

kiwi

[Shady Bimmer]

As if M-Audio hasn't been mentioned enough in this thread, a recently-released card that is getting a bit of attention is the Revolution 7.1 in their Prosumer line.  

The drivers are still undergoing updates to fix some issues but the card seems to be a hit over at AVS Forum in the Home Theater PC Forum.  One of the early complaints, though, was that its use of mini-plugs for analog outputs instead of RCA.  Its specs, though, are slightly better than the Delta and Audiophile series.  

The card is supposedly aimed at exactly at what is being looked for here.

List price is $119 but it can be found for just under $100.

[kiwi]

Hi  Shady Bimmer:

Yeah, the Revo 7.1 looks moderately interesting.  I am in the process of rewriting this list of sound cards, adding that one and several others.

For me, the Revo 7.1 actually is really not the card that I am looking for.  I am hoping to put a system together to replace my aging CD player.  (it's having mechanical problems and wasn't that great to start with, just a standard yamaha 5-disk changer.)  It was either build a PC or get a signifcantly better CD play, like the 1st or 2nd Lynn model.  I think that it's called the Genki (can't remember right now, but it was going for around $1400).

In that light, I am really looking at the other end of the spectrum from the Revo 7.1, at the cards geared more for the pro market.  The LynxL22, DAL CardDelux and RME 96/8 (and possibly the RME HDSP 9632 which is supposed to have 192KHz i/o and an addon board capable of doing 6 channels I believe).

This review of sound cards is aimed at providing all the information for someone looking for a new sound card.  So that they can say: "I'd like to spend X dollars on a card, what could I get for that?"  And also provide information on how much more or less they could spend on other cards.  Along with providing some info about the various cards...

[Shady Bimmer]

In that light, I am really looking at the other end of the spectrum from the Revo 7.1, at the cards geared more for the pro market.

Are you looking for input and output, or output only (as your first post mentioned)?  For output the Revo is at or near the top of the list from M-Audio (Its specs are better than any other PCI card they currently offer).  It does indeed output 24 bit/192kHz and provides for 7.1 analog output.  This was designed with the output quality of a pro card - but driver support (it is far more featureful than most pro products), distribution channels, and price make it a consumer-level product.  It provides for much-lower profit margin so M-Audio is counting on higher sales volume.

I wouldn't be able to comment on its quality compared to a Lynx, but for the price of a Lynx I'd expect RF/EMI shielding around the card.  Balanced outputs are nice but I'd almost expect more noise to be picked up by the circuitry on the card inside the PC than in the cables to the amp (or preamp) unless you have exceptionally long line-level runs (as you typically find in professional settings but not typical for home use).  The same for XLR connectors (common in pro, rare in home).

The Revo is opening new doors - the same specs as far more expensive professional cards, but none of the features only needed in true pro installations.  I would love (and hope) to see Lynx Studio provide a card with specs similar to the LynxTwo but with features and pricing geared towards home-theater use.

This review of sound cards is aimed at providing all the information for someone looking for a new sound card.

And what a list it is turning into!  

Of course the sound card is only part of the equation.  Use of a good-quality CD drive with correct C2 support and a good ripper (IMHO Exact Audio Copy can't be beat for accurate rips) are important as well.  

[kiwi]

Are you looking for input and output, or output only (as your first post mentioned)?  

Just for output.

For output the Revo is at or near the top of the list from M-Audio (Its specs are better than any other PCI card they currently offer).  It does indeed output 24 bit/192kHz and provides for 7.1 analog output.  This was designed with the output quality of a pro card - but driver support (it is far more featureful than most pro products), distribution channels, and price make it a consumer-level product.  It provides for much-lower profit margin so M-Audio is counting on higher sales volume.

I wouldn't be able to comment on its quality compared to a Lynx, but for the price of a Lynx I'd expect RF/EMI shielding around the card.  Balanced outputs are nice but I'd almost expect more noise to be picked up by the circuitry on the card inside the PC than in the cables to the amp (or preamp) unless you have exceptionally long line-level runs (as you typically find in professional settings but not typical for home use).  The same for XLR connectors (common in pro, rare in home).

I will have to poke around and see what information I can find out about the card.

The Revo is opening new doors - the same specs as far more expensive professional cards, but none of the features only needed in true pro installations.  I would love (and hope) to see Lynx Studio provide a card with specs similar to the LynxTwo but with features and pricing geared towards home-theater use.

Yeah, though they seem to be very geared toward just the pro market.  M-Audio seems to have goals in both markets.

I'll have to see whether or not there are any reviews comparing the Revo 7.1 to other cards.  I believe that I found one comparing it to the DMX 6, and it said that the Revo didn't sound nearly as good.

I would make the comment that it has a lot more than just picking the right parts and slapping them down on the board.  Analog circuit layout on a PC board is a very difficult art.  The board has to be designed, or errors come in.  

And what a list it is turning into!  

Yeah, it ended up being a lot longer than the 6 cards I was originally going to start with.

Of course the sound card is only part of the equation.  Use of a good-quality CD drive with correct C2 support and a good ripper (IMHO Exact Audio Copy can't be beat for accurate rips) are important as well.  

Definitely.

I've been using EAC for quite a while now and it does everything I need it to do.  

I am interested in whether or not MC's Digital Secure Ripping is as good as EACs.

-kiwi

[shAf]

..., a recently-released card that is getting a bit of attention is the Revolution 7.1 in their Prosumer line. ...

The links provided led me to another interesting discussion:
http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33683103 , and
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=255525&highlight=maudio+revolution ...
the forum of which, I have no need to join ... but the "lip sync" problem with the Revo card should be of interest to this forum.  I hope someone will let us know when M-Audio has fixed it.

[Shady Bimmer]

The links provided led me to another interesting discussion:
http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33683103 , and
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=255525&highlight=maudio+revolution ...
the forum of which, I have no need to join ... but the "lip sync" problem with the Revo card should be of interest to this forum.  I hope someone will let us know when M-Audio has fixed it.

This had already been fixed.  The issue was with analog line-in, but the drivers alluded to in the last post of the Rage3D forum were the solution.

[Shady Bimmer]

I always was quite sure that the best audio connection between PC and HiFi would be optical SPDIF.

Not necesarily.   I've seen many reports of higher jitter on optical ports (than coax), but none of these have had any supporting data.

Assuming high-quality cables the answer is "wherever the better DAC is".  If your receiver or external DSP has a better DAC then using SPDIF to that device would provide better sound.  With many of the cards in this list it is entirely possible the on-board DAC is better so using analog out may be the better route.

Cheap clockgens are the biggest enemy of SPDIF and unfortunately are not uncommon.  Resampling (typically to 48kHz) is another downside though most (if not all) of the cards listed here should be capable of outputting a 44.1kHz stream.  RME seems to be a leader for digital outputs.

If you have a Mark Levinson (Madrigal) DSP feeding Mcintosh amps driving B&W Nautilus speakers then you'll likely want an RME using SPDIF to the DSP.

If you have a $300 mass-market Surround-sound receiver you may be better served by a card with a high-quality DAC/analog outputs (your ears should be your guide).

[Shady Bimmer]

Sooooo many choices!

One factor that plays a large part in selecting a sound card is features:

• Digital inputs: required? quality?
  
• Analog inputs: required? quality?
  
• Digital outputs: required? quality?
  
• Analog outputs: required? quality?
  
• Multi-channel input: analog/digital/both? required? quality?
  
• Multi-channel output: analog/digital/both? required? quality?
  
• ASIO drivers (or other ability to bypas kmangler)?
  
• Surround sound (discrete: DD5.1, DTS, other): required? quality?
  
• Surround sound (encoded/simulated: SRS, DPL, other): required? quality?
  
• Game support? (For those that only have enough slots or enough $$ for 1 audio card but want gaming support as well)
  
• DVD-A and SACD support: required?
  
• Sample depth/rates supported?  Resampling possible?  Resampling forced?
  

There is currently only one sound card with DVD-A support (it isn't even worthy of being in this thread), and it is unlikely we'll ever see a PC-based solution for SACD (thanks to Sony license agreements). M-Audio Revolution is the only other card I've found so far with ability to support DVD-A (but this does not exist yet).

I had been looking at newer choices than RME (for SPDIF) had and along comes two more products: HDSP9632 and HDSP9652.  It appears an expansion board will work with the HDSP9652 for analog I/O.

There is a shootout in AVS forum between Lynx, RME,  M-Audio: High-End Analogue Soundcard Shootout: LynxTWO, RME DIGI96/8 PAD and Delta 1010 (LONG).  Even if I had $1000 to spend on a sound card, the LynxTwo may not be the best choice. . .