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[hit_ny]

I'm under the impression that APE lossles is typcially 3x times the size of mp3 VBR APS (approimately)

I was wondering whether that is the theoretical minimum size (or as close as can be obtained) for lossless ?

If not how much more reduction in size can we expect and still keep it lossless.

[Matt]

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't forsee too much progress.  High-end lossless compressors are close enough together that 1% more compression is a breakthrough.

Truthfully, the problem is that 16-bits is too much for most studios to utilize.  The last 2-3 bits are random noise, and so not compressible. (which adds 200 - 300 kbps to the file)

I played with a lossless / lossy hybrid mode for APE some time ago, but it seemed silly to make yet another lossy format. (yalf)

[GHammer]

Well, Matt's the expert on that, but from what I've read, APE is as good as it gets. And it is small enough. Ok, sure it is not an MP3 size, but then it is the original sound.

What's more important? To me, having the original to encode with the flavor of the month is great. And to have excellent playback via MC is the best. I used to have to make CD compilations via WAVs or settle for MP3 quality over the stereo. Now I have only to play what I like when I like.

Easy choice. For me anyway.

[hit_ny]

I guess we are pretty close to the theoretical max size for lossless..

ok...heres a thought...i feel with electronic or machine generated music..the amount lost to compression is small(er) than if the music was created by non-electronic sources.I'm guessing the reason for this is machine generated music is less rich (for the moment) and hence is less noticeable when compressed.

..so in theory if u listen to electronic music you aren't missing that much with compression (APS for instance) ...conversely ..u need lossless for the rest.

This might be used as a rough measure to decide which codec to use (and optimise for space) .

Admittedly its simpler to standardise on one format.