Topic: What do you rate as the best Soundcard ? (Read 3479 times)

sub-24 · « **on:** July 23, 2002, 01:05:47 pm »

My previous post seems to have dissapeared.

So what is the best soundcard - for quality rather than options.

Waiting.

zevele1 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 23, 2002, 01:18:26 pm »

For Godot?

ChicoSelfs · « **Reply #2 on:** July 23, 2002, 01:21:14 pm »

SoundBlaster Audigy --------- Games
Terratec DMX 6fire 24/96 ---- Music recording and edition

Dave · « **Reply #3 on:** July 23, 2002, 02:26:13 pm »

Turtle Beach Santa Cruz. Can't beat the price for what this card does.

sub-24 · « **Reply #4 on:** July 23, 2002, 02:29:29 pm »

Chico Thanks for the reply.

Zev Didn't quite understand yours. I know you are a great lover of music rather than Hi Fi and cant quite understand why you spend so much time posting off topic remarks here.

My question was genuine as to what other users out there are doing and using. I'd rather hear from real users than read biased reviews in magazines.
If you dont have anything nice to say, then dont say anything at all.

Bruce Springsteen - Ghost of Tom Joad - My Best Was Never Good Enough

Any player - any Hi-Fi - Anywhere

Fastyves · « **Reply #5 on:** July 23, 2002, 02:41:56 pm »

Hi Mikeh,

Have a look at this previous thread and you'll have some nice links.

http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/interact/NeoBoard.pl?Action=ShowPost&Board=inter&Post=12295&BoardIdle=7&SortingBy=0&BoardOrder=Descend&Page=0&UserSession=jacobsy.102746374494789&Marked=

Yves.

savamutt · « **Reply #6 on:** July 23, 2002, 04:30:26 pm »

"Best" sound card is a loaded query. I currently own 6 sound cards, two dirt cheapies, an Audiophile 2496 Delta, a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz, a SoundBlaster Audigy MP3|PLS|, and an older SoundBlaster.

What do you want to do? Are you a musician who wants to record demo tracks through your computer? Are you a DJ who wants to mix up a fruit salad of sound? Or do you just want top quality MP3 playback through your computer's sound system?

British readers of PC Sound magazine who are mostly professional musicians, rated the Audiophile 2469 Delta as the top computer sound card on the market last year (or maybe it was in 2000). Anyway, I have one. I bought it through e-bay for $159 plus shipping and insurance. It retails for $229.

The Audiophile 2496 Delta is a fabulous sound card, a German-designed sound card with typical German engineering standards and typical German considerations of quality, yet it isn't the best sound card for all users. It is really aimed at the professional musician market, at people who want to record demo tracks through a computer and at DJs who do a lot of mixing.

The Audiophile 2496 Delta also has some limitations I don't like as far as playback goes, especially in conjunction with Media Jukebox (volume controls are disabled for instance), and there is no capacity for a headphone outlet, none for a joystick either.

So currently I use a $100 Soundblaster Audigy MP3|PLS|. Guess what? This is the EXACT same sound card as the $200 Audigy Platinum. The latter comes with a front face plate for earphone convenience and a remote control (what on earth do you need that for??), and a software bundle including more extemporaneous bells and whistles (like games), but as far as the actual sound card is concerned, the $100 Audigy MP3|PLS| and the $200 Audigy Platinum are the same card.

I'm not a gamer nor am I a musician. I'm a commercial writer who spends 70|PLS| hours a week at my computer, so I like quality background music while I work, and I like to control my audio library from my computer. This is where the Audigy MP3|PLS| excels, because it is a computer user's sound card in all respects, and insofar as cleaning up clacks, hissing, pops, and other recording noises, nothing beats the SoundBlaster Audigy cards. The Turtle Beach Santa Cruz comes very close, but the Audigy MP3|PLS| still edges it out as a better choice in my experience.

In spite of whatever sound card you ultimately decide upon, if you are a Media Jukebox user, don't leave home without DFX. It'll make the worst sound card sound 300% better, and it'll make a quality sound card perform like a high-end tube component.

ChicoSelfs · « **Reply #7 on:** July 23, 2002, 04:42:23 pm »

Want to see more?! enter HERE

Charlemagne 8 · « **Reply #8 on:** July 23, 2002, 05:02:53 pm »

No sound card. I switched to Stereo-link which is a USB to RCA output device. It works great.

"Waiting for Godot" is a French play that is very "artsy". In other words, you can't understand it no matter what language it's done in.

I've been to some presentations of it (at least 2) and can never manage to stay awake for long enough to even TRY to understand. There's two guys at a bistro table and the premise is that they are engaged in idle conversation until this fellow "Godot" shows up. As well as I can remember, that's all they do ... sit and talk. Godot NEVER DOES show up.

CVIII

JohnH · « **Reply #9 on:** July 23, 2002, 05:21:04 pm »

No, that was 'My dinner with Andre'. 'Waiting for Godot' was 2 guys by the side of a trail/road near a tree. Basicly 2 versions on a theme with 'Waiting for Godot' the French original stage play by some french philosopher, Sartre I think.

ChicoSelfs · « **Reply #10 on:** July 23, 2002, 05:23:04 pm »

In that way you don't have the background noise that's good but you don't have also the 5.1 system you only have 1 stereo output. Correct me if i am wrong but i'm curious about this

gateley · « **Reply #11 on:** July 23, 2002, 06:08:34 pm »

Hi mikeh,

I had an M-Audio Delta DIO 2496, and now have a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz. I use(d) both to feed digital to my home stereo.

The 2496 was expensive, it had two channels digital in (coax), two channels digital out (coax) and two channels digital out lightpipe. No a/d or d/a anywhere. For sound quality, I couldn't tell the difference between it and the turtle beach, though I didn't do side-by-side tests or anything. I have a sony stereo with two of the 4 foot tall sony speakers. No magnaplanars or electro-statics or digital amplifiers or any of those cool toys.

A couple of points: unless you want the lightpipe, go with the audiophile 2496 instead. It's got a couple of d/a or a/ds on it, more connectors on the back. I don't know if digital through coax is any different than digital through lightpipe.

A real drawback of the delta is that it only does stereo. None of the newer multi-channel formats. It's okay for me because I don't watch tv/movies, but most people do.

I had a power failure during a storm (no UPS at home) and the surge toasted the delta card. (This was through a surge protecting power strip). The card wasn't really toasted, but after a few minutes playback, it would start having gaps. Rather than hassle with trying to get it fixed, I got the turtle beach.

I know you asked about 24 bit 96 khz somewhere. I've seen SACDs in the Sony Store in New York City (in the Sony Building of course), but nowhere else. I'm not sure it's gonna take the music world by storm. (I saw them about a year ago there).

Zevele may not always stay on topic, but he has quite interesting contributions. The language barrier is never easy, and when communicating via typing it's even worse.

j

Trelane · « **Reply #12 on:** July 23, 2002, 06:23:34 pm »

I'm with C8. Stereo-Link. If I were to get an internal board (which I doubt I ever will again), it would definately be the Santa Cruz.

Scronch · « **Reply #13 on:** July 23, 2002, 06:57:00 pm »

Before you buy an internal soundcard, you should be aware of the electrical noise levels within a PC. Review the spectral plots put up by stereo-link. Read the first page, then be sure to click on the light-blue plot icons on the left-hand side (wireless, 20 bit pro dac, usb converter, 24 bit dvd), and notice that the pop-up windows have a NEXT button at the bottom (each contains multiple plots). Start HERE. I think you will be surprised.

Scronch

Scronch · « **Reply #14 on:** July 23, 2002, 07:01:16 pm »

Start HERE

Continuing Interact problem: When I add an URL, hit Preview First, then Reply, Interact screws up the URL.

Osho · « **Reply #15 on:** July 23, 2002, 07:46:54 pm »

Try LynxTwo/Lynx L22 .. they have some of the best converters I have ever heard (both A to D and D to A). At 1000 and 700 street price, they are a bit expensive but worthy every penny if you are looking for quality.

Osho

Vlad · « **Reply #16 on:** July 23, 2002, 08:04:57 pm »

Hi mikeh,

I've been watching this thread (and your previous one which mysteriously disappeared

) with great interest. If I remember correctly, you started off by stating that your primary interest was "Hi-Fi/Music". That being the case, I assume that, like me, you have no interest in AV recievers, Dolby 5.whatever or DSP in general. You want a rock-steady and stable digital signal to feed your Hi-Fi stereo DAC. This, in turn, is feeding an amp and speakers which are to some extent revealing and accurate, and whose prime purpose is music reproduction. If so, then we are on the same journey and I can share a few experiences.

I'm running an M-Audio Delta DiO 2496. I believe that gately is mistaken about it's features. Mine has 6 sockets;S/PDIF coax digital input & output, TOSlink optical digital input and output, and a pair of RCA analogue outputs. It definitely has an onboard DAC. (see http://www.midiman.net/products/m-audio/dio2496.php). I've been using the analogue output to feed my personal workstation system consisting of a Cyrus2 |PLS| PSX driving a pair of Monitor Audio Studio 2s. Not high-end by any means but still a respectable piece of kit.

I was very impressed by it's analogue output. I thought it was more or less on par with my main, home CD player until... The Cyrus developed a fault and I took it to a repairer who is also an agent for ME (a respected Australian audiophile amplifier manufacturer). He was kind enough to lend me an entry-level ME integrated amp as the repair was going to take several weeks. Unlike the Cyrus which, though I like the sound, is a bit on the "warm and wooly" side, the ME is VERY accurate and revealing. Comparing the analogue output of the M-audio to my mid-80's vintage Sony CDP-557ES through the ME, the CD player is much better (it's had a few tweaks over the years).

Ultimately that's irrelevant because like you, I will also be using an external DAC for my main home system. (In fact, the Apogee DA-1000E-20 that I picked up on E-Bay for a song should be arriving any day now

.)

I will continue to use the M-Audio analogue outputs for my personal sound system. It's mainly for background music rather than "serious" listening. With the Cyrus amp, it's fine, but if you go up a notch or 2 in amp quality, it's definitely not. This is why I strongly disagree with Matt's advice earlier today to spend any extra money on an amp or speakers. The components must be in balance. If the source is not up to scratch then a "better" (more revealing) amp will just show up the defects, and cause fatigue.

I ultimately want to use a laptop, plugged into the home network to drive the main stereo system in the living room (small, quiet, inexpensive for a 2nd hand one). So, my holy grail is to find a reliable USB digital source. I've looked at the Edirol UA-1D but am put of by the long list of incompatible USB chipsets. I've also red some threads on other forums that it modifies the signal. M-Audio have recently released their own version called the Sonica. I was very excited about that until I discovered that it only had optical out, so it's no good with my Apogee.

The other important issue is general stability. I've heard various reports of M-Audio cards having problems with Windows 2000 and VIA chipsets. Of course I'm running both (Murphy's Law). Occasionally I get a loud buzz for 2-3 seconds while MJ connects to CDDB. Sometimes, the sound becomes crackly (usually after some installs) and needs a reboot to fix. I can't say that it's totally stable, but if used on a dedicated Hi-Fi source machine that doesn't run lots of applications or connect to the web while playing music, I've found that I can trust it.

If I can't manage the USB option, I'd consider using another M-Audio in the living room as a digital source. Besides, it's not as if there's much to choose from. Most of the higher quality "pro-sumer" gear is full of features that I have no interest in and certainly don't want to pay extra for (8 or more channels, ADC, DSP etc.) The M-Audio Deltas are the simplest and cheapest option.

Hope that's helped.

PeterE · « **Reply #17 on:** July 24, 2002, 07:21:02 am »

Some interesting ideas but...

MJ and my PC are primarily a source component of my HiFi. I'd like to get digital data out from the PC and into an "audiophile" DAC without using any PC cards or widgets.

Any ideas?

Osho / Gately - does the 2496 or DIO offer any facility to bypass the oncard DACs?

Mike - great minds think a like (glad to see you're working as hard as I am!!!)

Gatobrit · « **Reply #18 on:** July 24, 2002, 07:35:02 am »

Hi - the StereoLink appears to have many fans here. Has anyone tried the Harmon Kardon DAL150? Harmon Kardon DAL150 Alternatively the Xitel DG2? Xitel DG2

I have a digital input to my Denon receiver going begging. Going from USB to Digital to the receiver would appear, on the face of it, to provide better sound quality.

I haven't seen any reviews of the unit so input would be appreciated...

Scronch · « **Reply #19 on:** July 24, 2002, 08:59:20 am »

Gatobrit -

Not necessarily. You have to look at the quality (i.e. raw cost) of the DAC chip inside your amp as compared to the DAC chip in the stereo-link or other external DAC. Think about what you paid for the amp, back out retailer profit, wholesaler profit, manufacturer profit, and you can probably guess the component manufacturer's price for the DAC chip (probably about 5 bucks). Do the same for a unit like the stereo-link, and I come up with a much higher number. I realize this is full of assumptions, but here is what stereo-link told me in August of 2001:

Most multi-channel receivers and amplifiers today have some form of digital input - its primary purpose is to get a multichannel Dolby or DTS digital stream into the receiver in order to do the decoding. That does not imply that a digital input is inherently better for 2 channel music. All it means is that you will use the product's internal Digital to Analog converters (DACs) to convert the digital stream to analog before it is amplified. If these converters are known to be of better quality than those in your CD, DVD etc, then it makes sense. If not, the analog outputs of those devices may actually be of better quality (better noise, distortion, etc).

On the stereo-link 1200, out goal was to produce the best quality DAC possible at an affordable price, and to optimize it for the special application of connecting a "noisy" computer to a good quality audio system. We used our experience in professional and high-end systems to do this, and we think we've done a pretty good job of making a product that really sounds good. As part of our website update, we will be putting up comparison measurements in the next day or so - and they will show this in much greater detail than you're likely to get from any other manufacturer.

Some folks never believe what manufacturers say, but I was convinced by the spectral plots comparing the SL1200 to a professional DAC.

Scronch

cjdshaw · « **Reply #20 on:** July 24, 2002, 09:17:35 am »

I've just bought the Abit UA11 and it's lovely. Optical SP/DIF to my AV amplifier. It will also pass Dobly Digital and DTS from DVD's straight to the amp for decoding. If only MJ could encode its output as a 5.1 channel AC3 stream

For about £40 it seems like a pretty good option if you already have a decent amp.

Gatobrit · « **Reply #21 on:** July 24, 2002, 09:37:59 am »

Scronch - seems reasonable. I want my cake and eat it too - I would like to avoid too many cables - Herself has esthetic input to the digital-to-audio conversion process that goes beyond to cost of DAC components.

For $60 I will probably try the Xitel unit and let everyone know how it goes.

cjdshaw - the Abit unit isn't available in the US at present. :-(

MHorton · « **Reply #22 on:** July 24, 2002, 10:53:40 am »

waiting . . . for godot

that was funny

keep up the good work zevele10

don't let the humorless get you down

Michael

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Author Topic: What do you rate as the best Soundcard ? (Read 3479 times)

zevele1

Dave

savamutt

JohnH

gateley

Scronch

Scronch

Vlad

PeterE

Scronch

cjdshaw

MHorton