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[Qythyx]

I just noticed that DSP isn't working for some tracks. So far I've found it isn't working for some tracks that I recently imported. These tracks are in the same format (lossless WMA) as all of my other tracks.

I use DSP's Effects, Equalizer, Output Format (to play in 5.1), and Volume Leveling. As far as I can tell none of these are taking effect for these problematic tracks. Other, older tracks are fine.

Any ideas?

[Alex B]

How did you create the new files? How do they differ from the old files?

Could you create a small sample file, upload it somewhere and post a link here?

[Qythyx]

They were bought as iTunes+ tracks which I exported from iTunes as WAV and then encoded into lossless WMA inside MC. I have other iTunes+ songs that were imported in the same was that are fine.

I'll try to truncate a track and put it someplace. If I can get is small (a few hundred kb), can I email it to someone?

[Alex B]

I can't reproduce the problem. I converted a standard 16-bit / 44.1 kHz stereo wave file to WMA Lossless with MC13.0.171 and all DSP features are available during playback.

Please verify that you are really playing the WMA Lossless file versions. Select one of the affected files and check the tags inside the library (Filename / File Type). You can also click the topmost, "format", line in Action Window > Tag to open a detailed format info window.

If the files really are in the WMA Lossless format could you by any chance have changed the playback method setting in "Options > File Types > Audio > Windows Media Audio (wma, wax)"? The default is "Automatic".

[Qythyx]

I confirmed the file is lossless WMA:
Audio Codec: Windows Media Audio 9.2 Lossless
Format: VBR Quality 100, 44 kHz, 2 channel 16 bit 1-pass VBR
Protected: No
Seekable: Yes
Trusted: No

WMA Tag dump:
    Signature_Name:
    Title: Shell Shock
    Author: Heart
    WMFSDKVersion: 12.0.7100.0
    WMFSDKNeeded: 0.0.0.0000
    WM/ToolName: Media Center
    WM/ToolVersion: 13.0.171
    WM/Genre: Rock
    WM/Year: 1985
    WM/TrackNumber: 10
    WM/AlbumTitle: Heart
    JR/Disc#: 1
    JR/Date: 31048
    JR/PeakLevel: 0.999970018863678
    JR/BPM: 129
    JR/ReplayGain: -13.4760899999999992
    JR/Intensity: 5
    Duration: 121190000
    Bitrate: 914947
    Seekable: Yes
    Stridable: No
    Broadcast: No
    Is_Protected: No
    Is_Trusted: No
    HasAudio: Yes
    HasImage: No
    HasScript: No
    HasVideo: No
    CurrentBitrate: 889194
    OptimalBitrate: 889194
    HasAttachedImages: No
    Can_Skip_Backward: No
    Can_Skip_Forward: No
    FileSize: 1579062
    HasArbitraryDataStream: No
    HasFileTransferStream: No
    WM/ContainerFormat: 1
    IsVBR: Yes
    WM/SharedUserRating: 50
    ASFLeakyBucketPairs: <unknown data>


You said that you tested it and found "all DSP features are available during playback". I just want to make sure we're on the same page. I also see the DSP features and can adjust their settings, but the don't have any effect.

Almost my entire library is WMA lossless, and DSP works fine for 99.9%. For some reason there're a few tracks that are a problem.

I managed to truncate the file to the first 12 seconds using Windows Media File Editor. It's still about 1.5MB, though.

[Alex B]

You said that you tested it and found "all DSP features are available during playback". I just want to make sure we're on the same page. I also see the DSP features and can adjust their settings, but the don't have any effect.

DSP worked fine when I tested the file.

Are you sure that all DSP features have this problem? Something like an extreme EQ setting would be easy to distinguish.

If you happen use the album mode are the files imported? As you probably know, it is possible to play unimported files. The album analyzer calculates the album gain tags only when the files are actually imported.

I uploaded a sample package to rapidshare: Samples_MagicMushrooms30s.zip (6.1 MB)
I contains two WMA-LL sample clips. The samples are identical except a 12 dB volume level difference. If replay gain doesn't work the difference is clearly audible. Could you try them?

You can use the same place for uploading your sample (www.rapidshare.com).

[Qythyx]

I'll try them, although I won't be able to until this evening when I get home. But, I'm not sure what testing them will tell us. As I mentioned, the vast majority of my tracks work fine with DSP. I'm only having a problem with a very few. Given that, I'd expect the sample you have to work fine.

FYI, the tracks that are problematic are in my library and were analyzed. For these tracks all 3 of the DSP compontents I have turned on are not working:

Effects - The Environment, Subwoofer, and Surround Field settings are quite obvious when they're working, but not for these tracks.

Output Format - I have 5.1 speakers and use the Channels setting to take advantage of them, with these tracks there's nothing coming out of the back speakers. Other tracks are fine.

Volume Leveling - Same as above, these tracks don't seem to be leveled.

[Qythyx]

Sorry for the very slow reply. I got busy. I finally had a chance to upload a track to RapidShare, http://rapidshare.com/files/257880308/02_What_About_Love.wma.html.

I'm not actually sure if my problematic tracks do have any DSP applied to them, but they certainly do not play in 5.1 sound, which other tracks play as fine. Also, this problem exists in MC 14 as well, in fact, I'm no longer using 13, so if you come up with a fix please apply it to 14 too. 


As for the track you uploaded, it played fine in full glorious 5.1.

[MusicHawk]

Left field info:

I use a different DSP plug-in and different music file format, but I found that certain tracks pass through the DSP chain unprocessed.

Querying the plug-in's creator, he says this happens when the music track is in a format that the DSP doesn't explicitly handle -- in my case, a few tracks were ripped long-ago at oddball rate 48K, and some mono tracks were ripped as 1-channel when the DSP assumes all tracks are 2-channel.

Rather than go silent on these tracks, the plug-in I'm using just passes through the audio stream unprocessed, then resumes working at the next track. So maybe there really is something about your "problem" track that is triggering similar behavior in your plug-in.

[Alex B]

Sorry for the very slow reply. I got busy. I finally had a chance to upload a track to RapidShare, http://rapidshare.com/files/257880308/02_What_About_Love.wma.html.

I'm not actually sure if my problematic tracks do have any DSP applied to them, but they certainly do not play in 5.1 sound, which other tracks play as fine. Also, this problem exists in MC 14 as well, in fact, I'm no longer using 13, so if you come up with a fix please apply it to 14 too.  

I can't reproduce the problem with your file.

The first attached screenshot: DSP > Output Format > 5.1 Channels (Clone). My soundcard outputs to all 6 channels just fine.

Though, the fake surround option (JRSS 2.0) outputs very little through the rear channels. Except some occasional bursts the rear channels remain almost silent at a reasonable output volume level (the second screenshot). I have never used this option before so I don't know if this particular track doesn't contain audio information that creates meaningful rear channel output or if the situation is the same with all 2-channel stereo sources.


The attachments are available only if you are logged in to the forum.

[Alex B]

I inspected the file in Adobe Audition. It is almost monophonic and that is the likely cause of the problem. When the right channel data is reduced from the left channel data the remaining difference signal is about 35 dB below the track's original average volume level.

I think the JRSS processor uses the channel difference signals (L-R and R-L) when it creates the fake rear channels.