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[Magic_Randy]

I'm thinking of getting an iMac with Parallels Desktop so I can still run the handful of critical applications are only available for Windows.

When I'm working with media (pictures, music, movies...) can I access the same files with both Mac and Windows applications? As an example, can I use MC for all of this as I do today and still use Mac software like Final Cut Pro to edit my movies? Or maybe the Mac version of Lightroom but still use MC with the same files?

[MrC]

The fast answer is Yes.

1) The Mac can share directory trees using Windows File Sharing, so its available to any Windows environment via UNC paths or Windows Shares.

2) Parallels supports mapping the Mac directories into Windows, via its auto-installed/managed Parallels Tools (essentially a bunch of drivers, etc. to allow the emulated OS environment to be well integrated into the native OS, and vice-versa).

It would be worth getting Glynor's input on this, as he probably uses it far more heavily than I do.

[Magic_Randy]

Thanks MrC.

Let's see if glynor sees this thread and comments.

[goatherder]

Yeah, but the thing is, is there truly a point? It won't play nicely in the Apple ecosystem. Unless it's a purely standlone, one-machine aspect you're better off
a) Not going Mac
b) Going all-out iPhool ecosystem junkie.

Been there, done that. b) is painless, but you won't have the control of MC.

Neither is a good or bad decision, it's just which works for you the best.  Boot Camp / VM for regular use is IMO the worst of both worlds, though it's unsurprising to see Apple junkies espouse it as better. 

[Magic_Randy]

Thanks goatherder...

[glynor]

Thanks MrC.

Let's see if glynor sees this thread and comments.

I didn't see it until today, sorry.

If you still want comments, ping me.

[glynor]

I decided to actually read more, figuring other people might ask.

When I'm working with media (pictures, music, movies...) can I access the same files with both Mac and Windows applications? As an example, can I use MC for all of this as I do today and still use Mac software like Final Cut Pro to edit my movies? Or maybe the Mac version of Lightroom but still use MC with the same files?

Yes, absolutely on all counts.

1. Mac OSX can read/write to FAT volumes, and read-only NTFS volumes.  If you need to read/write NTFS volumes directly, Paragon Software makes a very nice, cheap NTFS Filesystem driver for Mac OSX which works beautifully (and, by the way, their similar HFS+ Filesystem driver for Windows also works perfectly).

2. Parallels Desktop has a built-in sharing system which is very seamless, even without being able to directly read/write to NTFS volumes.  When you boot the VM, it mounts the Windows disk (whether it is your boot camp partition or a VM virtual disk) to the Mac just like any other disk.  In fact, they even have features that "link" common "special folders" back and forth seamlessly (Desktop, Downloads, My Documents, etc).  So, in my VM, when I save something to the Windows Desktop, it appears on both my Windows Desktop and the Mac OSX Desktop, because they both point to the same "directory" on disk.  In addition to the built-in shares, you can set up your own.

3. Mac OSX can share via SMB (Windows-style file shares).  So sharing files stored on a Mac with a Windows computer works fine.  Likewise, Mac OSX fully supports Windows style shares, CIFS, and even UNIX/Linux style shares (since it is BSD Unix under all that chrome), so it is far more capable than Windows from a file-sharing perspective.

4. Parallels Desktop does some very slick behind-the-scenes sharing as well.  You can do things like drag-drop a JPG from MC running in "Windows" directly into Photoshop running on the Mac and it works.  Basically, since that C drive is mounted, Parallels automatically translates the filesystems calls as appropriate depending on your drop target.  This works extremely well if you are drag-dropping from your C drive (or a Mac drive) in MC, but less so if you are using a file on a separately-defined UNC share.  It still works though.  My copy of MC at the office has all of the files imported directly from Windows shares in \\servername\share\ UNC format.  These shares are NOT mounted as network drives on either the "Mac side" or the "Windows side", they are just referenced in MC.  In this case, I can drag-drop from MC to a filesystem location on the Mac side and it works (to the desktop, or to a different place in the filesystem on the mac), but I can't drag directly into another application like Photoshop.  This is NOT the case if you are using an actual mounted network drive in Windows (with a drive letter).  In that case, Parallels also mounts the network drive directly to your Mac (it shows on the OSX desktop) and the drag-drop integration stuff all works perfectly.  For UNC paths in MC, you can solve this using the sharing features of Parallels if you are determined, but I'm not determined.

I've had less success with this using VMWare Fusion, which is one of the reasons I prefer Parallels.

5. Macs can now join ActiveDirectory domains and they have a real version of Outlook.  A huge improvement.

I'd also say this...

It really is, in some ways, the best of both worlds.  I won't say running Windows under the VM is perfect in every way, but there are many little things about it that are very handy and a better user experience than just using Windows on a regular PC.

For example, Adobe wants to update Acrobat (or Flash or whatever) on the "Windows side" of my laptop?  Fine.  I only have to close out of any Windows browsers I happen to be using, and I can keep doing work.  Windows needs to reboot for something?  Again, fine, Photoshop stays running, as does my browser.  That, and "regular VM advantages" like Snapshots make dealing with and backing up Windows super-easy and flexible.  I can, with the click of a button, go back to the way Windows was on my laptop two weeks ago, non-destructively, as a test, and then just reboot to my current "snapshot" of Windows when I'm done.  I can make "safe images" that are easy to revert to, or read-only Snapshots for testing flaky software or dangerous sites.  That's very powerful once you get used to it, and it is frustrating when you can't do it on a "real PC" (you can, but only running VMWare).

And, of course, it is UNIX under there.  Mac OSX gives you a LOT of software flexibility, especially if you do things like web development.  It comes with Apache.  And Perl.  And PHP.  And CURL.  It has a "real" command line with a bash prompt.  Installing MySQL, and things like ImageMagic, is simple and it doesn't need a POSIX Wrapper.  And, so on and so forth.  Plus, if you need to, it'll run the "real" Windows version of Office or MC.  That is a very flexible solution, but that's not a reason to do it on its own (unless you really need to play with those things)...

The reason to do it is because they build the best hardware on the market that isn't custom built.  Their laptops last, and they hold their value, and AppleCare is the best warranty support in the world.

[Magic_Randy]

Thanks glynor... as usual a very thorough explanation

I'm pretty sure my next PC will be a Mac. I've been waiting for the new model Mac Book Pro or iMac to come out. I'm guessing that will happen by summer time.

In the mean time by PC seams to run better so it is a little less urgent. I replaced one of my hard drives, moved my Lightroom catalog to a local disc, upgraded Lightroom to LR 4.1 RC2, and uninstalled Genie Timeline which was a resource hog and never worked well for me anyway.

The perfect solution for me would be Mac support for MC but that is likely not in the cards. But it sure looks like I can have MC co-exist with Mac software for my multi-media.

[goatherder]

3. Mac OSX can share via SMB (Windows-style file shares).

Badly. Connect time = ages, frequent problems.

5. Macs can now join ActiveDirectory domains and they have a real version of Outlook.  A huge improvement.

AD = Badly. And no it's not a 'real' version of Outlook - significant functionality is missing. Office is still a poor second cousin, though it is obviously better than the alternatives on the platform. Incremental improvements over the previous poor integration at best.

I'd also say this...

It really is, in some ways, the best of both worlds.  I won't say running Windows under the VM is perfect in every way, but there are many little things about it that are very handy and a better user experience than just using Windows on a regular PC.

For example, Adobe wants to update Acrobat (or Flash or whatever) on the "Windows side" of my laptop?  Fine.  I only have to close out of any Windows browsers I happen to be using, and I can keep doing work.  Windows needs to reboot for something?  Again, fine, Photoshop stays running, as does my browser.  That, and "regular VM advantages" like Snapshots make dealing with and backing up Windows super-easy and flexible.  I can, with the click of a button, go back to the way Windows was on my laptop two weeks ago, non-destructively, as a test, and then just reboot to my current "snapshot" of Windows when I'm done.  I can make "safe images" that are easy to revert to, or read-only Snapshots for testing flaky software or dangerous sites.  That's very powerful once you get used to it, and it is frustrating when you can't do it on a "real PC" (you can, but only running VMWare).

And, of course, it is UNIX under there.  Mac OSX gives you a LOT of software flexibility, especially if you do things like web development.  It comes with Apache.  And Perl.  And PHP.  And CURL.  It has a "real" command line with a bash prompt.  Installing MySQL, and things like ImageMagic, is simple and it doesn't need a POSIX Wrapper.  And, so on and so forth.  Plus, if you need to, it'll run the "real" Windows version of Office or MC.  That is a very flexible solution, but that's not a reason to do it on its own (unless you really need to play with those things)...

The reason to do it is because they build the best hardware on the market that isn't custom built.  Their laptops last, and they hold their value, and AppleCare is the best warranty support in the world.

What you're espousing is merely the advantages of VM, not OS X. There's no magic that e.g. taking your example, makes Flash on OS X not also require a browser quit. So Macs got you into VM. Big whoop?

In terms of media consumption as opposed to creation, neither OS X nor Macs have any particular advantage. In fact, the opposite - and I'm not just talking about the non-availability of MC.
In terms of general productivity and entertainment, it's a tidal-wave advantage in favour of Windows - and if you believe Windows runs properly on a Mac, you have not used Windows on anything but a piece of junk.
For programmers who like to hedge their bets or develop for iOS, I'll grant you that you have no other choice unless you choose to Hackintosh.

The hardware is cosmetically very likely the best if you can't be bothered to look too hard - but is riven with engineering issues inside or is just second-rate - and you don't see it because the religious zealots actively suppress dissent. When did the Mac Pro get a rep as a quiet workstation? It's the noisiest (not to mention collectively the least reliable) workstation I've owned in the last 6 years. When did the current notebook range get a reputation for durability when they're built out of a material that bent (and it's not hard), pretty much stays bent? Because people who don't know anything automatically think 'metal = better'. Apple are geniuses in terms of having the lowest common denominator play into their hands. And Applecare has a great rep but people forget you pay for it if you want it to continue past the year, yet have this curious resistance to paying any other vendor anywhere near the same amount for often just as good, if not superior service.

Stores are good though. The number of times I've had to use Applecare I'd have gone mad if there weren't a couple of Apple Stores on the way back from work I could drop my notebooks into. Man, I'm going to be happy the day I don't *have* to use OS X.

...And needless to say, I'm not running MC on a Mac.

[glynor]

Badly. Connect time = ages, frequent problems.

I had issues with this prior to Snow Leopard.  It has been fine with Snow Leopard and Lion, which isn't surprising since they stopped using SAMBA then.

AD = Badly. And no it's not a 'real' version of Outlook - significant functionality is missing. Office is still a poor second cousin, though it is obviously better than the alternatives on the platform. Incremental improvements over the previous poor integration at best.

I agree about Outlook, though I hate the Windows version of Outlook too.  I like the OSX version of Word better.  The OSX Version of Excel is a piece of garbage.  I honestly can't remember the last time I opened an office document that wasn't PowerPoint, though, so... I really don't care.  If it opens a Word document, lets me edit the text, and can print to a PDF, then it does what I need.  I could not care less about "advanced features" of Word or anything (and if I'm going to lay out a document that needs more than text, I'm going to do it in InDesign anyway).  If Office is the main reason you are buying the PC?  Well then, YMMV.

Active Directory support can be called "working" but it is certainly far-from-perfect.  We have hundreds of Macs on our ActiveDirectory domain at the office.  They certainly have their issues, but I wouldn't say they are substantially more or less "fiddly" than the various Windows laptops we have, so I'd call that a wash in most ways.  Of course, if one of the ways you need them to work is one of the ways they're fiddly?  Well, then, YMMV.

And, yes, much of the other stuff is related to the advantages of running in a VM.  I said that.

But, of course, on Windows, you cannot get the advantages of running OSX in a VM without using a hacky unsupported method to get the image to boot.  It can be done.  I run one at home, but I'm much, much, much more happy with my multiple copies of Parallels running Windows than I am with my OSX Lion VM on VMWare at home.  You also can't simply reboot your PC and get "real" OSX like you can with Boot Camp on a Mac.  Ergo, more flexible.

When I was discussing hardware, I specifically mentioned laptops for a reason (though, I admit, I wasn't 100% clear on that).  Unless you have a very specific need to run a Mac Pro (in which case, you wouldn't even be asking these questions) then a Mac Pro is a terrible choice for you, just like buying a HP Z800 Workstation would be a poor choice for most home users of Windows.  But, for me at least, the question is simple:

1. If you are buying a portable computer, and OSX is an option, get a Macbook.  They have the best build quality and support out there (and, yes, I would certainly include Lenovo).  If you later decide you really would rather stick to Windows?  No biggie, install it and set it to boot there by default.  Done.

2. If you are buying a desktop PC, then the decision is much, much less clear.  I build all of my own, so I'm a poor person to ask for opinions, because I universally HATE all of the vendors up-to-and-including things like the Z800.  The iMac is a very good choice if you need a simple single-PC setup and you want a nice piece of glass to go with it anyway.  They're high-end compared to all the other similar "all in ones" and the support is better.  But if you are looking for a "PC in a traditional desktop box" then look elsewhere.  The Mac Pro is NOT that.  It is a workstation.

As far as AppleCare... Are they perfect?  No.  Absolutely not.  Are they better than basically every other support vendor out there for PCs that a home user might choose?  Heck yes.  And, yes, a big part of that is because of the stores (though not exclusively from that).  I've dealt with them all.  The only vendor that even comes close is Lenovo, and they don't have the presence in the States to compare to the Apple Stores and support system.  And their laptops are all thick, plasticy, junk with fiddly power supplies and questionable drivers.

Sorry, I just don't completely agree.

PS.  Calling people zealots, even in a sideways way, is the quickest way to make yourself look silly and to make your comments get disregarded on their face.  Call it the "Fanboy exclusion rule".  The way I read it when I read someone calls someone else a fanboy (in any camp, whether Mac vs. Windows, or Linux vs. Everyone, or AMD vs. Nvidia, or whatever) is "I'm an unreasonable person who doesn't have an open mind."

That's something 12 year olds do on forums like Engadget.  Lets not have that here.  You don't know anywhere enough about me and my experiences to make any kind of call like that.  For example, I don't know how old you are, but I've been running VMs since before the web existed.  OSX did NOT get me into VMs.  So stop talking out of your nether region, okay?