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BartMan01:
--- Quote from: rick.ca on August 31, 2012, 04:07:20 pm ---The fact that the configuration system can make a facsimile Theatre view from a Standard view doesn't mean there's any way to dynamically maintain it.
--- End quote ---
So it is possible to use a standard view item directly in Theater view, but there is no way to link them so that when I change the view in the standard view it replaces the copy in Theater view (resulting in that copy being dynamically maintained)? That makes no sense, since I can just go in to Theater View (and device views) and delete it and re-select it form the standard view.
If there are technical reasons that we can't have a central view library, then we need the option to either 'copy' or 'use' a standard view in the other areas. If I am 'use'ing a Standard View in Theater View, then when I change the view the Theater View copy should be replaced with my new version. If I have 'copy'ied the view, that would not happen. I hate having to find and replace a single view all over the system every time I need to tweak it.
Bottom line is there are two issues (from what I see) here:
One - It is a pain to maintain views across the system. Especially for new users since views will change frequently at first as the initial setup and 'settling in' occurs.
Two - the default views/media import options are NOT (at least based on all the feedback I have seen) what most people coming from other media managers want. There should be some work done to improve the 'out of the box' Theater View experience.
rick.ca:
--- Quote from: csimon on September 01, 2012, 08:01:11 am ---I cannot see any situation where you would want all these different areas to interpret views differently, contrary to what rick says. If I set up a view in one place, I want to see it exactly the same in all other places.
--- End quote ---
My, what clever thinking! I never said this is what you would want. I said very clearly, several times, the same view (i.e. an identical configuration) will not always produce the same result (or the result the user might expect) on a different device. So now you found one example of where this is so and reported it as a problem, while continuing to ignore what I've already explained to you. ::)
There's nothing wrong with wanting to use the 'equivalent' configuration on another device. But it's not necessarily easily done. If it were, surely it would already be so. I believe Matt has previously indicated the 'Add library item from Standard View' function is of limited value, and perhaps should be removed—because it creates this kind of confusion. I take that as confirmation it was never intended to do what you're expecting it to do, and changing it so it converts the view to one that will work on the other device is off the table—either because it's too difficult or simply not feasible. Maybe I misunderstand the situation or the circumstances have changed (that was some time ago), but you're not going to find out by muddling this completely different issue with the question of how to improve the Theatre View configuration.
--- Quote from: BartMan01 on September 01, 2012, 10:35:51 am ---If there are technical reasons that we can't have a central view library, then we need the option to either 'copy' or 'use' a standard view in the other areas.
--- End quote ---
It seems you understand the issue I've reiterated above. But I wonder what you mean here. The ability to 'use' a Standard View in other areas (i.e., interpret what is likely expected to be the 'equivalent' view at the destination, and create that) is what is needed for the library method to work. Whatever the technical reasons preventing this are exactly the same.
So my response to you is the same. If you care about the capability you're talking about, get over the fact it doesn't exist. No matter how much you think it should, it simply doesn't. I suggest you deal with it here as the completely separate issue it is, and ask the developers if the functionality you're seeking is feasible.
I still think the answer to that question could very well change if the configuration UI were improved (and the same for all devices). If it's much easier to create and maintain one view, and that view is easily linked or copied to other devices, then the need to overcome those technical issues is dramatically reduced. You would then get exactly what you want if it works, and if it doesn't, you would simply copy it and make the modifications required. This approach will also work in situations where even the cleverest code is unable to interpret exactly what you mean by 'create a configuration like this one that will work on that device'. Even if the views are fundamentally different, this approach still allows you to use the existing view as a starting point that you can modify so it does work. Simply expecting the system to something it cannot will produce nothing.
csimon:
--- Quote from: rick.ca on September 01, 2012, 01:47:57 pm ---My, what clever thinking! I never said this is what you would want. I said very clearly, several times, the same view (i.e. an identical configuration) will not always produce the same result (or the result the user might expect) on a different device.
--- End quote ---
It's not a diffeernt device. It's the same computer. If you would care to explain why you think Standard view and Web Gizmo would present the same view in a different order (Web Gizmo ignoring the sort order) then I'm all ears. I think it's you ignoring what's been said here.
--- Quote ---There's nothing wrong with wanting to use the 'equivalent' configuration on another device. But it's not necessarily easily done.
--- End quote ---
What's so difficult about getting Web Gizmo to display the same view in the same order as standard view?
--- Quote ---If it were, surely it would already be so.
--- End quote ---
No - it could be a bug in Web Gizmo's interpretation of the view.
--- Quote ---I take that as confirmation it was never intended to do what you're expecting it to do
--- End quote ---
Web Gizmo was never intended to perform sorts in the same way as standard view? I find that hard to believe.
--- Quote ---changing it so it converts the view to one that will work on the other device is off the table
--- End quote ---
It's not a different device. Have you been listening?
--- Quote ---If you care about the capability you're talking about, get over the fact it doesn't exist. No matter how much you think it should, it simply doesn't. I suggest you deal with it here as the completely separate issue it is, and ask the developers if the functionality you're seeking is feasible.
--- End quote ---
That's the point of this thread.
--- Quote ---I still think the answer to that question could very well change if the configuration UI were improved (and the same for all devices). If it's much easier to create and maintain one view, and that view is easily linked or copied to other devices, then the need to overcome those technical issues is dramatically reduced.
--- End quote ---
It's not a different device.
--- Quote ---You would then get exactly what you want if it works, and if it doesn't, you would simply copy it and make the modifications required.
--- End quote ---
Could you suuggest a modification I could make in Web Gizmo to make it sort in the same order as standard view? Both views have the same sort specification (in the display Rules) but Web Gizmo ignores it.
What are you on?
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