Topic: My One Theater View Request (Read 4808 times)

gvanbrunt · « **on:** January 14, 2012, 10:43:40 pm »

In several other threads it was stated that if we only had one request for changes in a particular area it my be looked at for implementation. So here is my one: "Cover Flow". I've had several other people I've tried to get to switch to MC. No matter how superior the other features they always complain about Theater View not being "sexy" enough. Every time I ask for an example the person always seems to show me some kind of "Cover Flow" in another program. That's it. That one feature is enough to make them not switch. Many want their eye candy, and with all the effort in setting up my hardware and library, it would be nice to have them appreciate it as much as I do...

Truth is I think Theater View looks great, but without Cover Flow it doesn't quite knock any socks off. Close but not quite. Here are some examples from a nameless other program:

Some of the key things that would be nice in the implementation:

- it would be good if you could change what information appears and how it is displayed on the screen with the currently selected cover. I think this might need to be done in the skin as opposed to a setting in the UI as formatting is key to how much information you can have and how good it will look. This would include the location of the title etc. Sometimes it looks good with the other information and in some it is better separated.
- It might be nice to have the skin pick from a few ways to "indicate" the current selection. For example "slide up slightly", grow, combine with other image (to simulate opening cover etc).
- The placement and size of the covers etc should be settable from the skin.

I know it is a big request, but that is my dream. Finger navigation would work well to as it is ONLY left or right. No up or down to worry about.

CountryBumkin · « **Reply #1 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:47:58 am »

That would be the icing on the cake.
But I suspect it takes good deal of programing to get that ability.

MrHaugen · « **Reply #2 on:** January 15, 2012, 08:45:21 am »

I agree. This is the sort of things that many users is missing. I don't necessarily have to be so much work either. Here's the mock-up I made earlier. If we drop the logo parts in the middle here, this could just be another twist of the small info pane, with cover flow list style.

Click to enlarge.

The cover flow strip at the bottom needs some time to be created, but the info pane don't really have to I think. What about the top info pane is just treated as a small info pane, but arranged a bit differently when Cover Flow is selected? The image could be on one side and the text could be positioned on the other side when cover flow was selected as a list type. For all other list types the Small Info pane would work like we're used to. Image and then text, on one side.

As for the navigation, I think that the selection of text should be disabled and an arrow up would bring you right back to the rollers. Or you could enable down button to go directly to the rollers, and up to go to the cover flow when you're at the rollers. Backspace could bring the user to the roller as well perhaps.

Just my 5 cents.

SamuelMaki · « **Reply #3 on:** January 15, 2012, 11:49:54 am »

I would like somebody (I cannot help, cause I don´t know anything useful

) create some easy-to-follow skinning tutorial for JRiver, so hopefully skinners would be more interrested about JRiver and we could have more great skins

Personally, I like a lot about Purity skin (both standard and theater view) and I´m not huge fan of cover flows, but I believe that skins can always develop better and better

I would like some theater view virtualisations or something like that (artists images were fun, but now they are just repeating and getting boring...). The basic navigation is very well executed, so it can be leaved alone...

gvanbrunt · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2012, 12:23:40 pm »

Quote

That would be the icing on the cake.
But I suspect it takes good deal of programing to get that ability.

True, but with this one change it would likely go a long way to addressing a very large portion of the Theater View requests/complaints. Instead of a long list of things to change, here is one view that addresses many of them.

Quote

I would like somebody (I cannot help, cause I don´t know anything useful ) create some easy-to-follow skinning tutorial for JRiver,

There are some things on the wiki, and some has to be found in the skinning board. You are correct that the wiki needs updating. If this gets done, I will do exactly that. I will create much better docs for skinning so others can contribute. I'm no artist, but I do have technical ability and would like to help artists help me!

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so hopefully skinners would be more interrested about JRiver and we could have more great skins

I think the Cover Flow is the key to making interesting skins. All the other views have a somewhat limited ability change they way the screen looks. For example you can't put Info on the same page as other navigation because of they way the view is laid out. This view is different. It allows a tremendous amount of customization and would probably draw a lot more people into creating skins of their own. I would be one of those people.

gvanbrunt · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2012, 12:25:02 pm »

I should also mention that if you feel strongly on this topic and would like to see the feature, give it a +1. This has worked for other features in the past...

JustinChase · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2012, 01:01:48 pm »

+1 (or 3)

nwboater · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2012, 01:12:21 pm »

While I was using SageTV there were addins that gave Cover Flow Views. They seemed to be very popular. They certainly added sex appeal to the product.

I didn't find Cover Flow to be useful. Perhaps because I'm an old far* I REALLY like the existing Theater View presentation: It's simple, classy and works very well. But I can certainly understand that there are a lot of folks that want more glitz and pizazz to the presentation. This seems to be the case where skinning and/or plugins would be useful. Those of us that are happy with it as it is leave it alone. If you want something more use a skin or plugin. But they somehow need to be available.

Rod

Added on Edit: Just reread my post and it sounds like one needs to be old to appreciate the existing Theater View. That's not what I meant. Just think that much younger people in general might prefer a flashier presentation. Oops, did I just dig myself into a deeper hole?

glynor · « **Reply #8 on:** January 15, 2012, 01:47:33 pm »

Quote from: gvanbrunt on January 15, 2012, 12:25:02 pm

I should also mention that if you feel strongly on this topic and would like to see the feature, give it a +1. This has worked for other features in the past...

While it certainly wouldn't offend me if Theater View had a view more like what is described above, I probably wouldn't use it, and there are other things more pressing IMHO.

So, I'm going to give it a 0 or -1, however you want to interpret that.

glynor · « **Reply #9 on:** January 15, 2012, 01:54:19 pm »

That said... If the current "wall" style mode was developed more (with configurable options like number of rows/columns and whatnot), it could serve to fill this function in a pretty slick way.

It would need to provide Category functionality, some way to display more info (than covers) about the currently selected item, and the video backdrop support like the rest of the View Modes. But, that plus a 1 row Wall Style display, would be pretty slick.

Again, I wouldn't use it, but that would be the road I'd suggest if they decide to implement something like this... Ever.

gvanbrunt · « **Reply #10 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:19:28 pm »

Quote

I REALLY like the existing Theater View presentation

I'm not asking to change the existing view. In fact there are more than one currently. There are list views, icon, wall, etc. I'm asking for one more. It's up to the user to use it if they wish. I probably won't use the view much myself either, but about 90% of my guests prefer it. It's simple, easy to operate and displays both flash AND information at the same time...

nwboater · « **Reply #11 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:31:41 pm »

Quote from: gvanbrunt on January 15, 2012, 05:19:28 pm

I'm not asking to change the existing view. In fact there are more than one currently. There are list views, icon, wall, etc. I'm asking for one more. It's up to the user to use it if they wish. I probably won't use the view much myself either, but about 90% of my guests prefer it. It's simple, easy to operate and displays both flash AND information at the same time...

Thanks for the clarification.

Since you were quoting me I guess I should explain that your quoted comment was really directed to those folks that are complaining about Theater View. I could be mistaken but I get the impression that many people just don't like Theater View and want some kind of fundamental changes. Thus my comment "I REALLY like the existing Theater View presentation." Sorry for messing up your thread with a comment that perhaps should have been elsewhere.

And for the record, while I don't much care for Coverflow View I do think it would be a nice additional View in the existing Theater View for those that do want some more 'eye candy'. If it really helps to bring in a lot of new users that otherwise will not use MC then a +1 from me is in order.

Rod

struct · « **Reply #12 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:40:59 pm »

Some of the images above contain fanart. Is this important for your coverflow screen?

When I have tinkered with XMBC, it was the fanart that added the glitz for me. Cover flow, is not that useful for a biggish collection (not to distract from it being a nice to have). Fanart does work in places in the current theatreview and thus not a big change to be done. Boosting it to all views and making it work off existing files (i.e. no slow downloading) would get me halfway.

Craig

Sandy B Ridge · « **Reply #13 on:** January 15, 2012, 05:41:13 pm »

Quote from: nwboater on January 15, 2012, 01:12:21 pm

While I was using SageTV there were addins that gave Cover Flow Views. They seemed to be very popular. They certainly added sex appeal to the product.

I didn't find Cover Flow to be useful. Perhaps because I'm an old far* I REALLY like the existing Theater View presentation: It's simple, classy and works very well. But I can certainly understand that there are a lot of folks that want more glitz and pizazz to the presentation. This seems to be the case where skinning and/or plugins would be useful. Those of us that are happy with it as it is leave it alone. If you want something more use a skin or plugin. But they somehow need to be available.

Rod

Added on Edit: Just reread my post and it sounds like one needs to be old to appreciate the existing Theater View. That's not what I meant. Just think that much younger people in general might prefer a flashier presentation. Oops, did I just dig myself into a deeper hole?

LOL, I agree with nwboaters sentiments - I guess that makes me into an old far* too!

For me the main focus is on the actual content ( ie the movies or audio ) and showing those in the best way (clarity, lack of flicker, PQ etc etc). I really like a 10' interface and use TheaterView 99% of the time but only as a portal to access the actual content. Since all of my movies/audio have been bought I tend to know roughly who the actors are and the plot synopsis, so 'eye candy' presentation of this is less important to me. I never got on with cover flow in iTunes anyway and prefer the MC moving 'grid'. I found with cover flow that I scrolled past the cd I wanted quite often. I really just need the grid of cover art to find what I want to watch/listen. MC does this well.

Nevertheless I can see that 'eye candy' can be useful to some and as stated before seems to be a commonly quoted 'missing feature' from those users of 'other' software that try-out MC. I guess if you're used to seeing the data presented in a certain way it is difficult to change.

SBR

gvanbrunt · « **Reply #14 on:** January 15, 2012, 06:57:29 pm »

Quote

Thus my comment "I REALLY like the existing Theater View presentation." Sorry for messing up your thread with a comment that perhaps should have been elsewhere.

Defiantly not messing it up!

Discussion and clarification are the key to getting a feature right. I too REALLY like theater view. I do find the 10 fit interface easy to use from the couch and customization of menu/views is a snap. No other software offers that, especially not with the speed. Cover Flow is the only major missing feature for me. There are some minor things I'd like there, but they can wait.

Quote

I really just need the grid of cover art to find what I want to watch/listen. MC does this well.

Exactly what I do. Also spells out why guests seem to prefer Cover Flow. It's better for browsing unknown content. It shows content AND information on one screen. And it is simple for them to navigate. Some are thrown off by MC icon views.

Quote

Some of the images above contain fanart. Is this important for your coverflow screen?

It would be nice to have but that is another feature. It requires other changes to MC for that work. For now static images or "fetched" images are fine.

rick.ca · « **Reply #15 on:** January 16, 2012, 02:21:04 am »

If this view is to be essentially a cover flow using about half the screen with data for the selected movie shown either above or below, it could be implemented in form involving very little change to the logic and functionality of the existing system. That might make it easier for the developers to create, and for users to learn, configure and maintain...

This could be, in effect, an alternative "Style" for the existing File List. In other words, it would still be possible to include categories for narrowing the selection of covers to be shown (e.g., to a genre, year, and/or rating, etc.). Many will prefer not to do that, and by not configuring any categories the cover flow would be presented immediately.
If the cover row were to take the place of the second roller in the navigation system, only some subtle changes the existing system would be necessary. (Or, if it's easier to imagine: the second roller is removed and navigation goes immediately to a "horizontal list of files represented by covers".) {Down} would select the cover row, and then {Left} and {Right} would be used to scroll the covers. Another {Down} would enter the info pane (even if it's above the cover row), which would in turn be navigated in the same manner the large info pane is now. {Left} would return to the covers (as it now returns to the second roller).
This warrants dedicated info panels, or at least the ability to create them. It would be too frustrating trying to balance the configuration of one of the existing panels so it suits this as well as other views. This could be implemented within the existing template system by introducing a "use for cover views only" switch. This would allow a template so-tagged to be placed before the template otherwise used, thereby being an alternate version for cover flow views.
To utilize the full width of the screen, the panel could simply wrap to two columns, newspaper-style. The existing background system would show fan art for the selected movie, as it does now. There could be options for small, medium or large covers to accommodate those who prefer to present a large, medium or small amount of data.
Pressing {Enter}/{OK} with a cover selected would advance to the "large panel," as it does now when a file is selected. As with Categories, many will prefer to skip that, and could do so by configuring nothing for display on the large panel. In that case, the result could be to immediately play the movie.

I've made no suggestion about the use of icons instead of text only because I believe that should be a separate feature allowing the mapping values to icons for any field, and then have the option to display those anywhere in a template.

MrHaugen · « **Reply #16 on:** January 16, 2012, 03:59:29 am »

Very good points Rick. This would be both functional and good looking, without having to do major changes and additions (I think).

)p( · « **Reply #17 on:** January 16, 2012, 04:18:31 am »

Quote from: glynor on January 15, 2012, 01:54:19 pm

That said... If the current "wall" style mode was developed more (with configurable options like number of rows/columns and whatnot), it could serve to fill this function in a pretty slick way.

It would need to provide Category functionality, some way to display more info (than covers) about the currently selected item, and the video backdrop support like the rest of the View Modes. But, that plus a 1 row Wall Style display, would be pretty slick.

Again, I wouldn't use it, but that would be the road I'd suggest if they decide to implement something like this... Ever.

I agree. The 3d wall has a lot of potential. Its different from mp and xmbc but with some enhancements could give the functionality and eye-candy people want while standing out as rather unique in its own way.

Some suggestions in regards to the eyecandy:
Most important:
1. Support for different aspect ratio for the thumbs.
2. Skinnable borders of the thumbs
3. Captions for the thumbs
Next:
4. An option to have the rollbar on top and a info field on the bottom with the 3d thumbs in between. This will allow for browsing hierarchies and to show information of the currently selected thumb.

MrHaugen · « **Reply #18 on:** January 16, 2012, 04:54:53 am »

As I see it, 3D wall is at it's current state only a showoff. Building more on this without fixing the flaws first would most probably be a miss in my opinion. A video wall would be great, but I do not want the 3D effect to be honest. I don't have any thing against the 3D wall being more customizable, but I would probably never use it if there was more alternatives of normal 2D list styles.

TMA-1 · « **Reply #19 on:** January 17, 2012, 07:03:21 am »

I believe that the visual sexiness is one of the few weaknesses JRMCs has when compared to competing media centers. I'm all for more customizations options when it comes to the visuall presentation of the media library. More cover views, skinning options, backdrop images, artist views, actor views, and everything else related are more then welcome.

Ekpen · « **Reply #20 on:** January 10, 2013, 01:17:15 pm »

Can this topic be revised for MC 18 ?
If so, I ask for it to be moved to MC-18 area.
Thanks.
Ekpen.

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Author Topic: My One Theater View Request (Read 4808 times)