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[robbbby]

I had a question about tagging before I added my huge library to jriver.  Is there a way to tag everything using jrivers extensive tagging system so that any and all tags along with cover art is stored in some sort of external database so that no changes are made to my media files?  I'd like to import everything as is then start tagging and save to a database of sorts that jriver can access for the library.

Thanks

[MrC]

MC already uses a database - it is its Library.

You can leave the default settings, where tag writing, storage of artwork, etc. are disabled.  You could also set the media or file system to read-only.

You can export the database fields to XML or CSV and do what you like with them.  I think there might have been some plug-in or other component a long time ago to take the MC data and manipulate it via SQL.  Check the Plug-ins forum.

[Frobozz]

I'm unsure about exactly what you're asking.  If the goal is to prevent JRiver Media Center from modifying the files after tag updates there are ways.

Tools >> Library & Folders >> Manage Library Fields...
That will display a dialog where you can manage the library fields (the tags).
For each field there is a setting named "Save in file tags (when possible)"
Fields with that option checked will be saved in the file as a tag
If the goal is to keep the media files from getting updated you can clear that setting.
If that setting is cleared the field and its data will be updated only in the library database.

You'll also need to be familiar with two actions to write the library fields back to tag or write the tag values back to the library database.

Tools >> Library Tools >> Update Tags (from library)
This action will update all tags with what is current in the library

Tools >> Library Tools >> Update Library (from tags)
This action will update the Library with what is current in tags

[robbbby]

Thanks, that is exactly what I was looking to do.

One other question regarding tagging, specifically for genres.

Is there a way to do multilayer genre tagging?  What I want to do, or am hoping to do, is setup all my music with the main genre and then have another layer breaking it down.  For example

Jazz
-Bop
-Free Jazz
-Avant Garde

Rock
-Acoustic
-Alternative
-Indie

I'd like it so that in gizmo if I select the "genre" option it brings up the main genre listings (rock, jazz in this example), from there I can select a sub genre and it will bring up and artist that has Rock -> acoustic.

Even better yet, but I think i'm getting carried away, is if I could give certain albums, or artists, multiple genres.  For example, some albums may be a combination of triphop/reggae/jazz/chillout and another triphop/jazz/rock/ambient/whatever.  It would be nice if I could tag an album with all the appropriate genres, then say in gizmo manually select to show everything that has the tag triphop/jazz and have both the above albums show up.

I'd prefer the latter method but if it isn't possible the first method I mentioned would do as well (if possible).

[kstuart]

The Genre tag, that is standard and shared with other programs, is a "list data type" and can have multiple genres.   Just separate them with semicolons like:

Jazz ; Hard Bop ; Soul Jazz

and then when you select "Jazz" you will see all files that have that tag, and when you select "Hard Bop" you will see all that have those, etc.   The example above would then appear in any of the three genres.

[rjm]

With list type fields, like genre, you can create really nice navigable hierarchies with the "\" character.

For your example, try assigning "Jazz\Bop" to one track and "Jazz\Free Jazz" to another. Then add Genre to a navigation pane and select Jazz to see what I am talking about.

I make heavy use of this and love it.

[robbbby]

The Genre tag, that is standard and shared with other programs, is a "list data type" and can have multiple genres.   Just separate them with semicolons like:

Jazz ; Hard Bop ; Soul Jazz

and then when you select "Jazz" you will see all files that have that tag, and when you select "Hard Bop" you will see all that have those, etc.   The example above would then appear in any of the three genres.

I'll try that but I don't think it will do what I want, it will just add a bunch of the sub genres to my first genre list creating a bit of an unorganized mess, especially if the other sub genres like "hard bop" that you mentioned above are mixed in with the albums?

[robbbby]

With list type fields, like genre, you can create really nice navigable hierarchies with the "\" character.

For your example, try assigning "Jazz\Bop" to one track and "Jazz\Free Jazz" to another. Then add Genre to a navigation pane and select Jazz to see what I am talking about.

I make heavy use of this and love it.

Without even trying it I can tell that it will do exactly what I asked about in the first method I listed. 

One other thing, does the library tagging system over ride the embedded id3 genre tag?  I don't want to bother going through or modifying the actual id3 tag if it isn't accurate to what I want to make it in the jriver library, specifically for when I start doing what you mention above with the "\".  I'd rather just leave it and have my music show up according to how it is tagged in the jriver database.

[rjm]

If you have "update tags when file info changes" on then MC will overwrite the id3 tag info. If off, MC will leave your tags unchanged.

With regard to your question about multiple genres, trying assigning "Jazz\Hard Bop;Jazz\Soul Jazz" to a single track and I think it will do as you expect.

With regard to your Gizmo questions, I don't use it and I don't know. I do use JRemote on an iPad and all of the above works great.

[Peter_RN]

Hi robbbby,

I hesitate to get involved in this sort of question as I am by no means an expert in the use of MC, barely competent is probably closer to the fact. 

However, I wonder if the solution I use with my Classical collection to achieve what you are looking for would work for you.

I use the Genre tag ‘Classical’ for all music and then use the ‘Style’ tag to separate the music into specific types so, ‘Opera’, PianoConcerto’,  ‘Symphony’ etc. This works extremely well for me especially in Smartlists.

Hope this may be of interest, apologies if its not.

Peter

[Frobozz]

There are many ways to manage and group genres.

My solution was to create a custom field.  Call it something broad like "Category". 
Have Category be broad groupings like "Rock" "Jazz" "Electronic" "Classical" "Country" "Blues" "Soundtracks" etc.
Let the Genre tags be more specific
Let the Styles tags be even more specific
For Genre and Styles I generally follow what AMG (All Music Guide) classifies genre and styles.

I modified the views I use to display the Category field.  For example, in the Panes views I have added a pane for "Category".  I can select the "Rock" category and be looking at just my rock albums.  I can select the "Classical" category and be looking at just my classical albums.  I've also customized other views like Theater View to let me display and select the Category field.

One reason I did it this way is because I didn't want the Genre tag to become too general.  For example when syncing to the iPod I wanted the genre tag to be descriptive enough to separate the blues rock from the heavy metal.  If the only genres I had on the iPod were "Rock" "Jazz" "Classical" then things would be too general to be of much use.

JRiver Media Center allows you to create your own fields and customize the views to make use of custom fields.  Lots of possibilities.  Many different ways to do things.  Go with a system that works for you and your needs.  JRiver Media Center is quite flexible.  Lots of features and ways of organizing.

[marko]

You can leave the default settings, where tag writing, storage of artwork, etc. are disabled.  You could also set the media or file system to read-only.

errm... I'm sure that "Update tags when file info changes" and "also store image in the file's tags" are enabled by default.

[MrC]

For new installs using auto-import, they are disabled:

18.0.12 (7/19/2012)

14. NEW: Auto-Import adds the option 'Write file tags when analyzing audio, getting cover art, and applying folder-based tags' (off by default, so a fresh install should never do any tagging).

[marko]

I see that, but after having been auto-imported, subsequent manual tag or cover art changes will, by default, be saved in the file's tags, which is an important distinction if never writing to files is what is desired.

[MrC]

Oh, I didn't know that.  Thanks.

[robbbby]

Ok now i'm a bit confused.  What should I change so that the actual files never get modified in terms of tags or embedded cover art when I start editing or do an update?


Also, I just finished importing all my music into JRiver (it started adding playlists and took a very long time) and I got this message

Failed to import 6951 files.
Skipped 9 files (filename too long).

I was then able to view a data log which showed me every single file that was imported and the 9 files that were skipped, but nowhere did it mention what the 6951 files it failed to import were.  Is there any place I can view to see what it failed?

[rjm]

Ok now i'm a bit confused.  What should I change so that the actual files never get modified in terms of tags or embedded cover art when I start editing or do an update?

Turn off Tools\Options\General\Update tags when file info changes

I'll let someone else diagnose you other question. My guess is that you have "ignore files previously removed from library on" and you previously removed 6951 files, but I am not sure.

[marko]

Ok now i'm a bit confused.  What should I change so that the actual files never get modified in terms of tags or embedded cover art when I start editing or do an update?

Also turn off "Tools > Options > File Location > Cover Art > Also store image in the file's tags"

I was then able to view a data log which showed me every single file that was imported and the 9 files that were skipped, but nowhere did it mention what the 6951 files it failed to import were.  Is there any place I can view to see what it failed?

I'm not sure about this either. I thought that previously removed files showed as 'skipped' in the log too, but don't quote me on that as it's been a long time. I wondered if it might be broken file links in your playlist files, but when I tried importing a duff m3u file here, MC simply added the playlist to "Imported Playlists" as an empty playlist, no failures in the log.

Did you try running import again? It won't 're-add' existing files, just scans the directories looking for any new content.

[robbbby]

I'll try to import again and see what happens.  I don't think it is the "ignore files previously removed from library" since it is a new installation and a new library.