Topic: Basic Tagging And Library Question I Can't Figure It Out (Read 3772 times)

parisphoto · « **on:** July 07, 2013, 12:32:36 pm »

If I change an album's name of all that album's songs in JR's Control Panel, and them select update tags from library, will that change be reflected in the songs tags ?
That is I have two Abbey Road albums.
One is a red book rip, the other is a 24/96 download.
If I change the 24/96 Abbey Road album;s name to Abbey Road 24/96, will two separate Abbey Road albums be displayed in the Control Panel, or will both versions of each song be displayed under one Abbey Road album title ?
I would like to have multiple albums of different resolutions be displayed under separate album titles.
Can this be accomplished.

MrC · « **Reply #1 on:** July 07, 2013, 08:49:41 pm »

People do this in one of several ways:

   a) Easy: use different album names (one per variant)
   b) Medium: add the variant value to an MC field (aka tag, property) and customize the view to show the variants as desired
   c) Semi-difficult: stacks

It seems like you want (b). Set the album values to the same for all the variations of the album you have in MC. Use a field in MC such as Custom or Keywords, or create your own new user field (Tools > Options > Library & Folders > Manage Library Fields). How you modify the view will depend which view type you want modified and how you want to navigate. Can you describe what you'd like to see, and which view you are want to base this new view on?

Note: "Control Panel" isn't a good term here. Probably just Media Center is what you mean to say.

parisphoto · « **Reply #2 on:** July 07, 2013, 09:25:26 pm »

Thanks.
I used Control Panel as that's what it's called in the Wiki, with the Standard View..

.
What I would like to see each variant of an album displayed, with it's files, as a completely separate album.
The way things are now, if I have an album Abbey Road, which is a red book rip, and an album Abbey Road 24/96, which is a hi res download, only one album, Abbey Road is displayed. All the files from both albums are listed in the MC view.
Just want to display each album separately, and the view should show just the files in that album.

MrC · « **Reply #3 on:** July 07, 2013, 09:46:41 pm »

Please show a screenshot of the view you are using, that you want modified. There are various Audio views (Albums, Artists, Files, Genres, Panes) and there is the Playing Now playlist. We'll base the customization from one of these default Audio views, but it will help to know which one so that I don't have to provide screenshots for each one.

p.s. I don't see Control Panel in your wiki screenshot. Where is it?

parisphoto · « **Reply #4 on:** July 08, 2013, 08:11:24 am »

Big senior moment for me.
It's the Content Panel, not Control Panel.
The view I'm using is the same as in the screenshot in the wiki.
I apologize for my mistake.

MrC · « **Reply #5 on:** July 08, 2013, 11:57:00 am »

That view is the Playing Now playlist view. If you have two versions of an album and are playing them both, they might show up there. But do you play both versions of the album at a given time?

At any rate, Playing Now is a simple File List, and you can't change its view (much). So this isn't the place where you can, or probably want to, change the view.

I assume you want to see the albums with the same name, but grouped together such that you can select a version to add to Playing Now (and hence play).

I'm going to assume the Audio > Albums view. See the attached screenshot.

I defined a new field called Album (special) and assigned it a calculated value as:

[Album]Delimit([Keywords], ], / [)

Then, for the 24/96 album, I set Keywords to 24/96. The view's first category is Album (special) and the file list are sorted by Album (special).

parisphoto · « **Reply #6 on:** July 08, 2013, 06:10:33 pm »

I use the Audio > Albums view, as in your screenshot.
Sorry if I did not express myself clearly, but I only play one album at a time.
My problem is this:
I have multiple albums with the same name, all flac, but at different resolutions.
I.E. Abbey Road @ 16/41 and Abbey Road @ 24/96.
In the past, using the Album View, all the files are listed together as if they were on one album.
I would like each album to be listed separately, with just the files that belong to that particular album displayed under that album's title.
I have named one album Abbey Road, and the other Abbey Road 24/96, but sometimes only one album title is displayed, and all the files from both albums are listed in sequence under the single album title.
Are you saying that I can create a new Expression Column, name it 24/96, fill in 24/96 on all the appropriate files, and them MC will display that album as a separate entity?
I'm sorry, but I don't understand :
"I defined a new field called Album (special) and assigned it a calculated value as: [Album]Delimit([Keywords], ], / [)".
Thanks again.

MrC · « **Reply #7 on:** July 08, 2013, 07:34:17 pm »

Let's change how you do this, so its more automatic. No keywords or manual setting of sample rate/bit depth flags.

Try this:

1. Tools > Options > Library & Folders > Manage Library Fields...

Add New Field

and use the definitions in the screenshot Album (special).png. The expression to paste is this:

[Album]ifelse(!isequal([bit depth].[sample rate,0], 16.44100), / /[[bit depth]//formatnumber(math([Sample Rate,0] / 1000),0)/])

2. Customize the Album view, and replace Album under Show Categories In This Order with Album (special). Do this by pressing Edit and changing the field. See Customize View.png.

3. Change the Group By for the file list. See Album (special) View.png.

Note how the albums are now grouped by the bit depth and sample rate (when it is not 16/44, where I thought you'd like it remain empty in this default case). And notice how the Album name for the Lili albums is exactly the same for both versions of the tracks (I'm only showing track 1 for all albums for the screenshot).

parisphoto · « **Reply #8 on:** July 08, 2013, 08:17:32 pm »

I really appreciate all the time you've invested in my question, but I think we've gotten way off track. The different sample rates were being used as an example. Here's what I would like to do.
Under the parent folder named Beatles there are three separate folders named HELP.
One HELP folder contains a cd rip, one contains a hi res download, named HELP Hi Res, and the third contains a copy in mono, named HELP Mono.
I type in HELP in my MC search window.
How do I get MC should show three albums, and each album should only have the files for that album displayed, exactly as in your album(special) screenshot?

MrC · « **Reply #9 on:** July 08, 2013, 08:36:47 pm »

I think you're having some general misunderstandings about how MC works.

You need to configure Views to show you items the way you want (if the stock views aren't meeting your needs). That's what we've been doing.

It doesn't matter if it is the folder or file names that are different, or the sample rate, or the album title. What matters is figuring out what you want to show, and configuring the view to show those things.

We've explored two (of many) different methods that shows that this can be done, and how it might be done. The views are all controlled by the items you configure as categories, and how you group those categories and the resulting file list.

Search just filters out values that don't match the search criteria. Those resulting items are still displayed in the same way as the configured view, as discussed above.

So, you'll need to be specific as to exactly which properties you want to show and use to group. The first example used Keywords, just because it is easy and quickly available to you. The second example used existing, predetermined fields to do the grouping. What do you want to use to distinguish separate albums, so that you can keep the Album name the same?

parisphoto · « **Reply #10 on:** July 08, 2013, 08:45:28 pm »

I don't want the album names to all be the same.
I want the HELP album with hi res files to be called HELP Hi Res, the mono album to be called HELP mono, the cd rip to be called HELP.
I want to search for HELP and have all three albums come up per your screenshot.

MrC · « **Reply #11 on:** July 08, 2013, 08:53:05 pm »

If you change your album names to be:

HELP
HELP Hi Res
HELP mono

search will reveal those items in the default Album view grouped separately, like in the screenshot.

To search for albums that begin with HELP, use:

al=[Help

in the Search bar.

parisphoto · « **Reply #12 on:** July 08, 2013, 09:08:16 pm »

That's exactly what I'm trying to accomplish, but many times multiple versions. from different albums, will be grouped together under one album title.
For example under the album title HELP, there will be two "Ticket To Ride" files listed one after the other, each from a different album.
Is the way to get MC to handle each album and it's files separately to rename the albums in the Playing Now Playlist view ?

MrC · « **Reply #13 on:** July 08, 2013, 09:27:55 pm »

I feel like I'm trying to catch an eel. :-)

The Playing Now list is entirely separate. We discussed this above. It is just an ordered File List. You can change the List Style (Details, Thumbnails, or Tiles) and change the Columns that are shown. That's it. There is no Grouping here.

If your two different versions of Ticket To Ride are listed under the same Album named Help, that's because you have the Album field assigned to Help in both tracks. You'll have to fix that. It can be automated from your file names and paths (or other property), or done manually.

You can add an expression column that combines both Track Name and Album, but this isn't much different than just showing Name and Album columns next to each other.

MrC · « **Reply #14 on:** July 08, 2013, 09:38:01 pm »

You CAN create your own view, which uses a function to tell you what is in the Playing Now list. That view CAN be grouped the way you want. It won't list the items in the same order as in Playing Now. And it isn't fast to refresh, but its as close as you can get.

Create a new view, and using Import/Export in the Set rules for file display area, set it to :

[=IsInPlayingNow()]=1

and set the view type to maybe Categories using Album as an Item to show. Set the File List to group by Album. Set Always show files.

parisphoto · « **Reply #15 on:** July 09, 2013, 03:04:03 pm »

I know exactly how you feel.
Let me approach this from a different direction.
I am working in the view shown in your screenshot album(special).
In this view, let's assume that I change the album name from Lila to Apple, the artist name from Lili Haydn to Joe Smith, and gave each song a new name. Will MC keep these changes ? Will changes made in this view be saved ?

MrC · « **Reply #16 on:** July 09, 2013, 03:12:02 pm »

Yes, the changes to properties (i.e. Album, Artist, Track #, etc.) you make in any view (either via Pane Tagging, in-cell editing, or the TAW) will be retained (so long as this isn't a read-only open of the Library). That's how you change MC's property values. And these by default will be written out to file tags (if you haven't disabled that, and the media files are writable).

parisphoto · « **Reply #17 on:** July 09, 2013, 03:24:16 pm »

Fantastic. Now we're getting somewhere.
If I change the album name in this same view, album (special), is that Pane Tagging ?
If so, what is In Cell Editing and TAW ?

MrC · « **Reply #18 on:** July 09, 2013, 03:31:50 pm »

Cell Editing: click a cell in the file list and press F2 (or slow double click).

TAW: Action Window > Tag, or Tag Action Window

Pane Tagging or Tagging Mode: http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Tagging_Mode

See Also:

http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/File_Properties_%28tags%29
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=68960.0
http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Edit_Properties_with_View_Schemes

parisphoto · « **Reply #19 on:** July 09, 2013, 04:16:50 pm »

Thanks so much.
We're almost done.
On a PC, working in this same view, I right click on a song title, and rename it.
Is the new name saved in my Library, or is it saved to a tag ?

MrC · « **Reply #20 on:** July 09, 2013, 04:25:04 pm »

Always in the Library (that's what you're changing when you F2/Rename). Next in the tags by default, if possible.

From the first paragraph of the File Properties link above:

Quote

Media Center helps you manage, organize and view your files by maintaining a collection of properties on a per-file basis. Each file managed by Media Center belongs to a particular media type (eg. audio, video, image), and each media type has a predefined set of properties available and valid for use.

Examples of file properties are Artist, Album and Genre for audio files, Actor, Director, and Aspect Ratio for movies, and Width, Height and Focal Length for images.

Initially, a file's properties are imported when the file is imported, or created when the file is created by Media Center (e.g. when ripping a CD or DVD). Typically, this data comes from a file's internal metadata (commonly referred to as tags), or is looked up from external databases. In addition, several library tools are available to assist in creating or modifying properties and tags.

Media Center can also save a file's properties to the internal metadata within the physical file itself. These tags are then available for use by other programs that support the specific file types. The tags supported by a given file type are file type-specific, but there is often commonality or overlap in various media or file formats. Media Center helps manage this by automatically mapping essentially similar tags with different names into a standard set of properties.

parisphoto · « **Reply #21 on:** July 10, 2013, 07:54:50 pm »

MrC,
The time and patience you spent on this problem is greatly appreciated.
Thank so much.

MrC · « **Reply #22 on:** July 10, 2013, 07:59:11 pm »

Sounds like you've accomplished your goals. Enjoy the music!

parisphoto · « **Reply #23 on:** July 10, 2013, 08:00:27 pm »

Be warned.
I'll be back!!!!!

INTERACT FORUM

Author Topic: Basic Tagging And Library Question I Can't Figure It Out (Read 3772 times)