Devices > Video Cards, Monitors, Televisions, and Projectors
4K TV's
glynor:
--- Quote from: Hendrik on November 18, 2013, 10:39:19 am ---Considering the lack of content and HDMI 2.0 still being rolled out only slowly, there is still plenty time for new models to appear in 2014 and prices to reach more sensible areas.
--- End quote ---
Yep.
I suspect anyone buying one of these cheap displays that is hoping to use it as a computer monitor is going to be sorely disappointed. 30Hz does not a good monitor make, and even if some of the ones out now support HDMI 2.0, none of your video cards do, so you'll still be stuck (unless, of course, they put a DisplayPort on those TVs, but I bet you the vast majority of the cheap ones don't have them).
6233638:
--- Quote from: Sparks67 on November 17, 2013, 04:50:55 pm ---So if the cost is so cheap, then explain the reason behind Mitsubishi leaving the projector and LCD market.
...
Panasonic, Sharp, and Sony are all have record losses, so how can these companies survive in the market?
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The display market has been in trouble for years.
The short version is that they saw massive surges in sales from people switching from their old CRTs to flat panels, and expected that growth to be sustainable with things like 1080p, 3D, 4K, OLED etc. when it is clearly not going to be.
Flat panel sales were good once they hit a certain price point, because people could justify replacing their perfectly functional, but bulky 4:3 CRTs with a shiny new widescreen flat panel that was only a couple of inches deep. Going from a couple of inches deep to a few millimeters thick, increased resolution, or better motion handling, is not going to bring a new surge in sales like that.
And with the sudden surge in sales they saw when they hit a point that they went from niche high-end products to mainstream, manufacturers went crazy and kept trying to undercut each other to grab some of the new money coming in, making up for low profit margins with volume, which has ended up devaluing their products, so that what may have actually be a reasonable price for a 4K display at one point, or a new high-end technology like OLED, now looks extremely overpriced. I remember when I paid $3400 for a 32" LCD back in 2006, when a friend paid about $7000 for his 32" Plasma a couple of years before that.
With the state of the economy, people don't value high end products or "good brands" any more so the Japanese companies like Sony and Panasonic have been struggling to keep up with the Korean competition from LG and Samsung, who are in turn, going to have difficulty keeping up with the Chinese brands entering the market.
Unless there's a very obvious reason for it, why would Joe Public spend $5000 on a Sony 4K TV rather than a $500 Seiki? On paper they seem like very similar displays.
That's maybe an extreme example, but I think we will see higher-end Chinese displays that will swallow up the market. Rather than a cheap $500 display with obvious flaws, make a good $1500 one, and it will be tougher for companies like Sony to compete.
--- Quote from: glynor on November 18, 2013, 12:41:15 pm ---I suspect anyone buying one of these cheap displays that is hoping to use it as a computer monitor is going to be sorely disappointed. 30Hz does not a good monitor make, and even if some of the ones out now support HDMI 2.0, none of your video cards do, so you'll still be stuck (unless, of course, they put a DisplayPort on those TVs, but I bet you the vast majority of the cheap ones don't have them).
--- End quote ---
If nothing else, it's the largest 120Hz 1080p display available right now, and apparently the 65" model will do 4K at 60Hz.
I agree that it's probably not a display I would want, but if people know what to expect, it's definitely good value to have that many pixels for such a low price. It really depends what your usage is. Some people just need high resolutions over anything else.
Sparks67:
--- Quote from: glynor on November 18, 2013, 12:41:15 pm ---Yep.
I suspect anyone buying one of these cheap displays that is hoping to use it as a computer monitor is going to be sorely disappointed. 30Hz does not a good monitor make, and even if some of the ones out now support HDMI 2.0, none of your video cards do, so you'll still be stuck (unless, of course, they put a DisplayPort on those TVs, but I bet you the vast majority of the cheap ones don't have them).
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The Chinese 4k TV's don't have display port according to http://www.displayport.org/products-database/ The only 4k TV set is the panasonic, that I listed above. The only 4k computer monitor that I saw on DisplayPort.org is the Sharp, and it has DisplayPort. Sharp is making them for Asus and Dell. Regardless, if you plan to buy a new 4k TV set, then you want HDMI 2.0 or DisplayPort. I haven't researched the HDMI 2.0 spec, but I rather the 4K TV manufacturers include DisplayPort 1.2.
Hendrik:
HDMI 2.0 has similar bandwidth to DP 1.2, so it can do 4K at 60Hz or 1080p at 120 Hz easily.
Not sure DP is really going to be big on new TVs. AV Receivers also are usually limited to HDMI, so if you want a DP connection you also need another connection to your AVR for audio, and sadly there is no pure digital audio connection with all the fancy features (8 channel audio up to 192/24, and HD bitstreaming).
Sparks67:
--- Quote from: Hendrik on November 19, 2013, 03:21:10 am ---HDMI 2.0 has similar bandwidth to DP 1.2, so it can do 4K at 60Hz or 1080p at 120 Hz easily.
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Actually, the HDMI 2.0 can do 4k at 120fps according to this video. It is briefing, but around 7:48 you see the slide on 4k at 120fps. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0JsC2Tk4Sw
--- Quote from: Hendrik on November 19, 2013, 03:21:10 am ---Not sure DP is really going to be big on new TVs. AV Receivers also are usually limited to HDMI, so if you want a DP connection you also need another connection to your AVR for audio, and sadly there is no pure digital audio connection with all the fancy features (8 channel audio up to 192/24, and HD bitstreaming).
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Your big unknown right is Apple! There has been reports that new 4k TV panel has thunderbolt on it, which is based on DisplayPort technology. The biggest problem with HDMI has been switching. A friend of mine does 100K to 450K home automation theater installations. He has been doing 4k Installs since 2011, but the biggest problem has been the HDMI matrix switch. Distance is another factor. One of his installs was with a Key Digital HDMI switch and it had problems as well. The question does HDMI 2.0 fix the HDMI Matrix switch? HDMI 2.0 is not a change in cables, as with Thunderbolt now allows for optical cables.
The new AVR receivers are all made in China now. I personally own a Denon AVR-5308 and my currrent setup is 7.1, but I could add 2 more speakers and 2 other subs. So it be a 9.3 speaker setup. I love my Denon, since it was one of the last made in Japan. I suspect once that audio gets resolved, then I have to use A/V Processor and Amp setup. Dolby Atmos hasn't announced at home theater setup.
It is the media optical solution, that is why there hasn't been any change in audio.
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