Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[bspachman]

Hi all!

I知 starting to plan for a major upgrade to my HTPC, which is beginning to show its age. Its last upgrade was about 6 years ago, when the Core2 Duos were all the rage Currently, I run a 2.66GHz Core2 Duo on a mATX motherboard from Gigabyte and am using integrated graphics.

I知 strongly considering going to a smaller, more power-efficient unit, IF (and only if), I can create a rig that can be powerful enough for Red October HQ. I have some thoughts, but can be easily swayed by opinions and research

I would strongly consider an mini-ITX form factor, and definitely prefer an Intel processor (Haswell). I知 wondering if the continued upgrades to the integrated graphics will be enough, or if I値l need to think about a separate video card. I generally will be driving a 32in TV via HDMI and a front projector via VGA, though not at the same time. I値l finally upgrade to a Blu-Ray drive. I知 used to bitstreaming my audio over an optical SPDIF connection.

Usage will be as my main MC machine, so local playback, as well as a server to a couple of laptops and DLNA boxes. As I mentioned above, power consumption, heat and noise will always be a consideration.

In terms of looks, HTPC-style is important too. I致e stumbled on the following case:
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=411
and think it's pretty sharp...

Do folks have thoughts or guidance, particularly on the mini-ITX front and on the graphics front?

Thanks!
brad

[6233638]

I think you will need a graphics card if you plan on using the highest quality scaling settings with ROHQ, but it should be able to handle lower settings just fine.

[csimon]

I have a mini-ITX board with a 3rd gen (Ivy Bridge) i7-3770T, integrated Intel HD4000 graphics. It just about manages ROHQ but would feel happier with a Haswell HD4600!

[connersw]

Haswell integrated HD 4600 should play most files just fine using ROHQ default setting.  See: http://missingremote.com/review/intel-hd-4600-madvr-performance

There is a chance that some more demanding video may require that you adjust the scaling.  FWIW, I can run ROHQ w/ bilinear scaling on an old NVIDIA GeForce 315; HD 4600 will far outperform that. 

You should have no issues running an HTPC with an ITX board.  Many are doing just that. 

[mykillk]

I have an AMD E-450 based Mini-ITX setup. It's a very slow APU, with only 18W TDP.

Yet, I have no problems running Red October HQ. Just don't get greedy with your MadVR settings (Bicubic and Softcubic work great, anything better than that gets iffy). The important thing is to make absolutely sure you are using hardware accelerated decoding of h264 videos. It is much more efficient than CPU decoding, and it makes all the difference on a slow Mini-ITX system.

[felix2]

connersw:
On the madVR Intel CPU test link you provided, it is hard to make a determination because it does not mention the bitrate of the video being tested. I can have a HD video with bitrate of 10Mbps, or up to 37Mbps, and they make a heck of lot of difference to the renderer ability to process.

bspachman:
The new Intel Haswell CPU uses finer line fabrication so that Intel can put a whole (previous generation) Ivy Bridge core into it and still have room to put a more powerful HD4600 GPU. But the Haswell CPU is no better than the Ivy Bridge. Intel integrated the HD4600 GPU so that Haswell can compete with AMD very powerful APUs. The HD4600 is much better than HD4000, but falls way short of AMD top-line APUs. The HD4600 is fine with general consumer grade video, download video. But it is very borderline with higher bitrate HD video expected of a HTPC.

I recommend one of the following for a dedicated HTPC build:
1) Use a top-line AMD APU, A6 to A8 class. Its powerful X4 cores plus integrated GPU with H.264 decode should take care of highest bitrate HD video using even the most demanding configurations of madVR.
2) Use any of previous generation Intel i7 with a mid-power external video card from nVidia or AMD. As long as the card has H.264 decode.

You certainly can pick the Haswell but you'd be wasting the HD4600 GPU in it because you still have to install an external video card. No integrated GPU can compete with an external one of today's design. The reasons should be obvious.

This is for a HTPC whose function is to play video. NOT for a gaming PC. And certainly NOT for a video creation, editing, rendering workstation. Those are a whole different ballgame.

[felix2]

bspachman:
One more thing. Watch out for those Silverstone HTPC cases. While they all look pretty, many don't have an open USB port facing the front. Some has but you have to open the metal door to expose it. Why a front USB port? Why for the wireless dongle of your wireless keyboard of course. Put the dongle at the rear and you will get almost no signal to your keyboard. You can use a USB cable to plug the front dongle to the rear port, but that only show you're not geek cool.

I use the Evermax Aurora Micro Wireless. Absolutely gorgeous. But the 2.4GHz dongle must face the front!

http://www.enermax.com/home.php?fn=eng/product_a1_1_1&lv0=3&lv1=12&no=53

[dean70]

I run a Logitech wireless receiver via a USB extender cable to the back ports. Just tuck or route the cable under the case so the k/b can receive the signal. Can barely notice it.

[connersw]

connersw:
On the madVR Intel CPU test link you provided, it is hard to make a determination because it does not mention the bitrate of the video being tested. I can have a HD video with bitrate of 10Mbps, or up to 37Mbps, and they make a heck of lot of difference to the renderer ability to process.

Agreed.  Which is why I said:

There is a chance that some more demanding video may require that you adjust the scaling.

The new Intel Haswell CPU uses finer line fabrication so that Intel can put a whole (previous generation) Ivy Bridge core into it and still have room to put a more powerful HD4600 GPU. But the Haswell CPU is no better than the Ivy Bridge. Intel integrated the HD4600 GPU so that Haswell can compete with AMD very powerful APUs.

I'm sorry, but this is simply incorrect. 

The HD4600 is much better than HD4000, but falls way short of AMD top-line APUs. The HD4600 is fine with general consumer grade video, download video. But it is very borderline with higher bitrate HD video expected of a HTPC.

I would prefer not to get into an Intel vs AMD debate, but I will say that this is questionable.  It depends on a variety of factors as well as what you want to do with the HTPC outside of video processing. 

You certainly can pick the Haswell but you'd be wasting the HD4600 GPU in it because you still have to install an external video card.

Again, this is simply not correct.  HD4600 has been proven to run ROHQ (madVR) on its own.  Granted, you may need to adjust the scaling, and you won't be running Jinc.  However, if you are looking to get by on an IGP, it can work. 

No integrated GPU can compete with an external one of today's design. The reasons should be obvious.

Unquestionably.  However, the OP is looking to build a small foot print, power efficient rig.  Will it be top class?  Obviously not.  But can it be done? Absolutely.