INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => JRiver Media Center 27 for Mac => Topic started by: macdonjh on March 07, 2021, 12:06:27 pm
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I see three tags related to composition movements:
Movement
Movement Count
Movement Number
Does JRiver (or any other software) use the metadata in these tags any differently? In other words, does it make any difference how I use them? I thought I'd use Movement for the individual movement number of a piece of music. Then I'd use Movement count to the total number of movements in the composition. I wouldn't use Movement Number at all.
So I anticipate my tagging would be interpreted as "Movement" of "Movement Count" movements. Or 1st of 3 movements...
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I'm pretty sure you can use the fields however you like. I suppose the movement count and movement number are defined as "number" fields and won't accept any text but you can change that, too if you like. The usage also depends on your overall naming structure. In my case, a track name (classical) contains:
- "track number. "
- "Composer: " (i.e. Beethoven: )
- "Composition - " (i.e. Beethoven: Symphony #5 in C minor, Op.67-'Fate' - )
- "Movement Number (Roman). " (i.e. I. )
- "Movement Name" (i.e. Allegro Con Brio)
So I use the [Composition] field for the "Composition" part of the name and the [Movement] field for Movement number & Movement name.
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Can you point me to an "article" describing how to change or add tags? I haven't been able to find out how to do that.
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I would recommend Movement Number for the number, and leave Movement for the name.
Here's an example of a well structured Name:
Piano Sonata in A: 1. Presto
[Composition]=Piano Sonata in A
[Movement Number]=1
[Movement]=1. Presto (or some might use just Presto)
The point is it is structured.
Name=Composition+Colon+Movement
-- or: Name=Composition+Colon+Movement Number+Dot+Movement
All my classical Name fields are structured so I don't have to type in movement info, it is calculated automatically. Since you cannot change built in fields to calculated data, I substitute custom [Movement #] and [Movement Name] fields.
This is the structure I've been recommending for Compositions for a long time. There's a tutorial around somewhere that includes it.
I'm sure ET's spider sense is tingling and he will shortly chime in on this thread as he is very interested in classical tagging and has written a plugin to deal with exactly this sort of data. :)
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Thank you wer,
Would you mind sharing how you calculate the Movement Number, please.
Many thanks
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Sure, although I am a little reticent, because I don't like giving people half-baked solutions, and it's still something of a work in progress.
Also, Matt is implementing some changes to the expression language that I proposed to make this sort of thing easier. Those are not out yet publicly, and it might cause some of the code to change.
But I'll put some thoughts together and post.
I would mention that generally, I would not favor putting the Composer field as part of the name, as Hawi is doing above. Classical Name fields and filenames can be long enough already, and it can begin to look redundant when every track on an album has Rachmaninov as the first word. There can be times when it is helpful to have the Composer displayed however. In those cases, I think it is better to put it as part of the Album rather than as part of the name. For example, I think it would be better to call the Album "Brahms Symphony No. 3" rather than start each track with the word Brahms.
Of course, there are exceptions. It can become an issue if you have mixed program albums. For example, I have an album of Bernstein conducting Beethoven's 5th symphony and Shubert's 8th, on the same disc. In that case, I added the name of the composer to all the tracks, since the album name cannot distinguish. But generally I don't like it, even though I did it myself. Fortunately, the vast majority of my albums are not mixed programs like that one. I would never do it to all the discs in the Mozart Complete Edition for example.
But there are probably as many different ways to tag Classical music as there are people to tag it.
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Unfortunately I don't visit the Mac Forum all that often - so this spider needed a prod - Thanks wer ;D
Designed with the help of wer and making extensive use of his tagging method/protocol the Classical Music TrackInfo Plugins I've been developing reveal more info/ tags about the Track being played and the Album it is from than any existing TrackInfo Plugins, which should make it easier for Classical Music Fans to tag their collection in an easier/ more meaningful way.
Like wer I try to keep Track Names as short as possible and one way of doing that is by not adding any part of the Composer's Name to the Track Title, I always place the Composer's Full Name in both the Album Artist and Composer fields/tags.
Likewise I only ever use - [Album Artist]/[Album]/[Disc #] - [Track #]- [Name] to name/rename tracks on disk.
Similarly I always complete all 3 Movement Tags when relevant
This set of images:-https://pix01.jriver.com/gallery/F9555BD5-69F7-4CF4-AE7C-C7452A4346FA/ET_Darkness_TrackInfo/ (https://pix01.jriver.com/gallery/F9555BD5-69F7-4CF4-AE7C-C7452A4346FA/ET_Darkness_TrackInfo/)
Will give you some idea of just how much Track and Album Info my plugins make available.
Images 5-7 are for the 3 web pages that make up the Classical TrackInfo Plugin.
The Track/Album Info page only displays the name and content for those tags that exist and have any content - Image #5.
Whilst the Tags page shows the names of every tag, including some built into the plugin that may not exist in the user's database, and their content - Image #7
To put it more simply - the Track/Album Info page tells the user what relevant info about the Track being played and the Album it is from MC already knows about whilst the Tags page tells you everything that MC does, or could, know about that Track and Album (in a more readable format than the MC Tag Window).
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I would mention that generally, I would not favor putting the Composer field as part of the name, as Hawi is doing above. Classical Name fields and filenames can be long enough already, and it can begin to look redundant when every track on an album has Rachmaninov as the first word. There can be times when it is helpful to have the Composer displayed however. In those cases, I think it is better to put it as part of the Album rather than as part of the name. For example, I think it would be better to call the Album "Brahms Symphony No. 3" rather than start each track with the word Brahms.
I have struggled with this for a while and I have come to agree with wer. I guess I didn't think this through well enough. When I get the time and patience built up I'll clean my name fields and remove the composer.
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Unfortunately I don't visit the Mac Forum all that often - so this spider needed a prod - Thanks wer ;D
Designed with the help of wer and making extensive use of his tagging method/protocol the Classical Music TrackInfo Plugins I've been developing reveal more info/ tags about the Track being played and the Album it is from than any existing TrackInfo Plugins, which should make it easier for Classical Music Fans to tag their collection in an easier/ more meaningful way.
Like wer I try to keep Track Names as short as possible and one way of doing that is by not adding any part of the Composer's Name to the Track Title, I always place the Composer's Full Name in both the Album Artist and Composer fields/tags.
Likewise I only ever use - [Album Artist]/[Album]/[Disc #] - [Track #]- [Name] to name/rename tracks on disk.
Similarly I always complete all 3 Movement Tags when relevant
This set of images:-https://pix01.jriver.com/gallery/F9555BD5-69F7-4CF4-AE7C-C7452A4346FA/ET_Darkness_TrackInfo/ (https://pix01.jriver.com/gallery/F9555BD5-69F7-4CF4-AE7C-C7452A4346FA/ET_Darkness_TrackInfo/)
Will give you some idea of just how much Track and Album Info my plugins make available.
Images 5-7 are for the 3 web pages that make up the Classical TrackInfo Plugin.
The Track/Album Info page only displays the name and content for those tags that exist and have any content - Image #5.
Whilst the Tags page shows the names of every tag, including some built into the plugin that may not exist in the user's database, and their content - Image #7
To put it more simply - the Track/Album Info page tells the user what relevant info about the Track being played and the Album it is from MC already knows about whilst the Tags page tells you everything that MC does, or could, know about that Track and Album (in a more readable format than the MC Tag Window).
I am a total noob with plugins. Would the Classical TrackInfo Plugin work on MacOS/Linux and if so, how can I get it?
many thanks
EDIT: added Linux to the question
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I am a total noob with plugins. Would the Classical TrackInfo Plugin work on MacOS/Linux and if so, how can I get it?
many thanks
EDIT: added Linux to the question
Although I don't own, or have access to, a Mac or Linux PC I'm assuming that, since all they use is HTML, CSS and JavaScript. they will work on both Mac and Linux
Once the Plugins have been added to the MC Accessories Database/Page I'll come back to this thread to let everyone know how they can get the plugins and also provide a link to a forum thread I'll create to inform users about them.
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Thank you EnglishTiger. That sounds great
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Ok I finished that tutorial on parsing the movement information. I hope you all will find it useful.
To make it easier to spot, I put it over in the Windows forum, since that seems to be the main board.
You can look at it here:
https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,128884.0.html
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Those TrackInfo Plugins designed specifically for Classical Music I mentioned in my first post, Reply #6, are now available for download
You can read about them here - https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,129621.0.html (https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,129621.0.html)
And download them here - https://yabb.jriver.com/mediacenter/accessories.php (https://yabb.jriver.com/mediacenter/accessories.php)