INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => JRiver Media Center 27 for Windows => Topic started by: Roma on September 26, 2020, 03:12:17 am
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There are improvements in SQ sound on JRiver 27?
I use the JRiver only for listening to music, and after upgraring to version 27 I did not hear any changes in the sound, also i didn't find any new features for audio...
I'm a little disappointed ...
Best regards,
Roma.
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…after upgrading to version 27 I did not hear any changes in the sound…
What, in all honesty, were you hoping for? How do you get more perfect than perfect?
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Exactly, JRiver Media Center already outputs bit-perfect audio, so how could it realistically go beyond that? It can't.
Instead, improvements to audio would have to be in things like DSP, which in JRiver Media Center 27 includes the newly added VST3 support.
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What, in all honesty, were you hoping for? How do you get more perfect than perfect?
This is a strange answer, it turns out that I pay money for this, I don't get anything, and is this normal in your opinion?
Exactly, JRiver Media Center already outputs bit-perfect audio, so how could it realistically go beyond that? It can't.
Instead, improvements to audio would have to be in things like DSP, which in JRiver Media Center 27 includes the newly added VST3 support.
VST3 support this will probably be useful for 1% of users, I asked to add Group delay correction or Dirac support, many want to have support for Tidal, Qobuz....
If there is no way to improve sound quality, then you need to add capabilities with the integration of room acoustics, for example...
Best regards,
Roma.
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This is a strange answer, it turns out that I pay money for this, I don't get anything, and is this normal in your opinion?
If there is no way to improve sound quality, then you need to add capabilities with the integration of room acoustics, for example...
First of all, the people you are talking to in this thread, myself included, are users just like you. They don't work for JRiver and it's not their job to improve the software. We all paid money for it, just like you.
It's perfectly reasonable for you to expect improvements in the software to induce you to upgrade. MC27 actually hasn't yet added anything I really consider important either.
But you asked specifically about sound quality (or "SQ Sound" whatever that is). And the answers you received were quite correct. The sound quality from MC is already bit-perfect. It's as good as it can be, and as good or better than any other software. So what improvement on perfect is there? Anyone who thinks "perfect" can be improved upon is confused.
The way to increase the sound quality you experience, once you are using MC as your source, is to improve your reproduction equipment (like speakers or headphones) or listening environment.
There are other types of sound related improvements, related to processing, one might request, like I want a different filtering algorithm, or I want an enhanced spatial processing algorithm, or I want a 50-band graphic equalizer. But these are sound manipulation (DSP), not playback quality. The VST3 effort is in this category.
But there are several other threads talking about the other feature-related improvements being made in MC27, and those that are planned. You might want to check out those threads, read about the new features that have been introduced, and ask questions about those. There are threads specifically about Tidal and Qobuz, did you know that? You can also make feature requests on the forum and JRiver staff will see them and might implement them. But if you request an improvement in sound quality, expect to be asked "How, exactly?"
It's naturally up to you to decide whether to upgrade or not. Your fellow users have no interest in persuading you one way or another, so you shouldn't be surprised if they fail to make what you consider persuasive arguments.
Good luck, and happy listening.
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many want to have support for Tidal, Qobuz...
Unfortunately, this is unlikely to happen. JRiver (Jim and Hendrik) tried to explain their reasoning here: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,125509.0.html
Dirac support
The Dirac Live VST3 plugin *should* be supported in MC27 now.
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The software player should not have a "sound signature or coloration" and be neutral - "Sine in, same Sine out". DSP is a different topic. Also if all DSD->PCM conversion filters are state of art is a different thread.
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Unfortunately, this is unlikely to happen. JRiver (Jim and Hendrik) tried to explain their reasoning here: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,125509.0.html
The Dirac Live VST3 plugin *should* be supported in MC27 now.
Dirac works perfectly in JRiver 25 as VST2
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People wrongly believe that "bit-perfect" is the end all and be all of audio. That once you achieve "bit-perfect" you can no longer improve the audio output and this is far from the truth.
First, EVERYTHING contributes to the "color" of your sound, your amps, speaker, interconnects, software, etc. this is why several systems all playing "bit-perfect" audio all sound different from each other. Remember, that unlike video, there is no "correct" or "right" in audio since so many things affect your perception of the audio itself. Video though can be more directly measured and thus there is an "accurate" representation possible.
Now, back to JRiver. Certain things they can do to improve the audio - deal with latency, jitter and processor overhead. Now, technically the majority of this is in your audio driver, but JRiver can also contribute to minimizing these three factors. Each of these also directly address sonic quality.
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People wrongly believe that "bit-perfect" is the end all and be all of audio. That once you achieve "bit-perfect" you can no longer improve the audio output and this is far from the truth.
"Bit-perfect" applies only to the digital portion of the audio reproduction chain and ends at the D/A conversion. It is irrelevant for everything that follows.
First, EVERYTHING contributes to the "color" of your sound, your amps, speaker, interconnects, software, etc. this is why several systems all playing "bit-perfect" audio all sound different from each other. Remember, that unlike video, there is no "correct" or "right" in audio since so many things affect your perception of the audio itself.
I think you are confusing taste/preference with accuracy. While nothing is perfectly accurate, there are enough measures to differentiate, in most cases, more accurate from less accurate.
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Understand your misconception.
Flavor is the result of the audio reproduction equipment, speakers, amps, cables, DACs, etc.
Accuracy is based on "bit-accuracy", Jitter and Processing overhead (which can induce noise, latency, jitter, etc.)
The data laid out in non-real-time fashion is only one aspect of accuracy.
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Understand your misconception.
Apparently you do not. No point in continuing.
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Sorry, I do not mean to be "flip". I deal with this issue a lot and I did not realize who you were and what your background is. Apologies.
However, do you not agree that accuracy is a process of data delivered at the precise and accurate time. These are the elements which affect that process.
I fully agree that other processes such as the choice of reproduction equipment, both digital and analog, can affect the "flavor" of the perceived audio, and is as personal to taste as is the individual.
I also deal with video, which can be far less subjective in reproduction than audio is currently.
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Sorry, I do not mean to be "flip". I deal with this issue a lot and I did not realize who you were and what your background is. Apologies.
No problem.
However, do you not agree that accuracy is a process of data delivered at the precise and accurate time. These are the elements which affect that process.
Sure but there are elements, like cables, which are not really significant compared to, say, room acoustics.
I fully agree that other processes such as the choice of reproduction equipment, both digital and analog, can affect the "flavor" of the perceived audio, and is as personal to taste as is the individual.
Ah but I contend that any "flavor" should be avoided if possible.
I also deal with video, which can be far less subjective in reproduction than audio is currently.
Amen.