INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => JRiver Media Center 20 for Mac => Topic started by: glynor on October 29, 2014, 09:25:05 pm
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In all seriousness. I've been able to use it.
My first few attempts resulted in crashes. It didn't give any error message, just disappeared, always after around 3-5 seconds of playback (during which, it was perfect). The videos opened in Display View (fullscreen-ish, though not true fullscreen on a Mac). I noticed before it crashed, I was able to see the player scrub bar UI if I moused over it normally. One thing worth mentioning, I had the Media Server startup option enabled. I had that turned on from when I answered the question the other night, but didn't intend to keep it on, but it happened to still be enabled when I tried. When it crashed, the Media Server icon would become non-responsive for 30-45 seconds (maybe a bit longer). But, it would eventually "unstick" and then I could quit out of it. I tried launching MC with it in this state (after unsticking) but nothing happened. After exiting from the Media Server, I was able to re-launch.
I tried both local files imported into a local database, and loading my regular home Library served by Windows. But...
Now I can play them, or at least, I've had more success. I was able to play and scrub through a bit, two files just now: an episode of BBC Horizon (720p H264 MKV) and another one of Homeland (same, I think, maybe 1080p), both using a local Library, played off of my SMB network volume (regular media drive on Windows). Previously, the Homeland one (same file) caused a crash, so it doesn't seem to be file related. The only thing I changed in between was disabling the Media Server option.
As far as playback experience goes: I noticed, when playback was working correctly (it didn't crash in a few seconds), I could NOT get the scrub-bar UI on mouse hoovering. It did the grayed-out thing I posted about in another thread. Also, when playing Homeland in Display View, I got into a state where it was playing fine, but I couldn't stop it. I couldn't get the UI at the top, so I couldn't stop it. And I tried double-clicking and ESC and neither would exit Display View. Using the right-click menu (which seemed very truncated) worked though.
I collected log ZIPs twice, but none of them actually list a crash. They should (at least one of the two definitely should contain one of these crashes), but there's nothing in there. I can post them if you want them.
Lastly, just some stuff you probably know or worth mentioning:
* Display View isn't fullscreen.
* The Toolbar in Display View isn't working for me on my Mini, in most cases.
* When it works, playback in Playing Now is quite good. I noticed an audio sync issue at the very beginning of playback once, but it corrected itself and didn't slip again.
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Now, without the Media Server startup option enabled, playback from my Windows Library is working fine too.
Amazing.
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Now, without the Media Server startup option enabled, playback from my Windows Library is working fine too.
Amazing.
Yep. It is largely continuing to work now, except the "expected" (fullscreen, etc). I am also still getting the gray UI bar. It doesn't always happen immediately, though.
For example, I just checked out an episode of the Borgias and skipped around. The player bar UI was working at the beginning, but after a little while, all I could get was the gray bar. Stopped, restarted. Now I get the gray bar immediately.
(http://glynor.com/img/screenshots/MC20/Mac-Video-DisplayView-Gray_Controller_Bar-small.png)
Quit, relaunched. UI bar is back, but when trying to use it, MC crashed. The log doesn't show crashing, that I saw in quick perusal.
http://glynor.com/files/jriver/JRiver%20Log%202014-10-29%2023-37-20.zip (http://glynor.com/files/jriver/JRiver%20Log%202014-10-29%2023-37-20.zip)
I haven't seen the "after a few seconds" crash again, though, since disabling the Media Server mode.
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There are some rendering issues for video playback with Retina Mode enabled.
The OSD renders at twice the size it should, so it's getting cut off.
Looks like the video is rendered at 1/4 the resolution and scaled up using Nearest Neighbor scaling too.
I don't believe it's an issue with the renderer itself, since the scaling looks fine at 2560x1600. (instead of 1280x800@2x)
It's also been extremely unstable for me and typically crashes within the first 5s of playback.
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Just tried it out. I have my dock parked on the left side of the screen and 'hidden'. When I start a video it seems to attempt to go full screen but leaves a strip of the desktop visible over where the dock is, video then crashes right after it starts. When I 'maximize' MC itself it also leaves that strip of desktop by the dock and doesn't really go full screen.
If you want me to start a separate thread or get a log file, I can.
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Just tried it out. I have my dock parked on the left side of the screen and 'hidden'. When I start a video it seems to attempt to go full screen but leaves a strip of the desktop visible over where the dock is, video then crashes right after it starts. When I 'maximize' MC itself it also leaves that strip of desktop by the dock and doesn't really go full screen.
If you want me to start a separate thread or get a log file, I can.
glynor found that turning Media Server off made a difference.
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ASS/SSA subtitles is not suported (and probably never be) ?
How to enable Video library field on left side ?
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Import a video and it will show up.
I don't know why you would assume that subtitles will not be supported.
Things are definitely early right now though, so it might be a while.
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Subtitles will get the same support as in the windows version, it may just take a while for all things to be supported, and subtitles are not on the highest priority.
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added file location, imported and now video library field is visible. Thanks!
regarding ssa/ass subtitles, I will just hardsub them into video and problem solved.
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In all seriousness. I've been able to use it.
My first few attempts resulted in crashes. It didn't give any error message, just disappeared, always after around 3-5 seconds of playback (during which, it was perfect). The videos opened in Display View (fullscreen-ish, though not true fullscreen on a Mac). I noticed before it crashed, I was able to see the player scrub bar UI if I moused over it normally. One thing worth mentioning, I had the Media Server startup option enabled. I had that turned on from when I answered the question the other night, but didn't intend to keep it on, but it happened to still be enabled when I tried. When it crashed, the Media Server icon would become non-responsive for 30-45 seconds (maybe a bit longer). But, it would eventually "unstick" and then I could quit out of it. I tried launching MC with it in this state (after unsticking) but nothing happened. After exiting from the Media Server, I was able to re-launch.
I tried both local files imported into a local database, and loading my regular home Library served by Windows. But...
Now I can play them, or at least, I've had more success. I was able to play and scrub through a bit, two files just now: an episode of BBC Horizon (720p H264 MKV) and another one of Homeland (same, I think, maybe 1080p), both using a local Library, played off of my SMB network volume (regular media drive on Windows). Previously, the Homeland one (same file) caused a crash, so it doesn't seem to be file related. The only thing I changed in between was disabling the Media Server option.
As far as playback experience goes: I noticed, when playback was working correctly (it didn't crash in a few seconds), I could NOT get the scrub-bar UI on mouse hoovering. It did the grayed-out thing I posted about in another thread. Also, when playing Homeland in Display View, I got into a state where it was playing fine, but I couldn't stop it. I couldn't get the UI at the top, so I couldn't stop it. And I tried double-clicking and ESC and neither would exit Display View. Using the right-click menu (which seemed very truncated) worked though.
I collected log ZIPs twice, but none of them actually list a crash. They should (at least one of the two definitely should contain one of these crashes), but there's nothing in there. I can post them if you want them.
Lastly, just some stuff you probably know or worth mentioning:
* Display View isn't fullscreen.
* The Toolbar in Display View isn't working for me on my Mini, in most cases.
* When it works, playback in Playing Now is quite good. I noticed an audio sync issue at the very beginning of playback once, but it corrected itself and didn't slip again.
All the same symptoms for me *except* - disabling / quitting Media Server does *not* resolve the problem for me. Any video plays approximately 3 seconds, then crashes. Nothing in the Media Center log showing an error, but here is the relevant extract from the Console:
10/30/14 8:53:42.542 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRCmdRelay is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libdsp_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:42.542 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSWindowDelegate is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libdsp_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:42.542 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRWebView is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libdsp_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:42.543 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSView is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libdsp_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:42.543 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSWindow is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libdsp_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:42.821 AM WindowServer[236]: Received display connect changed for display 0x4272dc2
10/30/14 8:53:42.839 AM WindowServer[236]: Found 30 modes for display 0x04272dc2 [30, 0]
10/30/14 8:53:42.854 AM WindowServer[236]: Received display connect changed for display 0x3f003f
10/30/14 8:53:42.854 AM WindowServer[236]: Found 1 modes for display 0x003f003f [1, 0]
10/30/14 8:53:42.854 AM WindowServer[236]: Received display connect changed for display 0x3f0040
10/30/14 8:53:42.854 AM WindowServer[236]: Found 1 modes for display 0x003f0040 [1, 0]
10/30/14 8:53:42.869 AM WindowServer[236]: CGXMuxAcknowledge: Posting glitchless acknowledge
10/30/14 8:53:42.904 AM WindowServer[236]: MPAccessSurfaceForDisplayDevice: Set up page flip mode on display 0x04272dc2 device: 0x7fe665004260 isBackBuffered: 1 numComp: 3 numDisp: 3
10/30/14 8:53:42.984 AM WindowServer[236]: Received display connect changed for display 0x4272dc2
10/30/14 8:53:42.984 AM WindowServer[236]: Found 1 modes for display 0x04272dc2 [1, 0]
10/30/14 8:53:43.421 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRCmdRelay is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libout_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:43.421 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSWindowDelegate is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libout_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:43.421 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRWebView is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libout_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:43.421 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSView is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libout_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:43.421 AM Media Center 20[5941]: objc[5941]: Class JRNSWindow is implemented in both /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Media Center 20 and /Applications/Media Center 20.app/Contents/MacOS/Plugins/libout_Main.dylib. One of the two will be used. Which one is undefined.
10/30/14 8:53:48.564 AM Media Center 20[5941]: *** Assertion failure in -[NSNextStepFrame lockFocus], /SourceCache/AppKit/AppKit-1343.14/AppKit.subproj/NSView.m:7573
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All the same symptoms for me *except* - disabling / quitting Media Server does *not* resolve the problem for me. Any video plays approximately 3 seconds, then crashes.
I strongly suspect that at least some of the crashes I was seeing are related to problems with Display View (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=92197). I've had far fewer issues when playing in Playing Now instead.
Just to see, try changing Tools > Options > General > Behavior > Jump on play (video) to Playing Now.
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Wow, big step forward for the Mac version. Kudos to all who worked on it.
So far, video import and cataloging has worked great. Still figuring out best options for playing.
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MC 20.0.29 changes:
* Seems to have solved my Display View related crashes.
* Still getting the gray bar in some cases (as shown above). Once it happens, it won't go away no matter what (including for new videos) unless I stop and restart MC.
* I've also had, once (when playing the MPG below that didn't play right) that it "locked" and wouldn't let me exit playing video normally anymore (as described above): Double-click and ESC didn't work. Switching modes via keyboard presses, and the View Menu also didn't work. Stopping via the Player menu did, but then the next video I played behaved identically. Quitting and relaunching fixed it (and got me my Display View UI bar back again).
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I'm also getting badly "juddering" playback with an AVI file. Details of file:
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
File size : 747 MiB
Duration : 58mn 51s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 1 773 Kbps
Video
ID : 0
Format : MPEG-4 Visual
Format profile : Advanced Simple@L5
Format settings, BVOP : 1
Format settings, QPel : No
Format settings, GMC : No warppoints
Format settings, Matrix : Default (H.263)
Codec ID : XVID
Codec ID/Hint : XviD
Duration : 58mn 51s
Bit rate : 1 632 Kbps
Width : 672 pixels
Height : 384 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 25.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.253
Stream size : 687 MiB (92%)
Writing library : XviD 1.2.0.dev47 (UTC 2006-11-01)
Audio
ID : 1
Format : MPEG Audio
Format version : Version 1
Format profile : Layer 3
Mode : Joint stereo
Codec ID : 55
Codec ID/Hint : MP3
Duration : 58mn 51s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Nominal bit rate : 144 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 53.9 MiB (7%)
Alignment : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration : 24 ms (0.60 video frame)
Interleave, preload duration : 591 ms
Writing library : LAME3.97
Encoding settings : -m j -V 4 -q 2 -lowpass 17.5 --abr 144
I can email a link to it if needed. The file seems to be playing frames out of order. It seems to "jump" backwards as it plays forwards. I can screencap if needed too, but you'll see it plainly enough. Not subtle in the least.
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Other types I tried:
MKV (Video: H.264, 720p; Audio: AC3): Fine
MKV (Video: AVC-high, x264 core, 1920x800; Audio: DTS-MA): Fine
MOV (Video: AVC-baseline, 480x360, iPhone 4S front-camera; Audio: AAC): Jumpy
MOV (Video: AVC-baseline, 1920x1080, iPhone 4S; Audio: AAC): Fine
H.264 MP4, AAC Audio: Fine
MPEG-1 PS: Jumpy
MPEG-2 PS, AC3 Audio: Fine
H.264 TS, AC3 Audio: Fine
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Most of the types I've tried that have had trouble have been older, lower-quality sources. Newer, more common H.264 media seems to be playing great, and my MPEG-2 test (which was 720p) worked fine too.
Looks very nice too.
As long as you don't have a lot of the older sources, or other oddballs, once it can go truly fullscreen, it will be completely usable. If you don't mind playing in a window, it is completely usable now.
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I split some discussion of a visual glitch here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=92985.0
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Additional Format Testing:
* WMV (Video: VC-1; Audio: WMA-2): Fine
* MPEG-PS (Video: MPEG-2, 352x480, 4:3DAR, interlaced; Audio: MPEG-1): Jumpy
* AVI (Video: WMV1, 320x240; Audio: WMA-2): Jumpy
* AVI (Video: MPEG-4 XviD 1.1.0, 720x540; Audio: MP3): Fine.
* AVI (Video: MPEG-4 XviD 1.0.3, 512x270; Audio: MP3): Jumpy
* AVI (Video: MPEG-4 ASP@L1, 720x480; Audio: MP3): Fine.
* AVI (Video: MPEG-4 DivX 5.0.3, 480x352; Audio: MP3): Jumpy
* MPEG-PS (Video: MPEG-1, 704x480; Audio: MPEG-1): Fine.
* MPEG-PS (Video: MPEG-1, 352x240; Audio: MPEG-1): Jumpy
* MP4 (Video: AVC-baseline, 720x384; Audio: AAC): Jumpy
* MP4 (Video: AVC-main, 640x480; Audio: AAC): Fine
I'm having trouble finding a rhyme or reason. I've looked for:
* Interlaced/Progressive: Nope, happens with both.
* Framerate Mode Variable: Happens with some, not others.
* Codec (obviously): All over the place
* Resolution: A correlation, but not a perfect one.
The closest I've gotten to a pattern is that it definitely seems to disproportionately impact my older, lower-resolution files. I don't know if I've found a file in the 720x540 or greater range that is impacted, and definitely no 720-1080p content. When I get to older content down below 640x480 it starts to impact almost all of them. The iPhone example listed above was particularly interesting. Those two iPhone videos were both shot with the same iPhone 4S, at the same time, one using the back camera and the other using the front-facing one.
Also, during this testing, I've had:
* A few instances of not being able to exit Display View without stopping playback. This seems to always coincide with having a gray control bar.
* One instance where the video got "stuck" in a "detached" display (I wasn't trying to do that, it went haywire) that was shifted part way off screen. Very odd.
* One notification from OSX that it detected a graphics problem (which means the GPU hung and was restarted).
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Here's the GPU Reset Log from the above-referenced Graphics hang in OSX:
http://glynor.com/files/jriver/Kernel_2014-10-31-004825_tilo.gpuRestart
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Can you test one of those jumpy files in the Windows version, but set the Playback Method in the options to the "JRiver OpenGL video engine (experimental)" first for that file type?
That would help to narrow it a bit.
Also, a sample might be useful, otherwise I'll have to go dig for one.
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Can you test one of those jumpy files in the Windows version, but set the Playback Method in the options to the "JRiver OpenGL video engine (experimental)" first for that file type?
Yep.
Also, a sample might be useful, otherwise I'll have to go dig for one.
I'll post a few this weekend. Probably not tonight though as I'll have about 500 kids coming to my house.
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I noticed the thumbnails didn't build, but did if i clicked on the file. I just had a black box before i clicked on it.
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Video display shows Mac OS dock at bottom and menu bar at the top. No theater/full screen display. Theater view, video category/files in JRemote don't work.
Video files import properly with thumbnails displayed.
Running Mavericks on Mac Mini.
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Proper fullscreen playback with the menu and dock hidden is coming for the next version. Its mostly done, with one small glitch remaining.
I'm also trying to determine whats going on with the player control going gray and unresponsive, I can reproduce it myself quite easily, so I hopefully can fix it as well soon.
After those issues are sorted out, I'll continue working on audio stream selection, and other basic video playback features still missing from Mac and Linux.
glynor, any info for the broken files?
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I noticed the thumbnails didn't build, but did if i clicked on the file. I just had a black box before i clicked on it.
Black box is quite possibly the image it extracted from the file itself. The default position for the thumbnail grabbing is 5 seconds into the file, which is black for quite a few files of my own, so I set it usually to 10 or 20 for better results.
Afterwards, it may have gotten artwork from the internet, TheTVDB for tv shows, etc, which was refreshed once the view updated.
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I am not getting the gray ui bar at the top, either under Mavericks on Mac Mini or Mac Pro under Mavericks and Yosemite.
Only one small glitch as Glynor reported: the first fews seconds of audio and video are out of sync but then quickly normalize. I have only played .mkv and .mpg files, some interlaced, and no problems other than the initial a/v out-of-sync.
I hope you are planning on TV as well. I have been using Elgato EyeTV for years so I know this works very well on a Mac. It would be nice if you could incorporate the video media editor the way Elgato has. But just being able to record and view live TV would be enough.
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Whenever I play a video, whether mp4, avi or mkv the picture is jittery and unwatchable. Sound is fine.
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I am not having those problems but I know Glynor and some others are. The video module is pretty much beta software at this point and I believe the JRiver guys acknowledged the first version was going to be a little unpolished. I am just grateful that they are working on video and hope they can get video and TV recording done so I can leave Windows and all of the headaches involved with getting it to network with Mac OS behind.
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I haven't re-tested in about a week. I've been busy.
I merged the other little thread into this one, where it belongs.
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Proper fullscreen playback with the menu and dock hidden is coming for the next version. Its mostly done, with one small glitch remaining.
I'm also trying to determine whats going on with the player control going gray and unresponsive, I can reproduce it myself quite easily, so I hopefully can fix it as well soon.
After those issues are sorted out, I'll continue working on audio stream selection, and other basic video playback features still missing from Mac and Linux.
glynor, any info for the broken files?
Does this include hiding the cursor as well? I'm currently using JRemote to play videos on my Mac Mini, and I can't get the cursor to hide during video playback. Additionally could there be added support for the display not go to sleep during playback?
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glynor, any info for the broken files?
I've been quite busy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFtb3EtjEic), unfortunately, which is why I haven't been around much lately.
I'll try to re-test here soon. When I recover from the plague I've been fighting lately.
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Some brief feedback from my side. Today I installed the latest 20.0.46 for Mac... Still can't switch soundtracks and use subtitles... :'(
Too bad for this amazing player...
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Switching audio tracks should be available very soon. Subtitles is still a bit further away.
I've also worked on the problem with the audio being out of sync for a couple seconds at start of playback, and that should be behaving much better now as well.
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Switching audio tracks should be available very soon. Subtitles is still a bit further away.
I've also worked on the problem with the audio being out of sync for a couple seconds at start of playback, and that should be behaving much better now as well.
Hendrik,
let's implement mandatory options first. Soundtracks switching and subtitles are definitely such options. After that will be time to implement convenient (visual) subtitles synchronization. )))
Will wait for it. :)
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Switching audio tracks should be available very soon. Subtitles is still a bit further away.
I've also worked on the problem with the audio being out of sync for a couple seconds at start of playback, and that should be behaving much better now as well.
Recently I purchased Master License (for multiply OS) and install MC for Mac 20.0.60 on my MacBook Pro Retina. What's the miracle - now I can see several streams and can switch them. Thanks Hendrik!
However, I can't to see any subtitles... Is it OK for this version or there is some sophisticated way to show subtitles?
By the way, I wasted 2 restores due to some MC SW glitches... Will enforced to uninstall my previous trial version manually and install 20.0.60 version. Hope JRiver team can compensate these 2 wasted restores in case of necessity.
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Subtitles are not yet supported.
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Subtitles are not yet supported.
Understood. Will wait for 20.0.61 version. ))))
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I've also worked on the problem with the audio being out of sync for a couple seconds at start of playback, and that should be behaving much better now as well.
I'm getting an audio delay when I press play after pausing playback - is this a known issue?
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Can't play any video with MC 20.0.60 on my MacMini Server Late 2009, OSX 10.7.5.
After starting the playback there only is the messagebox "Playback Problem, Something went wrong with playback". A very informative message, if you ask me.
Klicking the help button of the message box leads me to the even less informative JRiver "Playback Problems" web page, instead of saying, what my problem is.
Is my MacMini or OS too old to play back video - or what's wrong?
Thanks
Fred
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I cannot get MC20 (now v. 64) to import any mkv or m4v files from a mounted network share drive (from my NAS). Is this expected/known or am I doing something wrong?
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I'm currently testing JRiver and JRemote on my mac mini (2012-i5-16Go-500Go-intel Graphics.)
- Audio results are what I expected : excellent
- I began the Video tests on yesterday... Ooops....
Jumpy videos, crashes, even with single avi. or mpegs. files....
I have not any poblem with the VLC media player. So it seems not to come from the computer.
Question : is there an 'optimal' setting for JRiver which would give better results ?
Mathieu
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Please try the version from the top of this board.
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Better, but not yet usable... The image is dancing, some horizontal bars in the screen time to time...
I will use JRiver for audio only, and wait for the release of a robust version.
Mathieu
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JRiver MC 20.0.80
OS X 10.10.2
Macbook Mid 2012
Full-screen controls still are broken:
(http://i.imgur.com/yYsC0A7.jpg)
Also, here's no way to switch from full-screen mode to display (full window) playback: it switches back only to normal "small cover" mode.
Cursor doesn't disappear in full-screen mode.
I'm using JRiver MC for both music and video so really would like to see better support for video.
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JRiver MC 20.0.80
OS X 10.10.2
Macbook Mid 2012
Full-screen controls still are broken:
Also, here's no way to switch from full-screen mode to display (full window) playback: it switches back only to normal "small cover" mode.
Cursor doesn't disappear in full-screen mode.
I'm using JRiver MC for both music and video so really would like to see better support for video.
Just issues with full screen controls? You are lucky person...
Yesterday I installed the 20.0.80 release and can't see any picture. Just some gray screen.
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OS X 10.9.5 - latest Maverick, MacBook Pro Retina.
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So before I go through the process of creating logs and testing a number of files, should I just assume that video is not going to work at all on an older MacBook 1,1? (1.8GHz Core Duo, GMA950)
I had to pull that out to get some specific software working since it's running 10.6.8 (the last version it will run) and thought I'd set up MC on it just in case I ever had a need to use it for that.
It seems to work fine for audio, but I receive a general "something went wrong with playback" error when trying to play videos.
The videos I've tried work just fine in QuickTime X, but MC gives me that error.
MC does seem to generate thumbnails for the videos though.
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We require OpenGL 3.2 support, which these old mac books do not support, sorry.
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We require OpenGL 3.2 support, which these old mac books do not support, sorry.
Fair enough - I assumed it was probably due to the system being too old.
Is there any way to have the OS X version of MC open those videos with an external application? (QuickTime/VLC)
Even if I can't view them in MC, it would be convenient to have MC manage a local library, or access videos on my other systems through MC's interface.
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Just issues with full screen controls? You are lucky person...
Yesterday I installed the 20.0.80 release and can't see any picture. Just some gray screen.
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OS X 10.9.5 - latest Maverick, MacBook Pro Retina.
I implemented some latest recommended OS updates, as far as they come and, what a miracle!, I can see a picture now. By the way, my VLC and DVD Fab can show movies correctly before that as well...
After tthat I installed the latest JRiver 20.0.87 and still can't find any subtitles support.
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We require OpenGL 3.2 support, which these old mac books do not support, sorry.
Hendrik, do you happen to know when this transition happened on the hardware?
I added this page to the Wiki (https://developer.apple.com/opengl/capabilities/GLInfo_1075_Core.html), but that's scary to read (and I'm not entirely sure where the cutoff is on that chart either).
Is there any way to have the OS X version of MC open those videos with an external application? (QuickTime/VLC)
Unfortunately, no. I'd love it if they could give us that, and then just turn on all possible Media Types (just opening photos and documents in the associated system application). But Send To > External and the File Types > Play in External isn't available on the OSX version currently.
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Unfortunately I do not have clear information which hardware has GL 3.2 support. It requires OSX 10.7 at very least, but not sure about hardware.
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Unfortunately I do not have clear information which hardware has GL 3.2 support. It requires OSX 10.7 at very least, but not sure about hardware.
Ok. If I get bored, I might try to figure it out.
Do you know which of those "color bands" you can use? Is the Radeon HD 2400 okay, for example? It is listed as OpenGL 3.2 supporting, but I don't know if you need a particular amount of VRAM or something.
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JRiver Media Center for Mac 20.0.94 installed. Subtitles still not supported...
Guys, be honest, let's call it JRiver Audio Center for Mac... 8)
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I understand you want subtitles, and I do think that is planned, but... I don't know. This seems a bit hyperbolic:
Guys, be honest, let's call it JRiver Audio Center for Mac... 8)
I use MC on Mac for video all the time. I watched 2-3 hours of shows with it last night (including the latest Game of Thrones episode) with absolutely no problems.
Subtitles would be nice, occasionally, for me. I understand it is essential if you (a) have hearing loss, or (b) watch a lot of media with non-native languages. But, both of those are something of edge cases. Certainly important ones, but still edge cases.
In any case, the guy writing the Mac video engine is German, so I think he is well aware of the subtitles issues.
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I understand you want subtitles, and I do think that is planned, but... I don't know. This seems a bit hyperbolic:
I use MC on Mac for video all the time. I watched 2-3 hours of shows with it last night (including the latest Game of Thrones episode) with absolutely no problems.
Subtitles would be nice, occasionally, for me. I understand it is essential if you (a) have hearing loss, or (b) watch a lot of media with non-native languages. But, both of those are something of edge cases. Certainly important ones, but still edge cases.
In any case, the guy writing the Mac video engine is German, so I think he is well aware of the subtitles issues.
Subtitles just must be. I like French comedies, I like anime, I like great Asian movies. I purchased JRiver to enjoy all of them... Now you can understand my attitude... :)
And please do not discriminate deafs. It's unacceptable. ;) They need that subtitles support badly.
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:) To clarify the point - I have really perfect hearing and that's why I purchased JRiver.
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Subtitles just must be. I like French comedies, I like anime, I like great Asian movies. I purchased JRiver to enjoy all of them... Now you can understand my attitude... :)
And please do not discriminate deafs. It's unacceptable. ;) They need that subtitles support badly.
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:) To clarify the point - I have really perfect hearing and that's why I purchased JRiver.
this guy is telling the truth! 8)
and please fix "gray dock" bug in fullscreen mode! :D
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Agreed. JRiver will never be my default media player without subtitle support. Not an edge case!
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I have installed the newest MC 20.0.112. Thanks for DTS HD native support.
However, subtitles are still not supported.
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I purchased MC license to have ability to enjoy my music and films collection. The key reason to buy exactly JRiver MC was ability to watch my movies with perfect sound.
I am a Mac user, but I even can't presume that I will be discriminated for that. I mean the lack of subtitles support in JRiver MC for Mac. I was surprised, but indicated this defect on this forum (in "Feedback on Video Support in MC for Mac" topic). I did it several months ago and reminded several times, nothing is changed till now...
Please be aware the subtitle support is just a little feature, but without it you can't watch any foreign film, if you do not speak Dutch, Italian, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, you name it.
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While it might seem like subtitles are a little feature, implementing them on Mac and Linux isn't a simple walk in the park. It just takes time.
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While it might seem like subtitles are a little feature, implementing them on Mac and Linux isn't a simple walk in the park. It just takes time.
Awesome Donkey,
Frankly speaking, I was a software developer and know this subject pretty well. :) It's not about sophisticated technical difficulties (VLC has it, DVDFab has it as well), it's about prioritizing and correct project management and time planning.
Lack of subtitles support looks like a minor defect (probably, to your software developer only), but it is jeopardizing all video playback functionality.
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Your priorities are not always ours. Sorry.
Video was new just a few months ago and it's not completed.
If you have to have subtitles, then you will need to use another player until MC has them.
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Your priorities are not always ours. Sorry.
Video was new just a few months ago and it's not completed.
If you have to have subtitles, then you will need to use another player until MC has them.
JimH,
I glad to hear that you have some prioritizing. Just do not forget about your loyal customers. :)
I am enforced to use free VLC cause subtitles and easily can hear it's sounds much worse than my purchased MC. Now you can understand my attitude...
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I am also asking for a subtitle support. I bought a JRiver for both video and audio. There are many excellent software players for audio but only few for both video and audio. I have a Master Licence and I am happy with windows version. But lack of subtitle support in Mac version is a pain in...... I have to use VLC instead.
I know it will be added to MC someday but please put it higher in your priority list.
Tomek
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Full-screen playback doesn't seem to hide the mouse cursor
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Full-screen playback doesn't seem to hide the mouse cursor
Yes, it's unpleasant bug.
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Yeah. The mouse cursor is annoying. You can move it almost all the way off the screen usually, but it is annoying.
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Yeah. The mouse cursor is annoying. You can move it almost all the way off the screen usually, but it is annoying.
Yeah, this is as simple and prominent as you can get. I hope to see it fixed soon.
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Yeah, this is as simple and prominent as you can get. I hope to see it fixed soon.
Hopefully the mouse cursor will hide and show properly in the next build.
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Hopefully the mouse cursor will hide and show properly in the next build.
Ooooh. Fancy! 8)
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Hopefully the mouse cursor will hide and show properly in the next build.
It will be the greatest improvement of this build. :)
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I plan to upgrade my Master License to MC21 in a few days.
Definitely hope that subtitles support will be implemented in this version. :)
I hope as well that "mysterious gray rectangle" bug will be fixed as well.
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Video Support on Mac and Linux will definitely be worked on for MC21, including subtitles, hardware acceleration and language based stream selection.
It was originally planned for MC20 already, but unfortunately priorities shifted and other tasks took precedence.
Although I'm still not hearing all that much about Video on Mac/Linux in general. Do many people actually use it at all? I doubt missing subtitles are the only problem in it, but its not like there is a lot of feedback.
Admittedly I personally don't use it to watch videos either, since its all Windows for me.
Regarding the gray player controls bug, last I heard Matt and/or John wanted to look into that, since they have the experience with Mac window drawing. I should poke them to see if its still on their list somewhere. :)
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Do many people actually use it at all?
My guess is from reading some of the posts in both sections is that some are waiting for additional features, like subtitles.
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My guess is from reading some of the posts in both sections is that some are waiting for additional features, like subtitles.
The interesting part about that is, if we don't see a lot of use for a feature, the priority of future development of it drops - and the number of people asking for subtitles is < 5 from what I recall. So, hey! ;)
And I still find it weird that the entire userbase can't watch videos without subtitles. Surely its an important feature for some, but the majority, really? I just don't believe that.
But subtitles are coming now, so if that is actually a reason for noone using it, then maybe things will change - or maybe not.
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Video Support on Mac and Linux will definitely be worked on for MC21, including subtitles, hardware acceleration and language based stream selection.
It was originally planned for MC20 already, but unfortunately priorities shifted and other tasks took precedence.
Although I'm still not hearing all that much about Video on Mac/Linux in general. Do many people actually use it at all? I doubt missing subtitles are the only problem in it, but its not like there is a lot of feedback.
Admittedly I personally don't use it to watch videos either, since its all Windows for me.
Regarding the gray player controls bug, last I heard Matt and/or John wanted to look into that, since they have the experience with Mac window drawing. I should poke them to see if its still on their list somewhere. :)
Hendrik, let me respond.
First of all, I glad to hear that MC21 for Mac will be fully functional.
Second, if you propose MC on Mac/Linux and want some money for that, please sell a self-sufficient product, like on Windows. Otherwise it's looks like your sell some car without headlamps... Of course, you can drive without headlamps, but just imagine that your customers will say, if you will propose them such product.
I have to say that I can play music without MC. I can use several other quality music players, especially for Windows. But, I can't name any other video player with quality sound playback. Just treat it as some competitive advantage. So please keep in mind, that MC video functionality is important.
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If your arguments were true, then more people would care about video - which they apparently don't, judging from the feedback on this forum. Or its just that perfect that we don't need to get any feedback on it.
At the end of the day, any feature we work on for MC has to be used by a relevant number of users, especially something big like video. If there just aren't that many users, then its not worth prioritizing that feature in the future. Its inescapable logic, even if those 3 users that do use it would disagree.
Even if there wasn't a financial aspect in play, I personally prefer working on things that make people happy, rather than things that barely anyone uses.
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I have to say that I can play music without MC. I can use several other quality music players, especially for Windows. But, I can't name any other video player with quality sound playback. Just treat it as some competitive advantage. So please keep in mind, that MC video functionality is important.
We're committed to full support of video on Mac.
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I use the video support on the Mac version of MC much, much more than I use it for plain audio.
I don't have a huge need for subtitles. The biggest things that were annoying me are (in order):
1. The disappearing top toolbar in Display View.
2. The non-hiding mouse pointer
Both of which are reasonably minor, but irritating.
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... then more people would care about video - which they apparently don't, judging from the feedback on this forum. Or its just that perfect that we don't need to get any feedback on it.
That was my first thought when you said we're not getting much feedback. No news is good news.
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If your arguments would be true, then more people would care about video - which they apparently don't, judging from feedback on this forum. Or its just that perfect that we don't need to get any feedback on it. One of those!
At the end of the day, any feature we work on for MC has to be used by a relevant number of users, especially something big like video. If there just aren't that many users, then its not worth prioritizing that feature in the future. Its unescapable logic, even if those 3 users that do use it would care to disagree.
Even if there wasn't a financial aspect in play, I personally prefer working on things that make more people happy, rather than things that barely anyone uses - which is how Video on Mac and Linux feels to me right about now.
Luckily this topic is at least mildly interesting, or I would have no motivation left.
Hendrik,
Why have you and your team made high quality player for audiophiles? I presumed you and your team have some vision and some mission...
If you made video playback, please implement at least some basic features... Subtitles support is one of these very basic features.
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We're committed to full support of video on Mac.
Thanks for that.
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Although I'm still not hearing all that much about Video on Mac/Linux in general. Do many people actually use it at all? I doubt missing subtitles are the only problem in it, but its not like there is a lot of feedback.
Feel free to split this since it's more Linux oriented, but I think part of the story is that while video support is present on Mac and Linux certain key pieces of the puzzle are still missing (and not just subtitles)
I can't currently use the linux video playback regularly because it doesn't always work correctly with fullscreen mode/display mode on two monitors (with some hardware it works, but not with mine currently). The OSD also doesn't reliably show up. More info over here:http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=91652.msg682522#msg682522
The other issue is the lack of theater view in linux. I haven't converted any of my "family" PC's to linux because of the lack of a ten-foot HTPC interface. I would use linux video playback daily if there were a theater view equivalent on Linux because that's the only thing stopping me from moving my HTPC client boxes over. I'm sure mac users are in the same boat on that one.
The video support looks great and I'm looking forward to using it more. But I can't really use it right now in my main applications (HTPC and workstation), so I stick to the windows version for video.
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I use the video support on the Mac version of MC much, much more than I use it for plain audio.
I don't have a huge need for subtitles. The biggest things that were annoying me are (in order):
1. The disappearing top toolbar in Display View.
2. The non-hiding mouse pointer
Both of which are reasonably minor, but irritating.
Glynor,
I agree with you - these bugs are unpleasant. However, there are not vital.
Let me explain.
1. The disappearing top toolbar in Display View is nonsense. There is nothing to discuss, it need to be fixed.
However, I can switch to different view, make some needed actions and switch to Display View again.
2. The non-hiding mouse pointer looks strange, but I can try to hide it somehow on the right edge of the screen.
Regarding the missing subtitles support - I can't display any subtitles whatever I do. Taste the difference.
Thanks for understanding.
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My guess is from reading some of the posts in both sections is that some are waiting for additional features, like subtitles.
I am waiting for Blu ray , 3d and theater view. My son saw the theater view in Windows, he loves it.
at least blu ray and theater view, will be fine, sub titles may come later. I am even planning to get a Mac, but no point doing this when video support is minimal.
George Omoregie.
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Video support is more than minimal.
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I am waiting for Blu ray , 3d and theater view. My son saw the theater view in Windows, he loves it.
at least blu ray and theater view, will be fine, sub titles may come later. I am even planning to get a Mac, but no point doing this when video support is minimal.
George Omoregie.
George,
Subtitles support is actually minimal, but Blu-Ray support, 3D and theater view are more than minimal - may come later... 8)
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Even the Windows version doesn't do 3D, and its unlikely to change any time soon, and even if it does eventually, the Linux and Mac versions will likely take a long time to catch up on all features.
Windows is always going to be the most advanced platform for Video, on account of LAV Filters and madVR alone - which both have years of development behind them, and are not going to wait for MC to catch up first. ;)
Theater View is also quite problematic on Mac and Linux. We do want to offer it at some point, but its just an extremely huge task, so we have to be sure the time is right to spent all these resources on it.
In short, if you care about the most advanced Video features, you will want to stick to Windows. If you just want to play normal video files, then Mac and Linux will also do their job just fine.
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Regarding the missing subtitles support - I can't display any subtitles whatever I do.
I understand. I was just explaining my own personal needs. And, explaining that I do use the video support on MC for Mac, quite regularly (not every single day, but regularly). I haven't been posting a lot about it because (aside from those few bugs) for my own needs, it works.
I agree that subtitles support is the largest gap in video support currently.
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If your arguments were true, then more people would care about video - which they apparently don't, judging from the feedback on this forum. Or its just that perfect that we don't need to get any feedback on it.
I think you may be interpreting this wrong. Given the current issues with video, it's barely usable. 1) always visible cursor 2) grey box at top 3) no subtitles, for starters. These have been brought up multiple times by multiple people but never seem to get any attention.
In general, the Mac product just doesn't appear to get much love from the JRiver staff. All you have to do is look at the number of releases for V20 since it launched compared to Windows.
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These have been brought up multiple times by multiple people but never seem to get any attention.
I don't find this to be true at all. They've acknowledged the cursor and grey box issues and they've posted updates regarding other upcoming features in this thread, including subtitles.
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In general, the Mac product just doesn't appear to get much love from the JRiver staff. All you have to do is look at the number of releases for V20 since it launched compared to Windows.
The Mac version benefits from nearly all the work we do on other versions. Most fixed bugs are relevant. Most new features, as well.
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I don't find this to be true at all. They've acknowledged the cursor and grey box issues and they've posted updates regarding other upcoming features in this thread, including subtitles.
To each his own I guess but cursor and grey box are still existing problems that haven't been fixed and today is the first I've seen them commit on subtitles unless I missed something.
Hendrik's comments made it sound like they think video is perfect while this is clearly not the case.
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I believe I saw mentioned that the cursor issue is already fixed and will be in the next build.
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The Mac version benefits from nearly all the work we do on other versions. Most fixed bugs are relevant. Most new features, as well.
Fair enough but how about all the documented Mac bugs that aren't in the Windows version? Lockups, saved views, etc, etc. Been using the Mac version for the last 2 revs but haven't seen much improvement during that time. Yes, you launched Video and ripping in V20 but video has the same bugs that existed since it was launched. Now I hear you're launching a new version. My vote would be to fix what you already have. Sure, I would love to see new enhancements but they have to work or they're not much use.
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We do work on the problems that are reported. We can't always reproduce them.
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Fair enough but how about all the documented Mac bugs that aren't in the Windows version? Lockups, saved views, etc, etc. Been using the Mac version for the last 2 revs but haven't seen much improvement during that time.
I've seen all sorts of improvements and new features in MC21 for Mac. As was mentioned previously in this thread (and elsewhere), the change logs posted on the Windows version apply equally, by and large, to the Mac version. So there may have been things changed you didn't see, if you weren't following those change logs.
There have been, recently, a bunch of additions, including:
* Dr. Who Playlist sharing
* ~expand smartlist modifier
* Full support for DTS-HD audio formats
* A bunch of retina improvements
And, as Awesome Donkey mentioned, they have been working on some of the annoying video bugs, like the mouse cursor thing. I know for a fact that they've spent a ton of time and effort trying to work out the audio dropouts issues reported in that thread, even though it only impacts a handful of users. Problems don't always have easy solutions, unfortunately. But slow and steady wins the race.
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I've seen all sorts of improvements and new features in MC21 for Mac.
Cause I just upgraded my MC20 Master License to MC21, I have the right to see it soon. :)
By the way, do not forget some very unpleasant issue in MC20 video playback - I mean massive saw tooth edge distortion while 1080i is playing... Just painful to see it...
I can share some screen shots to proof it. Free VLC for Mac can display the same fragments correctly...
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Just to be precise - I have MacBook Pro Retina in top configuration. So my HW is OK...
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I've seen all sorts of improvements and new features in MC21 for Mac. As was mentioned previously in this thread (and elsewhere), the change logs posted on the Windows version apply equally, by and large, to the Mac version. So there may have been things changed you didn't see, if you weren't following those change logs.
There have been, recently, a bunch of additions, including:
* Dr. Who Playlist sharing
* ~expand smartlist modifier
* Full support for DTS-HD audio formats
* A bunch of retina improvements
glynor,
I have to admit - full support for DTS-HD audio formats is really important. Thanks for that.
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If your arguments were true, then more people would care about video - which they apparently don't, judging from the feedback on this forum. Or its just that perfect that we don't need to get any feedback on it.
There is a MAJOR logical flaw in your thinking. If a feature isn't worth using, because it doesn't work well enough to be useable, people just won't use it. If MC *only* supported video and not audio, people would be screaming for you to fix it. Because it's unusable for many people. Why? Because full screen mode puts a GIANT GREY RECTANGLE at the top of the screen and keeps one from being able to use the playback controls. That's not minor or "an edge case".
In recent builds the rectangle and the cursor disappear after a short time. This is good. But it all looks like a work in progress; which I guess it is. It makes me personally not want to use it because it's so clearly "broken".
Lest you think I'm bitching and complaining and demanding a fix... I am not. I don't use video support for MC and I didn't buy it for that reason. I bought MC for audio only. If it did video really well... I'd be really happy! I'd use it for video all the time. But if I had my choice, I'd rather have the audio bugs fixed first.
I'm only writing this to point out that people won't use stuff that doesn't work properly. ...and people who don't use a feature, don't complain about it.
Brian.
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There is a MAJOR logical flaw in your thinking. If a feature isn't worth using, because it doesn't work well enough to be useable, people just won't use it.
If that would be true, I would imagine people would at least say so. So my conclusion can only be that not many people actually seem to care.
If I would care about a feature that doesn't work properly, I would report it as a problem. People do that all the time with other features, afterall. The number of people giving any feedback on video is like below 10.
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If that would be true, I would imagine people would at least say so. So my conclusion can only be that not many people actually seem to care.
If I would care about a feature that doesn't work properly, I would report it as a problem. People do that all the time with other features, afterall. The number of people giving any feedback on video is like below 10.
Having a grey box on the screen while watching video is not an annoyance, it renders video unusable except for cataloging.
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I bought MC for audio only.
Hendrik,
I think this is the main reason we're not getting more feedback.
Maybe you've posted somewhere else, but the grey rectangle seems like the next problem to fix if it isn't a video driver problem.
The mouse cursor should be fixed soon.
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Maybe you've posted somewhere else, but the grey rectangle seems like the next problem to fix if it isn't a video driver problem.
John once said he wanted to have a look at that with Matt, since they have the expertise dealing with Mac window-painting weirdness.
Maybe a good time to push that further up the list soon.
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OK. Thanks.
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Hendrik,
I think this is the main reason we're not getting more feedback.
I think you are wrong. Video support for Linux (I don't have Mac) just isn't on satisfactory level yet.
I have no time or interest to beta test it at this point. I just bought master lisence to support Linux development further. I'll start to use Linux version with dedicated box when feature set suits me better. For now I just use windows. I think that you have enough feedback what to do to make video interesting on Linux/Mac.
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The cursor issue and the gray rectangle problem have both been fixed and will be in the next build.
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The cursor issue and the gray rectangle problem have both been fixed and will be in the next build.
Adamt, thank you for this progress.
And what about subtitles support?
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And what about subtitles support? How many unsatisfied customers extra you need for it?
It was already stated numerous times that subtitle support is being worked on and will be available in MC21.
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You made my day...
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Maybe subtitles are not important for English native speakers but the rest of the world needs subtitles. I am an European and almost 95% of the movies I watch are foreign ones and almost half of them non-English. As I have written before lack of subtitles support kills a need for "media center" on mac as I have to use Vlc anyway and there are other options for audio.
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It was already stated numerous times that subtitle support is being worked on and will be available in MC21.
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I'll bump this since it's relevant...
Subtitles support is in MC21 for Mac - find it in the MC21 for Mac section of the forums! :)