INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => JRiver Media Center 26 for Windows => Topic started by: sonus.faber on October 17, 2019, 05:39:27 pm
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I am disappointed with the JRiver pricing policy.
The Windows standard license is 60$, the upgrade from any version is 20$ and this is the discounted price, so the standard price for the upgrade is more or less 30$, considering the 30% discount.
The above means that once a year you provide a minor version and to be up to date I have to spend the half of the license cost.
Software maintenance average price is 20% of the license cost, not 50%, on the market, for other common product.
And to get the discount I have to pay for something that has still to be developed... very strange.
It seems your upgrade policy is aimed at collecting money to fund the next version.
this is my opinion.
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I am disappointed with the JRiver pricing policy.
The Windows standard license is 60$, the upgrade from any version is 20$ and this is the discounted price, so the standard price for the upgrade is more or less 30$, considering the 30% discount.
The above means that once a year you provide a minor version and to be up to date I have to spend the half of the license cost.
Software maintenance average price is 20% of the license cost, not 50%, on the market, for other common product.
And to get the discount I have to pay for something that has still to be developed... very strange.
It seems your upgrade policy is aimed at collecting money to fund the next version.
this is my opinion.
i think its fair ... product is already a bargain for what it offers ... and they do need to earn money ... i pay this bargain and let them do what they do ... cause alternative is grim, they go bankrupt and no more HTPC for me
compare that with plex ... 40usd for yearly subscription ... you dont renew subscription, you loose functionality ... wheres you dont upgrade MC ... you can still use older version (some ppl still sit on very old versions and happy with it ... i just upgrade to provide support ... didnt really need mc25 lol)
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First thing's first, this explains JRiver's business model: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,81987.0.html
Nowhere does it say upgrades are mandatory. If you're happy with the version you're running right now, then simply don't upgrade and use the version you're using now. Older MC versions will continue to work fine as long as the OS you're running it on still supports it. Windows is more forgiving in this regard when it comes to backwards compatibility, but macOS and Linux are not and are prone to breaking old MC versions with newer OS releases and updates.
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Each to their own I guess. I wish more business models followed suit. 'Are you listening iRule?' Having invested time into a platform that works exceptionally well I would happily pay an upgrade fee to keep it alive than loose and wander where next. And lets face it it's a small fee :)
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Each to their own I guess. I wish more business models followed suit. 'Are you listening iRule?' Having invested time into a platform that works exceptionally well I would happily pay an upgrade fee to keep it alive than loose and wander where next. And lets face it it's a small fee :)
Wow, I thought I was the only one who was duped into investing into iRule only to be dumped a year later. I went through the training and certification process with Kramer Controls (The company that bought the iRule IP) but their solutions are egalitarian, expensive and overkill for a simple HT presentation unless you have lights, blinds, projectors and a lot of other related equipment few homes have.
Now to the topic of the thread:
I actually wonder why the upgrade fee is so small. Look at Roon, they have an annual fee of $119 a year. After a year, it stops working. Or you can purchase a lifetime license at $499 Either option is pretty serious coin for me so $40-$60 is nearly negligible. Don't get me wrong, MC has some flaws, it can be frustrating, the documentation is lagging, and its a steep learning curve, but in the end, it produces the goods and if I choose to not upgrade for a few years, the existing version I have continues to work.
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Software maintenance average price is 20% of the license cost, not 50%, on the market, for other common product.
I have a simple solution for you. Your price for MC is now $150, and you can have the upgrade for 20% of that price, or $30. Of course, no guarantee it will stay at $30, because for you, the purchase price it is based on will increase over time.
Oh, also you have to pay that for every PC you install it on. You are only buying one seat for that $150, unlike everybody who pays $60 and gets "unlimited seats within reason" licencing.
Seriously, you are comparing a low cost, small application upgrade price to large application annual maintenance costs, and that is just silly. Also, in the large application software industry, that 20% maintenance may only buy you miinor upgrades within the current major version. Major version upgrades are often charged separately. JRiver are giving you major upgrades for that 50% of the original purchase price.
How about you just skip buying four coffees, or one dinner in a restaurant, and the price difference you point out will be covered.
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Every year with every upgrade the same threads.... ::)
Keep doing it the acutal way, this is fair for both sides. Thanks for your work!!!!
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It sure beats the current alternative most software is using - Subscriptions - Yearly!
I avoid that model at all costs as I prefer to BUY my software for the duration.
JRiver lets me buy the product.
Also then I can decide IF & when to upgrade as I see fit, based upon improvements and added features.
Subscriptions make you continuously pay for this development all the time with no choice in the matter.
I'll take the JRiver model every time. I like being given a choice.
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It sure beats the current alternative most software is using - Subscriptions - Yearly!
I avoid that model at all casts as I prefer to BUY my software for the duration.
JRiver lets me buy the product.
Also then I can decide IF & when to upgrade as I see fit, based upon improvements and added features.
Subscriptions make you continuously pay for this development all the time with no choice in the matter.
I'll take the JRiver model every time. I like being given a choice.
+1
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My main use for MC is music only and I consider it a bargain to have a product that performs as well as it does with the options that it has.
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Jeez. $20? $30? Every 9-12 months?!
People spend that much on coffee or pizza in a week... ::)
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Every year with every upgrade the same threads.... ::)
Plus usually from people who just joined the forum, and then posted a comment like this within minutes, as is this case.
Probably the same person, trolling every year.
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Plus usually from people who just joined the forum, and then posted a comment like this within minutes, as is this case.
Probably the same person, trolling every year.
In this case the original poster hasn't returned to read any replies.
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Major version upgrades are often charged separately. JRiver are giving you major upgrades for that 50% of the original purchase price.
I could be stirring the pot somewhat, but calling something a major upgrade simply because the version has incremented by one doesn't necessarily mean it's actually a major upgrade.
I'm kind of with the OP in this respect viz-a-viz what we're paying for (which I do for bugfixes more than anything else at this point) and what we're actually getting.
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It sure beats the current alternative most software is using - Subscriptions - Yearly!
I avoid that model at all costs as I prefer to BUY my software for the duration.
JRiver lets me buy the product.
Also then I can decide IF & when to upgrade as I see fit, based upon improvements and added features.
Subscriptions make you continuously pay for this development all the time with no choice in the matter.
I'll take the JRiver model every time. I like being given a choice.
It does beat the alternative, and that's why to date I have simply rejected Roon, despite all of the glowing praise it receives. I can't dig Roon's pricing model.
As you said, I then decide if/when to upgrade MC, as not all new features are going to be equally important to every individual.
I helped set-up a friend with Id Pi running JRMC22 a few years ago. He is still running that very same version, on an RPi3B, as a DLNA server. He sees no reason to upgrade it, it's been on 24/7 for years now and with the added $9 investment for JRemote, he and his wife simply dial up music whenever they feel like it from an Android phone as remote control.
Some of his friends/family/house guests have been curious about his set-up, and once shown they were stunned at how small, yet thoroughly capable the Id Pi server actually is. He considers it the best $39+9 he's ever spent on computer audio.
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It took me a millisecond to decide to buy MC26. $26 for the master licence - some people spend that money for cappucino in one week. Also the license model is flexible - you don't have to upgrade.
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Think of like Wikipedia Annual Begging Letter
I would and do lob in the odd $20 to keep the wheels turning
Bit difficult to PayPal half a pizza😈
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Jeez. $20? $30? Every 9-12 months?!
People spend that much on coffee or pizza in a week... ::)
try one meal. two large pizzas, three toppings. $38.
dont mess with jriver pricing please - i consider it a bargain for what i get!
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Nothing wrong with either JRiver pricing policy or Roons pricing policy. If you’re happy with how MC behaves you don’t have to fork out for the next release. If you want to stay at the cutting edge or just say thank you then you can stump up for the very modest upgrade cost. With Roon you are paying for continuing access to metadata so it’s reasonable to have to pay every year, as they have to, though you can get a lifetime subscription for about four annual subscriptions. It’s not difficult to come to a rational decision about what’s best for you, but it does really annoy me that people still expect software to be free, whether it is a program, rich metadata, or the music itself.
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With Roon you are paying for continuing access to metadata so it’s reasonable to have to pay every year, as they have to, though you can get a lifetime subscription for about four annual subscriptions. It’s not difficult to come to a rational decision about what’s best for you, but it does really annoy me that people still expect software to be free, whether it is a program, rich metadata, or the music itself.
I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree here. Roon does not have metadata I cannot gain access to for free. True, Ill have to dig for it but with the tool set I have, It only takes about 30 seconds per album. Roon's annual fees are just greedy
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I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree here. Roon does not have metadata I cannot gain access to for free. True, Ill have to dig for it but with the tool set I have, It only takes about 30 seconds per album. Roon's annual fees are just greedy
Fine. All I said was “it’s not difficult to come to a rational decision about what’s best for you.” Sounds like we both have. For me the way Roon integrates Qobuz with my own music, retrieves interesting metadata and album artwork and sleeve notes, and has a good remote app is worth the money. If it was just for playing my own music it wouldn't be worth the money, but the integration with Qobuz is the game-changer. I now have very little use for MC, but will renew my sub in any case. Would hate to think of JimH and the lads going hungry.
(Btw, what tool you got that could retrieve the sleeve notes for any album in 30 seconds free?).
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The only improvement to the current licensing model that I can think of would be to add a one time purchase lifetime license option. That would save me 60 seconds per year from having to deal with buying the upgrade.
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I've tried many other media players and this is the best all in one for videos, music, pictures and even data if you want.
After all the pain I went through trying other media players, I'm glad to support this one.
Plus I get all kinds of good help in the forum.
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I could be stirring the pot somewhat, but calling something a major upgrade simply because the version has incremented by one doesn't necessarily mean it's actually a major upgrade.
I'm kind of with the OP in this respect viz-a-viz what we're paying for (which I do for bugfixes more than anything else at this point) and what we're actually getting.
I really have to take issue with people that come to this conclusion.. Lord knows I've had my beefs with Jim over feature support, etc but the fact of the matter is, JRiver offers one of the best software upgrade/pricing models on the planet.
I've been purchasing upgrades since around MC 17, and have never felt the cost was unjustified. It's disingenuous to argue that major version increments are simple upgrades. Pretty much every version of JRiver that goes through a full versioning increase comes with new features, as well as roadmapped features for the rest of the year following the release. The bulk of these features are often user requests for new things or refinements of existing functionality. And in addition to that you get periodic updates with bugfixes and stability.
This isn't like Firefox and Chrome where they pump up the major revision number in a race to the bottom for very few, if any, actual improvements. You're paying for well tested, professionally developed software by people who are actually passionate about their product, not some big box corporate with an army of lifeless coders slaving away to implement a spreadsheet of marketing research.
JRiver also offers deep discounts on upgrading every year, sometimes more than once, and almost always they extend the sale period so as many people as possible can upgrade at a lower price.
The part that makes all the above "worth it", is the fact that this is perpetually licensed software. As had been pointed out, you can buy a major version and use it forever, in some cases important bugfixes or under the hood changes will even get backported to the previous years version at no additional cost.
You buy it, you own it. It doesn't stop working because you stop paying. I usually upgrade yearly because I support this philosophy. I grew up in the age of software where you bought it and you owned it. I understand what we are losing to all these "software as a service" models of subscription.
For everything JRiver Media Center is capable of, I think it is a very fair price, especially if you go in for a Master license.
If the features being added are of no use to you, then skip upgrades at your leisure. Just remember you can always take advantage of upgrade discount sales even when you come from a much older version of the software - that alone is also unique among a lot of software companies.
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Gotta say I love the software. I had version 18 and decided to upgrade this year to get all the new goodies. You don't have to buy the new version every year if you think it's just minor updates. It's always your decision and the price was right. I mean, what's $20 every few years if that's the way you want to go? Beats 5 or 10 or 20 bucks a month for a subscription service that delivers lousy sound quality and you can't customize it the way you want it.
A great value if you ask me. (Which you didn't, but, I threw my 2 cents in anyway.)
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Everybody has his own opinion and we have to respect this.
I upgrade to every new version since 16 or 17, as I remember. Even when I think I don’t need new features – at the end I do.
For me is MC the best Media Software on the market with absolute the best price-performance ratio.
Also I like to support this team with this little upgrade costs – don’t forget you can install it on 10 different machines.
Please go ahead as it is MC team.
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I still think an option to pay a annual subscription fee after the original purchase would alleviate many of the issues that get raised about pricing and would also stop me having to make a one off manual payment every ~1 yr (first world problems!). If someone doesn't want to subscribe, then their current version would continue working, same as today.
When I proposed this previously, it was interpreted as requesting a perpetual license. Hopefully this is clearer.
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Perhaps there are features of an annual subscription service that JRiver does not want to get into - credit card details would have to be kept and this is an area a small company would have to invest heavily in to keep everyones details secure. Personally I like to click the update button and do things the first world problem way. The pricing for this product is ludicrously low considering what you can do with it and the quality of the output is second to none.