INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => Media Center 12 (Development Ended) => Topic started by: cwilliams222 on November 13, 2007, 07:13:03 am
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If you show the column "Image File", does it say "Inside File" for the APE files in question?
And where does the art not show? In Playing Now for the playing file when the visualization is "Cover Art"?
If you reinstall the same version over the top, does it change anything?
Sorry for all the questions, but I can't think why an upgrade would have any bearing on this.
Matt,
I hope this isn't considered "hijacking" this thread, but when i read your questions/response above, it made me think about my library as everytime I have to change PCs and reinstall MC, I end up losing a lot of cover art and have to go through the process of re-downloading it.
I did as you suggested above and added the "Image File" column to my view and to my shock and surprise, only my MP3s show "Inside File," all of my FLAC and APE files show an actual file name.
My MC is configured to store cover art in the file's tag (File Location...Cover Art....In a specifified folder is set to a folder on my PC, and there is a check mark to also store the image in the file's tag).
If I right-click on a FLAC file and select Library Tools....Update Tags (from Library), the image file still shows a file path, not "Inside File."
Is this something I should be worried about? If so, how do I get MC to both ensure that the image file has been saved inside the FLAC/APE file and to recognize that has occured (so it reflects it is inside the file and not pointing to a file path)?
thanks
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Try a google search for cover art problems caused by Windows Media Player 11.
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Try a google search for cover art problems caused by Windows Media Player 11.
Now I'm a little lost....what would a problem with Windows Media Player 11 have to do with how my album art is displayed/saved in my library for Media Center?
Not sure if this is relevant, but the issue I mentioned has occured on PCs with Windows Media Player 10 and 11 installed.
thanks
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Specifically for flac, if your MC12 version is <12.0.365 the flac input plugin is broken with regards to coverart. You can update to a newer version or get an updated flac plugin from the link below. I just tested your "update tags from library" problem with flac and the updated plugin and it worked fine for me.
link removed, get the latest mc12 instead. All is fine with version >=12.0.384
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Specifically for flac, if your MC12 version is <12.0.365 the flac input plugin is broken with regards to coverart. You can update to a newer version or get an updated flac plugin from the link below. I just tested your "update tags from library" problem with flac and the updated plugin and it worked fine for me.
Bob, I am running 365 on a fresh install (meaning it did not have the "old" external FLAC plugins installed).
Again, if I run the update tags from library, my column still reflects that it is pointing to an external image file and not reflecting that it is stored in the file.
Please let me know what additional information i can provide (if there is any) to help out on correcting this). Maybe I'm not describing it properly or something else....
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Now I'm a little lost....what would a problem with Windows Media Player 11 have to do with how my album art is displayed/saved in my library for Media Center?
Because WMP11 has caused problems (maybe not yours) in the past:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=42147.0
and
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=40940.0
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12.0.370 is at the top of this board.
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12.0.370 is at the top of this board.
hadn't installed that yet as one of the notes surrounding its release said if you weren't having one of the specific issues it was addressing, you were better off waiting a couple of versions.
I can install it shortly and see if it corrects the problem and will report back results shortly.
Will also check out the WMP link as well.
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Updated to 370 and did the update Tags from Library - didn't change what was being displayed in the image file column (still shows the link to an actual file, versus saying "Inside File").
Again, I get this problem for all APE and FLAC files, only my MP3 files show that the image is stored inside the file. MC is configured to save the image inside the file's tag.
I checked the link above about WMP, didn't seem to be relevant as this PC doesn't have WMP 11 installed (it has version 9 installed, which I hadn't even opened up until now just to check on the version).
Any other thoughts or suggestions on what I should do next? I really am getting "annoyed" by having to go out and re-download cover art files every time I change PCs (which happens more than I'd like) or something happens to my library, especially since I've told MC to store the images in the files.
thanks for all the help so far.
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Is it possible you've disabled tagging in Options > General > Update tags when file info changes...
Or is it possible you're using Party Mode, or a read-only copy of the library (on a network configuration) where tagging is not possible?
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Is it possible you've disabled tagging in Options > General > Update tags when file info changes...
Or is it possible you're using Party Mode, or a read-only copy of the library (on a network configuration) where tagging is not possible?
Matt - good suggestions/thoughts....but:
1. Disabling tagging - Looked and the box is checked to "Update tags when file info changes"
2. Party Mode - nope not using it, not even sure how to turn it on or what it would look like.
3. Library itself is on an external usb drive, not a network share. Other tag changes seem to make it into the file without any issues (whether it is for an MP3 file, or any other change to the APE/FLAC file, such as changing the album, track #, etc.)
Again, thanks for the suggestions.
Any other thoughts of what I should check? Seems odd that it is for APE and FLAC files. This oddity with the cover art seems to occur for all the files that were in the library prior to moving to the new PC, as well as new APE/FLAC files I've added to it since then. I have also added some "plain" MP3 files since then, and they seem to be corrrect (indicating that the cover art is stored in the tag of the file).
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What if you put an APE file at C:\1.ape.
Then right-click it and add cover art from an external file, C:\1.jpg.
MC will say "C:\1.jpg" as the external image until it finishes saving the tag. You should see "Done saving tag changes" in the status bar when it finishes.
Then refresh the view -- if saving the image in the tag worked, it'll say "Inside File" instead of "C:\1.jpg".
Do any of those steps give any clues? Make sure you use C:\ because I'm wondering if there's a path or permissions issue.
Thanks for all the help.
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What if you put an APE file at C:\1.ape.
Then right-click it and add cover art from an external file, C:\1.jpg.
MC will say "C:\1.jpg" as the external image until it finishes saving the tag. You should see "Done saving tag changes" in the status bar when it finishes.
Then refresh the view -- if saving the image in the tag worked, it'll say "Inside File" instead of "C:\1.jpg".
Do any of those steps give any clues? Make sure you use C:\ because I'm wondering if there's a path or permissions issue.
Thanks for all the help.
Matt - this is what I was thinking i had to check next. I will not be able to do this test until tomorrow most likley as I'm in meetings the rest of the day. Will provide an update on this as soon as I do the testing.
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Yes, mainly in Playing Now does the cover art not show. As I originally reported (in one of the release threads), the image wouldn't be displayed in the Action Window, either, but like I show in my screenshot above, the thumbnails still display in the listing and tooltip.
For the problems I am having, I still see the Cover Art at all times when on the PC (thumbnails, Playing Now, Action Window, etc.). The problem occurs when I end up changing PCs and all of the coverart I thought was embedded doesn't make the move to the new PC since it just refers to a file name.
Since the issue Omni originally reported in this thread may be different from what I reported and that others have chimed in on as well (that cover art we thought was embedded in the file really doesn't seem to be reflected that way), should this be moved to a new/different thread?
As I said earlier, I will test what Matt asked me about (using a file on the c:\ drive) tomorrow morning and will report the answers shortly thereafter.
One question I have based on some of the comments in this thread - All of the cover art that i have added to my files (mp3, APE, and FLAC) has been done in 2 ways:
1. Using Cover Art.....Get From Internet
2. Cutting and pasting a file from the clipboard.
I have seen a few people listing this method: Cover Art.....Add from File..
Does it make a difference?
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Can anyone that can't get MC to switch to "Inside File" for some files do some tests with files at different locations to try to find a common link?
Thanks.
Matt,
I did some testing of APE and FLAC files this morning as you suggested yesterday and I'm not seeing anything pop out at me.
I downloaded test APE and FLAC files, stored them on my C:\ drive, got a sample JPG file serve as the cover art and also stored that on my C:\ drive.
I then added the image to the file by selecting Cover Art....Add from File. I tried it both ways (moving the image file to where I normally store my image files, which is on an external USB drive, and leaving it on the C:\ drive), and in both instances the "Image File" column in MC reflected the file path/file name, and did not say that the cover art was inside the file.
I will be happy to do additional testing, just have no idea what to text and how? I can supply log files if needed as well.
In my library I have MP3, FLAC, and APE files (about 4,200 files total, small library compared with most everyone else posting on this board). In that library, MP3 files show that the cover art is inside the file, FLAC and APE files show a path name for where the cover art is. I have, multiple times, run the "Update tags from library command." On previous builds I did receive some error messages on some of the FLAC files when doing this (not for all FLAC files, just a small number that I attributed to earlier reported probelms with MC/FLAC/and cover art).
I would also point out that when I re-installed MC on a new PC, and had to go out and re-download coverart for most of my FLAC and APE files, since they weren't embedded in the actual files as I thought, if I highlighted a FLAC/APE file that was missing its cover art, and click on Action Window....Tag...click on where the cover art would be...I got text saying <various internal images> .
What is even odder, and something that I just now ran across as I thought I had fixed this problem on all of the files, I still have 4 APE and at least 1 FLAC files that I had embedded cover art into, however, when on my main library page, I just see the blue note image, indicating it has no image (no cover art in Playing now either). If I click on Action Window...Tag...click on where the cover art would be, I get text saying <various internal images.> Now the really odd part - if I look at the "Image File" column - this column says the cover art is "Inside File."
I have not done anything to these files to correct this, get the cover art showing like it is supposed to, as I figure I can use these for additional testing or anything else that Matt or others would want to be checked.
Any suggestions or things that I should test/verify?
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I can't reproduce any of the problems described in this thread. I don't normally use embedded cover art, but as a test I experimented with a bunch of FLAC, APE and MP3 files using the latest public MC12 and MC11.1 builds.
I think this <various internal images> thing has something to do with the problem. I couldn't make that line appear when I had only one audio file selected.
It would be good to have some sample files that trigger this problem available.
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I can't reproduce any of the problems described in this thread. I don't normally use embedded cover art, but as a test I experimented with a bunch of FLAC, APE and MP3 files using the latest public MC12 and MC11.1 builds.
I think this <various internal images> thing has something to do with the problem. I couldn't make that line appear when I had only one audio file selected.
It would be good to have some sample files that trigger this problem available.
I can provide a sample flac and ape file that I am getting that "error." how do I get it to you or posted? the files would be about 25MB each.
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You can use a service like www.rapidshare.com, www.yousendit.com, www.files-upload.com etc.
Since this is not a place for public file sharing it might be good to use the forum PM for sending the link addresses to me and Matt from JRiver.
Edit
You may want to put the files in a zip or rar package because some of the services have waiting times for subsequent downloads.
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You can use a service like www.rapidshare.com, www.yousendit.com, www.files-upload.com etc.
Since this is not a place for public file sharing it might be good to use the forum PM for sending the link addresses to me and Matt from JRiver.
Edit
You may want to put the files in a zip or rar package because some of the services have waiting times for subsequent downloads.
check your Inbox. Should be a note there now. I did all of this before your edit, so if it doesn't work, let me know and I will re-do.
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Two more thoughts, maybe they've been explored.
Read only files or folders?
Some clever "security" feature of the OS or other app?
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check your Inbox. Should be a note there now. I did all of this before your edit, so if it doesn't work, let me know and I will re-do.
It seems to be working. I.E. is downloading the files now (I couldn't make the downloads start with Opera).
The service you selected is rather slow (the dl speed is currently 11.2 KB/sec), but I'll report back later after the downloads are finished.
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Two more thoughts, maybe they've been explored.
Read only files or folders?
Some clever "security" feature of the OS or other app?
Jim H
1. Read only files/folders - checked the security on the usb drive which holds the library and the cover art directory, no special/odd/"bad" security settings. Users and authenticated users have the ability to Modify, read & execute, Read, and write to the folders and files
2. Running XP SP2, not aware of any special things on the PC security wise that would affect this. Not running any special apps that should affect this. I did check out the unlocker application and can see that nothing else is locking the files.
Thanks for the suggestions, please keep them coming as this seems to be an "odd" problem.
Alex B - sorry about the slow service I picked, as I said in the PM, that is the only one I could get to at work. I'm just happy it seems to be working.
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checked the security on the usb drive which holds the library and the cover art directory, no special/odd/"bad" security settings. Users and authenticated users have the ability to Modify, read & execute, Read, and write to the folders and files
Try setting up a local library just to see if there is a difference. The fact that the files are on a USB drive shouldn't matter, BUT we have seen a lot of strange and unexpected things in the past. There's a list in my signature.
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Alex B - sorry about the slow service I picked, as I said in the PM, that is the only one I could get to at work. I'm just happy it seems to be working.
It wasn't a problem, downloading just took its time.
I tried the sample files with MC and various other tools, but couldn't find anything wrong. MC12 displayed the images prefectly fine and correctly indicated them as "inside file". The sample files contain a lot of text lines in the Bios and Lyrics tags, but that shouldn't be a problem. The codes in the cover art tags look normal when viewed with a hex editor. I wonder if Matt can find anything special in the files.
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Try setting up a local library just to see if there is a difference. The fact that the files are on a USB drive shouldn't matter, BUT we have seen a lot of strange and unexpected things in the past. There's a list in my signature.
Did as requested and it did not correct anything. Used a local library (the one created by default with the MC install, buried on my C:\ drive), for some APE/FLAC files that had cover art, I selected Update Tags from library, it ran with no failures and yet the Image File column still shows a file path/location.
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I've split the cwilliams posts to this thread. We're not certain the problems in the old thread are the same and we'd like to focus on one user for a little while. It's a really odd problem that we can't reproduce.
cwilliams
Can you copy your system info from MC Help and paste it here?
Then describe your setup. Any servers in use? Third party apps? Any unusual useage of MC? Security programs?
Where do you get your cover art? Scan? JPG? Size?
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I downloaded one of the sample files. It has art in it.
Look in Action Window > Tag > Format for a detailed tag dump.
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I downloaded one of the sample files. It has art in it.
Look in Action Window > Tag > Format for a detailed tag dump.
A screenshot of what I see is attached.
I didn't see an attachment/file to view to see what your screen shot looks like.
When I look at Window>Tag>Format, for cover art I just see <too large to display>, which is also present for Media Jukebox Bios and Lyrics.
no idea if that means it is too large just for this view or overall by MC.
That is one issue (again, thanks for looking into it, not sure if it is resolved or what to do next), but the much bigger one, and not entirely sure if it is related to these 6 or 7 FLAC/APE files that actually have the column "Image File" say that the cover art is in the file,
is why is it when I instruct MC to update tags from library, it doesn't appear to embed the cover art in the actual FLAC/APE files.
If I take one of the problem FLAC/APE files, that show that the image file is embedded (but it really isn't), and I Right click on the file, select Cover Art....Get from Internet. It downloads the proper cover art, and then the Image File column points to the path where my cover art is stored, it does not say "Inside File" as it should, since my MC is configured to embed all cover art (Just did that for one of the problem APE files and if I look at Action Window>Tag>Format, still just see that it is <too large>, so I'm guessing that isn't really the problem)
Any additional thoughts for troubleshooting? If you want any logs or any other things for me to try, just let me know as I'd really like to get this corrected.
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When I look at Window>Tag>Format, for cover art I just see <too large to display>, which is also present for Media Jukebox Bios and Lyrics.
That means cover art is in the tag. You're looking at an exact tag dump there.
Is it possible the only issue is that the image column sometimes stays with a filename instead of switching to "Inside File"? (but tagging is fine)
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Here's what you should have seen in Matt's post above:
http://pix01.com/rF@KiRq
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Are you, by chance, using a program that removes ads from your browser?
JimH - Just a plain/default installation of IE 6 (6.0.2900.2180.xpsp_sp2_gdr). I've not downloaded or installed any special apps to remove ads from the browser (I seem to to see more than my fair share while surfing). It does appear to have the default pop-up blocker installed/turned on, but nothing more advanced than that.
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Can you copy your system info from MC Help and paste it here?
Then describe your setup. Any servers in use? Third party apps? Any unusual useage of MC? Security programs?
Where do you get your cover art? Scan? JPG? Size?
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System Info as requested:
Media Center Registered 12.0.370 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 12\
Microsoft Windows XP Workstation 5.1 Service Pack 2 (Build 2600)
Intel Core 2 1387 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 1047 MB, Free - 241 MB
Internet Explorer: 6.0.2900.2180 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82.2900 / Shlwapi.dll: 6.0.2900 / Shell32.dll: 6.0.2900 / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping / Drive D: Mode:Normal Type:Auto Speed:Max
Digital playback: Yes / Use YADB: Yes / Get cover art: Yes / Calc replay gain: Yes / Copy volume: 32767
Eject after ripping: Yes / Play sound after ripping: No
Burning / Drive D: TSSTcorp CDW/DVD TS-L462D Addr: 0:0:0 Speed:24 MaxSpeed:24 BurnProof:Yes
Test mode: No / Eject after writing: Yes / Direct decoding: Yes / Write CD-Text: Yes
Use playback settings: No /
Portable Device Info
Removed devices:
Interface Plugins:
last.fm (Active)
Library Server (Active)
TiVo Server (Active)
UPnP Server (Active)
Lyrics Editor (Active)
Setup:
Have MC installed on a Compaq nc8430 PC, with the library and cover art directories on an external USB drive (Seagate ST90000U2, 100 GB). Library has 4,196 files in it, mixture of MP3, FLAC, and APE. Really only use MC for audio playback, tend to use Media Player Classic or Zoom player for video (have CCCP codec pack installed). The only additional add-in to MC that I have installed is the Lyrics Editor (I think from Doof). There are no servers in use for this setup. PC is generally used for work stuff, MS Office suite, MS Project/Visio, and web surfing. Security apps - the hard drive on the PC itself, not on the external USB drive, is encrypted by PC Guardian (NOTE: I had this problem on my previous PC, but didn't report it, a Dell laptop which did NOT have the hard drive encrypted). 99% of the music files that are in my library have been downloaded off the net from numerous sources, only a few are direct CD rips.
Cover Art:
I generally get my cover art by doing one (or more) of the following:
1. Right click on a file and select Cover Art....Get from Internet
2. If that doesn't work, I generally go to Google, Amazon, Yahoo Music, or some other site with albums and search for the album cover I need, copy it to the clip board, and then, make sure that I have clicked on Action Window...Tag...Then click on where the actual clip art would be, which gives me a little "Image" Box that would say something like <no image>. I then put my mouse in that box, right click and select paste.
After doing a good number of those, I would always then select Update Tags from Library to make sure that the cover art was being embedded in the actual file (this was before this all happened and I found out there was a column called "Image File" that I could use to easily see where MC thought the cover art was).
EDIT: Forgot you asked about size: No idea what the size is, whatever MC provides when I try and get it or whatever I download from one of the sites above. I do believe all of the cover art I've used has been JPG, at least in my cover art directory, all the files are JPG. In looking in my cover art directory, the dimensions seem to be all over the map (135 X135 up to 1398 X 1396).
Log File:
Below is a short piece of a log file where I cleared the log out, then told MC to update a FLAC files tags from the library (so it would embed the cover art). Don't see any errors pop out at me, but what do I know?
Media Center; Version: 12.0.370; Types: 16383
0000000: 5324: General: Starting logging: Date: 11/14/2007 12:12:59 PM
0000000: 5324: General: Log Reset: Logging reset
0001391: 5324: General: CMCResourceHelper::GetIsModalPopupShowing: Main window disabled
0006125: 5324: General: CMCResourceHelper::GetIsModalPopupShowing: Menu showing
0006125: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::Open: Start
0006125: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Start
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Filename: M:\My Music2\2005_095 - Howie Day - Collide [CD][4.06].flac
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Start
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Filename: M:\My Music2\2005_095 - Howie Day - Collide [CD][4.06].flac
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFileMJ: Start
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFileMJ: Finish (0 ms)
0006141: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Finish (0 ms)
0006156: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::AddFile: Finish (31 ms)
0006156: 5324: Import: JRAnalyzer::Open: Finish (31 ms)
0006156: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::OpenInternal: Opening: M:\My Music2\2005_095 - Howie Day - Collide [CD][4.06].flac
0006250: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::OpenInternal: Opening: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006266: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::Close: Closing: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006266: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::OpenInternal: Opening: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006281: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::Close: Closing: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006297: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::Close: Closing: M:\My Music2\2005_095 - Howie Day - Collide [CD][4.06].flac
0006313: 3780: Import: CWatchFoldersThread::Thread: Detected change
0006360: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::OpenInternal: Opening: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006360: 5324: Reader: CLocalReader::Close: Closing: M:\cover art\Howie Day - Stop All the World Now.jpg
0006391: 5324: General: CMJSearchWnd::UpdatePanes: Start
0006516: 5324: General: CMJSearchWnd::UpdatePanes: Finish (125 ms)
Just let me know what else I can provide.....
thanks
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I would always then select Update Tags from Library to make sure that the cover art was being embedded in the actual file
This is an unusual step. May be a clue.
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This is an unusual step. May be a clue.
Both Glynor and AoXoMoXoA mentioned doing basically the same thing at times in the thread that started this whole discussion.
Not sure why it would be unusual, a periodic update of the file tags from the library, making sure that what you are seeing in the library is actually being reflected in the files....
Is that something that one shouldn't be running "a lot?" Just curious as to why it seemed unusual to you.
thanks
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Update Tags (from Library)
This should be able to embed a linked cover art file to the file tags and change the field value to "Inside File" if the link valid and the "store in file tag" cover art option is enabled. However, if the linked image file is missing it can't do that.
"Update Library (from tags)"
- can update the Image File field value to "Inside File" if the field shows a filename (with or without a complete path) even though the image is already embedded in the file.
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I should note as well that it is pretty ridiculous that it does NOT properly embed the Cover Art in the file when you use Cover Art --> Add from File but requires the second arbitrary step.
This is exactly how I see it work on a regular basis as well. When I'm tagging files, after doing the Cover Art --> Add From File command, I need to then do a Library Tools --> Update Tags (From Library) to actually get the cover art to embed in the files. I would want to take this step anyway though, to make sure that the tags in the file match the library once I'm finished tagging (which is when I'd normally be doing this type of thing).
That said... Despite the setting in Options --> File Location --> Cover Art --> Also Store Image in the File's Tag, doing the Add from File command does NOT appear to actually embed the cover art into the file without the subsequent step.
If the option to store the images in the file tags is enabled, Cover Art --> Add from File should automatically embed it and set MC to Inside File. It never has. This isn't new, it just is silly.
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I should note as well that it is pretty ridiculous that it does NOT properly embed the Cover Art in the file when you use Cover Art --> Add from File but requires the second arbitrary step.
It is not necessary to do Update Tags -- MC does this automatically in a background thread after any changes.
I can't reproduce needing to do this.
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How long do you have to wait? Does the time taken depend on if the files are local or on a network drive?
This has NOT been my experience, but maybe I'm never patient enough. Generally I do the tags, add the cover art, check the Cover Art location, and then do the Update Tags from Library Step.
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It is not necessary to do Update Tags -- MC does this automatically in a background thread after any changes.
I can't reproduce needing to do this.
Well, for myself, neither seems to actually embed the cover art into the file if the file is a FLAC or MP3 (cover art...add from file, or update tags from library), while it seems for Glynor doing both steps gets the cover art embedded.
Very odd. Not sure why my library does this now, and has been doing it for some builds, do not remember when it started doing this and I guess there was no way for me to really see if it was working (since I didn't know about the "Image File" column) except when I moved PCs.
Any other suggestions out there for what to do to get MC to correctly embed the cover art for me (and for any others experiencing the problem, as both Glynor and AoXoMoXoA mentioned they have seen this issue)
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Well, for myself, neither seems to actually embed the cover art into the file if the file is a FLAC or MP3
Hmm... the FLAC sample file you provided has embedded cover art.
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I should note as well that it is pretty ridiculous that it does NOT properly embed the Cover Art in the file when you use Cover Art --> Add from File but requires the second arbitrary step.
It does exactly this for me and takes just a second for 5 or 10 files. Where are you looking when you say it hasn't done it?
If the option to store the images in the file tags is enabled, Cover Art --> Add from File should automatically embed it and set MC to Inside File. It never has. This isn't new, it just is silly.
It does here. Something's rotten in Denmark.
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Well, for myself, neither seems to actually embed the cover art into the file if the file is a FLAC or MP3 (cover art...add from file, or update tags from library), while it seems for Glynor doing both steps gets the cover art embedded.
Where are you looking that makes you believe it doesn't work?
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When I tried the "Add from file" tool with a few FLAC and APE files MC added the embedded images and changed the field info to "Inside File" immediately (within one second or so).
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Hmm... the FLAC sample file you provided has embedded cover art.
Alex B - see my post below from today at 11:36. The 2 sample files I posted for you and Matt (I think it was Matt at least), were a different symptom of my problems with cover art and FLAC/APE files.
Issue 1:
small number of files, about 4 APE and 1 FLAC that MC was saying had embedded cover art (the Image File column indicated this), but my installation of MC was unable to display any cover art,
This issue is possibly related to the major/main issue that I brought up, and one that Glynor and AoXoMoXoA also put messages in on:
Issue 2:
All of my other FLAC and APE files do not have cover art embedded in them, even though MC is configured to store the cover art in the files tag, and I have done multiple Update files from library operations. No matter what I do, the Image File column still points to file path to indicate where the cover art is for my FLAC and APE files.
This becomes a problem for me if I have to change PCs or if something happens to my library or cover art file location, lo and behold, all of a sudden MC can't find cover art for all my files even though I have told it to embed it in the files.
All of the MP3 files in my collection do show that the cover art is inside the file.
Make sense?
thanks
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When I tried the "Add from file" tool with a few FLAC and APE files MC added the embedded images and changed the field info to "Inside File" immediately (within one second or so).
Alex B - I tried doing this today per Matt's suggestions, on both files stored in my normal library, on an external USB drive, and for files stored on my C:\ drive, and for both APE and FLAC files, the "Image File" column never changed to indicate that the cover art was inside file, it only indicated a file path (also did a Update tags from library after doing this and nothing changes or was fixed).
Edit: One thing I should note, for this test mentioned above, I created a new folder on my hard drive (C:\) and configured MC to auto-import from this directory. I put the FLAC and APE files in that directory, and a test jpg file to use as its cover art. When MC auto-imported the file into the library, the Image File column had the jpg file name listed there (no file path, just the file name). I then did the Cover Art...Add from file, and it changed to the actual file path for the jpg file (this occured whether or not I had MC move the cover art to my normal cover art directory or leave it where it was).
Does that make any sense?
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Alex B - I tried doing this today per Matt's suggestions, on both files stored in my normal library, on an external USB drive, and for files stored on my C:\ drive, and for both APE and FLAC files, the "Image File" column never changed to indicate that the cover art was inside file, it only indicated a file path (also did a Update tags from library after doing this and nothing changes or was fixed).
Edit: One thing I should note, for this test mentioned above, I created a new folder on my hard drive (C:\) and configured MC to auto-import from this directory. I put the FLAC and APE files in that directory, and a test jpg file to use as its cover art. When MC auto-imported the file into the library, the Image File column had the jpg file name listed there (no file path, just the file name). I then did the Cover Art...Add from file, and it changed to the actual file path for the jpg file (this occured whether or not I had MC move the cover art to my normal cover art directory or leave it where it was).
Does that make any sense?
Does it say "Done saving tag changes" in the statusbar at the bottom after making a change?
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Does it say "Done saving tag changes" in the statusbar at the bottom after making a change?
Yes. I have noticed that at the bottom many times, especially when i am adding cover art to a fair number of files, I have seen it list at the bottom how many files it has left to update. I have made sure it says all is done before I say something worked or not.
What seems "odd" to me, is that when I am doing the Update Tags from library, it just doesn't seem that anything is actually occuring..I pasted in part of a log when i tried to do it, and nothing in it seemed odd, my reading of it seems to indicate that it was a success, and that the cover art would be embedded, but I know that wasn't the case.
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Maybe you've said, but what program do you use for a virus checker?
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Alex B - I tried doing this today per Matt's suggestions, on both files stored in my normal library, on an external USB drive, and for files stored on my C:\ drive, and for both APE and FLAC files, the "Image File" column never changed to indicate that the cover art was inside file, it only indicated a file path (also did a Update tags from library after doing this and nothing changes or was fixed)
Did you also try this (it is a separate tool):
"Update Library (from tags)"
- can update the Image File field value to "Inside File" if the field shows a filename (with or without a complete path) even though the image is already embedded in the file.
Edit: One thing I should note, for this test mentioned above, I created a new folder on my hard drive (C:\) and configured MC to auto-import from this directory. I put the FLAC and APE files in that directory, and a test jpg file to use as its cover art. When MC auto-imported the file into the library, the Image File column had the jpg file name listed there (no file path, just the file name). I then did the Cover Art...Add from file, and it changed to the actual file path for the jpg file (this occured whether or not I had MC move the cover art to my normal cover art directory or leave it where it was).
The cover art filename is supposed to be stored without a path whenever the linked image file is in the audio file folder. In this case the link is always correct if the image file is moved together with the audio files.
MC has an option for the default storing behavior (in a specific folder or in the audio file folder), but I think that during import it automatically links the first folder.jpg or [Album Artist (auto)] - [Album].jpg file it finds.
However, I don't normally use the Auto-Importer and I have not specifically tested if the cover art behavior is different when the Auto-Importer is used. (I did my mass importing years ago and currenty I import only a few files at a time.)
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Auto-Import ignores those files if the relevant "ignore special files" option is checked. You can uncheck it though and then it'll import them.
I'll have to check the behavior of Add from File when I get home. It could be entirely that I'm just not waiting long enough. I know that a week and a half ago or so I did a lot of tag maintenance including adding a lot of cover art from files. Each and every time it worked the way I described. I'd add the cover art via Cover Art --> Add from File. MC would update the thumbnails one by one and say "Done saving tag changes" and then I'd scroll over to my Image File column and it'd say M:\Music Art\blah\blah - blah.jpg" or whatever. I'd then finish tagging and select the files and do Update Tags from Library and it'd fix that column to say "Inside File" as expected.
I probably did this with at least 200 files in that sitting, so I'm pretty sure of the steps. However:
(a) The files were all on a network drive, and not my big fast RAID, but my temporary "import" drive (which is on a slower machine which is often pretty heavily bogged down with Bittorrent traffic).
(b) I was doing the operations fast. As soon as the thumbs finished redrawing and showed the cover art, they'd get the Update Tags from Library action almost immediately. I'd guess that I was slower on a few, but I just thought (from previous experience) that it was necessary so I was going along and doing it quickly. So... It is entirely possible that MC would have switched these all to "Inside File" on it's own a little while later. If it was going to take 20 - 60 seconds I'd have missed it. If it was nearly instantaneous I think I'd have caught it.
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Auto-Import ignores those files if the relevant "ignore special files" option is checked. You can uncheck it though and then it'll import them.
Hmm... I wasn't speaking about importing the actual image files to the library (at least not this time... :) )
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Doing "Update Library (from tags)" (not Update Tags) will switch the "Image File" column to "Inside File" if MC can read an image from the tag.
If you have a file that MC can't read or write an image into the tag, perhaps you could share it. The files from earlier today did have art in them.
Thanks.
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Maybe you've said, but what program do you use for a virus checker?
JimH - I am using Symantec Anti-Virus 10.1.6.6010, Corporate edition
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Did you also try this (it is a separate tool):
Not really sure what you are referring to here.. Are you asking did I try Update tags from library (versus update tags from library)?
If so, then, nope, not tried it yet, but will shortly to see what that does.
The cover art filename is supposed to be stored without a path whenever the linked image file is in the audio file folder. In this case the link is always correct if the image file is moved together with the audio files.
MC has an option for the default storing behavior (in a specific folder or in the audio file folder), but I think that during import it automatically links the first folder.jpg or [Album Artist (auto)] - [Album].jpg file it finds.
However, I don't normally use the Auto-Importer and I have not specifically tested if the cover art behavior is different when the Auto-Importer is used. (I did my mass importing years ago and currenty I import only a few files at a time.)
Really not sure what to say here as I don't think I totally get it above, I must be having a slow "processing" day...... I don't normally use the auto-important feature as well. I have MC configured to save all coverart in a specific folder, one that is on the same usb drive as the actual library, and to also store the cover art inside the file.
Not sure I really addressed the second part, but not sure how I could....
thanks
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Doing "Update Library (from tags)" (not Update Tags) will switch the "Image File" column to "Inside File" if MC can read an image from the tag.
If you have a file that MC can't read or write an image into the tag, perhaps you could share it. The files from earlier today did have art in them.
Thanks.
I ran Update Library from tags on 2 separate sets of FLAC files (one about 3 files, and one of about 10 files), ran fine, with no failures, but the Image File column still reflects the path to the image file, it does NOT say Inside File.
So running Update Library from Tags, and Update Tags from library, neither one seemed to correct the issue I am experiencing.
To address your second statement - I don't think I have any files that MC can't read or write an image to, but will keep checking.
All of you have come up with a lot of suggestions and thoughts and so far nothing has worked. I'm starting to get worried that the well of ideas is about to run dry and I'm just going to have to live with this problem........
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'm starting to get worried that the well of ideas is about to run dry and I'm just going to have to live with this problem........
Don't worry, you aren't the only one experiencing this problem. I'm confident it will get fixed.
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cwilliams222,
Does externally linked cover art work? You mentioned that you have the image files in a defined cover art folder.
If yes, do you actually need embedded cover art for some other program? (I mean for now, until the reason for the behavior has been found and the problem fixed.)
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cwilliams222,
Does externally linked cover art work? You mentioned that you have the image files in a defined cover art folder.
If yes, do you actually need embedded cover art for some other program? (I mean for now, until the reason for the behavior has been found and the problem fixed.)
Not really sure I understand your question. I have no other program that uses these cover art files, the MC library or anything like that.
All of the cover art I use for MC is stored on an external USB drive attached to the PC.
Did I address your question?
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I'm not convinced this is an MC problem. It may be, but it's acting like something may be preventing a tag from being written. A virus checker or other security app could do that.
Still, I'm not convinced that it isn't an MC problem.
cwilliams, thank you for your patience and for all the information you've provided.
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Not really sure I understand your question. I have no other program that uses these cover art files, the MC library or anything like that.
All of the cover art I use for MC is stored on an external USB drive attached to the PC.
Did I address your question?
Can you see the externally linked cover art in the main display during playback? Can MC create thumbnails for the view schemes and tooltips? I.e. does it matter if the Image File field shows a file path instead of "Inside File"? (Assuming the displayed path is correct.)
BTW, by default the cached thumbnails are stored in the application data folder. For example, my default location is C:\Documents and Settings\Alex B\Application Data\J River\Media Center 12\... Do you have write access to these folders?
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And one other thing....
If you delete/move/rename one of the "linked" image files, and then tell MC to rebuild thumbnails from scratch, does it then pull the image inside the file (since others indicated the FLAC you posted did indeed contain an embedded image)?
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I'm not convinced this is an MC problem. It may be, but it's acting like something may be preventing a tag from being written. A virus checker or other security app could do that.
Still, I'm not convinced that it isn't an MC problem.
cwilliams, thank you for your patience and for all the information you've provided.
I'm open to any idea or solution. I personally would lean more to it being an MC issue as I had the problem on an earlier laptop PC that had an entirely different software loadset installed (different anti-virus, software, different OS, etc.) I really love MC and want it to work "properly."
I did just go ahead and install 372 as it is now on the main board. After doing that I tried the updating tags from library and library from tags, still no fix.
Not sure what other information I can provide.....Again, I will provide any logs that may help, just tell me what to setup/configure and I'll try and get it done.
You had earlier asked what security/virus software I have installed and I replied Symantec Anti-Virus, I forgot to also include that this PC has Proventia Desktop (formerly blackice) installed as well. I checked its logs and there is nothing there that seems to be related to MC, the share where the library is.
I also checked the Event Viewer logs on the PC and nothing jumped out being related to this issue (not saying it wouldn't be there, but nothing obviously seemed to be related)...
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Here's another clue.
1) I took a song from one album and removed the coverart. Album is Aaron Neville's Gospel Roots. Original coverart was named "Aaron Neville - Gospel Roots Disc 1.jpg"
2) I attached art to that Aaron Neville song from another album (B.B. King)
3) MC asked if I wanted to copy the art to the default folder. I said yes.
4) MC now displays the new (B.B. King) art for all the files in that album. I only changed one.
5) The tag shows the original cover art file (C:\Documents and Settings\Ed\Application Data\J River\Media Center 12\Cover Art\Aaron Neville - Gospel Roots Disc 1.jpg"
6) When I look in the coverart folder on my hard drive, there is the B.B.King art renamed to Aaron Neville. So, all the rest of the songs in that album are now pointing to the B.B. King art that MC renamed and copied as "Aaron Neville - Gospel Roots Disc 1.jpg"
7) The art is not embedded. Update Library (from tags) does nothing but show "library updated for 1 files".
Files are all ape. MC ver 12.0.372
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And one other thing....
If you delete/move/rename one of the "linked" image files, and then tell MC to rebuild thumbnails from scratch, does it then pull the image inside the file (since others indicated the FLAC you posted did indeed contain an embedded image)?
Glynor -- Good suggestion, I did try this, took a file in the coverart directory, deleted it, and MC from that point just showed the file path in the Tag window for the corresponding FLAC file, and an X in Playing Now. I restored the file back and everything went back to normal... It did NOT appear to try and pull the coverart internally from the file.
I think you are thinking of the "smaller" of the 2 issues I was reporting, not the big one that is affecting my library --- sure you didn't have time to read through my 30 or so posts on this subjetc - you must have a life or something..... Anyway, I had about 5 FLAC/APE files that my MC showed as having the cover art embedded, even though MC couldn't actually show it to me via thumbnails, or when I looked at the tag. I believe this is a separate (but could be related) issue from the main one I am reporting about all (or more accurately, all but 5) of my FLAC and APE files being reported in MC as not having the cover art embedded in the file despite how MC is setup.....
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Glynor -- Good suggestion, I did try this, took a file in the coverart directory, deleted it, and MC from that point just showed the file path in the Tag window for the corresponding FLAC file, and an X in Playing Now. I restored the file back and everything went back to normal... It did NOT appear to try and pull the coverart internally from the file.
For these same files, if you look at Action Window > Tag > Format, does it say that the tag contains an image? I'm still trying to understand if the tag actually has an image and MC doesn't know about it, or if MC can't read or write the image to the tag.
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Can you see the externally linked cover art in the main display during playback? Can MC create thumbnails for the view schemes and tooltips? I.e. does it matter if the Image File field shows a file path instead of "Inside File"? (Assuming the displayed path is correct.)
Alex B - Yes, I can see the cover art picture in the main display during playback. I usually have a 3 tab setup, with one tab set to Playing Now, and use the "All I need" track info visualization for this and I see the cover art fine for all files (the MP3 files that do indicate that the cover art is inside the file, and the FLAC/APE files that MC indicates the file path to where the cover art is stored).
BTW, by default the cached thumbnails are stored in the application data folder. For example, my default location is C:\Documents and Settings\Alex B\Application Data\J River\Media Center 12\... Do you have write access to these folders?
I just verified this, I have full control of all the folders/files under ...\J River\Media Center 12\....
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For these same files, if you look at Action Window > Tag > Format, does it say that the tag contains an image? I'm still trying to understand if the tag actually has an image and MC doesn't know about it, or if MC can't read or write the image to the tag.
Matt - Didn't check that the first time, so I re-ran my test and the Action Window>Tag>Format screen looks different to me now with version 372 than it did with 370.
I took one FLAC file, took the cover art that was in the cover art folder and removed it. I played the file and there was no cover art show in Playing now (just an "X"), but the thumbnail was still there as I didn't get rid of it.
When I look at Action Window>Tag>Format there is now a little "section" called: # of Pictures and the information it has is this (this is the whole Format window):
Free Lossless Audio Codec (FLAC)
44.1 kHz Sample Rate
16 Bits Per Sample
2 Channels
Min Block Size = 4096
Max Block Size = 4096
Min Frame Size = 1594
Max Frame Size = 13891
Padding Block = 2582 bytes
# of Pictures = 1
Type 3 (4043 bytes)
SeekTable Block (396 bytes):
# of points = 22
Vorbis Comment Block (1561 bytes):
Vendor String = reference libFLAC 1.1.4 20070213
TITLE = Romancing The Stone
ARTIST = Eddy Grant
TRACKNUMBER = 1
Comment = <Too Long To Display>
date = 1984/01/01
genre = Whitburn Pop
TOOL NAME = Media Center
TOOL VERSION = 12.0.372
ALBUM = Going for Broke
LTESTATUS = Lyrics Updated on 11/14/2007 6:37:27 PM
LYRICS = <Too Long To Display>
Putting the file back didn't seem to change anything. I went ahead and tried it on an APE file as well, as when I looked at the Action Window>Tag>Format information for an APE file, it looked different than for the FLAC file. When i removed the cover art file for the APE file, Playing now showed no cover art (just an "X") and the Action Window>Tag>Format information had this:
Monkey's Audio 3.99 (fast)
Format: 44.1 kHz, 16 bit, 2 ch
Length: 3:59
Compression: 66.78% (26.9 MB / 40.3 MB)
Tag: APE Tag 2.00 (34162 bytes)
Track: 49
Year: 1983
Genre: Oldies
Title: Automatic
Album: Break Out
Tool Version: 12.0.370
Comment: Cruiser CD Rip
Tool Name: Media Center
Media Jukebox: Date: 30317
Artist: The Pointer Sisters
Media Jukebox: LTEStatus: Lyrics Updated on 11/14/2007 6:45:19 PM
Lyrics: <too large to display>
Cover Art (front): <too large to display>
This did not change when I put the file back (still said too large to display).
Does this help with the troubleshooting?
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Hopefully relevant, but if not, ignore:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=43317.msg295680#msg295680
The gist is that on one machine cover art displays "everywhere" i.e. tool-tip, Image in tree, Playing Now, and Display View>Cover Art.
On the other machine, laptop, using a mapped drives, cover art won't display in Image in tree, Playing Now, and Display View>Cover Art but the thumbnail works as well as tool-tip.
The problem lies in the fact that I copy my library to a local location on the laptop. All mapped drives have the SAME letter assigned on both machines, but it seems that MC on the laptop, with the copy of the library, is confused about the location of cover art even though the library and tags clearly, and correctly, report cover art as Inside File.
If I create a brand new library on the laptop everything is kosher. Strange though that with identical drive letters, the ability to play the same files, that the copy of my library will not allow MC on the laptop to display cover art.
My question is, would this same behavior happen using the "approved" method of write/read-only library sharing?
DC
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I am having the same issues as reported by cwilliams. I also cant get MC12 to store coverart inside APE files.
I am not entirely sure when it started it happen as I just recently ripped a couple of CDs after I hadnt done any for a couple months.
I am not sure whether this might be related to the fact that I have in the meantime moved all files to a network drive (as Library Server only "serves" Audio files but no video files).
I have not done testing as to what might happen if files sit on a local drive. Has someone already tried this?
BBRip
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Doc Cilantro,
Great clue. Thanks!
Are there any NAS drives involved? The reason I ask is that I believe sometimes these drives use SAMBA and there may be a case problem (S: vs. s:, for example).
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Hey guys & gals,
HTPC has PATA, SATA, and external Firewire HDs; no true NAS but all drives are obviously mapped over the network by the laptop.
I got a chance to setup a library share, the write/read-only method, and I am observing the same behavior. MP3s display okay. I'm pure monkey so I don't have any FLAC files left to test.
DC
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Can you provide more details on the external drive? Brand, model, etc?
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The external is one of my four drives. It is a PATA Seagte 500GB drive mounted in a FireXpress (made by Adlogix IIRC?) enclosure which has both USB2.0 & Firewire400. I have .ape files spread out across all the drives.
DC
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Dr. C's system is very similar to mine, and I'm not seeing the same issues (I don't think). My only cover-art related issue is that which I discussed ad-nauseum above, and I also haven't verified that I haven't just been being impatient. I'd have to check more thoroughly to be sure...
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I think we found the issue. The APE and FLAC plugins were trying to extract image files to a directory that didn't exist. That didn't work, so we were never able to get the image back out of the tag.
To test this theory, create "JRTemp" under the temp folder on your machine. It should start working then. For XP, the full path should look like this:
C:\Documents and Settings\[Username]\Local Settings\Temp\JRTemp
Recently we made this change, but it didn't make it to the input plugins that don't use the JRiver shared code:
Changed: Temporary files are now stored in the JRiver application data folder instead of the temporary folder. (allows better support when running with very restrictive privileges)
This will be fixed in the next public build. Thanks to everyone for all the help.
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I think we found the issue. The APE and FLAC plugins were trying to extract image files to a directory that didn't exist. That didn't work, so we were never able to get the image back out of the tag.
To test this theory, create "JRTemp" under the temp folder on your machine. It should start working then. For XP, the full path should look like this:
C:\Documents and Settings\[Username]\Local Settings\Temp\JRTemp
Recently we made this change, but it didn't make it to the input plugins that don't use the JRiver shared code:
This will be fixed in the next public build. Thanks to everyone for all the help.
Matt - thank you very much. Just did as instructed above, ran "Update Tags from Library" on a number of FLAC and APe files, and now my "Image File" column says that the cover art is inside the file.
Again, thanks for the persistence on getting this resolved.
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Fix working on Vista x86...thanks!!!!!!! ;D
DC
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Fix working on Windowz XP, Thanks.
Question: must I now use "Update Tags from Library" on all the affected files to properly re-embed the images?
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I think we found the issue. The APE and FLAC plugins were trying to extract image files to a directory that didn't exist. That didn't work, so we were never able to get the image back out of the tag.
To test this theory, create "JRTemp" under the temp folder on your machine. It should start working then. For XP, the full path should look like this:
C:\Documents and Settings\[Username]\Local Settings\Temp\JRTemp
Recently we made this change, but it didn't make it to the input plugins that don't use the JRiver shared code:
This will be fixed in the next public build. Thanks to everyone for all the help.
Matt - if you don't mind me asking, what pointed you to this being the cause of the problem that was being described? Just curious as how you made this connection.
thanks
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Matt made a lucky guess. Looking at the code helped.
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Matt made a lucky guess. Looking at the code helped.
I thought that was a trained bug-sniffing dog he had there ;D
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Can you provide more details on the external drive? Brand, model, etc?
For me, its a LaCie Bigger Disk Network Drive (2TB)
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Posted the last one before reading to the end..... Great to hear you found the issue. Not fiddling with temp folders now but eagerly awaiting your next release with the fix :D