INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => Media Center 12 (Development Ended) => Topic started by: Magic_Randy on January 27, 2007, 01:56:01 pm
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I would like to manage some of my DVD's within MC. I want to rip them so I can store them on my hard drive, play them from my hard drive using MC, and sync them to my iPod.
I assume I need additional software to do the ripping. Any suggestions on the tools I need and the workflow required to achieve this?
Thanks in advance...
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I would like to manage some of my DVD's within MC. I want to rip them so I can store them on my hard drive, play them from my hard drive using MC, and sync them to my iPod.
I assume I need additional software to do the ripping. Any suggestions on the tools I need and the workflow required to achieve this?
I wrote a MC12 wiki page about managing DVDs in MC12.. you can check it out at
http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DVD_Library_in_Media_Center
This should be a good place to start.
Osho
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Osho,
Thanks...
I actually started by looking at wiki but could not find anything on the subject. I did a search on DVD with no results and could find nothing by going through the index. I still can't find it using the index. With a search I can, but I have to say "DVD Library" to get a match. Maybe I'm slow, but I don't find wiki to be very good.
Randy
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If I extract the DVD's to either a ISO file or Video_TS folder, can I sync it to my iPod? Is one format better than the other for this purpose?
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I actually started by looking at wiki but could not find anything on the subject. I did a search on DVD with no results and could find nothing by going through the index. I still can't find it using the index. With a search I can, but I have to say "DVD Library" to get a match. Maybe I'm slow, but I don't find wiki to be very good.
I think Wiki is good but the search feature in Wiki seems busted. For example, searching for DVD, CD or CD rip all give no results!
I don't have any iPod that can do video so I haven't tried copying DVDs to video.
Osho
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I wrote a MC12 wiki page about managing DVDs in MC12.. you can check it out at
http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DVD_Library_in_Media_Center
This should be a good place to start.
Osho
Thanks for the link and the work there Osho, I hadnt considered that way of integrating ISOs into MC, but will be using it from now on.
Kudos to the JR team for making such a flexible product.
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If I extract the DVD's to either a ISO file or Video_TS folder, can I sync it to my iPod? Is one format better than the other for this purpose?
I would recommend VIDEO_TS folder, it works easier with MC in my experience.
Osho
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I would recommend VIDEO_TS folder, it works easier with MC in my experience.
OK. I'll create a VIDEO_TS for one of my DVDs and try to sync it to my iPod.
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I created a Video_TS file. Actually 40 files were created for my DVD. Of these 22 were imported to MC. Maybe the other 18 files are not needed by MC. I can play the DVD using MC, but I cannot sync it to my iPod. I get a message that says:
None of the files can be transfered. Common errors include insufficient rights or unsupported file types.
How are people getting DVD synced to the iPod?
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DvdFab has a Platinum version that I believe will do what you want. Try dvdfab.com for info.
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DvdFab has a Platinum version that I believe will do what you want. Try dvdfab.com for info.
Thanks, I'll look it up.
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Thanks, I'll look it up.
The gold version kicks a$$ and they are constantly updating the software. If you get the platinum verson, let me know how it works....I have a psp that I would be interested in converting video for, but dont know if I would use it enough to justify buying it.
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I'm trying DVDFab as I write this. It looks like it will work, but I'm spending a lot of time just to convert one DVD. It took over 1 1/2 hours to copy the DVD to the PC. The result was a Video_TS file. This format could not be synced to the iPod. They have a function to convert it into a format for the iPod (mp4), but this is taking a long time. I'm almost 3 hours into the conversion and I'm only on step 2 of 8. If the next steps are not faster, this will turn out to be an all day job for one DVD.
While this has been processing, I've been looking around the web. It looks like there are 3 products that do what I'm trying to achieve:
Roxio Creator 9
Nero 7
DVDFab
Anyone have any opinions regarding these 3 products? Or any other suggestions?
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I'm trying DVDFab as I write this. It looks like it will work, but I'm spending a lot of time just to convert one DVD. It took over 1 1/2 hours to copy the DVD to the PC. The result was a Video_TS file. This format could not be synced to the iPod. They have a function to convert it into a format for the iPod (mp4), but this is taking a long time. I'm almost 3 hours into the conversion and I'm only on step 2 of 8. If the next steps are not faster, this will turn out to be an all day job for one DVD.
While this has been processing, I've been looking around the web. It looks like there are 3 products that do what I'm trying to achieve:
Roxio Creator 9
Nero 7
DVDFab
Anyone have any opinions regarding these 3 products? Or any other suggestions?
I have a fairly new laptop I use and it takes about 20 minutes from Dvd to hard drive. If your pc is old, you could run into problems. Converting the video from the standard Dvd files to mp4 will take even more processor power. You might take a look at your task manager and see what things look like. If your CPU is maxing out thats part of the problem. I would doubt the other software you mentioned would work any better, but if you end up trying them out I would be curious to know how they stack up to DvdFab.
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I have a fairly new laptop I use and it takes about 20 minutes from Dvd to hard drive. If your pc is old, you could run into problems. Converting the video from the standard Dvd files to mp4 will take even more processor power. You might take a look at your task manager and see what things look like. If your CPU is maxing out thats part of the problem. I would doubt the other software you mentioned would work any better, but if you end up trying them out I would be curious to know how they stack up to DvdFab.
My PC is not the best, but should be more than enough for this task. It is a 3.2 GHz Pentium 4 with 1gb of memory. DVDFab is consuming ~50%f the CPU. That's not too bad, but it looks like the entire process is going to take 11-12 hours. At that rate I won't be converting many DVD's. The conversion part alone (to mp4) has been going for more than 4 hours and is less than 50% completed.
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My PC is not the best, but should be more than enough for this task. It is a 3.2 GHz Pentium 4 with 1gb of memory. DVDFab is consuming ~50%f the CPU. That's not too bad, but it looks like the entire process is going to take 11-12 hours. At that rate I won't be converting many DVD's. The conversion part alone (to mp4) has been going for more than 4 hours and is less than 50% completed.
Video processing and converting is probably one of the most CPU-consuming tasks out there so what you are experiencing is not too surprising. If you update to a top-end Core 2 Duo, I would expect that would reduce by about half (just an educated guess) but still it will take some time.
Osho
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Video processing and converting is probably one of the most CPU-consuming tasks out there so what you are experiencing is not too surprising. If you update to a top-end Core 2 Duo, I would expect that would reduce by about half (just an educated guess) but still it will take some time.
Osho
I think you're correct in your analysis. I will probably upgrade my PC in the spring. I want to wait until Vista stabilizes.
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Randy, I am using DVDFab Platinum to rip DVD's to sync to my iPod. I have not seen the problems you have mentioned and so far it works flawlessly. There are other free tools out there to get video on the iPod but there is more than one program to use and takes longer.
I just select the iPod option and in less time than the length of the movie I have a mp4 file that I simply sync to the iPod. Not sure why yours is taking a lot longer. I have a less powerful system but do have 2GB memory so maybe that's it.
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In part it may be because I'm ripping everything- all the extras plus the main movie. I'll do a couple more movies so I have a larger sampling size.
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The reason for the long long process is becoming a bit clearer.
The test I'm doing is using a Neil Young DVD. There is a music video and and music documentary. There is also a playing all section of the DVD which contains the video and documentary. So to start, I converted the bulk of the DVD twice.
There is also a high-rez audio. DVDFab does not like this format at all. I saw one part of the conversion that took ~4 hours. This was the one. And after all of that, the sound is terrible.
I'll try more DVD's before I draw any conclusions, but I think the speed will be much better as I gain some experience doing this.
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I'm trying to decide if I hate DVDFab or like it.
I've pretty much worked out the speed issue. But that is through trial and error. I just stopped doing things it should never have let me do in the first place.
This may be a great piece of software, but it is a terrible product. There is absolutely no documentation, no help, nothing. I guess you can camp out at their forum and ask basic questions, but that is silly. >:(
So if anyone has any suggestions on a product (software with at least some documentation) that has similar functionality, I would appreciate it. Otherwise I will work my way through this one.
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Thanks for all of the input. Based on my testing:
1) I think the VIDEO_TS folder is a very easy way to manage the DVDs on the PC
2) DVDFab works well for copying the DVD to the PC in the VIDEO_TS folder. The speed is fast (maybe less than 50% of the play time)
3) Converting to mp4 files for the iPod is a slower process, but works. This is part of the Platinum version. It takes about 1.5 times the playtime to do the conversion. I think this is slow, but acceptable.
I have had one problem using DVDFab. Some of my DVDs have high-rez audio tracks. DVDFab takes a long to to convert these to mp4 files, and after the conversion they don't work. All you get is hissing. The video part works, only the audio tracks don't work. The conversion time is 4 times the playtime, which is very slow. The slow speed is probably because it cannot cope with this audio format. Does anyone know how to convert a VIDEO_TS with a 24 bit 48kHz uncompressed PCM soundtrack to a mp4 format?
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It looks like my problem will be fixed by the DVDFab team. I'll just wait until they provide an update. They said:
DVDFab does not support LPCM audio track input - we will add this in future release.
Other than this feature, and lack of documentation, I think DVDFab is a product worth recommending.
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Other than this feature, and lack of documentation, I think DVDFab is a product worth recommending.
And you can't beat free lifetime upgrades.
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One thing I learned from this is ripping DVDs and converting them to mp4 files for the iPod takes a lot of space.
14 DVDs = 101gb.
I've been trying to have 3 backups of my PC and music/videos. I guess it's time to buy more backup storage.
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Does anyone know how to convert a VIDEO_TS with a 24 bit 48kHz uncompressed PCM soundtrack to a mp4 format?
Sorry. I haven't been paying attention and reading this thread....
Have you tried using AutoMKV? It's a pretty slick MP4/AVI/MKV converter (and it's completely free). If it can't handle it (which it probably can), I'm sure the guy working on it would try to implement it for you, especially if you have an example or a bunch of them exist.
Check it out: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=113811
For iPod, you'd just want to use MP4 as the container, X264 as the codec, and PD-iPod or PDiPod5.5G as the profile. It's pretty slick, and worth checking out. That plus RipIt4Me is how I convert all my DVDs and MPEG files.
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Sorry. I haven't been paying attention and reading this thread....
Have you tried using AutoMKV? It's a pretty slick MP4/AVI/MKV converter (and it's completely free). If it can't handle it (which it probably can), I'm sure the guy working on it would try to implement it for you, especially if you have an example or a bunch of them exist.
Check it out: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=113811
For iPod, you'd just want to use MP4 as the container, X264 as the codec, and PD-iPod or PDiPod5.5G as the profile. It's pretty slick, and worth checking out. That plus RipIt4Me is how I convert all my DVDs and MPEG files.
glynor,
Thanks for the suggestion. I tried to do a quick test, but I could not make it work. I got everything installed, but there were errors with the extraction. I ran it anyway, but it just hangs. I'll give it another try when I have more time. I probably did something wrong. For now I just uninstalled AviSynth and removed AutoMKV.
Randy
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One thing I learned from this is ripping DVDs and converting them to mp4 files for the iPod takes a lot of space.
14 DVDs = 101gb.
You must be doing more than just selecting the iPod format. An average movie is about 700MB so that would only be about 10GB for 14 movies.
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You must be doing more than just selecting the iPod format. An average movie is about 700MB so that would only be about 10GB for 14 movies.
Yeah. I strongly suspect that he isn't recompressing the video files, but is just wrapping the MPEG-2 data in a MP4 container. 101/14 = 7.214 GB per movie (which is basically the size of the main track on a dual-layer DVD).
Thanks for the suggestion. I tried to do a quick test, but I could not make it work. I got everything installed, but there were errors with the extraction. I ran it anyway, but it just hangs. I'll give it another try when I have more time. I probably did something wrong. For now I just uninstalled AviSynth and removed AutoMKV.
Not sure exactly what you were trying to do, but here's how I do it...
I rip all my DVDs to my hard drive using RipIt4Me (which is a front-end to DVD Decrypter) in IFO mode. In RipIt4Me's Wizard mode this is called "Rip Movie Only". IFO mode allows you to select the actual title that you want and only rip that file. I generally rip them to a folder on my hard drive called: C:\video\rips\<movie_title>
There's a really nice animated tutorial on using RipIt4Me available here: http://forum.digital-digest.com/showpost.php?p=422827&postcount=1
You'd probably want to follow those instructions exactly, only use "Rip Movie Only" mode and don't bother with DVD Shrink at the very end (since you want then to compress it with AutoMKV instead). You could actually rip directly using AutoMKV and DVDFab but I've never done this, so I can't help there. I like RipIt4Me better because it can handle all the DVD encryption techniques they use and it's simple.
Once I have the decrypted VIDEO_TS folder inside my path I mentioned above...
I open up AutoMKV, and set the following settings:
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/page1.jpg)
and
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/page2.jpg)
(the only thing I change here is circled in Red).
To convert to iPod format, you'd want to change the Profile on the Basic Settings tab to either PD-iPod.xml or PD-iPOD5.5G.xml depending on what type of iPod you want to support. I use HighProfile because I don't need to support iPod and HighProfile is a bit better quality. The Disk Settings drop down gives you a bunch of presets you can choose from, or you can choose Custom and then just type in a file size in MB (which is what I usually do, 1024MB generally will make a pristine copy of a 2 hour movie).
Under the Filters choice, the default (Remove Grain) works very well. I also sometimes use the Convolution3D settings for movies and (especially) animation. I also keep the "set width resolution" to AutoCrop Only to have the max possible resolution. I think for iPod you'd need to have it resize the video -- set it to 640 or 320 and you should be good to go. The only other thing to check on is the Audio settings. You'll probably want to use the NeroAAC encoder. You might have to click on the !!! button and enable LC mode and then play with the Quality slider until it works. I'm sure you could also just ask on the AutoMKV thread for iPod related settings help, because I'm not clear on what iPod supports and what it doesn't.
Then, just click either "Start" (which will start that encode immediately) or click "Add to Queue" which will save the settings so you can set up a batch and then start them all at once. The encoding will take a LONG time. Compressing to MPEG-4 is no easy task, even for a modern CPU. Dual-core and newer CPUs (plus lots of RAM) help to speed the process significantly. However, in the end, you can have a very nice 700MB - 1GB copy of your DVD in MP4 format that'll play just fine in MC and on your iPod.
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You must be doing more than just selecting the iPod format. An average movie is about 700MB so that would only be about 10GB for 14 movies.
Right you are.
I'm actually doing 2 things. I'm ripping the DVDs into VIDEO_TS folders. I'm then converting them into iPod format (mp4 files).
The mp4 files are very small. A full movie is about 700mb. Some of the extras are only 15mb.
The VIDEO_TS Folders are 10x larger. That is what's taking all the space.
So on the PC I can watch the movies using the VIDEO_TS folders, and for the iPod I have the mp4 files.
All of the ones I've ripped are actually music DVDs. Concerts and the like with interesting extras. I have lots of DVDs for regular movies, TV programs, and magic stuff. I would never use this approach for those as it takes too long and takes too much space. I have:
Movies/Specials - 640 DVDs
TV Series Episodes - 908 (Not DVD count - multiple episodes on a single DVD)
Music/Concert DVDs - 85 DVDs
Magic (history plus other) - not properly cataloged but ~50 DVDs
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glynor,
Thanks for all of the detailed information. I will give this a try when I have enough free time (this weekend I hope).
What I've done so far is similar to what you are describing, but I've used different tools. I used DVDFab to to rip the DVDs into VIDEO_TS folders. There is an option to select just the main movie, everything, or some custom combination. I've been ripping everything because the DVDs have some interesting extras. Also, this step, while it takes a lot of disc, does not take a lot of time. When playing these in MC, they behave just like a DVD, so I can navigate through the menus and the like.
I then converted the VIDEO_TS folders into compressed mp4 files for the iPod. For this task, I also used DVDFab. The platinum version includes this function. As you noted, this is a time consuming task. Lots of CPU, lots of memory, lots of time. The compression is good, however, so I get reasonable size files that fit very nicely on the iPods. The trouble I had was only with a few of the DVDs that had a high-rez audio format. The video converted fine, but the audio was drowned out by a hissing sound. So my goal was to try AutoMKV to see if I could properly convert these files.
When I tried to install AutoMKV, I had trouble before getting into the conversion process itself. I downloaded the software from the URL you provided. I extracted the rar file and dropped in the AutoMKV update. Before doing this, I installed AviSynth, which was listed as a prerequisite. When I launched AutoMKV, it was unresponsive - it just hung. I did notice that when I extracted the rar file, there were errors, so I'm guessing that something was messed up with my install.
Again, thanks for all of the information. Hopefully others will also benefit from your tutorial.
Randy
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I did notice that when I extracted the rar file, there were errors, so I'm guessing that something was messed up with my install.
Very likely. I actually had issues downloading it myself for a while there, until I got Free Download Manager. Never figured out why, as it happened on some computers specifically, and not others (even with identical -- cloned -- software loads). Either way FDM is awesome and solves all those problems (and makes the downloads of MC about 4x faster).
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Very likely. I actually had issues downloading it myself for a while there, until I got Free Download Manager. Never figured out why, as it happened on some computers specifically, and not others (even with identical -- cloned -- software loads). Either way FDM is awesome and solves all those problems (and makes the downloads of MC about 4x faster).
glynor,
thanks... I'll try Free Download Manager.
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glynor,
Thanks for the tip on Free Download Manager. Works great. I learn something new from you almost every day.
Thanks for your amazing contribution to this community!
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Very likely. I actually had issues downloading it myself for a while there, until I got Free Download Manager. Never figured out why, as it happened on some computers specifically, and not others (even with identical -- cloned -- software loads). Either way FDM is awesome and solves all those problems (and makes the downloads of MC about 4x faster).
I did download Free Download Manager. While I was at it I decided to test it out.
It did work for the AutoMKV. When I extracted the rar file there were no errors.
When I tried to download AviSynth it did not work using FF2. I had to go to IE7. In IE7 I had to click on download file in the status bar.
The conversion of one of my troublesome DVDs is now in process. I'll let you know if it works.
Randy
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The conversion of one of my troublesome DVDs is now in process. I'll let you know if it works.
It's running - but I find the UI to be weak.
1) There is no status bar or anything to tell you it is doing something
2) The start button is not disabled after you start the conversion - so you could hit it multiple times
I do know it's working. The HDD lights are flashing, task managaer shows CPU usage, and files are showing up in my target folder.
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It's running - but I find the UI to be weak.
I agree with these criticisms. It's still beta, and has improved greatly during it's short development time.
Getting all the separate little open source conversion utilities to work together in a unified manner isn't a simple task. But feel free to post any suggestions for improvement to the AutoMKV thread. The developer is very responsive and open to suggestions, if they're possible!
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When I tried to download AviSynth it did not work using FF2. I had to go to IE7. In IE7 I had to click on download file in the status bar.
Like any download manager, it does sometimes have issues with PHP driven downloads. I'm not sure if that's what happened with AVISynth. However, if you have any issues with it, you can always hit Cancel in the FDM download dialog that pops up and it should then bring up the standard browser download dialog (so it can be used).
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Agree, Free Download Manager is the way to go.
Randy, did you try the Generic option in DVDFab to create DivX files? Those will take up less space but you probably lose the menuing. There are options in there to customize that I haven't even looked at but there may be a way to do what you want to get a version to run non-iPod and take up less space but have all the extras too.
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iPods don't support DivX (MPEG-4 Part 2, ASP), only a subset of MPEG-4 Part 10, AVC encoding (and only when wrapped in a MP4 container file). This is supported by x264 and most other H.264 compliant encoders, with specific iPod-compatible profiles. MPEG-4 Part 10 gives much better compression results than DivX/XviD/3ivx anyway though, so that's not a huge deal...
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Glynor, not sure if you were responding to my post but Randy is creating 2 versions, one for the iPod and one for viewing on the PC. What I was suggesting to try was to create a DivX version for the PC instead of the VIDEO_TS files.
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Right. I probably wasn't entirely clear either...
My point was that if he wanted a recompressed version of his original DVDs on the computer to use through MC, then he might as well just compress to H.264 and keep that version for MC, instead of using both DivX and H.264. In other words, just eliminate the second version all together. At the same file sizes, H.264 provides better compression results than DivX/XviD, so if your portable device only supports H.264, then there's really no reason to make the extra DivX version. The only times I compress to XviD anymore is if I happen to need to support a set-top DVD player that handles DivX.
Of course, he might not be willing to accept a recompressed version at all, or he might really like having the DVD menus. I, personally, don't get this (since if you compress to x264 at a high enough bitrate it will be effectively identical in quality to the MPEG-2 version and you'll still save space), but some people really like the menus and don't like to bother with extra compression steps.
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Like any download manager, it does sometimes have issues with PHP driven downloads. I'm not sure if that's what happened with AVISynth. However, if you have any issues with it, you can always hit Cancel in the FDM download dialog that pops up and it should then bring up the standard browser download dialog (so it can be used).
glynor,
You are correct again. The problem with AVISynth was with a PHP driven download.
I really do like the Free Download Manager, so I'm not complaining at all. It is a very nice product. ;D
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dcwebman & glynor,
I'm actually just learning about ripping DVDs and uploading them to the iPod, so all of the comments in this thread are very helpful to me.
Right now I have 2 versions, one for MC and one for the iPod. One reason I have the uncompressed version is I really do like the menus, but this is not practical for any volume of DVDs. The only ones I've done so far are for the ones where the menus are meaningful. As I play around with this more I will take a different approach. For normal DVDs I will have one version that I can use on the iPod and in MC.
Thanks again for all of the help...
Randy
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glynor,
I finished the test using AutoMKV to convert a VIDEO_TS with a 24 bit 48kHz uncompressed PCM soundtrack to a format for the iPod. It started OK, but after awhile it crashed.
This is not a criticism of the product. I don't think this is a common format. So far I've tried it with DVDFab, Nero 7, and AutoMKV. None of them will do a proper conversion. The people at DVDFab are working on it, so I think they will support it soon.
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So I upgraded my storage so I can backup the larger volume that is coming with ripping DVDs.
And when I went to do the backup - the only remaining piece of Norton software (Save & Restore/Ghost) on my PC crashed with the blue screen of death. I tried it a second time and it crashed with the blue screen of death again.
So now I just ran my favorite Norton software. It really works well. It's called Norton Removal Tool. It deletes all Norton software from your PC.
BTW: I replaced Norton Save & Restore with Acronis True Image. For image based backups it does a very good job.
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If we were going to make one version as glynor suggests, then this is the iPod spec:
Video formats supported: H.264 video, up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480 pixels, 30 frames per sec
I have some AVI's already done that have different dimensions, I'm guessing because of a different widescreen aspect ratio. I guess if we stick to 640x480 then we can do the one version though.
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If we were going to make one version as glynor suggests, then this is the iPod spec:
Video formats supported: H.264 video, up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480 pixels, 30 frames per sec
I have some AVI's already done that have different dimensions, I'm guessing because of a different widescreen aspect ratio. I guess if we stick to 640x480 then we can do the one version though.
Just to be clear. The iPod does NOT support the AVI container. If you're ripping to H264 for iPod you'll want to plunk it into a MP4 container (and use AAC-LC audio).
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Well , browsing this topic i cannot not ask
You rip DVD to play them on an Ipod - With a screen as big than a box of fags ?
And you need hours to do it ?
Sorry , but it sounds so weird to me =)
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He-he! I agree! Man, I can't watch movies on the 34" TV in our living room! If I want to watch a movie, I have to go down to the Cinema Inferno, where the screen is measured in meters, not inches! ;)
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Well , browsing this topic i cannot not ask
You rip DVD to play them on an Ipod - With a screen as big than a box of fags ?
And you need hours to do it ?
Sorry , but it sounds so weird to me =)
The iPod Dock accessory has composite and S-Video outputs. This makes possible to easily take a few gigabytes of video with you and show them with any standard TV. 640x480 is a suitable resolution setting for that kind of use.
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Well , browsing this topic i cannot not ask
You rip DVD to play them on an Ipod - With a screen as big than a box of fags ?
And you need hours to do it ?
Sorry , but it sounds so weird to me =)
The DVDs I've ripped are all music DVDs. I can listen to the music and watch the performance.
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Incidentally, this is what I use most of the time:
http://www.aoamedia.com/dvd_ripper.htm
It looks like it's quite a bit cheaper than DVDFab, though I suspect it does a bit less. Does what you're saying you want though (ripping full copies and ripping for iPod).
It's very simple to use though.
I have found maybe 1 DVD that it didn't like much, but I've found it handles stuff other ones struggle with.
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Hi Glynor,
Following your recommendation (as always..) I have installed AutoMKV but no luck yet.
I see that you use DVDDecrypter to rip to an ISO file, but in your screen shot, you show VIDEO_TS.VOB as the selected file for conversion.
I have a DVD in raw format, i.e. all the various .IFO, .VOB & .BUP files. Which one do I specify for AutoMKV?
Thanks!
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Hi Glynor,
Following your recommendation (as always..) I have installed AutoMKV but no luck yet.
I see that you use DVDDecrypter to rip to an ISO file, but in your screen shot, you show VIDEO_TS.VOB as the selected file for conversion.
I have a DVD in raw format, i.e. all the various .IFO, .VOB & .BUP files. Which one do I specify for AutoMKV?
Thanks!
Here's my method:
1. I typically rip the DVD to ISO mode first. This is only so I can put the DVD safely away in storage, and not have to dig it out again if my rip doesn't go as well as I had hoped. This isn't really a needed first step, it's just what I do. This will create a full image of the DVD on your hard drive in ISO format. Just one big 8.5GB single file (the example below is smaller because it was just a little homemade 11 minute DVD I happened to have on my hard drive today).
2. I then load that ISO into a virtual "drive" on my system provided by Daemon Tools. If you don't want to rip to ISO mode, then you can skip these two steps and just rip the DVD itself directly in IFO or "Rip Movie Only" mode. That's probably what I would do if I were you... Just rip directly in IFO/Movie Only mode from the disc itself (sometimes Daemon Tools causes problems with DVD Decrypter for reasons I don't fully understand).
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/mount_iso.jpg)
3. Then I re-load DVD Decrypter and re-rip the "DVD" (which is now actually safely back in it's case) in IFO mode. Actually, anymore I use RipIt4Me and run through the wizard in "Rip Movie Only" mode as I described earlier (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg263907#msg263907). In IFO mode, you're going to select only the "title" (or video clip) that you want to rip and have it save the applicable VOBs, IFOs, and everything else to a folder on your hard drive. IFO is not ISO.
The reason you need to do this is because in the actual DVD, the video files can be all mixed up. The VOBs might contain bits and pieces of the main movie, as well as the extra deleted scenes, extra features, and hunks of the menu all in one file (or the movie is more likely broken up across multiple different VOB files). Ripping in DVD Decrypter's IFO mode uses the DVDs "table of contents" to extract only the bits you want and dump them all into one solid VOB file. The IFO is basically the index that tells you what stream does what and why and all that...
During this step, I generally just rip all the audio tracks and subtitle streams in the file (it looks like this might be harder with the new versions of RipIt4Me). Both AutoMKV and AutoGK allow you to choose which streams you want included and let you pick more than one.
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/ripit_step1.jpg)
or, using just DVD Decrypter...
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/dvdd_ifo.jpg)
4. You should then have a new folder with a bunch of VOB, IFO, and BUP files. I open AutoMKV and load the file called VIDEO_TS.IFO in as the input file. You can also use the VOB file, it makes no difference really. This is the rip of ONLY the title you selected in RipIt4Me or DVD Decrypter.
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/select_ifo.jpg)
You can then select the audio streams you want, and your compression settings and then go. One thing I just discovered is that current builds of x264 are no longer Quicktime compatible (because Quicktime doesn't handle stuff correctly), which could be some of the problems listed above. If you are ripping for iPod, there is an extra step you need to do in addition to picking the iPod profile. It's discussed somewhat over here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=953936#post953936 EDIT: This was wrong. See below here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg265235#msg265235
(http://www.geocities.com/ri0n/automkv/automkv_readytogo.jpg)
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One thing I just discovered is that current builds of x264 are no longer Quicktime compatible (because Quicktime doesn't handle stuff correctly), which could be some of the problems listed above. If you are ripping for iPod, there is an extra step you need to do in addition to picking the iPod profile. It's discussed somewhat over here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=953936#post953936
To do what the AutoMKV developer suggested in the thread I linked above, reference the screenshot below. You'd want to use the following settings:
Most NTSC (American) video with a 29.97 frame rate: AssumeFPS(30000,1001)
Film sources with a 23.97 frame rate (many movies): AssumeFPS(24000,1001)
I'm testing it now, but I suspect it will work...
EDIT: It didn't. See this post below: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg265235#msg265235
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3. Then I re-load DVD Decrypter and re-rip the "DVD" (which is now actually safely back in it's case) in IFO mode. Actually, anymore I use RipIt4Me and run through the wizard in "Rip Movie Only" mode as I described earlier (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg263907#msg263907). In IFO mode, you're going to select only the "title" (or video clip) that you want to rip and have it save the applicable VOBs, IFOs, and everything else to a folder on your hard drive. IFO is not ISO.
This is the problem bit for me - I too use RipIt4Me & DVD Decrypter. Having already ripped the "Full DVD", I need a tool to be able to re-create the VIDEO_TS.IFO for Movie only ( without going back and re-ripping again ). I now see why you rip to ISO in the first place...
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I now see why you rip to ISO in the first place...
Yep.
You might be able to get DVD Decrypter to re-rip from a directory. Let me try a few things...
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Okay. I found a way to do it.
DVD Fab Decrypter can handle VIDEO_TS folders on a hard drive, rather than just discs in a drive. Doom9 has it for download here: http://www.doom9.org/Soft21/Rippers/DVDFabDecrypter3050.exe
It's an old version, but it works (and appears to work free of charge). I know they charge for newer versions, but the version I grabbed from Doom9 says "free edition" in the "About" dialog (pops up when you click on the ? button in the titlebar of the main UI). I don't know if it's gonna expire in 30 days, but it gives no indication that it will! It looks like they're just trying to charge for the DVD conversion features, not the ripping, at least with this version...
Just load it up, put it in Main Movie mode (buttons on left), and then click the folder button next to Source and navigate and find your VIDEO_TS folder and select the VIDEO_TS.IFO file. Then choose which title you want and any audio tracks/subs (I'd just choose them all) and click Start to extract to a separate Target folder and you should be good.
The other option would be to use vStrip/vStripGUI, which is the real "power" IFO/VOB parser. Doom9 has a guide here: http://www.doom9.org/index.html?/vstrip.htm
I'd say using DVD Fab Decrypter would be a lot easier though...
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I use DVD Fab Decrypter, I am pretty sure it gets updated every time they update the gold and platinum versions, so the ripping engine is always up to date. I think the official site for it is http://www.dvdidle.com/free.htm (http://www.dvdidle.com/free.htm) that's where I download it at least.
@glynor
I have been playing with encoding movies trying to get as close as possible to DVD quality at the smallest size possible for awhile now. It sounds like you feel using AutoMKV with ce-highprofile at 1024 MB, keeping the original size of the movie, and changing the interlace settings, give you video that is very close to the same quality as the original DVD? In AutoMKV do you use any of the filters or did you set it to none? Any other settings you change? Also, what do you primarily watch your movies on? I would like to confirm the settings you use, then give it go, and let it do it's thing for the next 12 hours! So, I want to do right the first time.
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Thanks for the address of the free version! I couldn't find it earlier, but I didn't spend that long looking since the Doom9 version was only 1-2 builds old.
I'll respond and provide you with all my applicable settings, but probably not till tomorrow.
A couple of notes though quickly:
* I use x264 (obviously)
* CE-Highprofile.xml generally
* RemoveGrain(mode=2) for most stuff for the filter (but not always)
* Resize Filters = used to be lanczos, but the new version has a new default that I'm trying out with good results so far
* Width: always autocrop only (I almost always want full res versions)
* cust matrix (on advanced tab): eqm_avc_hr.cfg
I am by no means an expert -- just getting into x264, since I finally found a converter with a UI I like. I'm pretty well versed in MPEG-4 ASP stuff (XviD) and I do video editing professionally for my job and deal with streaming servers and do DVD authoring. I'd call myself semi-pro or a very advanced amateur since I'm almost entirely self-taught.
Like I said... More tomorrow, but yeah I use 1GB for most "regular" movies (less than 2 hour jobs). For "special" movies where I really care or they're long I'll go up to 1.5GB or 2GB. (I do re-encode the audio to AAC.) However, I'd say you could probably even go a little lower... My 350MB 1 hour TV shows look spectacular...
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Thanks glynor, no hurry at all of course, I appreciate any info you feel like sharing.
I would like to consider my self a self-taught semi pro as well. I have done a lot of video editing as a hobby, and for numerous side jobs. I have just grown weary of encoding, testing, comparing, then starting all over lately. I want that one magic "encode perfect copy now" button! When is that due out again? ;)
So, I thought I would take advantage of your knowledge this time if you don't mind :)
You're welcome for the link, I look forward to your more info when have time, and thanks again!
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Okay... This isn't the full post about all my settings, but I just figured something important out.
If you're trying to use AutoMKV and either the CE-Quicktime.xml profile (for a Quicktime Player compatible MP4) or the PD-iPod.xml profile (for an iPod compatible MP4), you cannot use the eqm_avc_hr.cfg custom matrix (under Advanced Settings) as that will prevent Quicktime from being able to playback the video stream. I haven't tested other custom matrices either, but I'd guess Quicktime wants none of them, so set that to none and you should be fine. There is no need to do the AssumeFPS hack I posted about earlier. That wasn't it...
That doesn't solve the crashing problem with the iPod 5.5G profile, but that's really fine since the vanilla iPod profile woks fine. EDIT: But the developer of AutoMKV (buzzqw) just figured that out as well...
More here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=955217#post955217
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Okay... Here goes. These are my typical settings for encoding with AutoMKV. When I use more than one setting, I've tried to explain as best I can why I use one or the other. If I don't mention it, I leave it alone.
AutoMKV 0.74e (current build) settings.
Basic Settings tab:
Audio:
Nero AAC - Stereo
Qual: 0.5 (for main track), and 0.4 (for an additional track, if any)
This generally works out to roughly 130kbit AAC VBR.
-or-
Copy Original: to keep AC3 audio from a rip
Container, Codec, and Profile:
Container: MP4 - I generally use this as it is more widely compatible than MKV. (MKV has some extra fancy features, but I don't use them).
Codec: x264 - That's the reason I use AutoMKV. Other good options available in it are VC-1 WMV, but I haven't used it. XviD is also available, but I'd probably just use AutoGK for that.
Profile: depends on purpose...
CE-Highprofile.xml - General purpose high quality encodes for playback on my computer or HTPC.
CE-Quicktime.xml - I only use if I need to support Quicktime player, which I need to do sometimes for work stuff.
PD-iPod.xml - I don't actually have an iPod, but some of my friends do. If I needed to do an encode for them, I'd use this. Took me a while to get it working but I figured it out finally...
Generally, the profiles listed as HQ will give better quality than Highprofile, but they take an ABSURD amount of time to complete for a small gain in quality. CE-Mainprofile.xml is slightly more compatible with players, but really most anything that can handle x264 at all can usually handle Highprofile too (which gives better results) so you might as well just use that.
Resizers:
Resize Filters: Spline36Resize (neutral sharp) - the new default and works well. I used to use LanczosResize.
Width Resolution: Auto Crop Only almost always - I generally want full resolution encodes. If you set this manually, it must be a number evenly divisible by 8.
Filters: RemoveGrain(mode=2) looks great for most things. It does tend to make video look a little "cellulosy" (sorry, don't know how to describe it really), which is great for stuff that's supposed to look "oldish" or "gritty" anyway, like Band of Brothers or HBO's The Wire. For other types of movies I sometimes use Convolution3D (movieHQ). For cartoon sources (anime and south park style stuff) I use Convolution3D (animeHQ).
I haven't spent a lot of time experimenting here. I haven't tried much other than those I've listed above (and the different versions of those filters). Asking what's "best" on Doom9.org get's you yelled at, so I'm mostly flying blind.
Output File Size Options:
Generally I like to give it 1024 MB for a regular 90-ish minute movie.
For "special" movies, or longer films, I bump it up to either 1500MB or 2048MB. These are usually beautiful encodes.
For TV Shows, I usually give it 250MB for a 1/2 hour show and 350-450MB for an hour show. These too are beautiful encodes, so the movie sizes could probably stand to come down a bit. Just to explain, the number to the left of the disk size box will let you split the final output file into one or more separate hunks.
Advanced Settings Tab:
The vast majority of this stuff I leave alone.
Deinterlacer: Always Auto unless I happen to know it's a progressive source. Then I change it to None which saves some time in the encode process (it doesn't have to test it then). I generally do not check HQ Deint, which makes the deinterlacing a little nicer but takes way longer. Compare it yourself if you want.
Custom Matrix: These are special ways to improve the color fidelity of the encodes. They are built specifically for a particular codec. The user on Doom9 called "Sharktooth" created the eqm_avc_hr.cfg matrix which works very well for high-resolution (640x480 and bigger) encodes to x264. I almost always use it. However, as is noted above I just discovered that this breaks compatibility with Quicktime and iPod, so if you need to support them, you must set this to NONE.
Del Temp File: Check this to have it automatically delete the Temp directory after the encode completes. This happens automatically when you encode in batch mode.
Specify Bitrate: sometimes it's nice to shoot for a specific bitrate instead of a file size target (same goes for specify quality). This is a target, since it is a VBR encode and it won't be hit exactly.
Language: eng because I'm an American.
Generally, I leave everything else to the defaults. You can save and load different configuration files on the Advanced Settings tab as well, which is a good way to create different quick "setups" for different media types.
I have not yet used the Episodic DVD/IFO option, as I haven't had many episodic DVDs to do recently. I'll get into that rotten stuff soon enough though...
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Thank you very much glynor, I really appreciate you taking the time to write such a great description. Before this I think the only answer I saw to encoding questions were either, "Depends on the video source" or "You will have to try it yourself and see what you like best" At worst, you gave an excellent place to start at, so thank you, and I will be testing it out tonight!
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Glynor
I did an encode of a Farscape episode, (hour long TV show) I used the settings you suggested, using the convolution3D (movieHQ) except I did set the size for 500 MB. You were right, the picture looks amazing. In fact it really looks sharper and brighter then the original DVD!
I had one problem though that I thought you might have an idea about. I am getting interlacing artifacts in scenes where there is just moderate amount of motion and higher. I had the deinterlacer set for auto, so I am guessing the Auto deinterlacer guessed wrong. I tried it on a few different computers and different players including VLC in case a codec was causing the problem, same interlacing problems, so I am pretty sure the problem was with the encode.
Before I gave it another shot, and just set the deinterlacer to none to see happens, I was curious if you had any thoughts about it. If I can get rid of that problem it would be perfect, I was amazed how good the picture was.
Thanks again
p.s. I did use mkv for the container so I could keep the original AC3 audio. I pretty sure the container would not be the problem, but I am not positive on that one.
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Glynor, thatnks for the AutoMKV advice. I managed to use DVDFab to re-build the .IFO to include the main title only. But, try as I might, I cannot ge AutoMKV to produce anything else but a log file. It appears to do lots of work along the way, but no significant output!
But, on the way, I have started using DVDFab - and so far, it's really good. Version DVDFabDecrypter3050.exe does as you say, allows main selection, but not re-encoding for 'generic' or 'ipod'. Version DVDFabPlatinum3080.exe allows everything - free for the first month.
I have used the Platinum version to encode some old movies, some new ones and some TV series. One of the convenient features is to allow multi-titles to be separated (common with bundled season DVD's). There are some pre-loaded default methods and one that you can play around with yourself. This is obviously a far cry from AutoMKV, and it has much less sophistication, but is (almost) idiot proof. I'm also guessing that it's not yet optimised for dual core processors; I set up similar batches to run on a single core and dual core and the encoding times were the same.
Not having a comparison to AutoMKV, I cannot give a realtive assesment, but I'm getting about a 1:1 in terms of timing for single pass encoding ( and double for dual pass ).
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I've been off skiing and partying in Vermont and am just now getting caught up. I'll respond more later...
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While we were working, building a better world for you....
::)
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Glynor, the DVDFab is working really well... Despite the lack of sophistication in the conversion options, it is doing a really good job.
I was unable to see (or hear) the difference between the original DVD and an episode of 24, encoded at contant bitrate of 900, with original soundtrack on a 42" plasma.
I have started re-coding multi-episode DVD's overnight on a MacBook. 1 DVD with 6 or 7 45 minute episodes, dual pass, 900 bit rate takes 5-6 hours. The pre-view funtion is good as it allows you to check the film, soundtrack and subtitles.
In an ideal world, there'd be AutoMKV with the DVDFab interface with a 'basic' and 'advanced' user option. (I'm still on basic)
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I've been following some of these discussion with interest since I've been back, but I have an interesting problem with how my re-codes interact (pun intended) with MC.
Some background...
I generally back up my TV episodes from DVDs with Nero Recode using its AVC profiles/codecs. As I understand it, this is roughly equivalent to using the AutoMKV toolset and encoding with h264.
Several of the episodes have commentary tracks on them, and I usually include those tracks when I recode them.
The resulting mp4 files play back fine in Nero's ShowTime player (using the GUI to select the audio track) and also play back fine in QuickTime 7 on my Macintosh (although I have to manually enable/disable the audio tracks I want).
MC12, however, plays both audio tracks at the same time. I can't seem to find any way to choose which one of the tracks plays.
Again, this is with h264/AAC-encoded files in mp4 containers, not the actual DVDs themselves...
Any ideas?
brad
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Yep. Please see this post: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38553.0
Make sure to read down till you get to my addition to the thread... ;D
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Thanks...follow-ups in that thread...
Best,
brad