INTERACT FORUM
More => Old Versions => Media Center 14 (Development Ended) => Topic started by: JimH on January 16, 2010, 09:42:04 am
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You may wonder why we've spent so much time on it lately, but it is likely that you will find it very useful in the next year or two. There are DLNA Instructions (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA) on our wiki.
Build 127 added two new features. Both are still in progress but working with many devices. They are:
1. A DLNA Controller -- Like a TV remote, it allows you to control other devices.
2. A DLNA Renderer -- MC can be a playback device for other devices.
Yes, MC can control another copy of MC now and play to it. You must turn the DLNA options on in Tools/Options/Settings/DLNA.
More definitions are below (from the old thread)...
We have renamed the UPnP Server as "DLNA / UPnP Server". It's a mouthful. We will probably drop UPnP from the name later.
There are two threads listing DLNA devices known to work on the Other Hardware board:
DLNA Boxes (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55380.0)
DLNA TV's (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55379.0)
You may be asking yourself, "Why is this important? Why all the fuss about DLNA?" Good question. The answer is that it provides a standard way to move media and control its playback among devices in a home.
Protocols like TCP/IP, HTML, and HTTP are the foundation of the Internet. DLNA is becoming another important standard.
It is very much like UPnP, but it adds some new features and more importantly, hardware vendors have adopted it.
Terminology
1. DMS -- Digital Media Server -- where the media resides
2. DMP -- Digital Media Player -- where the media is played
3. DMR -- Digital Media Renderer -- where media is played, but with ability to respond to a controller
4. DMC -- Digital Media Controller -- software control of the renderer -- functions as a remote
DLNA Instructions (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA) on our wiki.
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I tried build 127 ... same behaviour ...
Can you explain how to create the logs from wireshak?
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http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/Sharing_Plug-in_Debugging_Hints
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Find the wireshark file here:
http://www.80fotos.de/pdf/wireshark_capture_2010-01-17.zip (http://www.d80fotos.de/pdf/wireshark_capture_2010-01-17.zip)
I hope it helps to solve the issue.
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Thank you.
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One more observation:
- When I used build 121 to connect Panasonic and MC14 via DLNA I could see the file system of my PC/Server and browse the files there instead of using the categories given from MC14. This option is not available in build 127. It would be good to have it back, since not all the video files are tagged.
There is one other little problem, that might be a Panasonic Software issue or could be a MC14 issue:
- When Panasonic and MC14 are connected and accessing the files from the Panasonic device you can see the list of files and the number of files and the window has a scrollbar. You see something like 10 or 15 files on the screen, when you scroll down, srolling works for the five or ten files and the you only see an empty window - no mor efiles listed, no more scrolling.
Can you look into this problem?
Thanks. It would be great if you can make this connection working ...
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This DLNA suddenly got a lot more interesting :) I'll try to test it as soon as possible. Seems like you've done much work in this area.
I just don't hope that this standard will prevent you from adding functionality that only might only works between MC client and server though. Like adding user or group access to the server part, and to be able to retrieve settings, view schemes and such from the server based on this user/group.
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Yes. Start here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55670.0
I read that and don't understand how this is supposed to take over library server. I also tried the newest build and don't see how to connect to an "MC DLNA server" with an "MC DLNA client". Could you please explain this more? Thanks.
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In build 127, MC has a DLNA renderer and controller, in addition to the previously existing DLNA Server (formerly known as the UPnP Server).
The controller can play media from the DLNA server to another copy of MC.
New DLNA Instructions (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA)
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I read that and don't understand how this is supposed to take over library server. I also tried the newest build and don't see how to connect to an "MC DLNA server" with an "MC DLNA client". Could you please explain this more? Thanks.
Sorry. I just added new DLNA Instructions (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA). Please let me know of any confusing points or any mistakes.
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Sorry. I just added new DLNA Instructions (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA). Please let me know of any confusing points or any mistakes.
I still don't see how to browse the library from an MC DLNA client or am I not understanding this properly?
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I still don't see how to browse the library from an MC DLNA client or am I not understanding this properly?
DLNA doesn't completely replace Library Server. Library Server has more functionality. But for a simple use, DLNA may be better. The current implementation is just running, so its features will grow.
The terminology is an obstacle. But let's say you have two machines:
A is your main copy of MC. Here you have a DLNA Server running and you want to use a DLNA Controller to play music on
B which is running the DLNA Renderer.
On machine A, you should see B under Playing Now. Drag any file to it. (Technical details ... When you drag the file there, the controller tells the renderer what to play. The renderer requests the file from the server.)
It isn't as hard as it sounds.
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One advantage of using DLNA is that it works with other software and hardware. Bob found that Plugplayer (http://www.plugplayer.com/), for example, will let you use an iPod Touch as a remote control for MC. It's a DLNA Controller.
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I, for one, have absolutely zero interest in DLNA. I have no intention of buying any consumer electronics devices that aren't going to be plugged into a general-purpose PC, and they're all going to access their media via the network. I think Matt is on the right track here. I have absolutely ZERO faith in the ability of Samsung, Sony, LG, or Pioneer to build a good User Interface.
Why spend extra on a special purpose box (or fancy TV) and get a crappy and non-expandable UI as your reward?!? I'd rather spend $250 on a little computer, which will do a MUCH better job, and will provide the same UI no matter where I am or what equipment happens to be hooked up on the back-end.
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These devices are available at around $100 now and will be going down in price.
They don't do what a PC will do, but they do solve a simple problem neatly.
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I just played with my Amplifier/Receiver Yamaha RX-V3900 and it should be DLNA certified. From what I am reading it looks like you currently need Windows Media Player installed to acces the music on a PC/Server. I had this working a while ago, but did not like the interface and Media Player installed on top of MC.
Is there any knowledge out there if this could/would work with MC14 and it's new features. When I currently try to connect I see "nothing connected" or so.
I am living in Germany and my RX-V3900 is a Europe build, not the US model and there may be differences.
Thanks for some insights and help.
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While experimenting I installed twonky media server and I can connect with my RX-V3900 to this server and play my music.
The user interface ist not nice and I can't get my playlist and more ...
So in priciple this seems to work. MC 14 obviously does not know anthing about the Yamaha box.
So: Can you "just" add it to you list of DLNA boxes and make it work. Yes you can ...
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This should work in a build or two.
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Great!
Can't wait.
And thanks for the speedy replies and excellent support. I would pay you a beer or two if you where around ...
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Thanks!
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Why spend extra on a special purpose box (or fancy TV) and get a crappy and non-expandable UI as your reward?!? I'd rather spend $250 on a little computer, which will do a MUCH better job, and will provide the same UI no matter where I am or what equipment happens to be hooked up on the back-end.
I think I saw somebody else post this idea too, but this is why a $100 box with a JRiver GUI on it would be splendid and, for me a more useful purchase than a Synapse. This could prove especially useful, since this box could still hook into other vendors' DLNA servers, and wow new users into the JR world ;).
(Is it theoretically possible to send all of JR database data via the DLNA standard?)
-JB
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Is it theoretically possible to send all of JR database data via the DLNA standard?
Yes and no. A DLNA server will see the files in MC's library, subject to format limitations. You can specify by device what the overall layout will be on the device, but the details of how it is presented are up to the device.
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I don't think a DLNA box with the MC front end is even possible without some of what I'm suggesting. With what I'm asking for, a new device could be added to your MC Network Picture with a network address and authentication if desired. All policies would be strictly enforced on client boxes. View schemes, database content (music, images, etc.) would be FORCED upon client machines. Instant updates of all db items, settings, view schemes, etc. Every last piece controlled strictly by the server.
I, too, have completely and fully given up on set-top boxes and systems with built in media playback. They are garbage as far as I'm concerned. I've thrown way too much time and money away on boxes that really only caused me headaches. Some of the new ones might be closer but even if I found the perfect box, the moment the company stops caring about it because they released a new box I'm done!
That's the big problem with these boxes...they release them with software upgrades (Great!) but before you know it, time is up and they've moved on to another box. They need to put a ton of effort into ONE box instead of releasing new boxes all the time hoping to sell more.
I think a surprising number of people using MC are not here for cost savings in any way. Anyone who wants good, high quality content with powerful playback systems is definitely not going the easy, cheap way.
Why can't we find a way to funnel more of this SPENDING back to JRiver?! A high end server-client package sold at typical audio/video dealers cost hundreds or thousands of dollars. I'm not sure about other people but those with the most complicated setups would, I believe, certainly be willing to pay a lot on this type of extension to Media Center.
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Howdy,
Scuse the nube-ness - but can anyone explain the DLNA concept and why it matters in MC? I have a WDTV Live (and will be getting another) and it took me about 8 seconds to connect to the network and play everything on my network with no issues...via this little box.
How does MC play into this and what's the advantage...if any?
Cheers!
VP
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WDTV Live is a client. MC has a DLNA server. Each serves a different purpose. MC serves media. WDTV Live allows you to see and hear it. WDTV Live is a DLNA client, but not the only one on the market. There is the PS3 and the 360 and many others. MC supporting DLNA enables it to serve all the media cataloged in your MC database to DLNA clients on your network.
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With MC and WD TV Live, you'll see your media organized the way you have it in MC.
Get the latest build from the top of this board to try it. We're still fine tuning.
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With MC and WD TV Live, you'll see your media organized the way you have it in MC.
Get the latest build from the top of this board to try it. We're still fine tuning.
Thanks! I will give it a whirl.
Cheers!
VP
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With MC and WD TV Live, you'll see your media organized the way you have it in MC.
ahhh.... now I'm starting to understand and am getting interested.
Anyone care to save me some research time and tell me if WDLive is the best choice for WDLive'ish features?
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While Jim's reply made sense - I still do not see the need for it.
Sounds to me like I need to have a copy of MC running somewhere for this to matter. Over here - no PC stores anything locally - all media is centrally stored on a WHS so we can hit it with any of the 4 PC's and (soon to be) 2 WDTV live boxes at anytime - with no hassles, strings or anything.
While I love to use MC on the PC when I am sitting at it...why would I care to have the WDTV live box "see" the media the way MC has it organized....when I can click Music on the WDTV interface and all the tunes that are on my WHS?
Unless the MC DLNA really speeds up the user experience and makes searching etc more efficient on the WDTV live - then I may interested...and if MC could run on my WHS as a quiet, "do not have to be logged on at the server at all time", DLNA service - then I would be really interested....but I do not think that is possible....
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Sounds to me like I need to have a copy of MC running somewhere for this to matter.
You need to start the DLNA / UPnP Server under Services. If you have Media Server running, you can exit MC and the DLNA server will still run.
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You need to start the DLNA / UPnP Server under Services. If you have Media Server running, you can exit MC and the DLNA server will still run.
So do I:
1. Install a full copy MC on my WHS
2. Construct a library with music, picture and vids from the WHS shares
3. Start the DLNA server service - which I presume - starts Media Server? (Never quite understood this)
4. Exit MC
5. Log off the server - this is the most importnat one as it always killed MC acting as say - a library server
6. Use another instance of MC or the WDTV Live (via DLNA) and enjoy my stuff?
7. Yes?
8. No?
Appreciate any comments on any of the steps - especially #5 - which - at least trying to act as a Library Server ruins any kind of MC usage in a server environment.
Cheers!
VP
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You could find more info there, and on our DLNA wiki page (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA) where there are some instructions.
Make sure you're using the latest build from the top of this board.
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1. Install a full copy MC on my WHS
I think you could just import the files from the WHS. You wouldn't need to install MC on it.
3. Start the DLNA server service - which I presume - starts Media Server? (Never quite understood this)
Please read the wiki article on "Servers (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/Servers)".
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MC to MC doesn't work for me. Nothing appears to Playing Now.
I can see a new "received request for device description" appearing in the plugin window about once in a minute, but that's all. I don't even know where it is coming from. I don't have any HW UPnP devices.
Does it work for anyone else? Can an MC instance browse a file list that comes from a remote MC server and the play it on any MC renderer?
Would it be possible to see screenshots of the "MC to MC" interface?
What additional services and connections are actually needed for UPnP? I have allowed free access between our PCs, but otherwise the SW firewall settings on each PC are quite restricted because I don't use a NAT box anymore. The router is situated somewhere between our apartment house and the public Internet and I don't have access to it. The IP addresses are public and the "local" network is bigger than the usual 254 possible hosts (the subnet mask is 255.255.252.0 instead of the usual 255.255.255.0). I am wondering if something that is needed is missing.
"SW" UPnP used to work when I had NAT and I made some experiments with the free Intel demo programs, but that was years ago.
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Double check that you have turned on the DLNA options.
http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA
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Please read the wiki article on "Servers (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/Servers)".
I have...and until this piece is correctly annotated to include DLNA with up to date info - it's useless to me.
Besides - Media Server will not stay running - even tho this article says it will - when one logs off of a server based (WHS) OS. Having to leave MC running on the server is simply not an option.
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Double check that you have turned on the DLNA options.
http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA
Setup Instructions
In build 127, MC has a DLNA renderer and controller, in addition to the previously existing DLNA Server (formerly known as the UPnP Server).
The controller can play media from the DLNA server to another copy of MC.
To set it up
1. In MC's Tools/Options/DLNA, turn on the functions you need in each copy of MC. Normally, this would be the controller and server on the machine you're playing from, and the renderer on the machine you're playing to.
2. Start the copy of MC that is running the renderer.
3. Start the copy that is running the controller and server. In a minute or two, it will show any renderers it finds under Playing Now. Click on the one you want. Then drag a file to it. This should play on the remote device.
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55670.msg378481#msg378481
I did all steps before posting.
BTW, the link on the wiki page doesn't work (anymore?). Maybe it was intended to point here and this tread was moved.
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Does it work for anyone else? Can an MC instance browse a file list that comes from a remote MC server and the play it on any MC renderer?
I am not able to get this to work yet either. However, Library Server still sounds like it will be the best option in this scenario.
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We found a problem on XP that would keep MC from finding renderers. Next build.
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I'm very excited to use DLNA. I have a samsung TV and other devices. want to use as server and controller. using defaults on Win 7 with no firewall, i get an error "Failed to Start Generic DLNA" in the console. not much useful info. using 14.0.130. bummer. Tried with a new library too.
----- Just found out the problem --- port number 2869 is reserved by Microsoft for UPNP. I tried changing to 1900 and connects BUT - my samsung TV won't play anything at all :(. Also takes a long time to load.
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I can't see my Samsung series 7 TV from MC, nor can i see Windows 7 set up to stream ...
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I can't see my Samsung series 7 TV from MC, nor can i see Windows 7 set up to stream ...
There are a lot of changes related to machine interfaces and ports in use coming in the next build.
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Our DLNA server and renderer work with the DLNA / UPnP controller available for Android from www.andromote.de. Thanks, Mirko.
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I've been playing with build 130 and the DLNA server/controller/renderer functions and have got a few observations... Not sure if they are bugs or not.
On the Renderer... (MC build 130 on Vista 64)
The renderer doesn't automatically advance to the next track in the controller's Playing Now.
No info for the currently playing track shows up except the Name which shows as "F18400" or something similar.
Stop/Pause/Play/FF/REW work but Next/Prev simply restart the current track.
Only the currently playing track shows up in Playing Now.
On the Controller/Server (MC build 130 on XP)
Stop/Play/Next/Prev work but Pause/FF/REW do nothing.
The track position slider continually advances a little bit from the beginning then resets, even if there's nothing playing.
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I've been playing with build 130 and the DLNA server/controller/renderer functions and have got a few observations... Not sure if they are bugs or not.
On the Renderer... (MC build 130 on Vista 64)
The renderer doesn't automatically advance to the next track in the controller's Playing Now.
Hi Remy. You're on a two year cycle now. I saw the same problem. Matt thinks that turning "repeat" off on the renderer might work until we can get a better fix.
No info for the currently playing track shows up except the Name which shows as "F18400" or something similar.
Known problem. Others exist.
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Hi Remy. You're on a two year cycle now. I saw the same problem. Matt thinks that turning "repeat" off on the renderer might work until we can get a better fix.Known problem. Others exist.
The 2 year cycle is a testament to how well MC has been working for me. DLNA is something new to play with. :)
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I am using the DLNA server, connecting with my Onkyo receiver HT180.
Everything works great.
I love the new DLNA support, super customizable.
2 things are not working:
1) I cannot see the artist displayed (on the TV connected to the Onkyo)
Note that when I connect the Onkyo to a Twonky media server I can
see the artist just fine, so it seems a problem with the MC14 DLNA server.
2) Search feature is not supported. Would be nice to be able to search
by artist name or something like that.
Twonky media server supports it.
I would like to use only the MC14 DLNA server so I can get all my smartlists
and also because I can add extra categories to browse the music collection
thanks
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I am using the DLNA server, connecting with my Onkyo receiver HT180.
Everything works great.
I love the new DLNA support, super customizable.
2 things are not working:
1) I cannot see the artist displayed (on the TV connected to the Onkyo)
Note that when I connect the Onkyo to a Twonky media server I can
see the artist just fine, so it seems a problem with the MC14 DLNA server.
2) Search feature is not supported. Would be nice to be able to search
by artist name or something like that.
Twonky media server supports it.
I would like to use only the MC14 DLNA server so I can get all my smartlists
and also because I can add extra categories to browse the music collection
thanks
Make sure you have build 131. Search is supported with recent builds, but perhaps the Onkyo is doing new types of searches we haven't seen before?
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I have two related basic-level questions:
Is there a simple explanation of when it would be best to use the old Tremote functions and when it would be best to use the DLNA functions to control one instance of MC with another (classic Tremote style)? If all of my media is on a central server, accessible to all clients, and I don't have any fixed-function DLNA "devices" (TVs and STBs and whatnot), is there a benefit to this for me?
Second... Are there any DLNA applications for OSX? Would this allow me to control a remote Mac with MC, and play files from my MC media library "to" my Mac?
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PS. I said I wasn't interested before. I've decided that I was wrong. This is very interesting.
I am building a new PC for a good friend this weekend. They're also building a new house and just bought a nice, shiny new Samsung LCD TV that does, I believe, support DLNA in some fashion (and has an ethernet port).
The possibility of running a copy of MC on their new PC with their full media library, and "playing to" their TV (or maybe a to a new receiver once I tell my friend it would be possible) is very interesting! Even better, I show up in their house with my laptop, connect to their wireless network, and then fire up my copy of MC and connect to their media library in order to play-to the TV from the couch. Very cool.
The idea of using a crappy Samsung-designed UI to pick and choose media out of my remote MC library never seemed appealing, but the idea of using MC as an interface to other "dumb" devices that you might have spread around is an entirely different thing!
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PS. I said I wasn't interested before. I've decided that I was wrong. This is very interesting.
http://www.pix01.com/gallery/8D12431D-7EA0-495D-9EA2-775091458CB9/Mighty_Mouse/1053294768_orig0.jpg
Aha! Thanks. ;D
I'm still trying to get my head around this. Team JRiver has laid a lot of new track in the last few weeks.
If you're planning on being a hero at your friend's house, test first. There are a lot of rough edges still. Don't expect everything to just work immediately.
I'm sure there are some OSX solutions out there. I can't recommend any. TwonkyVision may have one, but I think their interface is confusing. The DLNA article on Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DLNA) has some programs listed.
For controllers, Plugplayer works, not yet perfectly. It's an iPhone app. So does Andromote. It's an Android app. Android opens the door to some less expensive hardware.
The new Buffalo Linkstations are network drives with DLNA servers built in. These work with our latest builds.
Trial and Error is your friend. Let us know how it goes.
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Second... Are there any DLNA applications for OSX? Would this allow me to control a remote Mac with MC, and play files from my MC media library "to" my Mac?
You could try Kinsky (http://oss.linn.co.uk/trac/wiki/Kinsky). It has Windows, Mac and Linux versions. The Windows version works with MC. I'd like to try the Linux version, but first I need to create a new Linux installation. My most recent experiment with Linux was several years ago.
DLNA could be a way for JRiver easily expand MC to the other platforms. Kinsky runs on .Net 2 (Windows) and Mono (OS X and Linux). IMHO, Java would a be a very good OS independent platform for a lightweight control point and renderer application that could be used with MC DLNA servers. Two years ago I suggested that JRiver could create a Java client for MC.
From http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=47138.msg323277#msg323277
(more details there):
(http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd212/AB2K/MC/javaclient.png)
Jim, you have now created the infrastructure for such a "client". You would just need to create a platform independent "JRiver / Media Center" branded application. Kinsky is a good example of what I have in my mind. You could include features that are specifically designed to work in conjunction with MC and design a look and feel that would make it a part of the "MC family".
Regarding the problem I reported earlier in this thread, the latest build fixed it.
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I have...and until this piece is correctly annotated to include DLNA with up to date info - it's useless to me.
The DLNA information is in the article on DLNA.
Besides - Media Server will not stay running - even tho this article says it will - when one logs off of a server based (WHS) OS. Having to leave MC running on the server is simply not an option.
I am not at all familiar with WHS, but try the option in MC for running Media Server on Windows Startup.
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PS. I said I wasn't interested before. I've decided that I was wrong. This is very interesting.
I'm jumping on this bandwagon, too! I'll admit that I had lost "interest" in the last few builds of MC (121 was the last I downloaded) but now I'm like a kid with a new toy! I'll be keeping my eye on the progress with DLNA from now on!
Way to go Team JRiver! 8)
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Make sure you have build 131. Search is supported with recent builds, but perhaps the Onkyo is doing new types of searches we haven't seen before?
I actually did try but I was not able to connect. Weird.
I now see the HT180 listed as a player, but from the Onkyo I am not seeing the MC14 DLNA server.
I will give it a try again but I was seeing some errors on the DLNA server, something about the
format not being recognized (I will cut and paste the message when i try again).
for now I had to revert to 130
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Make sure you have build 131. Search is supported with recent builds, but perhaps the Onkyo is doing new types of searches we haven't seen before?
i did re install 131
I powered off and on the Onkyo but still no luck, even after 30 min.
But after few tests, I realized that MC14 DLNA is on a new port, so I opened that port
in the firewall setting and now I am back in business.
But the search feature is still not working
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You could try Kinsky (http://oss.linn.co.uk/trac/wiki/Kinsky).
Very nice. I downloaded it and ran it without much trouble at all. It found our server on my machine, and I could play to our renderer on a different machine.
Thanks.
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Hi there,
after about 3 years since http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=37097.0 I come back to this topic.
I manage all my music (about 35.000 files) with MC. My dream was, to have all of them available in the living room and everywhere else in the house, where a UPNP capable device is present. Until now this remains a dream.
Today I updated to MC14, because I read in this forum, that UPNP-->DLNA experienced a lot of progress.
I currently own the following devices with DLNA functionality:
- Noxon iRadio (Audio only)
- Samsung TV LE32B679 (audio, video, pictures)
- DENON AVR-3808 (audio only)
Unfortunately NONE of them plays my files using MC14 (build 131) and DLNA without problems.
Hope this will be better soon...
Rgds
Sternwart
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I currently own the following devices with DLNA functionality:
- Noxon iRadio (Audio only)
- Samsung TV LE32B679 (audio, video, pictures)
- DENON AVR-3808 (audio only)
Unfortunately NONE of them plays my files using MC14 (build 131) and DLNA without problems.
Pick one and describe the problem you have. It may be just configuration. You need to set the options in Tools/Options/DLNA. Check the Server feature at least.
I'm pretty sure someone reported this working on Noxon.
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Hello - quick question - i have a popcorn hour c200 as my DMR. I'm running build 14.0.130, and have enabled the controller function under "Services & Plugin-ins"
... I can't see my PCH under the "Now Playing" tab though - can anyone confirm if this device is supported yet or if there's any plan to in future builds?
Is there a firewall port on my DMP that I need to open up (have the windows firewall enabled)?
Thanks for your help!
Cheers, Jon
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... i have a popcorn hour c200 as my DMR. I'm running build 14.0.130, and have enabled the controller function under "Services & Plugin-ins"
I believe you need to enable the Renderer in the same section. It is the playback portion, and I think the Popcorn Hour c200 is a server. I may be mistaken about the PH.
... I can't see my PCH under the "Now Playing" tab though - can anyone confirm if this device is supported yet or if there's any plan to in future builds?
Is there a firewall port on my DMP that I need to open up (have the windows firewall enabled)?
In that build, try setting the port to 2870. The next build moves the ports used to the range, 52100 to 52199.
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thanks Jim - i enabled the renderer function and change port to that suggested, but still not seeing the PCH in the now playing tab.
...is there any debug strategy you could suggest to try find out where i'm getting stuck?
cheers, Jon
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thanks Jim - i enabled the renderer function and change port to that suggested, but still not seeing the PCH in the now playing tab.
...is there any debug strategy you could suggest to try find out where i'm getting stuck?
If it is a DLNA Renderer, MC will show it under File/Library.
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hi Jim - no it's not a server; i have a NAS device serving up the files... i want to control the render of these files on the PCH using jriver MC as the control point.
i'm thinking i don't necessarily want to turn the tv on every time i want to select something else to play on the PCH.
i'll maybe ask the popcorn hour guys as well? - maybe c200 is does not offer suitable remote rendering functions to MC (e.g. stop, play, pause etc)?
cheers, Jon
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Please tell them we'll provide a license and technical contact.
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Jim - will do - cheers, Jon
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Pick one and describe the problem you have. It may be just configuration. You need to set the options in Tools/Options/DLNA. Check the Server feature at least.
I'm pretty sure someone reported this working on Noxon.
I take the Samsung TV. It has a DLNA client included. When choosing "Media" I get an Intro screen containing buttons for "Music", "Photo" and "Video".
The TV comes with a terrible software called "PC Share Manager". You have to include every single folder into the "Database". It took me about 20 minutes to include two dozens of mp3 files. You have a language mix from German, Dutch, English and what else in the GUI. But using this application I can play Music (MP3), Pictures (JPEG) and Videos.
When using MC14 (tried "DLNA Generic" profile) the following happens:
- Which button I ever use, I always get the Menu starting with "Music", Photos" and "Video" (if the "Music" button was pressed, it's useless to present "Photo" and "Video".
- I can navigate through the path (i.e. Music\Artists\Artist Name\Album Name)
- then I see the track names and the album cover
- when trying to play any of the tracks I always get "Not supported file format" (or in German "Nicht unterstütztes Format")
That was for "Music", similar things happen with the other categories.
It would be nice, to have a similar result on the screen, like with the Samsung application.
I never tested Twonky, but I read somewhere, that the twonky user can make file formats readable by changing some program parameters.
When using the Noxon (with the standard "DLNA Terratec Noxon" parameter set) I run into a loop: after choosing "PCName Terratec Noxon" I get a list, containing all discovered DLNA sources, one of them is "PCname Terratec Noxon"... and so on.Never got deeper into th menu.
Thanks for your patience.
Regards
Sternwart
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Don't expect everything to just work immediately.
This gave me a good laugh. Thanks, Jim. ;) ;D
(We are, after all, dealing with a computer, right?)
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Second... Are there any DLNA applications for OSX? Would this allow me to control a remote Mac with MC, and play files from my MC media library "to" my Mac?
You could try Kinsky (http://oss.linn.co.uk/trac/wiki/Kinsky). It has Windows, Mac and Linux versions. The Windows version works with MC. I'd like to try the Linux version, but first I need to create a new Linux installation. My most recent experiment with Linux was several years ago...
glynor, did you try it on a Mac?
BTW, there are actually two interesting versions, in addition to "Kinsky" there is "KinskyDesktop".
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Not yet. I'm going to try to get there later this week.
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Actually... I just went over and checked it out. These both look like the opposite of what I'm looking for.
What I'd really like is the ability to turn a Mac into a DLNA Renderer, not a server or controller. I'd want to use MC to drive them, and just output the audio/video on the Mac. Am I missing something (I admittedly didn't look that hard)? Are these apps able to act as renderers as well?
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I take the Samsung TV.
Good choice.
It has a DLNA client included.
In DLNA terminology, the Samsung has a DLNA Renderer (it plays content from a DLNA Server).
When choosing "Media" I get an Intro screen containing buttons for "Music", "Photo" and "Video".
The TV comes with a terrible software called "PC Share Manager". You have to include every single folder into the "Database". It took me about 20 minutes to include two dozens of mp3 files. You have a language mix from German, Dutch, English and what else in the GUI. But using this application I can play Music (MP3), Pictures (JPEG) and Videos.
Good. So we know the Samsung will work.
When using MC14 (tried "DLNA Generic" profile) ...
Make sure you have checked the option for the DLNA Server in MC.
the following happens:
- Which button I ever use, I always get the Menu starting with "Music", Photos" and "Video" (if the "Music" button was pressed, it's useless to present "Photo" and "Video".
You must customize the view in MC for that server. It's a characteristic of DLNA in general.
- I can navigate through the path (i.e. Music\Artists\Artist Name\Album Name)
- then I see the track names and the album cover
- when trying to play any of the tracks I always get "Not supported file format" (or in German "Nicht unterstütztes Format")
So it almost works. It may just be the conversion setting. Make sure that you can convert to MP3 format, and try "Always convert".
That was for "Music", similar things happen with the other categories.
Other categories may not yet work, but that will change shortly.
When using the Noxon (with the standard "DLNA Terratec Noxon" parameter set) I run into a loop: after choosing "PCName Terratec Noxon" I get a list, containing all discovered DLNA sources, one of them is "PCname Terratec Noxon"... and so on.Never got deeper into th menu.
I'm not sure on that one. Let's stick with the Samsung for now.
Thanks for your patience.
And yours!
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Are these apps able to act as renderers as well?
Most apps do a piece or two, but not often all three.
The best list of possibilities I have seen is on wikipedia.
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Good choice.In DLNA terminology, the Samsung has a DLNA Renderer (it plays content from a DLNA Server).Good. So we know the Samsung will work.Make sure you have checked the option for the DLNA Server in MC.You must customize the view in MC for that server. It's a characteristic of DLNA in general.So it almost works. It may just be the conversion setting. Make sure that you can convert to MP3 format, and try "Always convert".Other categories may not yet work, but that will change shortly.I'm not sure on that one. Let's stick with the Samsung for now.And yours!
Thanks Jim for your quick response.
Customizing: I know about these features and i appreciate them. So I reduced the features for the Noxon to "Audio" (because it doesn't show pictures... nor it makes coffee...:-) BUT: the Samsung TV plays Audio, Pictures and Video as well. So it makes no sense in my point of view, to present all theses categories again, when I already chose "Audio" in the main menu. I do not expect to see photos, when I chose Audio - so I don't want to have this choice again.
Converting:
I played around with the converting options - without success. BTW: I only gave simple MP3 files to the test folder. So I assume there would have been nothing to convert... Am I right with this?
Rgds
Sternwart
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I'm happy to report that I can use one PC running MC to control playback on another. However, large HD video files take a long time to start playing. Can we have a similar option to that of library server to play files locally if they exist?
I have a central (unRAID) server which all my PCs connect to. I think that (for example) a simple 1.5 GB file is being loaded before playback and that is pretty intolerable.
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Get a faster LAN. 10 Gbps or faster. ;D
(I am just joking.)
Probably the file format doesn't allow starting playback before the file is fully transferred (i.e the behavior is not different from a Library Server/client connection).
Can we have a similar option to that of library server to play files locally if they exist?
I think the nature and the strict standards of DLNA/UPnP prevent from transmitting Windows file name paths through the UPnP server/control point/renderer chain, but perhaps JRiver could add their own extensions that would be used only when all involved participants are MC instances.
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Get a faster LAN. 10 Gbps or faster. ;D
(I am just joking.)
Probably the file format doesn't allow starting playback before the file is fully transferred (i.e the behavior is not different from a Library Server/client connection).
I think the nature and the strict standards of DLNA/UPnP prevent from transmitting Windows file name paths through the UPnP server/control point/renderer chain, but perhaps JRiver could add their own extensions that would be used only when all involved participants are MC instances.
Thanks, Alex. My files are mostly mkv or avi - the majority of those being h264 encoded mkvs.
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I split some posts to a thread called DLNA vs. HTPC (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55846.0).
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I have the DLNA connection working both in MC, my XBOX360, and on iphone via the PlugPlayer app.
Is there any provision in the DLNA spec that could allow the rating of the currently playing track to be updated?
I don't see anything in the interface of these DLNA clients that would indicate that would be the case.
That's really the one feature we have in Library Server that would keep me from moving over to the DLNA method.
It's a shame since DLNA is more flexible in some ways.
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I have the DLNA connection working both in MC, my XBOX360, and on iphone via the PlugPlayer app.
Is there any provision in the DLNA spec that could allow the rating of the currently playing track to be updated?
I don't see anything in the interface of these DLNA clients that would indicate that would be the case.
That's really the one feature we have in Library Server that would keep me from moving over to the DLNA method.
It's a shame since DLNA is more flexible in some ways.
My Streamium has a rating button on the remote. I'm not sure if it's calling a standard DLNA function. We'll investigate.
If anyone else knows more about DLNA + ratings (like a program that does this already), please let us know.
Thanks.
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In 14.0.130 my PS3 can find my Media Server just fine, but in 14.0.131 and 14.0.136 the PS3 was not able to connect. When I try to connect with my PS3, the DLNA/UPnP section in Media Center shows the following line 3 times:
SSDP request for service type: urn:schemas-upnp-org:device:MediaServer:1;Responses: 1
I am not sure if I need to modify my DLNA/UPnP setup to be different in 136 than my setup in the 130 options or if this is just a problem with the beta versions. I did notice that between 130 and 136 the port is no longer modifiable and the DLNA/UPnP server connects on a different port in 130 than it did in 136. I don't know if that makes a difference or not, but it is one change that I noticed.
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I am not sure if I need to modify my DLNA/UPnP setup from my 14.0.130 options or if this is just a problem with the beta versions. I did notice that between 130 and 136 the port is no longer modifiable and the DLNA/UPnP server connects on a different port in 136 than it did in 130. I don't know if that makes a difference or not, but it is one change that I noticed.
You will need to change the settings. Try adding a new server, and choose PS3. Don't make any other changes.
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I wasn't expecting such a quick reply. Thank you very much.
I am not sure if this makes a difference or not, but I had originally upgraded from 104 (or 107, can't quite remember which) to 131. The UPnP section changed significantly between those versions, so I added a new PS3 server in the new DLNA/UPnP section at that time. I tried to connect with the PS3 with the same error. When I saw the post for 136 this morning, I was hoping that version would fix the problem and so I installed it and tried connecting with no success. After that I tried going back to the last non-beta version, 130. With no changes, the PS3 connected just fine. After your post, I re-installed 136 and tried adding a new PS3 server just in case I made a change to the PS3 server that I forgot about. Still no success. Is there anything else I may be missing? Oh, one other note, I checked for any PS3 updates and there were none. So, I am on the latest PS3 version.
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It's possible that your firewall is blocking the port. It's probably 52100 or 52101.
Also, try powering down both sides.
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The firewall was the problem. I completely forgot to check it. Thank you for the help. I am loving being able to stream my media straight to my PS3 with Media Center. It is nice to get it back up and running again.
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The firewall was the problem. I completely forgot to check it. Thank you for the help. I am loving being able to stream my media straight to my PS3 with Media Center. It is nice to get it back up and running again.
Good news. Thanks.
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Hey, this looks promising (using build 136). So far, got my server running, my workstation controlling it, my two [Philips Streamium] SLA5520s being driven and my Samsung 9 series (which has always refused to work in the past, despite saying it's DLNA certified) can at least see the server.
There are some simple things I can't seem to get my head around, such as when a new device is turned on, why the server doesn't get to see it unless I stop and restart it. I still can't see my Samsung Telly after multiple restarts, but the telly can see the server.
Also, my samsung telly tells me all my music is in an incompatible format, but everything I have is an MP3 VBR format. The server is set to recode to VBR, recode to CBR and the server doesn't even start.
Beyond the base principles I'm trying to find if some more advanced things are possible. For example, can multiple renderers be synced up so they are all playing exactly the same track at the same time. For example, if I'm having a party, the telly and sound system in the lounge, one SLA5520 in the kitchen and the other driving the speakers outside can all be set up so they are playing the same thing at the same time with zero lag between them and controlled by a single controller. I'm guessing not, but it's something I'd like to see.
Definitely an improvement over plain uPnP though, that's for sure.
I plan to give the wife kittens by changing the music she's listening to at home at various random intervals thoughout the day. It's just got to be done !!
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I am using an Onkyo HT-RC 180 to connect to MC14 build 136
I can see all the smart lists just fine.
Music streams without a problem.
I can also see the album covers, but somehow when a song is being played,
I do not see the author information being displayed, only the song name and the album
but not the author.
Note that when the Onkyo is connected to TwonkyMedia, I can see the author correctly.
also the search feature is not working with MC14.
Instead it's working just fine with TwonkyMedia.
Any tips on how to solve these 2 issues?
Many thanks
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There are some simple things I can't seem to get my head around, such as when a new device is turned on, why the server doesn't get to see it unless I stop and restart it. I still can't see my Samsung Telly after multiple restarts, but the telly can see the server.
MC will show Renderers that it can control under Playing Now. We probably aren't refreshing this list often enough.
Also, my samsung telly tells me all my music is in an incompatible format, but everything I have is an MP3 VBR format. The server is set to recode to VBR, recode to CBR and the server doesn't even start.
Try 128Kbps. It's possible the device doesn't like some formats. Try forcing conversion.
... can multiple renderers be synced up so they are all playing exactly the same track at the same time.
Not at this time.
For example, if I'm having a party, the telly and sound system in the lounge, one SLA5520 in the kitchen and the other driving the speakers outside can all be set up so they are playing the same thing at the same time with zero lag between them and controlled by a single controller.
Definitely an improvement over plain uPnP though, that's for sure.
I plan to give the wife kittens by changing the music she's listening to at home at various random intervals thoughout the day. It's just got to be done !!
Thanks for the report. We'll get the Samsung going for you. We may need a wireshark log.
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I am using an Onkyo HT-RC 180 to connect to MC14 build 136
I can see all the smart lists just fine.
Music streams without a problem.
I can also see the album covers, but somehow when a song is being played,
I do not see the author information being displayed, only the song name and the album
but not the author.
also the search feature is not working with MC14.
Any tips on how to solve these 2 issues?
This may not have been implemented yet.
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Try 128Kbps. It's possible the device doesn't like some formats. Try forcing conversion. We'll get the Samsung going for you. We may need a wireshark log.
Tried release 136 today with my Samsung TV. Used CBR, forced conversion 128kbps. After selecting "Music" the TV came back with "Request cannot be completed, Media Play will return to Main Screen." and then "Media Play is disconnecting device <pcname>Samsung". After that the Samsung specific DLNA-Device is not shown within the DLNA Menu of the TV for a while.
What can I contribute to get the Samsung family running with MC?
Rgds
Sternwart
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Is there Samsung software running on the PC? Or does the TV expect it to be?
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Jim,
there is no Samsung software on this PC.
I have it ("PC Share Manager") on my laptop for testing purposes. This is the most terrible piece of software, I ever saw. BUT: the Samsung TV can see my media files after importing them into the Share Manager database. Seems as they speak a foreign dialect of DLNA language...
Rgds
Sternwart
PS: Samsung calls its TV "DLNA compatible". The only "DLNA Server" they talk about, is "PC Share Manager". From this point of view they expect it. I choose this TV because it's DLNA compatibility and saw the chance, to acces my media via MC...
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What model is the Samsung?
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LE32B679
http://www.samsung.de/de/Privatkunden/TVHeimkino/Fernseher/LCDTV/le32b679/LE32B679T2SXZG/detail.aspx
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We can look at this in more detail but it will take at least a couple of weeks. In the meantime, please try the builds as they are made available. Something else we do may affect this.
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Hope, you will succeed...
Sternwart
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Thanks. It looks like Samsung's DLNA may be a little different:
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-13973_102-0.html?threadID=325920
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Now that I'm a proud owner of the LG BD390 device:
With the generic settings as DLNA server in MC14, all is almost working out of the box:
- Custom views are showing as expected
- Playlists/Smartlists are working perfect
- Music is playing perfect
- Pictures are displaying well
- Videos are playing ok (even DTS/Dolby digital, MKV files etc.)
Some things that are not working (yet):
- No thumbnails are shown (neither for Audio, Images or Videos)
- Subtitles (in the same folder of the video file with the same name and .srt extension) are not displaying
- Only the Title is shown in the list of files, can't this be an option so for audio we can also choose to show Artist ?
The first two options above (thumbnails and Subtitles) are working perfect with Nero Mediahome 4, all other DLNA servers I tread fail to show thumbnails and subtitles.
Is there something special to be done and/or why is Nero working ok for this ?
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bou, i can't stream to my Sony 32v4500 kdl tv !
dlna works with Microsoft media player but nothing with MC, i'm so sad...
LuLu from Paris, France
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bou, i can't stream to my Sony 32v4500 kdl tv !
dlna works with Microsoft media player but nothing with MC, i'm so sad...
Are you using build 136? It's at the top of the MC14 board here.
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The first two options above (thumbnails and Subtitles) are working perfect with Nero Mediahome 4, all other DLNA servers I tread fail to show thumbnails and subtitles.
Is there something special to be done and/or why is Nero working ok for this ?
We probably need to tune something, but someone else found a problem related to case sensitivity. folder.jpg worked. Folder.jpg did not. Could be the same problem here?
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We probably need to tune something, but someone else found a problem related to case sensitivity. folder.jpg worked. Folder.jpg did not. Could be the same problem here?
This would maybe ok for audio (I will try), but for Videos and Images not. (Images don't have folder.jpg, because they are already images...)
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We probably need to tune something, but someone else found a problem related to case sensitivity. folder.jpg worked. Folder.jpg did not. Could be the same problem here?
tried with folder.jpg and Folder.jpg, no joy
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Hello,
I just want to use MC as the server and use Linn KinskyDestop to control Linn DS player to play music.
How should I set-up MC?
- turn DLNA server on
- Select " Generic DLNA"
- Should "MC as renderer" on?
- Does the server function will be on at once or do I need to restart MC?
- Can the KinskyDestop and MC run on same PC?
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We probably need to tune something, but someone else found a problem related to case sensitivity. folder.jpg worked. Folder.jpg did not. Could be the same problem here?
Just tested my LG BD390 with just browsing thru shared folders (no DLNA) from my PC, this shows my coverart (for audio only) perfect.
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I just tried .137 with my Denon 3808CI. I used the 'Denon' server in the DLNA dialog. The receiver can see MC, browse and play. MC can see the Denon after a restart, but can only pause and play a track that's already been started from the Denon interface. I can't choose a track from the MC interface and have it play on the Denon, which is what I'd really like to do. I get an error that the file can't be played.
...alan
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Thanks. It looks like Samsung's DLNA may be a little different:
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-13973_102-0.html?threadID=325920
I had a look at this forum post and found this header info at the end.
I'm extremely happy to report that this simple fix will allow you to stream almost any mp3/avi file to the Samsung using mediatomb on Linux...
Step 1: Open your mediatomb config and place this in the <server> section:
<custom-http-headers>
<add header="transferMode.dlna.org: Streaming"/>
<add header="contentFeatures.dlna.org: DLNA.ORG_OP=01;DLNA.ORG_CI=0;DLNA.ORG_FLAGS=01700000000000000000000000000000"/>
</custom-http-headers>
Step 2: Add this node inside of the <extension-mimetype> node:
<map from="avi" to="video/mpeg"/>
Step 3: Restart mediatomb
Step 4: Sit back and enjoy streaming media directly to your tv
I too am extremely interested in getting the samsung DLNA TV working with MC as this functionality was the reason I bought it
Are there any user accessible config files where I can add this info to test or is it code that has to be embedded in a dll somewhere.
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I had a look at this forum post and found this header info at the end.
I too am extremely interested in getting the samsung DLNA TV working with MC as this functionality was the reason I bought it
Are there any user accessible config files where I can add this info to test or is it code that has to be embedded in a dll somewhere.
It's inside the program and can't be changed. At some point this will be more configurable. I'm working on the video now. That info you quoted assumes all of your avi files contain mpeg content. Is that the case?
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It's inside the program and can't be changed. At some point this will be more configurable. I'm working on the video now. That info you quoted assumes all of your avi files contain mpeg content. Is that the case?
Some files maybe but most of my videos are encoded with DivX or Xvid (I don't know if this is the same or not.
Also, the "Not supported Media Format" error occurs for all my MP3's and Jpegs as well (Audio & Photos). How are these types dealt with in the Headers?
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Can you make this topic a sticky one, Jim?
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Hi, please excuse this newbie...
I am searching for a suitable DLNA setup. I have:
- Synology DS207 NAS where the media resides
- HTPC running XBMC (Win 7, could go linux)
- relatively old laptop running MC 14: library resides locally, files pulled from Synology via a Windows share.
Right now I set up the laptop acting as a DLNA server, and thus controlling the XBMC on the HTPC. One slight annoyance is that the cover art (embedded in id3 tags) does not get displayed. (Is this a known issue?) Apart from this, the setup works relatively well - the media info, and search functionality shows up on the MC quickly with no lag. But does this mean that the media flows Synology->laptop->HTPC ? Or is it intelligently routed Synology -> HTPC?
Since I suspect that anser to the above is the former, I wonder if a better setup would not be Synology as a DLNA server, laptop MC as a DLNA controller. Based on the definitions of the modes my understanding is that the MC would simply act as a 'remote control' to select the media to be played on the XBMC - is this correct?
I tried this approach: enabled 'DLNA renderer' in MC, and the media server on the NAS. The media content shows up in MC (albeit a bit laggy - one disadvantage over the above), XBMC shows up as a zone in Playing Now. However when I try to play, MC tells me that Server functionality needs to be enabled. Is this intended? It seems to me that this will not lead to the intended setup?.
Finally, what setup would you recommend? The key objective is to be able to control the music from the MC gui, and for the data to reside on the NAS.
Oh, and a minor question: can I make the XBMC zone the default zone, so that I can simply double click on content to play it.
Sorry for the long winded post - I appreciate your input.
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It's inside the program and can't be changed. At some point this will be more configurable. I'm working on the video now. That info you quoted assumes all of your avi files contain mpeg content. Is that the case?
Some files maybe but most of my videos are encoded with DivX or Xvid (I don't know if this is the same or not.
Also, the "Not supported Media Format" error occurs for all my MP3's and Jpegs as well (Audio & Photos). How are these types dealt with in the Headers?
I did a wireshark trace back before New Year and emailed it in but have had no response to it. Did it contain useful information? Do I need to do another one?
I really don't want to ditch MC for something else as it rocks in almost every other way. I am keen to help get this DLNA to Samsung TV working so just ask what you need me to provide.
Thanks
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I did a wireshark trace back before New Year and emailed it in but have had no response to it. Did it contain useful information? Do I need to do another one?
Bob was in the hospital for almost three weeks. He's back and beginning to work again.
Thanks for your patience.
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Can you make this topic a sticky one, Jim?
Bump
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Some files maybe but most of my videos are encoded with DivX or Xvid (I don't know if this is the same or not.
Not the same, those will have to be transcoded. We added the compression tag for video. If you "update library (from tags) for your video files you will get that field filled in by MC. Then you can see the video and audio codecs for all of your videos.
Also, the "Not supported Media Format" error occurs for all my MP3's and Jpegs as well (Audio & Photos). How are these types dealt with in the Headers?
That's really weird. The generic DLNA should be sending the same headers as MediaTomb for audio and image formats. You are using the generic dlna profile? You don't have the WMC Compat flag set in advanced options??
You could try deleting your profile and recreating it. You might have to restart MC AND the TV after making the change.
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Has anybody been successful at passing cover art to a DLNA renderer, specifically XBMC? I managed to get the artist/album/time displayed, but not the cover art.
I am using MC 14 build 140. Cover art is embedded in each FLAC/mp3 file.
Thanks!
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Has anybody been successful at passing cover art to a DLNA renderer, specifically XBMC? I managed to get the artist/album/time displayed, but not the cover art.
I am using MC 14 build 140. Cover art is embedded in each FLAC/mp3 file.
Thanks!
Build 147 is on the download page now. Cover art works on the WD HD TV Live as a renderer.
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Has anyone tried this with an Xtreamer or Patriot Box Office?
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I don't believe the Xtreamer has DLNA rendering functionality - I own one and have suggested/requested this feature in fact. Main reason for me moving to xbmc...
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I don't believe the Xtreamer has DLNA rendering functionality - I own one and have suggested/requested this feature in fact. Main reason for me moving to xbmc...
What kind of rendering does it do? If it's Windows Media you could always try the xbox 360 profile.
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Just tried out MC14 to check the new DLNA progress, but it is missing one feature that makes it of limited use (for me). Most of my content uses CODECs that the PS3 and/or XBox 360 can play, but not in containers that they support (mostly MKV). This content shows up a 'unsupported' on these devices. This same content does stream fine (as is - not transcoded) to the 360 using Windows Media Center 7 with the new DIVX platform installed.
Part of the new DIVX platform is MKV support for media extenders, and it works by making the extender see the content as being supported. Not sure if it is remuxing the content on the fly or just sending the raw stream, but it works. It does currently lack chapter and subtitle support and doesn't yet work with the PS3.
I am not interested in transcoding support. On my smaller PC screens I can play back any format I want and on my larger TV screens transcoded material is noticeably worse than the original. I would rather just take the time to find and use the original disc over watching a lower quality version.
Not sure how technically feasible this is, but it would help as new containers come out that older (or even existing) extenders can't (or won't) support.
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I'm new at DLNA.
I want to use Plugplayer and have enabled (I think) the Rendered option in DLNA settings.
PlugPlayer can see my 4 zones but I get an 801 Error when trying to browse. I seem to be able to control file playback but have just one file in PlugPlayer.
What am I doing wrong here?
There is nothing here in the wiki (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA)about ports and firewalls, and I can see the Zones.
thanks
hifi
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I'm new at DLNA.
I want to use Plugplayer and have enabled (I think) the Rendered option in DLNA settings.
PlugPlayer can see my 4 zones but I get an 801 Error when trying to browse. I seem to be able to control file playback but have just one file in PlugPlayer.
What am I doing wrong here?
There is nothing here in the wiki (http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DLNA)about ports and firewalls, and I can see the Zones.
thanks
hifi
How do you want to use MC?
As a server of music/images/video to be rendered elsewhere?
or to render the music/images/video?
or both (which essentially means using PP as a fancy remote)?
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HI Bob
I want to use my iPhone as a fancy remote, and just control playback on any of my 3-4 zones.
I currently have MC14 as the front end for my and 2channel hifi & hometheater.
I currently use RiverMote but there are some compatabilityand focus issues with it. It allows my to see all Playlists and Smartlists, and control Playing Now.
thanks!
hifi
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Hello,
I have just upgraded from MC 13 to 14. However I am now having problems with a uPnP device which was running very well until the upgrade. It is a Netgear MP101.
I have added it to the server list and removed the default Generic DLNA. I have made no changes to the settings. The MP101 sees the server, connects and even starts to play. However at the end of the song it stops and doesn't play the next song on the album.
I have restarted server and client a couple of times, but it still does this... Any ideas ??
Cheers
Chris
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I have added it to the server list and removed the default Generic DLNA. I have made no changes to the settings. The MP101 sees the server, connects and even starts to play. However at the end of the song it stops and doesn't play the next song on the album.
Did you upgrade your OS too?
The MP101 doesn't work with Vista and Windows 7 with any server software.
You might be able to find firmware on the internet that gets it working, but I don't have the specifics. I gave up on my MP101 when I first upgraded to Vista years back because of this.
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Hi Matt.
No, still on XP Pro SP3.
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I had a look for the vista/7 compliant firmware you mentioned and found it here:
http://shazwanazizan.blogspot.com/2009/02/giving-back-to-society-netgear-mp101.html (http://shazwanazizan.blogspot.com/2009/02/giving-back-to-society-netgear-mp101.html)
I was planning on upgrading my main HTPC soon and Win7 would be the likely OS to use. So I tried this firmware to see if it helps...
And no it doesn't.
Now the MP101 can view the library, but cannot play anything. When you try and play something a message pops up "Item is currently unavailable".
I thought I had knackered the MP101. But when I run up MC13 and connect the MP101 to that, it works fine.
There is definitely a problem that has crept into MC14...
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I had a look for the vista/7 compliant firmware you mentioned and found it here:
http://shazwanazizan.blogspot.com/2009/02/giving-back-to-society-netgear-mp101.html (http://shazwanazizan.blogspot.com/2009/02/giving-back-to-society-netgear-mp101.html)
I was planning on upgrading my main HTPC soon and Win7 would be the likely OS to use. So I tried this firmware to see if it helps...
And no it doesn't.
Now the MP101 can view the library, but cannot play anything. When you try and play something a message pops up "Item is currently unavailable".
I thought I had knackered the MP101. But when I run up MC13 and connect the MP101 to that, it works fine.
There is definitely a problem that has crept into MC14...
Thanks for testing.
We'll plug in an MP-101 here sometime this week and see how we fare. Hopefully it's an easy fix.
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Thanks Matt :)
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Thanks Matt :)
I just plugged in an MP101 and had pretty good luck with it.
Make sure you're running build 153 of Media Center from the top of this board. Also, make sure it's set to convert to MP3 in the DLNA server options. I streamed an APE file converted to MP3 and also a plain MP3. Both played fine.
It does stick at the end of the song for me, but I'm testing with Vista so this is sort of expected (it doesn't have the newest firmware).
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Thanks for trying that Matt. I appreciate your efforts. It is encouraging that some else has it working ok
I have another XP machine (main HTPC), but that is a Via Epia and I have never attempted uPnP from that as the CPU is only 500MHz. But I'll give that a try later and also with my Vista laptop.
Cheers
Chris
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I don't believe the Xtreamer has DLNA rendering functionality - I own one and have suggested/requested this feature in fact. Main reason for me moving to xbmc...
Thanks. I'll still keep it though.
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Has anyone tried this with an Xtreamer or Patriot Box Office?
To answer my own question, I set it up last night with my Patriot BoxOffice.
-It's meant to be UPnP, and no mention of DLNA. Does this make a difference?
-It saw MC DLNA servers straight away.
-I was even able to navigate the views which I left on default.
--However, video files would not play. They were seen, but I got "Invalid file".
--Music files were fine, however.
--The same video files that wouldn't play, would play fine if I navigated to them via the network.
-The BoxOffice never showed up as a Playing Now Zone.
Any tips, anyone?
Maybe I should sell my two BoxOffices and get WDTVLive units instead? Perhaps this is something that might be enhanced in future firmware releases for the BoxOffice?
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I found this on another forum, but I don't see where I would change the port MC DLNA is running on.
the Wiki needs some work for PlugPlayer users imo (i.e. WIndows logo vs. MC icons):
Yes I certainly have received that error (801). It took me a while to figure it out. the problem was I selected the wrong Media Server in the PlugPlayer setup. If your version of Windows is also running a UPnP server (it likely is) it may appear in the list instead of the MC Media Server. Selecting the Windows Media Server will give you the 801 error every time. There should be a media server selectable with the MC icon not just one with a Windows icon.
I had to change the port MC Media Server was operating on, in order to make this work. Windows and MC used the same port by default and Windows won the battle.
Also, make sure you have downloaded the absolute newest version of MC from the MC forum. It really makes a difference.
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Okay, so enabling the server did the trick. :-[ Choosing Renderer makes the zones show up in PlugPlayer, but it is confusing for a new user that you need to choose Server as well because it seems like it is already running, and I don't want it to server anything; just be controlled by my iPhone. DLNA is incredibly fast with my 122K song library. Color me impressed. Wish I had a way to do ratings though like in RiverMote!
hifi
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Hi,
First, this Media Center is for me the best I ever seen. The eye candy is fantastic.
Used system: Win7, MC 14.0.151, Denon AVP-A1HD
Working with mostly FLAC and some mp3's. Everything works: Playing songs via zone 1 etc, except I can't get the function I needed most to work.
I want to push content to my Denon, but I don't have success with this. UPNP service selected is 'Denon', tried also 'general dlna'. Tried to change options too.
When I drop a .flac or .mp3 or any other file on the 'playing now'-Denon (In fact it is reported 'Network Audio' by the Denon.) I get this message:
'There was a problem controlling the selected DLNA device. Double check your device server and network settings'
The Denon can play mp3 and flac, but i'm suspecting it is not advertising flac in upnp. (Some control point won't play flac, and can't be forced to do so)
With Twonky server, or the on2share plugin I can push mp3 and flac native to the Denon without problems.
Also with MC server, I can pull mp3 and flac content, controlled by the Denon controls.
Strange thing, when I start a song with eg on2share/winamp, en go to MC, then the upper left play button changes to pause and time is counting.
I can even pause/play the running song with MC.
I think this person has the same problem: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55720.msg380620#msg380620 (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55720.msg380620#msg380620)
Thanks for your time, I hope to get this working!
Eddy
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How do you control what filetypes are supported? Just tried feeding some FLAC files to my Denon 3310. The Denon supports FLAC, but MC was trying to transcode to MP3 instead of passing the FLAC directly.
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flac files should be passed properly in the current version. Choose "never convert" for the audio conversion under options. The current version of MC converts everything to the format you choose with you select "convert unsupported formats". I'd use generic dlna for any recent Denon. Let us know if this change lets you play flacs natively.
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flac files should be passed properly in the current version. Choose "never convert" for the audio conversion under options. The current version of MC converts everything to the format you choose with you select "convert unsupported formats". I'd use generic dlna for any recent Denon. Let us know if this change lets you play flacs natively.
Using generic DLNA and never convert allows FLAC to pass to the 3310.
Edit:
Of course now non-supported tracks won't play.
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Not the same, those will have to be transcoded. We added the compression tag for video. If you "update library (from tags) for your video files you will get that field filled in by MC. Then you can see the video and audio codecs for all of your videos.That's really weird. The generic DLNA should be sending the same headers as MediaTomb for audio and image formats. You are using the generic dlna profile? You don't have the WMC Compat flag set in advanced options??
You could try deleting your profile and recreating it. You might have to restart MC AND the TV after making the change.
I have just tried the latest MC14.0.149 & the MC15.0.12 versions and DLNA streaming to my Samsung TV still does not work. All media types Images, Music & video exhibit the same problem. i.e. Media Format Not Supported error on TV when selected for Playback. I can see the image thumbnails (including the embedded cover art in the MP3 files) but when selecting anything to play the above error is displayed.
I have been trying to get this problem addressed for a number of months now in this forum and it seems that it is in the too hard basket. :( This is disappointing as it means that I cannot stream to my TV as was my intention. I will probably be forced to run alot more cable or buy another PC to stream to.
I have used the generic DLNA profile and no advanced options. I am prepared to do another wireshark trace over the weekend but don't know how to best get it to you (JRiver) can you please advise.
Thanks in advance
Brian
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I have been trying to get this problem addressed for a number of months now in this forum and it seems that it is in the too hard basket. :( This is disappointing as it means that I cannot stream to my TV as was my intention. I will probably be forced to run alot more cable or buy another PC to stream to.
I hope you'll understand that we can't just buy a $1000 TV to solve every similar problem.
If you'll try a google search, you'll find many people saying what you're saying. Samsung is different than other DLNA. It shouldn't be.
Bob is working on a change that _might_ affect it.
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Using generic DLNA and never convert allows FLAC to pass to the 3310.
Edit:
Of course now non-supported tracks won't play.
Since device support for different formats is all over the place there is no way to do this in a simple fashion. The way we currently do it is assume all devices can do mp3 and all DLNA devices can do LPCM (B.E. Wave). The best sound you could get is to "convert when necessary" to uncompressed wave. This is lossless since you are simple sending the encoded output to the device. At some point we will probably let one create a list of supported extensions in the advanced options so it can be tailored per device however that's certainly past the understanding of the average user.
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Understood - Most of my tracks are MP3/FLAC (was APE but have converted to FLAC for now since it is more supported on devices) so I haven't decided what to do with the few oddball (mostly apple mp4) tracks. The convert all to wav would work at the expense of extra bandwidth and the loss of knowing the original file type when supported.
What I think would work best long term is the following:
Leave the defaults 'as is' with always convert and MP3. For the 'average' user that would make it 'just work' and if they are average they probably don't have any lossless files in the first place.
Then give us more advanced users the ability to define valid file types (like we can with handhelds).
Edit: Also think about leveraging stacks here. If there is a supported file in the stack then use that.
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I've made some changes in the next build of 15 (this will be 15.0.17 or greater) after doing much searching for the differences with the Samsung tv's.
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55379.msg385885#msg385885
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OK, lemme get this straight. I've been following several of the threads about DLNA but i'm still having trouble getting my head around it.
I've looked at the following threads:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55380.0
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55435.0
...the DLNA entry on the wiki and many other threads, but I still have some questions.
My main goal would be to easily play videos (vobs, xvid, etc) from my PC to my TV in a different room. If i'm understanding all this correctly, i could get a device like the LG BD390 (for example, because with the Blu-ray and Netflix built in, i'd probably get that), configure MC15 to use it via DLNA and voila--even to my old-school CRT TV? Am i connecting the dots correctly?
- What role is the LG playing DLNA terms? If MC is the renderer and controller, is it the player? Or is that moot?
- What does the interface look like? Whatever LG provides? Or as the controller is MC involved? If the latter, is it controlled from the PC with MC? (and therefore could be set up with a remote, etc)
thanks for any clarification...
-steve
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Going by this review (http://www.techradar.com/reviews/audio-visual/blu-ray-players/lg-bd390-blu-ray-player-631686/review) of the BD390...
- What role is the LG playing DLNA terms? If MC is the renderer and controller, is it the player? Or is that moot?
The LG is the renderer ie player , MC is just the server. Just like if you had hooked up any generic DLNA file server.
- What does the interface look like? Whatever LG provides?
Whatever LG provides.
My main goal would be to easily play videos (vobs, xvid, etc) from my PC to my TV in a different room. If i'm understanding all this correctly, i could get a device like the LG BD390 (for example, because with the Blu-ray and Netflix built in, i'd probably get that), configure MC15 to use it via DLNA and voila--even to my old-school CRT TV? Am i connecting the dots correctly?
In theory yes. But understand if the LG does DLNA in a quirky way there is going to be some miscommunication with MC like file unplayable on the LG. In which case you would need to cooperate by providing the requisite wireshark trace files to JRiver and hopefully a solution will be found. Ideally you'd want to test this out before you buy the BD390. Take a laptop with MC with you to the showroom and play around. I expect DLNA compliance will stabilise after some time when it becomes the norm.
You could play back to your CRT TV but you'd lose the benefit of HD in that case.
If you want to use MC as your interface then you'd need to setup a HTPC with MC running on it, it's interface would see much more improvements and adapt better over time than one provided by any CE vendor. Their obligation to you is only a few firmware iterations ie bug fixes before they EOL and move onto the next hardware product. Their business is hardware and churning out as many desirable units as possible and therefore there is only so much work they can do on each product's software.
In short they could never compete with a pure software company when it comes to interface.
DLNA is good if you have a few media files and want it all to play easily. The sort of thing that looks great in an ad blurb but becomes impractical over time as your media grows and the need to organise increases.
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There was a report of the 390 working. You'll find a link in this thread:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55380.0
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Very good, the thread is here (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55435.0)
There are two members on the board that have this unit & bennyd says video (Xvid, Divx, VOB) works cept subtitles :)
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The LG is the renderer ie player , MC is just the server. Just like if you had hooked up any generic DLNA file server.
I see, so i could get a Buffalo Linkstation and the LG could play directly off of it...
So the advantage of using MC is really the interface, no? Not dissing that, but it just isn't what i'm looking for. For audio, there's no comparison--i NEED to have MC, but i've got that covered adequately. I'm looking for an easy way to pipe video, and that might be just the ticket.
That is:
DLNA is good if you have a few media files and want it all to play easily. The sort of thing that looks great in an ad blurb but becomes impractical over time as your media grows and the need to organise increases.
right--that's really what i'm looking to solve. Not really looking for the functionality and organizational features (yet, of course).
Plus, the HTPC market just never took off, did it? I mean the most inexpensive, off-the-shelf thing i've seen talked about in this forum is the Mac Mini. Otherwise it's DIY, which i have the inclination towards, but not the time, unfortunately--nor the WAF. ;)
thanks for the response...
-steve
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Very good, the thread is here (http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=55435.0)
There are two members on the board that have this unit & bennyd says video (Xvid, Divx, VOB) works cept subtitles :)
Right--i'd seen that and bennyd's other queries on the status of that situation...as a fellow subtitle needer i was just bumping this question again. ;)
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I see, so i could get a Buffalo Linkstation and the LG could play directly off of it...
In theory yes, but you'd need to verify the LG with the Buffalo ppl. Everybody says they're compliant but there's little exceptions here & there till it gets standardised implementation wise.
So the advantage of using MC is really the interface, no? Not dissing that, but it just isn't what i'm looking for. For audio, there's no comparison--i NEED to have MC, but i've got that covered adequately. I'm looking for an easy way to pipe video, and that might be just the ticket.
For a few tens of files with a few tens of folders, yes. Any more and it will get unwieldy with the LG interface.
MC could help here with getting the right files & folders with smartlists.
With the linkstation you'd need to do it manually in win explorer assuming you want to present a subset of your collection to the LG. Otherwise you need an organised folder structure as the LG would display literally how things were stored on the linkstation. Then again with the linkstation alone you don't need to run a PC just to use the LG, so there's a trade both ways.
DLNA means you have just a wire coming into the LG and one less box in the living room. It depends on having a restricted list of media types, if you can stay within those bounds then DLNA will work otherwise you will be left with conversions, this is another feature MC could do over the linkstation.
This is the picture today, I've no clue what JRiver will cook up 6 months or a year from now to add to that list ;)
Plus, the HTPC market just never took off, did it? I mean the most inexpensive, off-the-shelf thing i've seen talked about in this forum is the Mac Mini. Otherwise it's DIY, which i have the inclination towards, but not the time, unfortunately--nor the WAF. ;)
HTPC > WDTV, xbmc, pop corn hour etc > DLNA
Do you want to stream any web media off the net as well ? How demanding are you :)
This list grows with time, you could keep buying black boxes as you go or just upgrade the HTPC's software.
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Do you want to stream any web media off the net as well ? How demanding are you :)
This list grows with time, you could keep buying black boxes as you go or just upgrade the HTPC's software.
Yeah--i would *like* to stream directly from the web, sure.
I mean, you're right--an HTPC is the way to go, it just requires more of an investment in time and (arguably) money. I already spend what i can afford on both fronts on my main PC that runs MC. I love it--i just wish there was an easier way to pipe it's video (in addition to non-MC streaming) to my living room. That's the thing--it's all about the display: if there were such a thing as a full-on "wireless" (meaning networked) display, i'd be done. DLNA *sounds* like the closest thing to that i've heard, but there are always caveats.
If there's a black box that does some of that with under some parameters it's worth investigating--esp if it has Netflix streaming native, since that's a lot of the streaming i would do, and Blu-ray to boot. And for under $200? Then i could still afford to upgrade the TV as well.
Fact is, i probably won't do anything. ;) Like you said, every six months or so i get an email from JRiver and i have to check out what they're up to and what's going on in the market, and then i decide not to do anything anyway.
Anyway, thanks for the dialog :)