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[jmone]

JRVR, or JRiver Video Renderer, is our new in-house video renderer, designed from the ground up to be cross-platform and offer high-quality video playback on all devices.

Philosophy: JRVR is designed with a few key ideas in mind

1) Cross-Platform
    A cross-platform renderer allows us to offer a consistent video experience on all supported platforms, on Windows, Linux and Mac
2) High-Quality Video
    High-Quality processing and presentation of the videos is the primary goal of JRVR. Including full support for HDR and other modern video technologies.
3) Ease of Use ("It just works!")
    The experience should be good out of the box, and only get better with a bit of configuration, and not require hours of research to tune hundreds of options
4) Efficiency/Scalability
    Low-end machines can still play video just fine. And we want to enable them to do so in high-quality. At the same time, faster machines can use more advanced features to get even more out of the videos.

JRVR may not be a full replacement for madVR for the hard core enthusiast, but it should work very well for the typical video user. And this is our goal. A solution that offers high-quality video for everyone, at no to very little setup effort.

How to Use JRVR?
- On Windows, you can opt-into using JRVR in Options -> Video -> Video Mode: Red October JRVR
- JRVR is the default renderer on Linux and Mac, you can confirm it is enabled in Options -> Video -> Video Renderer

How to Configure JRVR Options?  The Wiki has an explanation of the various options and how to configure JRVR.  The default setup should work well for most equipment across most media producing a great image.
https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/JRVR_-_JRiver_Video_Renderer
https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/JRVR_-_JRiver_Video_Renderer/Configuration

You may want to explore some of the JRVR options pending on what GPU you have, what media you commonly play, and what type of display you have.  Without exploring all the options outlined in the Wiki, a general approach would be:
- iGPU (Integrated GPU):  JRVR is very efficient and runs well on even modest iGPU (such as the very common Intel UHD graphics) with "HDR10 Passthrough" mode checked for all common media types, resolutions, and framerates.   
- Dedicated GPU:  JRVR also allows those with dedicated GPU to not only optionally "HDR Tonemap" HDR content to SDR displays, but also apply a range of high quality scaling and processing algorithms to take advantage of the extra performance that a dedicated GPU offers.
- Bright HDR Displays/TV:  You may prefer to enable "HDR Passthrough" on such displays letting the display do the Tonemapping over your GPU (hence freeing resources on the GPU)
- Projectors:  Given the comparative low light output, you may prefer to uncheck "HDR10 Passthough" and adjust the "Target Peak Nits" to suit your equipment
- SDR Displays/TV:  Given the lack of HDR support and in most cases lower maximum brightness, you will likely prefer to uncheck "HDR10 Passthrough" and adjust "Target Peak Nits" to suit your equipment

What's new in MC29?  JRVR is under active development, and with the introduction of MC29 the following features and improvements have been added.

Major new features:
- Playing Dolby Vision (DV) content with JRVR can now be transformed to HDR10 (note: this iS for Files with DV, and does not support BD folders that have DV layer)
- Playing HLG HDR content with JRVR can now be transformed to HDR10
- DVD playback with JRVR will now use hardware deinterlacing
- JRVR will signal the selected gamut/primaries to the graphics card, if possible (mostly relevant for BT.2020)

Other Improvements:
- Enabled Ctrl-J JRVR functionality in TV engine and non-DirectShow JR Video Player (on Windows, Mac, and Linux)
- Re-designed JRVR HDR tone mapping and related options.
- Added a JRVR performance option to avoid extraneous frame copies for systems with low memory bandwidth (on by default)
- JRVR now caches shaders between runs, for faster subsequent startups
- Improved YouTube Trailer playback to play more fluidly
- Disabled JRVR Peak Detection by default due to its performance cost and potential for brightness shifts, and moved the option into the Advanced section
- Added an option to JRVR for toggling reporting the selected primaries/gamut to the display

[jmone]

MC29 JRVR development is going at a cracking pace! 
- we now have support for other HDR types (Dolby Vision, and HLG)
- performance boost in general but much more noticeable for iGPU (BryanC has reported even low cost and low powered 10w N5105 with Intel UHD Graphics are working well such as these mini PC's this or this NUC)

[JimH]

Beauty, ol cobber!  Hope your chooks are all clucky!

[jmone]

Clucky Chooks get shown the axe in the hope they snap out of it! 

[lello]

(note: this if for Files with DV, and does not support BD folders that have DV layer)

This is not good news for me: if I want to get DV tonemapping will I then have to convert my BDUHD to mkv? Did I get it right?

[jmone]

This is not good news for me: if I want to get DV tonemapping will I then have to convert my BDUHD to mkv? Did I get it right?

From Hendrik

Blu-ray DV is not supported, because it's extra special. My primary goal was playing DV Profile 5, because without support it's rendered in false colors, making it unwatchable. Profile 8.1/8.4 should work just fine, but all they do is slightly mess with the image a bit, which may or may not result in visible changes. Profile 7 (Blu-ray) is not supported, because it's Dual Layer and would require combining the two layers first, but maybe in the future (but then again, it also only slightly messes with the image, after learning how it all works, most of DV really is just marketing)

From my FOV:  JRVR can tone map DV (files only) but can not passthrough (fixed the OP with info from Hendrik below).  BD's with DV also have HDR10 which can be both tone mapped or passed through.  I'm content using HDR10, and I passthrough on my OLED's and ToneMap on the PJ.

[Hendrik]

[Edit by JimH -- DV is Dolby Vision, a proprietary variant of HDR.]

"DV tonemapping" is not a thing in this context. All JRVR can do is apply the DV enhancement information to improve the image - which results in a (refined) HDR10 output image. If you want SDR from that, it would run through the normal tonemapping.
"no passthrough" in this context means not passing through the DV information to the screen, as it is not fully known how to do that, instead its being processed in JRVR to produce a HDR10 image - which you can pass to the TV.

There are several DV profiles that are relevant here:
- Profile 5: Single-Layer, no fallback format - hence not watchable without DV processing. Used by streaming services.
- Profile 7: Dual-Layer, HDR10 fallback. Used on Blu-ray
- Profile 8.1: Single-Layer, HDR10 fallback. Not widely used as far as I know.
- Profile 8.4: Single-Layer, HLG fallback. Recorded by iPhone cameras in HDR mode.

Other profiles are largely deprecated and not used in recent content.
JRVR only supports Single-Layer formats for now.

The special case here is DV Profile 5, because here a special color space is being used that in theory improves the compression, and the DV processing will convert it to a normal HDR10 image. Due to the compression advantage, this is commonly used in streaming services.

When JRVR processes a DV stream, it'll use the DV information to enhance the image as the information dictates. The result of this process is always a HDR10 image (even for Profile 8.4, where HLG is converted to HDR10 by this process).
The resulting HDR10 image can then either be send to the screen as any other HDR10 video would, or it can be tonemapped to SDR, also just as any HDR10 file would. There is no special DV tonemapping.

As a final note, remuxing a Blu-ray to MKV would not change anything, as it remains a dual-layer profile 7 stream, just how it is stored is different.

In my view of things, the only profile with any real credibility here is Profile 5, which can get actual compression advantages due to the use of the special colorspace. Profile 8 is mostly marketing fluff, as the enhancement information alone can't really do significant changes to the image. Profile 7 can in theory improve the bitdepth of the image from 10-bit to 12-bit, however the actual quality gain from that is questionable.

Feature-wise, Profile 5 support is also the most important, because it actually allows playing those files without them being in the wrong colors, and practically unwatchable.

[Hendrik]

I split the settings profiles discussion here:
https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,131994.0.html

[Gedeon]

Firstly. allow me to congratulate you about this new DV processing feature. Really impressive.

I really got excited to see that it seems possible to preprocess DV metadata and to use it to build "DV-like frames" in HDR10 format.

So, if i've been able to understand it well, a mkv file with an HEVC stream which contains RPU DV info can be decoded and applied to the basic frame in order to deliver an HDR10 compatible stream. So no need to have a DV compatible display or device to enjoy the video almost like we had a DV display receiving a DV stream ¿ correct ?

Could you please confirm if the profile 8 and/or profile 7 RPU metadata could be also applied, not only the HDR10 info in such files. and not only profile 5 ?

DV profile 8 and profile 7 are "a popular way" to keep DV info in mkv files, even if those already have the HDR10 info.

Is availabe a MC trial version to test this new DV feature ? I have a Debian mini-pc, J3455 motherboard with a 500 series igpu and other machines to test it.

Thanks in advance.

[ppataki]

These are excellent news, really happy to see them coming!

One question: will the subtitle frame drop issue be fixed as well?

Thank you

[jmone]

One question: will the subtitle frame drop issue be fixed as well?

It is fixed in MC29.  I've posted some screen shots of testing in this thread https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,132075.0.html and this is with Subtitles on.

[ppataki]

Thank you for confirming, this is excellent!!

[Gedeon]

Hi again

Could you please take a look to my post (three above this) ?

Thanks !

[jmone]

So, if i've been able to understand it well, a mkv file with an HEVC stream which contains RPU DV info can be decoded and applied to the basic frame in order to deliver an HDR10 compatible stream. So no need to have a DV compatible display or device to enjoy the video almost like we had a DV display receiving a DV stream ¿ correct ?

Could you please confirm if the profile 8 and/or profile 7 RPU metadata could be also applied, not only the HDR10 info in such files. and not only profile 5 ?

DV profile 8 and profile 7 are "a popular way" to keep DV info in mkv files, even if those already have the HDR10 info.

Is availabe a MC trial version to test this new DV feature ? I have a Debian mini-pc, J3455 motherboard with a 500 series igpu and other machines to test it.

I think most is answered in Hendrik's post on DV.  My reading is that JRVR (currently):
- only supports Single-Layer formats for now : eg 5,8.1,8.4 (so not 7 regardless of if it is muxed from a BD into MKV or not)
- it uses the DV meta data to create an "enhanced" HDR10 frame that can then be sent as "passthrough" or tone mapped pending your settings.  There is no need to have a DV display.
- MC29 is in early beta testing and JimH has stated "target date is April 1" for availability
- I've tested Profile 5 and 8 samples from the DV Dev page, and it looks like JRVR DV Processing is pretty efficient as they played on my old NUC7 with HDR passthrough without dropping frames.  I've no idea how the J3455/500 will go however.  I'll post some screen shots in the preview thread - https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,132075.0.html

[Gedeon]

Thanks for your answer.

I totally understand that FEL enhancement layer is totally out of the scope.  I've just always thought that DV RPU metadata in profile 7 mkv files shares basically the same scheme with other profiles so, although no FEL would be processed at least RPU could be used. More or less in the same way that Nvidia Shield, Zidoo players and other similar boxes.

In any case I'm not any pro or expert. Still very impressed with your job.

[jmone]

I'm just a user testing.  Hendrik is the driving force for development of JRVR, so anything he says is correct, I'm just interpreting and testing!

[armyplace]

> Re-designed JRVR HDR tone mapping and related options

- How's this looking so far, are the changes going to be subtle compared to DTM in MC28?

[jmone]

FYI - I tested the DV P7_MEL and P7_FEL clips from here https://www.makemkv.com/download/dvtest/

Both triggered JRVR's DV processing and played fine.

[jmone]

Re-designed JRVR HDR tone mapping and related options

- How's this looking so far, are the changes going to be subtle compared to DTM in MC28?

Good.  The Tone Mapping looks good with no pulsing ("Allow delayed HDR peek detection" is now OFF by defualt and moved to "Trade Quality for Performance")

[Zemi Atral]

Hello,

it's unclear for me, will we be able to passthrough DV content (embedded in an mkv container) directly to a DV compatible monitor/TV?

Congratulations for your work anyway, it's really good!

[armyplace]

Any chance we get to test new builds before April?

I'd like to have access to test internal releases if possible! 

[Gedeon]

FYI - I tested the DV P7_MEL and P7_FEL clips from here https://www.makemkv.com/download/dvtest/

Both triggered JRVR's DV processing and played fine.

Great news. I'll wait patiently to test it. Just willing to compare vs DV native.

[Hendrik]

Hello,

it's unclear for me, will we be able to passthrough DV content (embedded in an mkv container) directly to a DV compatible monitor/TV?

Congratulations for your work anyway, it's really good!

Pass-through is not supported, JRVR uses the DV data to improve the image itself.

[Zemi Atral]

Thank you.

Maybe you can clear this out for me. Why can't we pass-through Dolby Vision from a computer?
Is this a licensing matter? And if it's the case, why can't we bypass it? Or why can't we just buy the ability to do so?

[Hendrik]

Technical reasons mostly. Maybe we'll figure it out some day.

[Zemi Atral]

I don't want to be insisting here, but I was waiting for a more technical answer.

I don't get why an Apple TV, a Nvidia Shield (if I'm not mistaken) or some other third party hardware could do it but not a computer, specifically if it's technical and not a license problem.
If it's too time consuming or technical, maybe you can redirect me somewhere with answers.

Thank you for your time.

[EnglishTiger]

I don't want to be insisting here, but I was waiting for a more technical answer.

I don't get why an Apple TV, a Nvidia Shield (if I'm not mistaken) or some other third party hardware could do it but not a computer, specifically if it's technical and not a license problem.
If it's too time consuming or technical, maybe you can redirect me somewhere with answers.

Thank you for your time.

Try asking Dolby the same question

[CadErik]

JRVR is very efficient and runs well on even modest iGPU

Out of curiosity, do you guys plan to support bullseye on RPi4? From what I've read in the forums the hardware decoding support is a bit complicated in this new distribution and only VLC supports it.

Thanks