Topic: DVD Ripping -- Is it wrong? (Read 11380 times)

Rob L · « **Reply #50 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:00:03 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on February 19, 2007, 10:46:44 am

Can you point to one that is legal to distribute in the US? Given that JRiver is a US based company, that is where I would expect the MPAA and it's kind to prosecute from.

No, ok, that wasn't really what I meant though. I realise that's the big problem.

I presume this is why some people were suggesting making it a plugin - to try and make it the responsibility of the person installing it rather than JRiver. I don't particularly agree that that's a solution...

MadJewDisaster · « **Reply #51 on:** February 19, 2007, 04:22:41 pm »

think about one thing = you sell MC around the world , there is few translated 'interfaces' of MC .
So , look like you cannot be Region number X only- All DVDs from all around the world must be able to be rip.
I do not rip DVD , to much of a pita , but would like very much a not such a pita program to do so and i'am waiting for a kind of APE for DVD.
I do copy DVD , without any compression using some programs than one said to be 'going underground '... well they are so much underground than you can get it on internert in no time and can hardly find anyone around you not having it ...And TONs of other riping/converting programs are on sale all other the net - One is even using a JRiver codec in his encoding options ...
Seing than more and more people going the 'screen big as a person box ' way , hard to imagine than the way to produce such a files illegal ... but USA is not know as a rational place....

I saw another post about file sharing -So far only good citizens are posting 'NO i do not share ' LOL
Remenbering me few years ago when many users still here posted the same thing about music while sending you they nick on prog file sharing X .
No one , if me , will say yes i share- But i cannot say so,cause i do not, honest , upload speed to little here.

Beside it, a very very great amount of sharing is by now FLAC and APE+CUE and FULL DVD - yes 4+ giga a movie !Or 8 is double layer. So , i really do not think , than compression still a major factor of sharing.

If JRiver must offer a Rip DVD fonction , my answer is yes , on the Multi Media level the player wants to be .
Up to you to know if possible to stop the game as soon as bells starting to ring, or if the only fact to put out a test built can start the process for good up to very naugthy results

Tanoshimi · « **Reply #52 on:** February 20, 2007, 08:17:04 am »

After having about 105 DVD's "lost" during a move (thank the movers with the sticky fingers), I truly believe in backing up DVD's. I currently back up every DVD I have to my PC, and use MC12 to play them all in an "On Demand" scenario. My major complaint was having to go through a ton of trouble trying to rip them, and recently wrote a plugin for MC12 that allowed me to do exactly what they've incorporated. My plugin basically ran DVDDecrypter in batch, then ran ffMPEG to convert, then imported the file into MC, then parsed iMDB for information on the Recently Imported files. If MC can do this without me having to use the plugin, then I say, "Kudos to them for taking a stand for what is right!" Remember, the great thing about America is that you can stand for what is right, even if it's not legal. I'm not advocating breaking laws, or stealing from MPAA, but 105 DVD's x $10-$25 per DVD = a whole lot of reasons for backing up what's rightfully mine.

Scarpad · « **Reply #53 on:** February 20, 2007, 09:15:08 am »

Well I rip alot for backups, but mainly I rip to encode my movies and TV Shows to Xvid files, so I believe in being able to rip what you own. But I would'nt want to see this feature in MC since it is by law circumventing Copy Protection. Let's leave that to the Myraid of programs out there, it does'nt need to be in MC

thenoob1 · « **Reply #54 on:** February 20, 2007, 10:48:09 am »

When will the new build come with/without the ripper?

johnnyboy · « **Reply #55 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:38:28 pm »

Quote from: Tanoshimi on February 20, 2007, 08:17:04 am

After having about 105 DVD's "lost" during a move (thank the movers with the sticky fingers), I truly believe in backing up DVD's. I currently back up every DVD I have to my PC, and use MC12 to play them all in an "On Demand" scenario. My major complaint was having to go through a ton of trouble trying to rip them, and recently wrote a plugin for MC12 that allowed me to do exactly what they've incorporated. My plugin basically ran DVDDecrypter in batch, then ran ffMPEG to convert, then imported the file into MC, then parsed iMDB for information on the Recently Imported files. If MC can do this without me having to use the plugin, then I say, "Kudos to them for taking a stand for what is right!" Remember, the great thing about America is that you can stand for what is right, even if it's not legal. I'm not advocating breaking laws, or stealing from MPAA, but 105 DVD's x $10-$25 per DVD = a whole lot of reasons for backing up what's rightfully mine.

Sharing is caring!!
Care to share this plugin? (just put a link to it and host it somewhere else to keep JRiver out of trouble)

darichman · « **Reply #56 on:** February 20, 2007, 10:04:26 pm »

Of course you should. I won't pretend to be overly familiar with US legislation, but as far as I know we're okay with backups here in Australia - provided we don't share what we've archived.

I would definitely use this function in MC, and could line up about 10 friends who would buy MC instantly if it were added, but I sure as hell don't wanna see JRiver caught up in legal battles. Proceed carefully, not that you need me to tell you that

benn600 · « **Reply #57 on:** February 20, 2007, 11:13:58 pm »

Here is a very interesting question. We all know it is illegal to borrow DVDs, copy them (either to another DVD or your hard drive). Okay, that's fine. However, take the rare occurrence where you are reasonable and only backup DVDs you own. Now say you lose the original copies somehow--moving, weather, whatever. Now, you have a nice pile of DVDs on your hard drive--which you kept offsite so it's safe--but, you don't really have much if any proof that you actually purchased a copy of those titles. This all assumes that someone would question you.

Besides, what would be the procedure for "getting in trouble for doing something like copying friends DVDs while borrowing them?" I don't support illegal activities like that but have always wondered that! Does a RIAA or MPAA official have to walk into your house and examine your computer? Does a police officer have to? How could you even get caught? If you got in trouble for something else and police searched your computer, finding lots of ripped movies/music, what could they do? What if they didn't even check to see if you own a copy on DVD--they just assumed you got the content illegally?

interesting, hmm?

Addition: I really like ripping my DVDs because it just makes watching them SO much easier. I watch a limited number of movies and the process of actually deciding to watch one is usually somewhat random. With my main computer, our living room computer, our family room computer (with 31" monitor), my laptop, or best yet--our theater (projector--130" screen) I can just call up MC with all my DVDs ready to go and I'm watching the movie in a matter of seconds! Compare that to deciding a place to store our DVDs as central as possible and then the likelihood that DVDs would get moved around the house, misplaced, lost, damaged, or not put away when finished. All those things literally destroy the few chances I actually have to watch a movie. I also love the ability to instantly pull up a portion of any movie...if a song comes to mind in a movie, I've got it in seconds! The only delay, other than human slowness, is the time it takes for the hard drive heads to locate the precious DVD VOBs.

MadJewDisaster · « **Reply #58 on:** February 21, 2007, 10:30:04 am »

~~~~~~~~~~~We all know it is illegal to borrow DVDs~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This is true ? I mean it is somewhere printed black on white ?

REALLY, it is illegal to lend a DVD to your next door neighbour ?

What's about children from divorced couple ? Are they allowed to go to mum with a DVD dad brought them?

Sorry , but i wonder about a country where you can lend guns but no DVD..............

thenoob1 · « **Reply #59 on:** February 21, 2007, 10:38:01 am »

That´s equal. Nobody will punish you because you have a dvd of your friend....and how do they proof that it doesn´t belong to you.?

KingSparta · « **Reply #60 on:** February 21, 2007, 11:56:02 am »

Quote

We all know it is illegal to borrow DVDs

Where Or what law is that written into?

I can't find it.

InflatableMouse · « **Reply #61 on:** February 21, 2007, 12:10:57 pm »

Mediacenter allows ripping of audio cd's AND encoding them with many different codecs.

IF you are going to allow ripping of DVD's, do it right and make sure video can be transcoded as well.

Media center already allows playing of video files, but they can't be transcoded unlike music files. This would be a very welcome feature.

I don't know exactly what can get a company in trouble, but I am sure JR will do its homework before doing anything. There are many, many commercial programs that backup dvd's and decode/encode video files. I don't see the problem if things are done the right way.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #62 on:** February 21, 2007, 12:50:04 pm »

Quote from: InflatableMouse on February 21, 2007, 12:10:57 pm

There are many, many commercial programs that backup dvd's and decode/encode video files. I don't see the problem if things are done the right way.

People keep saying this, but these programs are NOT legal for sale/distribution in many countries. It is definitely not legal to sell/distribute them in the U.S. and that is where JRiver is based. The places that sell these programs are located in jurisdictions where it would be difficult or impossible to prosecute them under the laws of the countries that they are violating.

GHammer · « **Reply #63 on:** February 21, 2007, 11:37:15 pm »

Perhaps treat it like some linux flavors treat MP3 format.
Leave the ability to use deecss (or whatever) if it is dropped into the system.
Otherwise rip without the ability to decode protected DVDs.

Which is a not a real useful ability as most the DVDs I see are protected.

brainsoup · « **Reply #64 on:** February 22, 2007, 03:27:10 am »

After reading I am in two minds.

Here in the UK it is illegal to rip CD's to your PC although the industry have said they will turn a blind eye. I wonder if they would turn a blind eye towards ripping DVD's to your PC. I would love to be able to take my DVD's, rip them and convert them to iPod (or whatever) format using MC. This would make MC way ahead of the pack.

However this could come at a huge cost that might mean no more MC...

I suppose there always has to be one pioneer that tries to implement a feature first, as with ripping audio CD's. MC would gain huge amounts of exposure - that's for sure. If handled correctly this could be MC's future, handled wrongly it could be the demise of MC.

benn600 · « **Reply #65 on:** February 22, 2007, 08:51:12 am »

Good thing CD ripping is commonplace and the original creators of CDs didn't build in copy protection! Some companies add some forms of copy protection but at that point, they can't use the CD logo. Imagine if we couldn't rip music?! I probably wouldn't buy many CDs at all. I want it immediately accessible in MC. With busy lives, we don't want to spend all day searching for a CD--even if they're in alphabetical order.

Jakester · « **Reply #66 on:** March 30, 2007, 12:38:01 pm »

It's a good time to add this as part of the standard MC load: http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=BQLQEH1XIVWJYQSNDLSCKHA?articleID=198701186

tunetyme · « **Reply #67 on:** March 30, 2007, 03:26:27 pm »

I think this is a very complex question. I would not recommend for anyone to get involved in all the legal wrestling that is going on. The only winners in any legal battle are the lawyers. Unless you have $10 million that you can afford to toss away with the hopes of making billions.

To tackle this problem we need to look at it from a public policy viewpoint. We want to protect the artist and entertainment companies rights but at the same time we should have fair use of the product. This includes ripping, storing, and playing from your PC any media product. The key is that the user must not profit from it. So from a personal rights viewpoint, I believe that once you have purchased a product that you have the right to use it any way you want to.

As for CD's the biggest thing that record companies can do is stop selling CDs with one or two good songs and have the rest as filler. The second is to stop this crazy price escalations. That drives people into looking at alternative methods of acquiring music, movies or any digital media. If the price is reasonable then no one needs to circumvent the law. As it stands now they see that sales are down so they raise the price then people stop buying so they raise the price and on and on. I rarely pay more than $7 for a CD.

An alternative view, would be that if we purchase a DVD and it gets damage then we should be able to exchange it for a like replacement at a nominal cost of .50 to $1.00. Once you have paid for the license you own the license. It is not fair that you pay for the same license 2 or 3 times.

The other choice is for the industry to develop an indestructible media to distribute their products on. I've paid for the same music on 8 track (I'm dating myself), vinyl, cassette, CD, and no, I am not going to buy SACD since all I hear is the original tape noise and no significant improvement.

Tunetyme

gregoryx · « **Reply #68 on:** March 31, 2007, 05:37:09 pm »

I've read the thread at least two different times now - as it grows.

I see two directions that are promising with low(er) risk:

1- a non-JRiver-published plugin that batches DVDDecrypter or whatever external program.

2- a method that will NOT rip any protected DVD.

I think method 2 is used in other legal programs, such as Roxio and their competitors.
Since no law-abiding user would use a program like decss or AnyDVD or such things, this seems to be the way that ripping non-DCMA-addressed DVDs.

CaballoVerde · « **Reply #69 on:** November 01, 2007, 10:40:57 pm »

Well, I checked "of course" of course. No one should have the right to tell me whether I can watch a DVD on my TV or instead on my computer-- that's too much governmental intrusion. The only way to really preserve the function of the law protecting works of media (I think) is to sell finite-play media; anything else should be "fair use" due to its fixed form & all that that implies.

benn600 · « **Reply #70 on:** November 01, 2007, 11:47:35 pm »

I guess this thread was brought back to life.

With music, I would absolutely not buy as much music if I couldn't catalog it on the computer (program independent). DVDs are very similar in that regard. It isn't as big of a deal because DVDs tend to be watched less than a song played, in general. But I know I like having our purchased DVDs on the server. I will watch them much more when they are a few clicks away vs. running around the house to locate them. Plus, with not needing the discs they can more easily be stored in a single, central location.

kevind · « **Reply #71 on:** November 03, 2007, 05:44:54 pm »

What a heated topic

Of course the whole issue of personal backup of movies is a joke in real user terms as the only holdout in complete digital integrated entertainment IS the movie industry. I could rant on this for hours about our right to backup our movies...the ones we've spent $30 plus each on... so they are easy to watch, don't get scratched by our kids which of course forces us to buy the same DVD again.....etc etc.

Of course we should have this right. How they (the movie industry) get away with threatening the general plubic like this is absurb. The "law" that "they" have forced upon is is unjust and unfair and should never have been allowed to pass in the first place. It's not going to be long anyway before DVD's as we know them are obsolete anyway.

At any rate...
The answer I think is a plugin for a third party program. There is a fantastic backup program called DVDFab Decrypter which has a "command line option" to run it. http://www.dvdfab.com

Please...encorporate DVD backup somehow.

INTERACT FORUM

Poll

Should you be able to rip a DVD movie or music video that you own?

Author Topic: DVD Ripping -- Is it wrong? (Read 11380 times)