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[rpalmer68]

In my quest for the smoothest video playback I have found that the best I can find so far is;

Audio Filter: AC3Filter (this really doesn't matter)
Video Filter: FFDShow (Tryouts versions - currenly using Rev 3222)
Renderer: Haali

I then turn ON deinterlacing in ffdshow and select the method as "yadif", I then select the "Double Framerate" box.

This seems to give the best result with scrolling text and also with fast moving ball sports (like tennis).

BUT

I now seem to have a problem with LIve TV playback.

When I start TV playback or change channels 90% of the time the video will lag the audio.  It could be 1/2 a seond or it's even been as much as 3 seconds!

I can fix it by just jumping back 10 seconds and then everything is in perfect sync.

I have read Jmones thread as I also use reclock, but setting reclock to resample is not fixing it, in fact I can remove reclock and change the audio filter and I still get the same problem.

The only way I seem to be able to resolve this is to TURN OFF the Double Framerate option, but then the picture suffers.

Any ideas what/why this might be happening?

Running Windows 7 Ultimate (32 bit) on an intel quad core at 2.8Ghz, ATI 4850 GPU with latest 9.12 drivers and sending audio via the SPDIF output on my Maya44 card.
 

Richard

Code: [Select]


Filter Graph Info (Time-shifting player graph):

    Filter 'ReClock Audio Renderer'
        CLSID: {9DC15360-914C-46B8-B9DF-BFE67FD36C6A}
        Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\ReClock\ReClock.dll
        Input Pin 'In'
            Connected to pin 'Out' of filter 'AC3Filter'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx

    Filter 'Haali Video Renderer'
        CLSID: {760A8F35-97E7-479D-AAF5-DA9EFF95D751}
        Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\Haali\MatroskaSplitter\dxr.dll
        Input Pin 'Input'
            Connected to pin 'Out' of filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_YUY2, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
        Input Pin 'Subtitle'

    Filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
        CLSID: {04FE9017-F873-410E-871E-AB91661A4EF7}
        Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\ffdshow\ffdshow.ax
        Input Pin 'In'
            Connected to pin 'Output' of filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Video'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_VIDEO, Format type FORMAT_MPEG2_VIDEO
        Output Pin 'Out'
            Connected to pin 'Input' of filter 'Haali Video Renderer'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_YUY2, Format type FORMAT_VideoInfo2
        Input Pin 'In Text'

    Filter 'AC3Filter'
        CLSID: {A753A1EC-973E-4718-AF8E-A3F554D45C44}
        Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\AC3Filter\ac3filter.ax
        Input Pin 'In'
            Connected to pin 'Output' of filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Audio'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_AUDIO, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
        Output Pin 'Out'
            Connected to pin 'In' of filter 'ReClock Audio Renderer'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_PCM, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx

    Filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Video'
        CLSID: {A4207487-E7D8-406B-9882-B66370DE2492}
        Host:
        Input Pin 'Input'
            Connected to pin 'Video Output' of filter 'MJTSReaderFilter'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_VIDEO, Format type FORMAT_MPEG2_VIDEO
        Output Pin 'Output'
            Connected to pin 'In' of filter 'ffdshow Video Decoder'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_VIDEO, Format type FORMAT_MPEG2_VIDEO

    Filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Audio'
        CLSID: {A4207487-E7D8-406B-9882-B66370DE2492}
        Host:
        Input Pin 'Input'
            Connected to pin 'Audio Output' of filter 'MJTSReaderFilter'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_AUDIO, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
        Output Pin 'Output'
            Connected to pin 'In' of filter 'AC3Filter'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_AUDIO, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx

    Filter 'MJTSReaderFilter'
        CLSID: {8303B00A-D9E3-4BD7-A79A-AD7077F54123}
        Host: C:\Program Files (x86)\J River\Media Center 14\TV\MJTSFileReader.ax
        Output Pin 'Audio Output'
            Connected to pin 'Input' of filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Audio'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Audio  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_AUDIO, Format type FORMAT_WaveFormatEx
        Output Pin 'Video Output'
            Connected to pin 'Input' of filter 'JRiver Media Proxy Video'
            Major type MEDIATYPE_Video  Sub type MEDIASUBTYPE_MPEG2_VIDEO, Format type FORMAT_MPEG2_VIDEO

[raym]

Timeshifting on or off? Does it make a difference? SPDIF passthru?

I'm using the MS decoder, AC3Filter, Reclock and EVR and sync is ok. I'd bet my money it's ffdshow. I've never had much luck using this with live TV. Try the MS one or cyberlink with HD accel on and see if the problem goes away.

I have an HD4550 and am very impressed with the PQ under Win 7 using the above filter combo. On your ATI card (Catalyst), make sure you disable all the deNoise options and other related garbage. That may help you get a better picture.

[rpalmer68]

Timeshifting on or off? Does it make a difference? SPDIF passthru?

I'm using the MS decoder, AC3Filter, Reclock and EVR and sync is ok. I'd bet my money it's ffdshow. I've never had much luck using this with live TV. Try the MS one or cyberlink with HD accel on and see if the problem goes away.

I have an HD4550 and am very impressed with the PQ under Win 7 using the above filter combo. On your ATI card (Catalyst), make sure you disable all the deNoise options and other related garbage. That may help you get a better picture.

Hi Ralf,

Timeshift is ON.

Any other video filter (MS, Cybrlink) is fine with the sync and ffdshow with "double framerate" off is fine too, but having tried the MS and Cyberlink filters the ffdshow gives the best result on my system now.   With the tennis on TV almost 24/7 at the moment  it's a great test source, the ball is much clearer with ffdshow and yadif deinterlacing than the others (even with HW accel on).

Richard

[raym]

Ok so it is ffdshow with this specific de-interlace setting. I wonder if it is simply requiring more system resources which in turn causes the audio lag - especially for HD streams perhaps? I'll download the latest tryout and test for myself. Will let you know what I find...

[rpalmer68]

Ok so it is ffdshow with this specific de-interlace setting. I wonder if it is simply requiring more system resources which in turn causes the audio lag - especially for HD streams perhaps? I'll download the latest tryout and test for myself. Will let you know what I find...

The sync seems to start worse on my slower PC (I was out by 6 seconds on my p4 3Ghz yesterday, but normally it's only 1 second or so) but if I skip back 10 seconds sync then corrects itself, so I don't think it CPU related, and certainly my quad core should be OK.

Be interested to see what you find.

R

[rpalmer68]

I've been doing a lot of testing on this and the sync only gets out at TV startup or when changing channels.  (Although Jmone reported to me that his gets out if he gets a glitch in the signal)

Doing a REW or FF fixes the sync, but I really would rather it didn't happen as it stuffs the WAF big time!

I also note that sync NVER gets out playing a DVR-MS recordings using exactly the same filters with exactly the same settings.  The only difference being the splitter as the live TV one is a JRiver splitter, so I'm wondering if the issue is related to how the splitter works somehow?

Is there something that can be done in/with the splitter to ensure video/audio stays in sync when changing channels or if there is a glitch due to a signal problem?

Thanks
Richard

[jmone]

This could be a good one for Yaobing!  To expand on Richards post - I see the same as Richard where Sync can be off when using TS and:
1) Establishing the tune for the first time and there is a "glitch" trying to get going (for me on one particular channel that has a lower signal quality)
2) Tuning to or from this channel
3) If I get a signal drop - MC recovers from the dropped packets just fine but then the sound is out.

As Richard said - doing a seek fixes the sync.  Is it possible that the JRiver splitter only checks that the Audio / Video is in sync when starting or performing a seek operation and just presumes all is fine otherwise?

Thanks
Nathan

[jmone]

Yaobing - i've got a JTV recording that shows the issue perfectly.  It's in Sync - there is a DTV "glitch" with the signal and it goes out of sync.  If I then seek past this point is comes back in sync.  If you like I can zip this up and upload it to a one of the file sites
Thanks
Nathan

[jmone]

Yaobing - here is the JTV file - http://www.megaupload.com/?d=6L8LZ0TW

[rpalmer68]

Yaobing - here is the JTV file - http://www.megaupload.com/?d=6L8LZ0TW

I see where Nathan does the seek near the beginning, but the sync stays out for me until I actually seek on my system, then sync comes right.

Richard

[jmone]

I see where Nathan does the seek near the beginning, but the sync stays out for me until I actually seek on my system, then sync comes right.

Richard

I actually never do a sync during the recording of this file.  It's just a DVB-T "glitch"....

[rpalmer68]

Just to add to this, I get no sync issue if I use say the cyberlink video filter, but I do see the sync issue using ffdshow with detinterlacing turned ON with yadf & double frame rate selected.

A seek fixes the problem as already discussed.

Also don't see any sync issues if I use FFDShow as above with any other file types (dvr-ms, avi etc) it's ONLY with the .jtv files or live TV that I see this issue.

Richard

[rpalmer68]

This is still an issue with the latest builds of MC14.

Any thoughts?

Thanks
Richard

[rpalmer68]

Ok so it is ffdshow with this specific de-interlace setting. I wonder if it is simply requiring more system resources which in turn causes the audio lag - especially for HD streams perhaps? I'll download the latest tryout and test for myself. Will let you know what I find...

Ralf,

Did you ever get a chance to test this?

Cheers
Richard

[raym]

Sorry mate, forgot all about this.... Just tried it though. It took about 10 channel changes but then the picture started to stutter badly. I jumped back 10 secs and the stuttering stopped and yes, the audio was out significantly. I then skipped 10 secs forward and everything came good again. The next time took sooner to reproduce, this time, after the stutter, jumping back resolved the issue and I saw no audio lag.

Not exactly the problem you described but I can confirm a problem somewhere with this config.

I'm not really across the "double framerate" setting but have you tried disabling ATI's hardware DI settings?

Sorry. Not too sure what else to suggest other than the filter combo I use which looks pretty darn good on my systems :-)
AC3Filter
MS MPEG Decoder
EVR
ReClock

[rpalmer68]

Sorry mate, forgot all about this.... Just tried it though. It took about 10 channel changes but then the picture started to stutter badly. I jumped back 10 secs and the stuttering stopped and yes, the audio was out significantly. I then skipped 10 secs forward and everything came good again. The next time took sooner to reproduce, this time, after the stutter, jumping back resolved the issue and I saw no audio lag.

Not exactly the problem you described but I can confirm a problem somewhere with this config.

I'm not really across the "double framerate" setting but have you tried disabling ATI's hardware DI settings?

Sorry. Not too sure what else to suggest other than the filter combo I use which looks pretty darn good on my systems :-)
AC3Filter
MS MPEG Decoder
EVR
ReClock

Thanks Ralf,

I tried your filter selection and although the picture looks good, when you get scrollig text the text is not at all smooth, or at least it isn't on my system.   Try watching the mid day news on ABC1 and you'll see what I mean (or won't if it's my system only).

Richard

[raym]

...you'll see what I mean....

No, no.. I understand exactly what you mean but I can't say I experience this anymore. I had battled this issue for ages in the past. I got it sorted on XP after a lot of work but somehow on Win7, it just isn't a problem anymore.

[rpalmer68]

No, no.. I understand exactly what you mean but I can't say I experience this anymore. I had battled this issue for ages in the past. I got it sorted on XP after a lot of work but somehow on Win7, it just isn't a problem anymore.

I rememebr the XP issues... Cyberlink and VMR7 back then to sort it

Hmm, wonder why it's still an issue for me on Win7 then.  Although the morning shows have stopped using the scrolling ticker tape so it's not as easy to notice now I guess.  But the midday news just annoys me if I watch it and the ticker isn't smooth!

R