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[Boyotk]

Howdy All,
I am using a DAC Magic 100 and have not found any settings in MC that will allow me to choose 192 kHz in DSP studio. Will choosing ASIO rather than WASPI allow this option?
Output is 24/96. Are there settings I'm missing?
Thanks in advance,
TK

[mwillems]

ASIO or WASAPI shouldn't make a difference in the supported sample rates.  How is your DAC connected to your computer?  My understanding is that SPDIF connections, for example, don't support 192 KHz, so that may be your issue if you're using SPDIF. 

[TedSmith]

ASIO or WASAPI shouldn't make a difference in the supported sample rates.  How is your DAC connected to your computer?  My understanding is that SPDIF connections, for example, don't support 192 KHz, so that may be your issue if you're using SPDIF. 

192k is stretching it a little for S/PDIF but some devices do support it on S/PDIF and/or AES/EBU and others don't (I had a marginal setup where some cables worked at 192k and others didn't.)  You should check your manual.  (192 over TOSLink isn't likely to work, but you might get lucky.)

[Boyotk]

Thanks for the replies,
I'm using an Audioquest USB cable from computer to the DAC using aif. files.

[TedSmith]

I am using a DAC Magic 100 and have not found any settings in MC that will allow me to choose 192 kHz in DSP studio. Will choosing ASIO rather than WASPI allow this option?

I took a quick look at the Cambridge Audio web site and curiously they say "24-bit/96kHz driverless USB Audio 1.0 input
24-bit/192kHz USB Audio 2.0 input with ASIO or kernel streaming modes" so yes I'd try ASIO or kernel streaming to do 24/192.

[Boyotk]

Thanks for the input, I'll give it a try and post results for those who may be interested.
TK

[bfburkejr]

I am probably not the most knowledgeable person when it comes to Listening to media center, but as far as WASAPI and ASIO go there importance comes when you are monitoring music and trying to get low latency times. As far as what you hear, unless your recordings were made in 192 KHZ the difference probably won't be audible. I use professional MOTU PCIe 424 series I/O I didn't bother getting the box that will decode 192khz as the 96Khz boxes are as good sounding. The only difference is a few dB of S/N and it is the difference between like 100dB and 110dB or something like that, definitely Not enough to make a difference.

Most CDs are 44,100Hz 16 bit.  most or many DVD's are 96 Kkz and 24 Bit then there is bit stream. I am sure there are DVD out there with 192 as it is rather a common sampling speed, but I doubt that the sounds on them were actually recorded at that rate or at the same bit rate as there are 32 and high bit recorders and then there is the bit stream deal with 1 bit at 2.8 Ghz and there are 5.6 Ghz recorders, KORG makes one for instance.

But more depends on what happens to the sound wave before the final mastering at those ultra high sampling rates etc. I guess what I am saying is that a very good 48 or 96 KHz 24 Bit DAC will stand toe to toe with just about anything. I would put my MOTU up against anything out there, even without going out and buying the 192Khz box. I know this isn't really an answer, but maybe there isn't a good answer?
Peace,
Brian

[kstuart]

Brian - the thread is referring mostly to 24bit 192khz downloads from sites like HDtracks.

(There is a small, but discernible difference between 96khz and 192khz, if one's equipment has the overall resolution to distinguish the difference.)

[felix2]

Boyotk:

Let's work this out backward, from the preamp to the DAC, to the computer, to the source.

- The analog side of audio - preamp, power amp and speaker - is the final determinator of quality. Most good analog section can deliver CD (16/44.1) quality reasonably well, but not classical or jazz CDs mastered with highest quality. One needs a true high-end analog section to fully take advantage of 16/44.1 mastered with top quality. So this sets the baseline. My message is: don't discount 16/44.1 - it can be darn good. Especially played with an audiophile CD player. You biggest investment and attention MUST be that of the very best loudspeakers you can afford.

- The DACmagic 100 DAC can accept PCM digital inputs up to 24/192 bitrate. From the Toslink input, it should accepts S/PDIF digital signal up to 24/192 - IF the optical cable is reasonably short (no more than 15') and of high quality construction. Longer than that you might get occasional 'clicks'. The trouble with S/PDIF is not length or speed, but jitter. S/PDIF protocol does not allow for for clock synchronization and at high bitrate jitters can be high. Which defeats the purpose of high bitrate audio. From the USB input, DACmagic accepts PCM signal up to 24/96, or up to 24/192. Which one depends on the USB driver used from the computer side. [Because while S/PDIF is a low-level protocol that can work mostly by itself, USB requires high-level software defined protocol to make the USB hardware work.] If you use the standard (Windows supplied) USB driver, it will run the port in a synchronous master-slave mode: where PCM audio up to 24/96 can be transferred. This driver will kick the USB receiver chip in the DACmagic into a mode to match. But if you install a special driver, called Audio Class 2.0 driver (download from Cambridge), it kicks the while USB chain into asynchronous mode, where the DACmagic is no longer clock-slaved to the computer. As such, you can transfer PCM up to 24/192 with an extreme low-jitter performance. This mode deliver higher performance than S/PDIF. Try to use short (<6') and audio grade USB 2.0 cable in async mode. It will make a difference IF you analog section is of high quality.

- On the computer side, you are running MC19. If you want 24/192 performance, you must 1) install USB Audio Class 2.0 driver, 2) use Control Panel>Sound> select the USB Class 2.0 port (and it will only show up when you connect the USB cable to a live DACmagic) as default, 3) under MC Output Mode, select the same port for output, while using WASAPI (a Windows sound subsystem) to control the operating system audio path. If you want ASIO, then we are in a different ballgame. ASIO takes over the entire Window sound system including the USB port driver. It alone is responsible for everything. If you installed a well-designed ASIO 'driver', and selects it from MC, then things will work. How it works is entirely under the control of the ASIO software you picked.

- Under MC DSP Studio>Output Format, there is a table which you can use to upsample PCM an audio file you play on-the-fly. If your source is not high bit such as CD 16/44.1, you can use this table to create 24/96 up to 24/192, and output this to the DACmagic, as long as you set things up right as described above. Note this is on-the-fly upsample. It is NOT original high bit. A better upsampling performance is to take the rip CD files and upsample them using a professional grade audio editor. Such editor upsample with better accuracy, and can apply an anti-alias filter to the upsampled file. Upsampling creates lots of very high frequency artifacts and can make the output sound harsh. The anti-alias filter cuts out such artifacts.

- Finally the source. There is nothing like a real 24/192 source - recorded, mixed, edited and mastered in true high bit. This however is rare and expensive. Only albums of the past few years are done this way not because they can't but because there is no market or equipment to play back. But even today, with HDtracks and others, you can see playing back high bits is not something plug-and-play. You need to do all of the above, and you need a high-performance (expensive) analog section to make it worthwhile.

Hope this help!

[kstuart]

- Finally the source. There is nothing like a real 24/192 source - recorded, mixed, edited and mastered in true high bit. This however is rare and expensive. Only albums of the past few years are done this way not because they can't but because there is no market or equipment to play back. But even today, with HDtracks and others, you can see playing back high bits is not something plug-and-play. You need to do all of the above, and you need a high-performance (expensive) analog section to make it worthwhile.

No, it does not have to be "recorded, mixed, edited and mastered in true high bit" to take advantage of 24/192.  The HDtracks 24/192 releases of 1950s analog master tapes have small, but discernible improvements over other formats.
No, the analog section of your equipment does not have to be expensive.  A good $300 headphone amplifier with a good $300 pair of headphones should suffice, although you can certainly get better performance by spending more.
Lastly, there is no overall benefit to upsampling.   Some particular DACs internally upsample, and so there can be a minor benefit to doing the same upsampling prior to the DAC.   But if the DAC does not upsample internally (such as Schiit DACs), then it is counter-productive.