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[dekodo]

Hi All!,

Well I'll tryu to keep this short.  I never got into the mp3 thing because I don't listen to music while I'm on the computer...and my computer is not located where I usually listen to music...Anyway, am redesigning my home theater and would like the muy a computer specifically to hold my CD collection.  Here are the questions...

I'm looking at a used PIII733 10G, 128Mb, blah blah...will this be enough to not just run the program, but keep everything running smooth even with 300-400 albums.  Basically I dont wnat to be waiting to for this thing to thread its database...i.e...is it a pain in the ass to use as a full time CD player or I better off with a 100 CD changer?

Also, What are my CODEC options...what would be best for quality while still saving enough on file size to make this project possible.  Bundled or 3rd party?  Shareware/How much?

Additional thoughts would be welcome

Thanks,
DK

[Harry_The_Hipster]

DK:

The concept makes sense: If you can accept the risk of drive failure, a computer with MJ as the database manager integrated into a home audio system is far more flexible than any CD jukebox. But I'm not sure if what you're looking at will do what you want. Depending on how demanding your ears are, first question is if the drive is large enough to handle your collection.

You don't say what OS you want to run, but that's going to take up drive space. Ditto MJ. (XP on my unit has a 1.4+GB footprint. MJ is pretty slender - around 50 MB)). So, say you're down to around 8.5GB +/-.

You can find a variety of views on compression formats and target file sizes in this forum. Myself I think that 128 is marginal quality in MP3. However, use that for the moment just to make some calculations.

CD length is going to be all over the place - mine run from 40 min. on Savoy reissues to 70+ - but assume an average of 50 min. And further assume 350 albums at this average length, for a total of 17500 minutes of play time.


At 128kbps, 1 minute of music translates into 0.91MB of file size, so without further refinement, your collection will absorb 17-18GB of space, unless I've misplaced a decimal somewhere. With 8-9 GB free, you're barely half way there. You can't squeeze out any more space without dropping your quality completely off the charts, particularly if you're into higher end audio. (I'll hear from WMA fans on that.)  

At the other extreme, it's harder to estimate file size per minute with a lossless format (APE) because of differences in the bitrate of the source material, but assume something in the 500-600 range; that will occupy about 4MB of drive space per minute of play time, or around 70GB for your 17,500 minutes of music.

Long way around, but with storage so cheap, why not move up in size? Quick look at Pricewatch: 80GB drives for $89. That would allow you to encode your entire collection in true CD quality with room to spare, and if you ever decide to work with a lossy format, you can do so whenever you'd like.

Others will have better ideas on access time, adequacy of PIII, clock speed, etc. Ditto codecs.

If anyone's fitting me for a dunce's cap, I'm a Small.

HTH

[rocketsauce]

Yeah, you would definitely want to add an 80 - 120GB hard drive to that setup.  Keep the 10Gb to install the OS and software and use the big drive only for the music library.

Since this setup would be playing back thru your home theater you wouldn't want to encode your music at too low of a bitrate, whatever lossy format you choose (MP3, MPC, Ogg Vorbis).  Contrary to what you may have read or heard, MP3 at 128kbps is not CD quality, especially coming out of a decent hi-fi system.  You could always use a lossless encoder like Monkey's Audio, but you would have to increase your hard drive space by probably at least a factor of 5.

For more propaganda on the various codecs, check out the forums at Hydrogen Audio:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/

Rob

[KingSparta]

400Lp's X 15 = 6000 songs

that CPU should work, you need a larger hard drive for sure.

depending on the OS you may need more ram

I had 131,000 on a 700mhz it played fine

sort may take a bit of time, auto adjust cols needs to be turned off.

[dekodo]

Thanks all...

I forgot one thing in my description...sorry.  I planned on adding a media drive but forgot to mention it.

I plan on about around 80G to 100G of storage.  Maybe even a redundant RAID in case of drive failure.

So from what I gather the machine will work fine as far as processor (perhaps a little more RAM).

Now on to CODECs:

ROCKETSAUCE: thanks for the link, I'll start digging through all the info.

I'm not a total audiophile, however I do expect a quality listening experience.  I know I will be giving up something in terms of quality, but I can live with it if it is much more convient.  I do use DVD-Audio, and thinks its great.  If I'm going to sit down and be critically listen to a recording I'll use a DVD-A but the MP3 thing will be for parties or background music.

Are the CODECS you all have mentioned free (and included), and are there other, possible better, CODECS available elsewhere (purchase?)

[rocketsauce]

Yes, the MJ/MC encoder plug-ins for Lame MP3, Ogg Vorbis, MPC, etc are all free and either included with the install or available to download.  All three of those mentioned formats have command line encoders available for free, which can also be used with MJ/MCs external encoder option.

There are several different MP3 encoders available, but LAME is the only one that is free and is generally considered to have the best sound quality for bitrates above 128kbps.  Ogg Vorbis is probably equal in quality to MP3 at bitrates above 128kbps, but is much better than MP3 at bitrates under 128kbps.  MPC is generally considered to have the best sound quality for medium to high bitrates (160-200kbps).

Rob

[rodders]

Well gentleman, I am doing just what you are talknig about, and after reading this have made the decision to increase the bit rate for all future rips.  128Kbps is ok in the car, when hurtling down the motorway, but on a decent home set up, I am finding the reproduction lacking, and have resorted to audio plugins in Musicmatch Jukebox to compensate. I have just compared 192kbps, which is a lot more acceptable to 128kbps, which is what everything is ripped at... sigh...and nearly so acceptable. Oh well.

btw, I have a via epia fanless motherboard (built in tv out/S-Video, ethernet, 4 x usb), gorgeous case from these guys www.mini-itx.com, IR receiver from www.electro-home.com, Girder and am looking for the perfect media centre software. This little lot sits under the TV, connected to broadband internet, streaming radio and video, playing and ripping dvds, etc. etc. you get the picture.  

[RemyJ]

Don't forget,  choice of codec, disk space, processor speed, etc.  will all mean nothing if you use a crappy sound card.   Assuming your HT amp has digital inputs, make sure your sound card has digital outputs.  ALso be careful about double DSPing.  If you plan to adjust the sound of the audio from the amp (equalizer, ambience, etc), make sure the mixers and DSPs are all set to flat in the PC (or vice versa).

[rocketsauce]

I have just compared 192kbps, which is a lot more acceptable to 128kbps

What program are you using to encode your MP3s?  If it uses the LAME MP3 encoder you will get higher quality if you encode using a VBR (variable bitrate) setting rather than CBR (constant bitrate, which is what 192kbps is).

Rob

[KingSparta]

I prefer VBR Setting Of High