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Author Topic: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?  (Read 1012 times)

curiousMonkey

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Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« on: September 18, 2023, 11:12:23 pm »

I am using the Anthem AVM 70 preamp which has default modes that can be configured on each input for mono, stereo and multichannel signals. When I play 5.1 SACD and stereo CDs on my Bluray player over HDMI, the AVM 70 picks the appropriate default mode.

I configured JRiver with 7.1 channels in DSP so that surround sound movies and audio will use the maximum channels available. I also checked the box for mixing stereo as 2.1. However when I play stereo music tracks, the preamp still uses the multichannel default mode. If I reconfigure JRiver in stereo mode, the preamp does select the stereo mode.

So I am curious what JRiver does differently with the audio signal over HDMI compared to the Blu-ray player. Is there a better choice I can make in the DSP menu that will handle all audio formats seamlessly?
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HTPC - Windows 11 64-bit Minisforum MS-01

JVC NX7, Panamorph Paladin DCR, Stewart ST130 G4 140" 2.4:1, Anthem AVM 70, Aerial Acoustics 7T/7CC/10T, Rythmik F18 (2),  Sony UBP-X800 Mk2

audunth

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2023, 04:59:28 am »

I suspect it is because the when you choose 7.1 in Output Format, it will output 7.1, and when you play stereo it will still output 7.1 with 2.1 channels of sound and 5 channels silent. MC will decide what goes to the subwoofer channel. If you wanna output stereo from MC when playing stereo files, you can make another zone for stereo output, but it will then be 2.0 and your processor will handle the subwoofer(s).

You can auto switch zones based on number of channels in the file, media type etc.
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Cheers,
Audun

My system:
ASUS  P8Z68 V-PRO/GEN3, 8GB RAM, Core i5-2500K
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Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit
Sony VPL-HW30ES 3D projector
Yamaha RX-V3900 receiver and custom built 2Ch power amp for front/stereo speakers
Klipsch Reference/SVS 7.1 speaker system
Always running the latest available version of MC

audunth

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2023, 05:10:23 am »

Just a question out of curiosity, with such a new and expensive surround processor, why wouldn't you just bitstream everything from MC and take advantage of the Anthem AVM 70's processing power? New formats like Atmos and DTS:X can't even be decoded by MC.
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Cheers,
Audun

My system:
ASUS  P8Z68 V-PRO/GEN3, 8GB RAM, Core i5-2500K
EVGA Nvidia GTX 970 SSC, 4GB RAM
Antec P180 case w/Seasonic X460 fanless PSU, water cooled by Zalman Reserator 1+ w/extra DDC pump
Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit
Sony VPL-HW30ES 3D projector
Yamaha RX-V3900 receiver and custom built 2Ch power amp for front/stereo speakers
Klipsch Reference/SVS 7.1 speaker system
Always running the latest available version of MC

dtc

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2023, 07:40:03 am »

Have you tried Source Number of Channels rather than 7.1 That will switch the number of channels depending on the input.

You cannot play SACD (DSD) over HDMI from Windows. You need to convert to PCM. That is a restriction in the HDMI hardware/drivers.
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eve

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2023, 11:53:17 am »

Just a question out of curiosity, with such a new and expensive surround processor, why wouldn't you just bitstream everything from MC and take advantage of the Anthem AVM 70's processing power? New formats like Atmos and DTS:X can't even be decoded by MC.
Some people need MC's DSP engine or videoclock.

What you're seeing with it staying in 7.1 isn't a problem. JRiver is just using a 7.1 container and populating channels as needed. If you need stereo to stay as 2.0 and not 2.1, just don't use mixing.
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arcspin

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2023, 01:46:59 pm »

I myself who also uses a AVM70 always send a PCM stream from JRiver to AVM70.
Atmos tracks are almost always underperforming in regards of immersive activity from the top/height channels.
When sending a PCM stream to the AVM70, AVM70 upmixes the PCM with a Dolby upmixer and the result is a more immersive top/heights channels.
And, the experience is comparable when I get the same immersive upmix on all my movies regardless if the movie is Atmos or not.
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Hardware: Intel Core i5-8600K 16GB RAM, ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 8GB DUAL OC
Software: Windows 10 Home 64-bit, version 2004, JRiver MC 29, MadVr 0.92.17 (Beta 113), NVIDIA driver 457.09
Projector: JVC DLA-I X5500 (RS420, X570R) -
Screen: DNP Supernova 08-85
Processor: Anthem AVM 70
Power amp: XTZ A2-400 for Front & Center - XTZ A2-300 for Surround & Height channels
Speakers: Arendal 1723 S Monitor for Front & Center, Linn Unik for Front Height, Rear Height, Surround & Surround back. Elipson Planet M for Top Middle.
Sub: Arendal 1723 1S

audunth

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2023, 05:52:22 am »

arcspin, thanks for the input, good to know! I've been thinking about upgrading my old Yamaha (partly because of HDMI issues), but if Atmos isn't better for 7.1 than TrueHD, then no need to shell out thousands of $ for a new one. I'm pretty happy with the sound immersion as it is  :)
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Cheers,
Audun

My system:
ASUS  P8Z68 V-PRO/GEN3, 8GB RAM, Core i5-2500K
EVGA Nvidia GTX 970 SSC, 4GB RAM
Antec P180 case w/Seasonic X460 fanless PSU, water cooled by Zalman Reserator 1+ w/extra DDC pump
Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit
Sony VPL-HW30ES 3D projector
Yamaha RX-V3900 receiver and custom built 2Ch power amp for front/stereo speakers
Klipsch Reference/SVS 7.1 speaker system
Always running the latest available version of MC

arcspin

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2023, 01:46:46 pm »

Correct,
Dolby Atmos is metadata that rides on top of Dolby TrueHD which provides the codes for height channels in a Dolby Atmos-compatible surround sound setup.
If the surround receiver cannot process bitstreamed Atmos the Atmos meta data is simply striped away.

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Hardware: Intel Core i5-8600K 16GB RAM, ASUS GeForce RTX 2080 8GB DUAL OC
Software: Windows 10 Home 64-bit, version 2004, JRiver MC 29, MadVr 0.92.17 (Beta 113), NVIDIA driver 457.09
Projector: JVC DLA-I X5500 (RS420, X570R) -
Screen: DNP Supernova 08-85
Processor: Anthem AVM 70
Power amp: XTZ A2-400 for Front & Center - XTZ A2-300 for Surround & Height channels
Speakers: Arendal 1723 S Monitor for Front & Center, Linn Unik for Front Height, Rear Height, Surround & Surround back. Elipson Planet M for Top Middle.
Sub: Arendal 1723 1S

curiousMonkey

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2023, 11:53:34 pm »

When I have JRiver DSP configured as 7.1, it places stereo, multichannel music and bitstream surround sound formats without any problems. I tried switching to Same as Source and multichannel music does play, but the Anthem still does not change processing modes. However bitstream audio (Dolby Atmos) no longer plays.
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HTPC - Windows 11 64-bit Minisforum MS-01

JVC NX7, Panamorph Paladin DCR, Stewart ST130 G4 140" 2.4:1, Anthem AVM 70, Aerial Acoustics 7T/7CC/10T, Rythmik F18 (2),  Sony UBP-X800 Mk2

dtc

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Re: Is 7.1 channels in the DSP settings always 7.1?
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2023, 07:26:40 am »

There is a feature called Zones. You can create  separate zones that have a unique set of DSP settings associated with each zone. So, you could set up a 2 channel zone and a 7.1 channel zone. Then there is an option called ZoneSwitch that will change to the appropriate zone based on the parameters you set, like number of channels. It is a little more complicated to set up, but it may be what you need.

https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Zones
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