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Author Topic: Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff  (Read 1772 times)

LonWar

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Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« on: July 06, 2004, 02:27:58 pm »
Is there any performance difference if you save the Image and additional Tag info (Bios, Lyrics) in the tag as opposed to storing it outside of the file??

Anyone do any comparissons?
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Matt

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2004, 02:31:14 pm »
You won't see a difference with files that can be quickly tagged like APE.

MP3s could be slower since large changes in the tags size cause the whole file to get rewritten. (since the tag is at the start of the file)
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Matt Ashland, JRiver Media Center

LonWar

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2004, 02:37:32 pm »
So I can save all the info in the file and have no performance loss...

Cool, that good to know,

Thanks,
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hit_ny

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2004, 03:58:37 pm »
Quote
MP3s could be slower since large changes in the tags size cause the whole file to get rewritten. (since the tag is at the start of the file)

I'm curious about this. If a file has ID3v2 tags already, will there *STILL* be a performance hit due to rewriting ?

I'm not certain which of the ID tags(v1/v2) is written at the beginning/end of a mp3.
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Matt

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2004, 04:03:10 pm »
Quote from: hit_ny on July 06, 2004, 03:58:37 pm
Quote
MP3s could be slower since large changes in the tags size cause the whole file to get rewritten. (since the tag is at the start of the file)

I'm curious about this. If a file has ID3v2 tags already, will there *STILL* be a performance hit due to rewriting ?

I'm not certain which of the ID tags(v1/v2) is written at the beginning/end of a mp3.

ID3v1 tags are at the end of the file, but are quite limited. (30 characters for artist, comment, etc.)

ID3v2 tags are at the front of the file.  Small size changes don't cause a file to be rewritten due to padding.  However, large changes like adding or removing a 50 kb JPEG will cause a rewrite.  Unless you're changing 100's of files at a time, it's probably not a big deal.

Hopefully that makes sense.
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Matt Ashland, JRiver Media Center

hit_ny

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2004, 04:37:16 pm »
Thx Matt

Quote
Unless you're changing 100's of files at a time, it's probably not a big deal.

I think this would be likely if one wanted to store extra info in the file itself, to do it for the whole library. It's tempting as in the case of a library corruption, then it only takes a import to set everything right.

Personally i prefer to only store rating in the file, everything else is in the library, images in each album folder. As this less duplication and smaller files. With v11 and relational abilities this will be even better.

Of course now the library is the weak link (incase of a corruption) so backing up the library each time MC is closed (read v11 does this already) sounds like a good idea.

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Jakester

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2004, 10:47:44 pm »
I have begun ripping my 700+ CD collection with MC in .ape format.  Great software!

Most of my albums are found in the online database, but often I make small changes to things like Genre, or touch up a file name or two.  I was expecting all tags to be stored in the file itself, other than the cover art which I have going to a separate directory.  Is this not true?  If it is, and I have a major crash but my 250GB of .ape files and cover art files are backed up, I should be able to recover everything, correct?  If not, what would I be missing?  What is stored in the "library" versus in the files themselves?  ?

Thanks.
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hit_ny

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2004, 01:41:06 am »
Quote
What is stored in the "library" versus in the files themselves?

Can't give you a list but here is how you can find out.

Options->Tree&View

Do you see the list of Library fields now ?

Click on the first field, then Edit and look whether the Store in file tags (when possible) is checked. Repeat for all fields in the list.

For some fields it is checked, so this field is stored in the file as well as the library. This field can also be overrided to save all fields in the files if desired or none.  

Note that the more fields that are saved in the files, the longer it takes to process each file, so the default settings try to set a balance.

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Alex B

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2004, 07:47:30 am »
Jakester,

You can see what tags are currently written inside the file in Action Window (at lower left corner) -> File Properties -> File Type Info. If you right click it you can copy that information to clipboard.

Here is an example:

Monkey's Audio 3.97 (extra high)
Format: 44.1 khz, 16 bit, 2 ch
Length: 6:41
Compression: 33.02% (22.3 MB / 67.6 MB)
Tag: APE Tag 2.00 (684 bytes)
   Track: 6
   Year: 2002
   Genre: Classical
   Peak Level: 0,99997
   Media Jukebox: BPM: 83
   Tool Version: 10.0.149
   Tool Name: Media Center
   Artist: Piotr Anderszewski
   Media Jukebox: Intensity: 1
   Replay Gain (radio): -6,54856
   Media Jukebox: Encoder: MA397eh
   Album: Mozart Piano Consertos 21 & 24
   Media Jukebox: Band: Sinfonia Varsovia
   Media Jukebox: Conductor: Piotr Anderszewski
   Composer: Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart (1756 - 1791)
   Comment: Sinfonia Varsovia orchestra conducted by Anderszewski
   Title: Piano Concerto No. 21 In C Major, K467: III. Allegro Vivace Assai

Besides the media files you should backup your MC Library after changes to it (File -> Library -> Backup Library...). That way you can restore everything including your playlists.
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Jakester

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #9 on: July 09, 2004, 05:22:57 pm »
hit_ny, Alex B -

Many thanks ... been busy this week with Father-in-law in hospital and a sick kid ... will try this over the weekend.

Anyone with issues backing up the library?  Is it a reliable function?  I've found other software to be unreliable with respect to backing up its own data, so I usually go the raw route and simply back up the entire directory(s) containing the "library" type info.  Anyone feel this is a better idea with MC than using its own backup feature?

Thanks.
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Alex B

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2004, 08:14:05 pm »
I use MC Library Backup every time I have made several changes to my library. It is quick and it gives some protection against mistakes too. I keep about 10 last backups on my second hard drive. If I notice later that I accidentally did something seriously wrong I can always go back to the last library before my mistake.

I copy my library backups and all new or changed media files to a Maxtor OneTouch external hard drive whenever I feel that it must be updated (about daily).

I use that external drive also with my laptop. When I restore the latest MC Library backup the whole Media Library is instantly in use with my laptop. (Media Library folders are under the same drive letter on both PCs.)

I also make backups of my whole system including the OS and all installed software, but I don't do that daily.
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Jakester

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Re:Save Tag/Image in file--- Any performance Diff
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2004, 12:33:14 am »
Alex B -

Great tip on using "File Type Info" - it shows the fields that are stored in the file and excludes the library-specific tags.  Excellent!

Also, I just used the library backup feature and it was very fast and resulted in a small file.  I'll be sure to do this regularly.

Backup related question: I just connected an external Lacie 400GB Big Disk via USB2.0 to my PC for backups.  Anyone have a suggestion for basic and simple-to-use backup software for XP SP1?  I simply want to select directories/files on my PC that I want the software to keep current on the backup drive when I tell it to (manually or based on a timer).  Nothing fancy.  Want to keep it simple.
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