Topic: POST IPOD SUPPORT QUESTIONS HERE (Read 45486 times)

moose · « **Reply #50 on:** October 07, 2003, 05:08:12 am »

Hi guys!

I have some questions about to (new) support of the iPod. With an older version of the iPod-plugin the files where transfered to the iPod without renaming. But the new plug-in renames the files to a name consisting of some digits. The first question is WHY? Is this the apple standard? And the second is: Is this the final format, or will there be a further change in the format of the name? Because obviously when you transfere a file which is allready on the iPod but with a different name you have it then twice there.

The second question which worries me is why does the plug-in now rename sometimes (when the album tag is empty?) the artist tag from the correct (and stored in the library as well as in the file tag) artist name to "multiple artist"? This is quite annoying.

And finaly I have a suggestion: when you want to transfere a playlist to the iPod you have to create first of all a playlist in the playlist folder of the iPod. Then you can transfere the files to this new playlist, right? But I think it would be easier when you just drag a playlist from the playlist folder of the jukebox and drop it to the playlist folder of the iPod. When you want to tranfere a number of playlist it would be much more comfortable. Maybe you would suggest to use the auto-sync function but my database is to big for my iPod so I have to do the file transfere manually

Thanx
Moose

indevelopment · « **Reply #51 on:** October 07, 2003, 05:18:21 am »

.268 worked when synching and also when importing playlist databack!

Happy,

Grant

indevelopment · « **Reply #52 on:** October 07, 2003, 05:48:26 am »

Here's one thing I noticed in .268

1) played 1 song to test if I could synch back data to mc - success

2) played 1 song from the ipod from within mc and this is what happened:

2a) neither playcount or play time were updated on pod

2b) restarted mc

2c) Only the song I'd played to test the info synch "1" showed as being played - not the one that I played from the pod "2" from within mc

4) unmounted (ejected) ipod and then reconnected ipod

5) again, only track "1" registered

Just a quirk I noticed, other than that .268 going a-ok

Grant

SteveG · « **Reply #53 on:** October 07, 2003, 05:54:54 am »

Moose,

Don't worry about the names of the files. The tag information (i.e Name) is important but the actual filename is not important to iPod. There is no Apple standard because they have not documented anything relating to iPod. What is important is that if you use MC to manage your iPod, each file in your MC database has a unique ID number. That is the number assigned to your files on iPod. By doing this, you will not have duplicates on iPod unless you have multiple copies of the song in your MC database. The tag information is irrelevant.

The 'Artist' rename is by design to assist users who have compilation CDs. The default behavior is to use the 'Multiple Artist (auto) field for 'Artist' on iPod. You are "quite annoyed" by this, but don't worry because you can easily turn this behavior off. Right click on your iPod drive letter and choose 'Select Artist Field' and then select 'Artist'. After this, the Artist field on iPod will only be filled with what is listed as 'Artist' in MC.

In regards to the Playlist stuff, you have many options available to you.

1) Use the auto-sync. You do not have to transfer all your playlists. Simply select the ones you want to transfer and let MC create the playlists for you. You can always add more later. If you want the playlists to be additive, do not select the "Delete files not in transfer" checkbox. A more elegant solution is to use smartlists to assist in limiting your selections to a size that is appropriate for your iPod.

2) Drag and drop a playlists on the iPod drive letter. When you transfer, the playlist will be automatically created.

3) Use the action window for drag and drop for a simple file transfer.

Steve

Phil Lee · « **Reply #54 on:** October 07, 2003, 06:39:37 am »

Moose

I noticed in your post that you said you didn't want to use synching to put music on your iPod because your music library was larger than your iPod. I think this situation applies to almost all of us so I thought you might find it useful to know how I manage my 9.2Gb iPod to get best use of my 20Gb music collection.

First I have created three playlist groups. These are called:

iPod
Not on iPod
Smartlist templates

The "iPod" group contains all the smartlists I synch to my iPod. The "Not on iPod" group contains the smartlists I don't want on my iPod at the moment. Finally the "Smartlist templates" group contains smartlists that are used by other smartlists.

When I click on the "iPod" playlist group, MC 9.1 shows how many files are in the group and how much space they take up. When the total space gets up to 9.2Gb I know I have to amend the smartlists in the group so that there will be enough room on the iPod for a successful synch. If I want to remove a smartlist from the synch I move it from the "iPod" group to the "Not on iPod" group. When I carry out a synch, I make sure that all the smartlists and playlists in the "iPod" group are ticked and the ones in the other groups aren't ticked. I also make sure that I have the three check boxes on the synch dialog checked. The synch automatically synchs the smartlists with my iPod, giving me a new selection of music on the iPod each time I synch.

Smartlists are extremely useful tools for managing the music on your iPod. Here's a typical example of how I use smartlists.

In my "iPod" group I have a smartlist called "Random Female Albums" which has the following query:

Playlist: Female Vocalists Random Albums Track 1 Modifier: Full Albums

This smartlist contains complete albums based upon the contents of the smartlist "Female Vocalists Random Albums Track 1". This is in the "Smartlist templates" playlist group and has the following syntax:

Playlist: Female Vocalists Not Artist: Stevie Nicks,Sheryl Crow Limit: 22 tracks Track#: =1 Not Playlist: Essential Albums, New Albums

This smartlist selects the first track from 22 random albums by artists in the "Female Vocalists" smartlist. I have excluded Stevie Nicks and Sheryl Crow because they have their own smartlists so their albums will already feature in the synch. I have also excluded albums on my "Essential Albums" and "New Albums" smartlists. The "Essential Albums" smartlist contains a list of albums I always want to have on the iPod. The "New Albums" smartlist contains my new albums. I manage these smartlists manually and always include them in the synch too.

The "Female Vocalists" smartlist has the following syntax:

Artist: A Camp, ABBA, Alanis Morissette....T'Pau

I used the smartlist wizard to select all the female artists in my collection. If I add a new female artist, I edit this smartlist. That automatically has a cascading effect on the other two smartlists that depend on this master smartlist.

I have a similar set of smartlists for male vocalists as well as artist specific smartlists for my favourite artists.

Since Steve implemented last played and play counts, I have started to make use of these in my smartlists too. I have a smartlist called "Random Female Vocalists" that has the following syntax:

Playlist: Female Vocalists Limit: 120 minutes No Duplicates: Name Sort: Random [Last Played]=>=20160

This selects 120 minutes of random tracks by artists in the "Female Vocalists" smartlist. It makes sure that no track name is repeated and that the tracks haven't been heard for the last 2 weeks (14 days x 24 hours x 60 minutes = 20160 minutes).

I'm going to produce a few more smartlists based on the last played time and the play counts now that they are working properly. I may also use ratings although, since I have a Gen 2 iPod, I don't make much use of ratings at the moment.

gpvillamil · « **Reply #55 on:** October 07, 2003, 07:05:01 am »

Re Phil's post regarding the use of Smartlists to manage the iPod:

As he points out, managing libraries larger than the iPod is a common problem for many of us. He gives us an example of a very good approach.

Would it make sense to collect more examples and build some "best practice" examples? A well-defined set of Smartlists is key to making MC the best iPod solution in the world, and yet there seems to be a bit of a steep learning curve...

I do something quite similar to what Phil does, albeit less sophisticated: I also created an "iPod" playlist group, and have a number of smartlists that for recently imported music, favorites, and then random selections within dance, ambient & world genres. These latter use a modifier to keep them within 1.5GB each.

Recently I'm building smartlists using the info from Audio Analysis, eg. intensity <=2 and BPM <=60 for a collection of mellow tunes, and the opposite for some high energy stuff!

I really like the template idea, however, I can see how powerful it might be.

I'm going to go think about this now...

SteveG · « **Reply #56 on:** October 07, 2003, 07:20:33 am »

Phil,

Thanks for taking the time to post such a detailed and useful suggestion.

gpvillamil,

It would be good to try to compile these suggestions in a way that would be useful for all. Perhaps we can do this in the future. For now, postings such as Phil's may be a useful tool for others who are iPodders and check this thread.

Grant,

The correction for this may be worse than the problem. I will look at it in the future.

Steve

moose · « **Reply #57 on:** October 07, 2003, 07:43:42 am »

Wow guys!

Thanks a lot for this broad variety of hits and tips, I will try them as soon as possible

ashawley · « **Reply #58 on:** October 07, 2003, 11:07:25 am »

And moose...I also outline that process w/step by steps and screen shots (albeit somewhat old) in my little help guide. It's under the sync and smartlist section.

Adam

mclaugh · « **Reply #59 on:** October 07, 2003, 11:47:32 am »

I have benefitted in the past from the smartlists posted by other Ipod users, so the least I can do is pass some knowledge down.
-->The ipod smartlist group is key, as mentioned earlier, b/c if you left click and give it a minute, it will "gather files" and tell you the total amount- this allows you to budget your space on the ipod accordingly.
-->There's a smartlist primer that's referenced constantly- it was written by ashawley- it's at the beginning of all the Ipod threads. He answers questions regarding smartlists (and all else) directly, either here or at the MC forum at Ipodlounge.com.
--------------------<smartlists>------------------------------------
(I'm at work, so I don't have the exact smartlists in front of me- just bear with me, and if you have specific questions, I can cut and paste from home one evening)
Most start with genre lists, bounded by time (in minutes) or total size (in megabytes)
-rock, 4 hours
-blues, 1gig (1000 megabytes to MC)
-jazz, 40 tracks
Next, people will get into ratings, using those to include/exclude songs. Playcounts (which the Ipod now syncs w/ MC) can also play a part here
-singles, 1gb (I have singles rated as songs >=4)
-I have one "IpodPrerequisite" list that weeds music for the Ipod- it disallows songs rated=1, songs with genre or comment =xmas, etcetera
All my other ipod playlists reference this IpodPrereq playlist.
-You can make one to play all songs rated greater than 3 that you haven't heard in a month.
SteveG has allowed us to right click on smartlist groups in the Ipod sync screen and choose Select/Deselect all playlists. I'm now in the process of making smartlist groups for all the different things that go on- I've got one for Workday, Weekend, Family Road Trip, and so on.
I know this is a long post- here are the playlists I have on my Ipod today-->
+1 Random Album (this http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=MediaCenter;action=display;num=1052332509;start=18#18link will help with this)
+2003 Best of (this is a playlist)
+AlbumsNow (it's a 1gig smartlist that choose randomly from 100 or so albums I've selected using the Album= in the wizard screen)
+CDChanger (it's like 1 random album, but 6 random albums, to simulate my car's cd changer)
+Classic (albums where comment=classic)
+Essential 2gb (2gigs of albums/songs sort=random that I select from the masterlist of albums)
+Fo5 (I select five albums/EPs each week to listen to)
+Indie 4hrs (4hrs of music sort=random, comment=indie)
+Itrip NYC (Itrip station frequency mp3s for NYC- I eliminated the major NYC stations from the master list)
+Jazz 4hrs (4hrs of jazz sort=random)
+Never Heard (40 tracks that have number plays=0, sorted randomly)
+Racquetball (60 minutes of music sorted randomly with intensity set to 4 or higher)
+Recent Adds, 200 (200 most recently added tracks to MC's library)
+Rock 4hrs (4hrs of genre or comment=rock)
+Singles 1gb (1gb of songs rated 4 or higher, sorted randomly)
+This Week E:rip (E:rip is where I store my ripped cd's, it grabs 100 tracks that were ripped in the last week, time in minutes)
+Workday Mix (9hr smartlist sorted randomly that excludes hiphop & vocals genres)
----------------------------------<>---------------------------------
One final thing- I use the comment field extensively, and have pasted a list of little tags to use down the side of my monitor. When I rip my CDs, i consult the list and enter the applicable comments, which I can then have my smartlists search for stuff by. It's good for a band/song that is really two genres, for splitting up a computer music library between multiple users (such as my wife and i), and for putting music rereleased/remastered into its proper decade. Here are some I use:
earlystuff, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80, 90s, 00s
twang, r&B, roots, rockin, indie, chill
famtrip, jen, onlyjen, jenjoe, party
classic, live, soundtrack
WOW- I wrote a novella. HTH.

parannoya · « **Reply #60 on:** October 07, 2003, 07:23:47 pm »

runnin' .270. very nice....

at first i thought i was nuts, but now I've seen this enough to know somethings wrong.

When i import new Audible files, the first time I try to play a file, it will not play, and the iPod skips forward to the first track that has been already played. Then, I can navigate to that file a second time, and it will play. I've seen this happen at least six times now on newly imported files, and always will play on the second attempt.

everything else is grand so far.

gpvillamil · « **Reply #61 on:** October 08, 2003, 03:07:53 am »

Quote

It would be good to try to compile these suggestions in a way that would be useful for all. Perhaps we can do this in the future. For now, postings such as Phil's may be a useful tool for others who are iPodders and check this thread.

Here's an idea - how about an iPod setup wizard, that runs during setup or whenever the user wants, that sets up an initial set of Smartlists implementing some of the basic functions?

eg:

1) Builds an "On iPod" playlist group
2) Sets up lists for:
- Recently imported
- Never played
- Favorites
(all of these with media type = mp3, limited to 1500 megabytes, etc.)
3) Asks about the "Upload volume adjustment", explains difference between Replay Gain and fixed adjustment, prompts the user and sets the option
4) Asks about the artist field: Album Artist vs. Artist
5) Sets up the synchronization dialog correctly:
- delete files not in sync (explain and ask)
- update tags
- set default view to only show the "On iPod" playlist group
6) Explains about the need to initialize the iPod for MC and does it
7) Creates a set of sample smartlists prefixed "iPod:" with things like automatically created genre samplers, using ratings, playcounts, etc.

I think this would go a long way towards getting new users up the learning curve.

SteveG · « **Reply #62 on:** October 08, 2003, 07:33:30 am »

McLaugh,

Thanks for the novella

.

parannoya,

Your nuts

. Just kidding. You were right, there was a bug in regards to .aa files. It is fixed in what will be tonight's build. I will post it under the Portable Drive Plugin in case you want to test it out before then.

gpvillamil,

Thanks for the suggestion. Perhaps in the future.

Steve

tupacwe · « **Reply #63 on:** October 08, 2003, 03:15:37 pm »

Hey,
I have had my pod and juxebox for like a year now. But I updated and everything. Then I initilized the pod so I could start from scratch. Then I uploaded a batch of albums. This went fine. Then I went back today and was going to upload some more albums but it wont upload. Like I will send them to the pod, and on MC9 it will show that they are in fact on the pod, but when I disconect the pod and check, they do not show up. So I have no idea what to do now. Can anyone help out? Also, I have never been able to get playlists to show up. Do you just right click and send them to the pod?
Thanks much,
Tupacwe

ashawley · « **Reply #64 on:** October 08, 2003, 03:40:08 pm »

Steve:

Think I found a bug or at least something that is confusing to some folk. Here's how to reproduce:

Start w/a clean iPod
Sync a smartlist that has the rule Limit=10 Tracks.
Note smartlist on iPod, specifically first and last track
Sync again without Delete Files checked.
Note smartlist: it still has the first 10 tracks from the first sync, but it now also has 10 additional tracks from the second sync.

It works fine w/Delete files checked (i.e. only 10 tunes on the smartlist)

I don't know if this is possible to fix or not, but w/the Delete File option not checked, the playlist on the iPod should still only have 10 tracks on it.

Make sense?

Adam

rupertn · « **Reply #65 on:** October 08, 2003, 04:41:05 pm »

Hi, this has been a bit of a long running thred in ipodlounge, thought i drop in here too.

The issue is a random amount of files will not transfer each time i sync.

I have tried all the different MC9 builds and get the same problem.

My last action was to clear library, re-import files, restore ipod and sync. From a playlist of 1760 files only 603 transfered. Previuosly all these tracks have been on my Ipod so they are all 'clean' MP3 files.

Any suggestions on what to do?

Thanks

- Here's the system info.

Media Center Registered 9.1.268 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows XP Workstation 5.1 Service Pack 1 (Build 2600)
Intel Pentium 4 2000 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 522 MB, Free - 245 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1226 / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2800.1233 (xpsp2.030604-1804) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping / Drive D: Copy mode:ModeSynch CD Type:Auto Read speed:Max
Digital playback: Yes / Use YADB: Yes / Get cover art: Yes / Calc replay gain: Yes / Copy volume: 32767
Eject after ripping: Yes / Play sound after ripping: No

Burning / Drive D: QSI DVD/CDRW SBW-081 Addr: 1:0:0 Speed:8 MaxSpeed:8 BurnProof:Yes
Test mode: No / Eject after writing: Yes / Direct decoding: Yes / Write CD-Text: No
Use playback settings: No / Normalization: None

markp99 · « **Reply #66 on:** October 08, 2003, 06:22:34 pm »

<<from the iPodLounge>>

Three of us have observed a reproduceable error related to mass tagging directly on the iPod. via a playlist or category.

If I attempt to update more than ONE tag (GENRE) on the iPod directly, I am immediately booted out of MC9. This is 100% reproduceable for me.

I can retag single files on the iPod with no problem.

I can make mass tag changes on the library directly (on the PC) with no problems...

Note: Not a critical bug for me; I have never needed to re-tag many (or any) files directly on the iPod before. Not a common use model.

http://www.ipodlounge.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10622

SteveG · « **Reply #67 on:** October 09, 2003, 02:19:00 pm »

Tupacwe,

Quote

Then I went back today and was going to upload some more albums but it wont upload. Like I will send them to the pod, and on MC9 it will show that they are in fact on the pod, but when I disconect the pod and check, they do not show up.

I am having trouble following this. Do you see the files progress through the upload? It sounds like you do and that MC shows the files as present. Check the path of one of the files and make sure it is physically on the iPod. You could also try to play a file on iPod.

Adam,

This is by design. If you have a smartlist in MC that is created dynamically (i.e Limit rules or Random, etc) each time you go to the smartlist in MC the files in it are recreated. If you sync with iPod and you want to have smartlists retain their structure but change files, you should check 'Delete files' so that MC will automatically erase and readd new files. If you leave 'Delete files' unchecked, MC treats the iPod playlist like a MC Playlist which has new files in it and thus adds the new files.

rupertn,

Do you get any error messages on the files that don't transfer? Can you find a file that does not trasfer and email it to me? (steve @ jriver.com)

markp99,

This bug is verified and fixed in tonight's MC build.

Steve

ashawley · « **Reply #68 on:** October 09, 2003, 05:29:10 pm »

Steve:

Rupert's error code is:

E:\ipod_control\music\f19\21076.mp3 -23C:\Documents and Settings\Owner\Desktop\Music\Death in Vegas\The Contino Sessions\Death in Vegas - Aisha - The Contino Sessions.mp3 -23

Thought I'd take the liberty of posting it for him.....

Regarding the smartlist/limit/delete files thing. OK, I thought that it might be by design. Don't agree with it personally, but who am I?

One thing that is still cropping up on the 'lounge boards is the All Music smartlist. Anytime that is checked forlks aren't getting playlists at all.

I really don't know how it's happening, but it's still there and I haven't been able to reproduce myself.

I'll test more tonight. I've been doing it with a small library. I'll try w/a bigger one and see what happens.

Adam

Phil Lee · « **Reply #69 on:** October 09, 2003, 05:47:01 pm »

Something I've noticed is that it is really important to initialise your iPod when you upgrade to a new version of MC. I synched my iPod using 9.1.269 a couple of days ago then upgraded to 273 and synched the iPod again. The last played times for a whole load of tracks in MC went completely screwy. I had to restore a backup of the MC database, initialise my iPod and reload my music to get things working again properly. Fortunately I can't see any problems with 273 at all so will stick with that for a while.

Anyway the moral of this story is synch your iPod and backup your MC database before upgrading and initialise your iPod after the upgrade before you synch it again.

Kurt Young · « **Reply #70 on:** October 09, 2003, 08:58:18 pm »

Quote from: Phil Lee on October 09, 2003, 05:47:01 pm

<snip!>
Anyway the moral of this story is synch your iPod and backup your MC database before upgrading and initialise your iPod after the upgrade before you synch it again.
<snip!>

Please understand that, although this is what I currently do, I do not believe that "normal" users should have to do this any more than is absolutely necessary. Not just for installing a new build (especially when it's uncommon to not have a new build on any given day). There's some stiff competition looming on the horizon, and it's got a reputation for being super-freakishly-user-friendly.

bvm · « **Reply #71 on:** October 09, 2003, 11:14:32 pm »

I just installed 9.1.269 over 9.0 and after synching my iPod I find that the Composers menu hierarchy is missing an awful lot of items. And MC agrees, in that after a synch, the display of the iPod's contents show the Composer field blank in nearly half of the 1700+ files. Even more striking, when I first hook up the iPod (i.e., *before* a synch), *no* files have a Composer field.

The corresponding files all have Composer fields in MC's Media Library, they're just not making it to the iPod.

Or do I need to do like the previous poster and reinitialize my iPod?

p.s. I wish we didn't have to combine all these diverse posts inside a single thread. Does the iPod developer not read any other? Not even if we put "iPod" in the subject?

ashawley · « **Reply #72 on:** October 09, 2003, 11:50:04 pm »

bvm:

If you're moving from 9.0 to 9.1 you really should Restore the iPod. At a minimum, you can first try "Rebild iPod Database" (should only take 10 minutes or so), then do a sync to get the playlists on there.

There are a number of changes in 9.1. Among them the iPod Toolbar icon is now your quick one-stop shop for syncing.

Steve:
OK, things are pretty stable now...so, your next challenge: What about getting dynamic playlists on? You know, where if I change a rating on the iPod and have a Top 4 or 5 playlist that list will get updated without a sync?

Hm???

Adam

bvm · « **Reply #73 on:** October 10, 2003, 12:28:05 am »

Quote

At a minimum, you can first try "Rebild iPod Database" (should only take 10 minutes or so)

Where's that? My iPod menu has a "Rebuild Database from iPod", but that sounds like the opposite of what I'd want (like building the MC database from what's on iPod).

Quote

Among them the iPod Toolbar icon is now your quick one-stop shop for syncing.

By which you mean it's an accelerator for the "Synchronize" command on the right-click ipod menu? ("One-stop shop" for me usually means I can do *many* things there.)

dallardice · « **Reply #74 on:** October 10, 2003, 06:19:29 am »

I guess I'm behind here, but the link to the old Ipod topics doesn't work with the new boards, so a quick question:

Ratings - I usually rate on MC, not on the Ipod, but I'd like the opportunity to do both. At the moment Syncing seems to take the ratings from the Ipod and overwrite MC ratings. Is this a restore/reinstall job, or is this how it's designed? Can someone point my to a post that sums up how the new sync functionality works?

(I'm on the "production" version of MC 9.1,.269, with plugin 9.0.62)

SteveG · « **Reply #75 on:** October 10, 2003, 10:21:37 am »

Rupert,

For anyone following Rupert's issue, here is the scoop. Error code '23' (thanks Adam) is a Windows error that means 'Data error (cyclic redundancy check)". This is somewhat of a generic error that implies a problem with the memory to which the data is being stored. I have seen it before on occassion and the best solution is to try to reformat the iPod drive. Typically this is not an error related to MC and once it appears, it can be reproduced using any other application (including Windows).

Adam,

In regards to the smartlist/limit/delete, why not leave the delete checked to achieve what you need? I ask because I think it is valid to provide the additive functionality of the playlists with that box unchecked. Because of this, I would prefer to leave it as an option. In regards to the All Music problem, I am still unable to reproduce (and therefore fix)this. I will run some more tests today to see if I can come up with a reason why this happens for some.

Kurt,

Quote

I do not believe that "normal" users should have to do this any more than is absolutely necessary.

Agreed. This should not be the case in the current version. There was some weirdness in the 9.1.26x series, but this should now be resolved. The reinitializes were at times a necessary evil to add functionality. I am freezing new functionality for the time being so this should cease.

bvm,

Yes, the iPod developer (me) reads other threads. It is the preference of the owner of JRiver that iPod issues are consolidated in one thread so that users can gather information from others and save time on redundacy of information. 'Rebuild Database from iPod' is in the right-click menu on the iPod drive letter. This feature will recreate the iPod database from the files on the iPod and in the process should fix any problems in the iPod database.

Quote

("One-stop shop" for me usually means I can do *many* things there.)

You can elect to synchronize data from iPod to MC as well as decide what to sync from MC to iPod and how to sync(i.e delete files not in the sync and update tags).

dallardice,

I would suggest getting the latest build of MC. In the Synchronization dialogue if you check 'Sync Portable info to PC' you will when you synchronize, Rating, Playcount, and Date last played info from iPod will overwrite the data in MC before then synching MC data to iPod. Without this box checked, MC data remains unaffected by iPod.

Steve

Kurt Young · « **Reply #76 on:** October 10, 2003, 12:08:08 pm »

Thankee, Steve.

mclaugh · « **Reply #77 on:** October 10, 2003, 01:02:47 pm »

I've been holding off on upgrading my beta of MC since I saw posts about the Ipod icon being removed in favor or a Rio or something.
Since then, has some "Ipod Icon Order" been restored in the program? It may sound sad, but I don't want to upgrade if it means I'm going to lose that cool little icon- and considering the Ipod is easily the #1 selling mp3 player out there, I can't think of any other reason to remove that icon.

bvm · « **Reply #78 on:** October 10, 2003, 05:12:54 pm »

'Rebuild Database from iPod' did indeed repopulate my Composers menu. Briefly. But then the next time I synchronized, half my Composers menu vanished again.

So I did 'Initialize iPod' and synched again. Looks like it's okay now. I'll let you know if it flakes out again.

ashawley · « **Reply #79 on:** October 10, 2003, 07:49:54 pm »

Steve:

While I understand (somewhat) your reasoning behing the additive nature of smartlists w/o delete files checked, I'm just posting it because others are confused about it.

Me, I always leave it checked as I want my playlists/smartlists to drive what's on the iPod.

But what is confusing to people is that if they have a smartlist with a limit in it and they sync once and then sync again, the next version in their mind should only have the new values in it (so the count of songs on the iPod playlist sould be whatever they set the limit to in the smartlist).

It just makes it appear to be a bug. I know why you're doing it this way..just trying to make it simpler for folks, and I personally can't think of a reason why anyone would want to make the playlists themselves additive.

But that's just me....

we'll handle it by instructing people as they run into it.

Adam

Kurt Young · « **Reply #80 on:** October 11, 2003, 12:05:33 am »

I tend to agree, naturally, (me and Adam are really one person. You, too, will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.) that additive playlists/smartlists are rather weird. Y'all know that I would just as soon have the "delete files not in sync" option enabled by default and removed as an option. It seems to go against the logic of synchronization in a way -- I would use the manual upload if I wanted to achieve this effect, ya know? When I sync, I want the data on each end to mirror one another.

Besides, with this option unchecked, it would be very easy to stuff your iPod to capacity and not even realize it.

ashawley · « **Reply #81 on:** October 11, 2003, 11:51:01 am »

And to add on to what Kurt (I mean me, er wait that is me) just said, I also think Update Tags should be removed.

When in the world would you not want this checked. Can someone give me a use case where your wouldn't want it checked?

I guess what Kurt and I are saying is this: make it more user friendly.

Adam

bvm · « **Reply #82 on:** October 12, 2003, 12:18:48 am »

Yesterday I said

Quote

'Rebuild Database from iPod' did indeed repopulate my Composers menu. Briefly. But then the next time I synchronized, half my Composers menu vanished again.

So I did 'Initialize iPod' and synched again. Looks like it's okay now. I'll let you know if it flakes out again.

Sure enough, it flaked again, and this time I didn't have the excuse of running a new version (still on 9.1.269). After synching, I lost some Composers menu entries (some would have been newly synched, some old), though it seemed like it was a much smaller fraction missing this time. I did another synch, and my Composers menu was completely wiped!

Furthermore, next time I put my iPod in the cradle (or maybe it was the time before the menu got wiped -- the details blur a bit at this point), when I clicked on the drive letter for my iPod, MC responded with a tiny error popup with the title "h." and no actual error text in the window. Very informative ?

So I again did a "Rebuild Database from iPod", and got my composers back.

I'm not really relishing having to do this Rebuild step after every (or at least many) synchs.

Kurt Young · « **Reply #83 on:** October 12, 2003, 01:40:24 pm »

Quote from: ashawley on October 11, 2003, 11:51:01 am

And to add on to what Kurt (I mean me, er wait that is me) just said, I also think Update Tags should be removed.

When in the world would you not want this checked. Can someone give me a use case where your wouldn't want it checked?

I guess what Kurt and I are saying is this: make it more user friendly.

Adam

The views of this member do not always reflect the views of Kurt Young, or of Razool Inc. or any of its subsidiaries. They do this time, though,

Zeke · « **Reply #84 on:** October 12, 2003, 01:43:51 pm »

I have a question about synchronizing playlists. When I sychronize the playlists the song order is never the same as the original. I have tried multiple different ways, including reinitializing the Ipod and starting from the begining without any luck. I have never had a problem actually copy the songs over and playing them on my Ipod. It is only a problem with the order within the each playlist.

I am using MC 9.1.274.

Thanks.

IDSmoker · « **Reply #85 on:** October 13, 2003, 12:56:11 pm »

Haven't been on these forums in a while and I was suprised and impressed to read that the playcounts/rating functionality is now working.

Should I assume (without having to go back and read all the old iPod threads) that this is only true for the "new" iPods? Or is the "playcounts" file actually being updated on the 2nd gen iPods these days?

I can certainly understand if this functionality doesn't work on the 'older' pods, since Apple never got around to making the firmware upgrade some of us expected from the time we bought our Apple products.

Just thought I would ask....

Kurt Young · « **Reply #86 on:** October 13, 2003, 01:05:23 pm »

Quote from: IDSmoker on October 13, 2003, 12:56:11 pm

Haven't been on these forums in a while and I was suprised and impressed to read that the playcounts/rating functionality is now working.

Should I assume (without having to go back and read all the old iPod threads) that this is only true for the "new" iPods? Or is the "playcounts" file actually being updated on the 2nd gen iPods these days?

I can certainly understand if this functionality doesn't work on the 'older' pods, since Apple never got around to making the firmware upgrade some of us expected from the time we bought our Apple products.

Just thought I would ask....

I believe that playcounts and last-played data will work on a Gen1 or Gen2 iPod, so long as it has firmware 1.3 installed on it. Ratings won't, naturally.

IDSmoker · « **Reply #87 on:** October 13, 2003, 02:24:14 pm »

Quote from: Kurt Young on October 13, 2003, 01:05:23 pm

I believe that playcounts and last-played data will work on a Gen1 or Gen2 iPod, so long as it has firmware 1.3 installed on it. Ratings won't, naturally.

Cool!

I've read that you can transfer the updated values from the iPod to MC, during a "sync". Is it possible to differentiate what is transferred?

Since I can only change ratings within MC, I would like to just transfer the playcounts and last played information, without over-writing any changed ratings.

Is this possible with the current version of MC? If not, I'd like to request this as a change/feature.

TimB · « **Reply #88 on:** October 13, 2003, 03:08:08 pm »

Just did the "Sync data to MC" option on the Synchronize screen and got a bunch o' weird minus numbers like "-20390271.4 minutes ago" in the "Last Played" dates in MJ and on iPod. I'm reverting to last night's backup library. Any ideas?

Thanks!

-=Tim=-

SteveG · « **Reply #89 on:** October 13, 2003, 03:34:11 pm »

mclaugh,

Quote

I can't think of any other reason to remove that icon.

I know it seems ridiculous, but there really is a reason. It has to be this way for now.

bvm,

I found a bug related to 'Composer'. The data in the iTunesDB was storing correctly but not being displayed correctly. Anyway, it is fixed in the next MC build. If you want it sooner, download the Portable Drives plugin from the website.

Zeke,

I am guessing you are referring to Smartlists and not Playlists. Playlists should always preserve the order. If order is important, either use Playlists or you can add a 'Sort' rule to your smartlist which will be respected when you transfer the smartlist.

IDSmoker,

Quote

Since I can only change ratings within MC, I would like to just transfer the playcounts and last played information, without over-writing any changed ratings.

You can change ratings from within MC on iPod, or on the iPod itself. If you do not want iPod info to go to MC, uncheck the 'Sync data to PC' checkbox in the Sync dialogue. Are you saying you want to have songs rated one way on iPod and another way in MC?

KAudratm

,

Some people organize their music with Playlists and not Smartlists. For those people, there was a time when some people told me they wanted the ability to create a new playlist and an easy way to add it without parsing through all the files. For those people, they can check only the one new playlist and sync and they will add just the new playlist. I know that seems crazy to you, but I am not making that up. In regards to the Update Tag checkbox, again, there was a time where a user wanted to tag his files differently on the iPod so that checkbox was included to allow the possibilty to not overwrite files on the iPod (and their modified tags) when synching.

I agree it would be easier and simpler to remove these options, or bury them, but my hunch is that if I do, I will hear about it. Lets try to get more feedback. Does anyone out there deselect the 'Delete files on sync' checkbox or the 'Update Tags' checkbox? If so, please comment or I will soon give in to the combined wills of Kurt and Adam. Resistence is futile........

Tim,

Please verify that the time and date on your iPod are correct.

Steve

TimB · « **Reply #90 on:** October 13, 2003, 03:43:37 pm »

Quote from: SteveG on October 13, 2003, 03:34:11 pm

Tim,

Please verify that the time and date on your iPod are correct.

Steve

Doh!

Thanks Steve.

-=Tim=-

TimB · « **Reply #91 on:** October 13, 2003, 03:56:15 pm »

Quote from: TimB on October 13, 2003, 03:43:37 pm

Quote from: SteveG on October 13, 2003, 03:34:11 pm
Tim,

Please verify that the time and date on your iPod are correct.

Steve

Doh!

Thanks Steve.

-=Tim=-

I guess I'm glad I caught this after "only" 25% of my 12,000 files were messed up by my screwup!

I understand that setting the dateisn't an MC function but as this is CRUCIAL to last played working is there a way to check this when MC first loads up the iPod data and advise the dopey user (ie me) of impending doom and maybe give 'em a chance to fix it?

-=Tim=-

Kurt Young · « **Reply #92 on:** October 13, 2003, 04:00:59 pm »

Quote from: SteveG on October 13, 2003, 03:34:11 pm

<snip!>
For those people, there was a time when some people told me they wanted the ability to create a new playlist and an easy way to add it without parsing through all the files. For those people, they can check only the one new playlist and sync and they will add just the new playlist.
<snip!>

Can these people not just drag-and-drop the updated playlist onto the iPod or the Action Window? Or perhaps use a right-click-send-to?

Again, I'm maintaining that a synchronize should make the two points mirror one another. If we just want to put new files on the iPod, we can use the plethora of manual upload methods.

thosj · « **Reply #93 on:** October 13, 2003, 04:30:12 pm »

I'm new to MC9 and iPod. I can't for the life of me figure out how to do Audible files with MC9.

I have file association checked for *.aa, I have searched for new media, there are *.aa files on my HD in the default Audible Manager location, I can use Audible manager and put them back on my iPod.

But.........I cannot figure out where this is in MC9. Using 9.1 271.

Feeling pretty dumb.

SteveG · « **Reply #94 on:** October 13, 2003, 05:06:36 pm »

thosj,

After importing the .aa files into MC, you can move the files to iPod in many ways. Try selecting 'Handheld' in the Action window and then drag and drop the files on the window. You can also right click the file and select 'Send-To' followed by the drive letter for your iPod. After you do this, click on the iPod drive letter and you will see the option for 'Transfer'. Finally, if you start using Playlists and Smartlists, try clicking on the little iPod in the task bar to synchronize playlists to iPod.

Kurt,

A good point. Lets see what others say.

Tim,

I will try to make this safer in this situation.

Steve

IDSmoker · « **Reply #95 on:** October 13, 2003, 05:21:44 pm »

Quote from: SteveG on October 13, 2003, 03:34:11 pm

IDSmoker,

Quote
Since I can only change ratings within MC, I would like to just transfer the playcounts and last played information, without over-writing any changed ratings.

You can change ratings from within MC on iPod, or on the iPod itself. If you do not want iPod info to go to MC, uncheck the 'Sync data to PC' checkbox in the Sync dialogue. Are you saying you want to have songs rated one way on iPod and another way in MC?

Steve

No, I want the ratings to match between the PC and iPod... The problem is probably with the methodology I've been using...

You see, I have to use MC to change the ratings, but I really only listen to my music through my iPod (at work and in the car during my commute).

When I add music/books to my MC library, I use the "Unrated" smartlist to set the rating of all new music/books to "2".

Among the smartlists I use to sync my iPod, there is a rule to only include music/books that have a rating of 2 or higher.

While listening, I make notes about music I don't like (REMOVE), music I like (BUMP), music I love (FAVORITE), books that I've finished (REMOVE), and music/books that need attention (FIX) because they are being chopped off, they skip, have the wrong tag info, or have some other sort of technical issue.

When my pile of notes gets high enough, I take them home, fire up MC and churn through them. Mostly changing the song/books rating... REMOVE = Rating 1, BUMP = Rating 3, FAVORITE = Rating 5, FIX = Rating 1 (until resolved). This may happen 2 or 3 times a week or once a month, it just depends on what I've been listening to.

In the meantime, I've gotten into the habit of going quite a while between syncs of the iPod. Partly, this is lazyness, partly this is because of a problem my system developed that makes it difficult to get the iPod to stay connected to the computer (I'm pretty sure it's related to my adding an additional external HD, but I haven't had any luck solving it). As an aside, the only way my iPod will stay connected is if I keep the iPod Updater running in the background! This really hasn't been a big deal, since my 20gb holds enough to last me for more than a month!

So you see, with my methodology, the older song ratings on the iPod will over-write the changed ratings I've put in MC since my last sync, if I enable the new "Transfer data to MC" function. Not really a big deal... I've never had a working playcounts function, so I won't really miss it, but I've always wanted to try using that info to create the "Never Heard" and "Most Heard" smartlists.

BTW, since my iPod has never kept accurate time (even with FW 1.3), I've never bothered to set the Date/Time on it, so the "last date/time played" data is pretty worthless to me, and I would never bother to transfer it, given a choice.

bvm · « **Reply #96 on:** October 13, 2003, 05:51:16 pm »

Quote

I found a bug related to 'Composer'. The data in the iTunesDB was storing correctly but not being displayed correctly. Anyway, it is fixed in the next MC build.

Would that be .275, announced 85 minutes after you wrote this, or do I need to wait one more?

I'll try it out, but I'm not sure your characterization of the bug matches what I'm seeing -- not only is the Composer not showing up in the Content Pane when I'm pointing to my iPod drive, but the entries really aren't in the Composers menu when I look at the iPod itself.

gpvillamil · « **Reply #97 on:** October 13, 2003, 06:12:28 pm »

I've recently had a problem for the first time that hadn't occurred before.

Basically, on a sync, I lose all the playlist information. The Playlist menu on the iPod shows a single chevron, but there's nothing there. Also, though the iPod shows 2700 songs and 36MB free, the number of songs that is reachable is much smaller.

When plugged in, however, the iPod tree in MC looks correct.

This has happened whenever I synchronize after making a change to the set of playlists I synchronize to the iPod. Both times this has happened has been after I've deselected a Smartlist and added a new one to the synchronization set.

If I initialize the iPod and do a synchronization from scratch, everything is fine.

thosj · « **Reply #98 on:** October 13, 2003, 07:05:36 pm »

Quote from: SteveG on October 13, 2003, 05:06:36 pm

After importing the .aa files into MC, you can move the files to iPod in many ways. Try selecting 'Handheld' in the Action window and then drag and drop the files on the window. You can also right click the file and select 'Send-To' followed by the drive letter for your iPod. After you do this, click on the iPod drive letter and you will see the option for 'Transfer'. Finally, if you start using Playlists and Smartlists, try clicking on the little iPod in the task bar to synchronize playlists to iPod.

If I could find the aa files, perhaps I could move them to the iPod!! I see no aa files. Where are they?

I imported with aa set as file association. I see no aa files.

Perhaps they won't import from C:\Program Files\Audible\Programs\Downloads?? Perhaps I should copy the aa's somewhere else?

Thanks for your patience, this has me stumped!!

Tom

ashawley · « **Reply #99 on:** October 13, 2003, 11:43:42 pm »

IDSmoker:

Since you have a 2nd gen iPod that doesn't support ratings, there will not be any rating information to update MC9 with. So, your ratings will always stay what you set them in MC9.

BTW, you need to upgrade to a 3rd gen. It'll let you get rid of all those pesky notes.

Want to change the rating on a song? Just do it while it's playing. It's a nifty feature.

Steve: what Kurt said.

Adam

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