INTERACT FORUM

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Tooltip Options  (Read 1426 times)

mvandyke

  • World Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 159
Tooltip Options
« on: May 10, 2023, 09:49:13 am »

Using latest version of JRiver 30.  Under Options -  Tree & View - List - Show Tooltips  has four variables and I'm unable to find documentation (Yes googled JRiver and tooltips options, etc.) on the last two options:

No
Yes
Everything but Track Info
Only Track Info

What exactly are those 2 options supposed to do?  The last two tend to display the same thing as having it on (the Yes selection).  Those last two always display for me exactly what the Yes option provides.   I do have a customized Tooltip.

I would also like to use the Tooltip Toogle ICON button (customize toolbar) to turn Tooltips on or off but cycling through 4 different options is silly since you can't see what they are and again option 2-4 do the same thing for me.

The tooltip toogle ICON should toogle on or off tooltips not go through 4 different options that you can't see what those options are and 3 of the 4 options work the same at least for me.

Thanks
Matt
Logged

mvandyke

  • World Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 159
Re: Tooltip Toogle - Need to fix, adjust or explain.
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2023, 03:56:19 pm »

Bump on this.  Would like to understand exactly how this is supposed to work.

Matt
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2023, 08:47:22 pm »

See pic below for what is a tooltip, and what is track info.  Regarding the 4 options in settings under Tree & View:

- YES will show both Tooltips and the Track Info popup when hovering over selected items
- NO will exclude either of these from ever popping up. 
- The Everything but Track Info nomenclature is an odd choice, but all it really means is it that only tooltips will be shown, and not the track info popup
- That leaves Only Track Info which by process of elimination, is the option to only show the track info popup.

This specific control over what is displayed was implemented around a year ago to satisfy a request from a user who really disliked the track info popup. That said, there are several issues that need to be addressed for this to be a more useful.

- the tooltips toolbar icon needs to include a drop-down menu with a checkmark by the current selection - cycling through four options blindly is not very useful.
- having an icon menu will make it much easier to switch among the options and know exactly what the outcome will be
- Tooltip popups in every program I've used shows a brief description for the specific function of a button (like the radio button in the screenshot), or over the play/previous/next buttons in the player bar
- With the exception of the track info however, MC treats everything elseas a tooltip, even if it is not really a "tooltip"

To improve this functionality, there needs to be a 3rd category of "pop-ups" for things like the artist bio popup when hovering over that tag in the tag window, or to display the full track title when it is cut off by the column width - these items are most definitely not "tooltips".  After all, things like biography and lyrics ARE explicitly "track related info", so why MC groups these with tooltip popups (and thus get turned off along with tooltips) makes no sense to me.

But others may prefer to only see the track info popup, but never the artist bio, lyrics, notes, etc. popup (or the other way around) - thus a 3rd option. It could possibly be called "text expansion pop-up".  Either way, This additional "popup" category is highly necessary IMO.  Even lightly experienced MC users have zero need for actual "tooltips" (everyone knows triangle = play, square = stop, etc).  I would very much appreciate an option to turn off "actual" tooltips only, and leave all the other popups active, but that is not currently possible.

Crossing my fingers Matt reads this thread and incorporates the suggestions above.
Logged

Matt

  • Administrator
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 42071
  • Shoes gone again!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2023, 08:43:12 am »

Next build we'll have this:
Changed: Truncation tooltips no longer honor the setting for tooltips, but instead always show.

I can't really think why you would ever want to turn them off.  If someone disagrees, say so here and we'll add another option :)
Logged
Matt Ashland, JRiver Media Center

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2023, 12:01:31 pm »

Changed: Truncation tooltips no longer honor the setting for tooltips, but instead always show.
Ahh... see? you already had a name for it… Truncation Tooltip (which is not really a tooltip).  This one has annoyed me for some time now so I am really looking forward to the fix.  Thanks Matt!
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2023, 12:07:01 pm »

I can't really think why you would ever want to turn them off.  If someone disagrees, say so here and we'll add another option :)
As far as truncated names/info in a filelist, I would agree.

OTOH, pop-ups that expand the biography and lyrics (which are also currently included under tooltips) I imagine some users might prefer those do not pop up.  Not me though, I want all the pop-ups except for the button tooltips.
Logged

SkGe

  • Galactic Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 424
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2023, 01:39:41 pm »

@Matt. If we talk about tooltip can we have an option to hide stack items in tooltip?


Logged

mvandyke

  • World Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 159
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2023, 06:40:52 am »

Next build we'll have this:
Changed: Truncation tooltips no longer honor the setting for tooltips, but instead always show.

I can't really think why you would ever want to turn them off.  If someone disagrees, say so here and we'll add another option :)

There are times that I want to read a larger field like Artist Bio or Album Review by hoovering over the file.  With Tooltips on it comes over the top of the display information for those larger fields.  See example where the bio is lower left but "over written" by tooltips.

Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2023, 09:08:40 am »

There are times that I want to read a larger field like Artist Bio or Album Review by hoovering over the file.  With Tooltips on it comes over the top of the display information for those larger fields.

Yes! that was exactly the point I was trying to make here:

To improve this functionality, there needs to be a 3rd category of "pop-ups" for things like the artist bio popup when hovering over that tag in the tag window, or to display the full track title when it is cut off by the column width - these items are most definitely not "tooltips".  After all, things like biography and lyrics ARE explicitly "track related info", so why MC groups these with tooltip popups (and thus get turned off along with tooltips) makes no sense to me.

Currently, the tag window's large field pop-ups are coupled with button function tooltips, so if you turn off those tooltips it turns off the large tag window pop-up. However, biography and lyrics are clearly track info, so if it is to be turned on and off with anything, it should be with the track info... or create a 3rd category of pop-ups as I noted above.
Logged

mvandyke

  • World Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 159
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2023, 11:35:01 am »

What about a standard tooltip pop up that allowed you to use the scroll button on your mouse.  That would solve the problem - I believe
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2023, 02:44:45 pm »

whoops… Ignore my previous reply - I had not looked at your image first.  That is some fancy tooltip you got there mister!  I've never customized tooltips as you clearly have here - very impressive. Your issue is a little more complex than the default set up, but adding the ability to scroll in large pop-up windows (for things like biography and lyrics) would be desirable in my view as well.

I am curious where the album thumbnail is coming from?  Is that a pop up of the small album image in the player bar (separate from your custom tooltip), or is it part of your custom tooltip? 

FYI, as a child of the sixties, Green Eyed Lady was my favorite tune when I was around nine years old (I also have Spaceship Earth in my library). Gotta love the band member in the mesh shirt on the right - I owned a few of those and wore them with pride during my teen years... ahh youth... such blissful stupidity!
Logged

SkGe

  • Galactic Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 424
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2023, 02:47:29 am »

Code: [Select]
I am curious where the album thumbnail is coming from?Is probably the cover art from album or you can use the <img src="your album art location"> or the image file saved inside the audio file. You can resize the cover but the tooltip have max width of around 800 pixels.
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2023, 07:37:08 am »

Code: [Select]
I am curious where the album thumbnail is coming from?Is probably the cover art from album or you can use the <img src="your album art location"> or the image file saved inside the audio file. You can resize the cover but the tooltip have max width of around 800 pixels.
It is definitely the cover art from the album, but in his screenshot it looks like pop-up size you get when clicking on the player bar's small album image, while the metadata looks to be a separate pop up - that is what I can't tell for sure from his picture. You (SkGe) have a pretty fancy info pop up yourself in your previous post, and in yours it is clear the cover art is embedded within the info pop up.

I never realized how much info could be added to the file info pop-up - both of you have inspired me to take a look at making a custom one myself.
Logged

mvandyke

  • World Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 159
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #13 on: May 22, 2023, 08:07:45 am »

whoops… Ignore my previous reply - I had not looked at your image first.  That is some fancy tooltip you got there mister!  I've never customized tooltips as you clearly have here - very impressive. Your issue is a little more complex than the default set up, but adding the ability to scroll in large pop-up windows (for things like biography and lyrics) would be desirable in my view as well.

I am curious where the album thumbnail is coming from?  Is that a pop up of the small album image in the player bar (separate from your custom tooltip), or is it part of your custom tooltip? 

FYI, as a child of the sixties, Green Eyed Lady was my favorite tune when I was around nine years old (I also have Spaceship Earth in my library). Gotta love the band member in the mesh shirt on the right - I owned a few of those and wore them with pride during my teen years... ahh youth... such blissful stupidity!

I had to check my Tooltip - Audio field as I didn't recall but there is no calling for a defined Album Art image so it is the default.

I have very detailed Tooltip for Audio, Video, Movies, Audiobooks as I enjoy looking at the additional metadata on all of the media that I have.  Would love to see a scroll on Tooltip display if it's possible.
Logged

JimH

  • Administrator
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 71768
  • Where did I put my teeth?
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2023, 08:44:20 am »

We might be able to make Spotlight work for audio books.
Logged

SkGe

  • Galactic Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 424
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2023, 11:27:43 am »

@HPBEME
I have a few views for what I use. Artist or album or anything else. It is a tedious job but the result are good. Some of my tooltips are still WiP and I'm still trying to find ways to show them, but it's hard when you hit this limitation of tooltips.
Here are some previews.
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2023, 09:46:57 pm »

I have very detailed Tooltip for Audio, Video, Movies, Audiobooks as I enjoy looking at the additional metadata on all of the media that I have.  Would love to see a scroll on Tooltip display if it's possible.
I would love to add band members as you have in your tooltip, but I imagine you scraped all that manually. I doubt I will live long enough to undertake that for my library!  The amount of time I have spent gathering album reviews, artist biographies, and high quality album art is already ridiculous.

If you have an automated process for gathering up all that info, I would love to hear about it.

I have a few views for what I use. Artist or album or anything else. It is a tedious job but the result are good. Some of my tooltips are still WiP and I'm still trying to find ways to show them, but it's hard when you hit this limitation of tooltips.
Those look great! But... same comment as above - unless there is an automated way to scoop up all this info, I will have to make do with what I have I think.
Logged

Moe

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 699
  • Hi
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2023, 10:25:49 pm »

Quote
I would love to add band members as you have in your tooltip, but I imagine you scraped all that manually. I doubt I will live long enough to undertake that for my library!  The amount of time I have spent gathering album reviews, artist biographies, and high quality album art is already ridiculous.

If you have an automated process for gathering up all that info, I would love to hear about it.

You should look into MCUtils.  It can get all that stuff for you.
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2023, 10:58:41 pm »

I downloaded MCUtils a year or two ago, but was intimidated by how complicated it seemed to get it up and running.   

Working on my Dream in Blue skin update is my main priority anyway, and I barely have the time and energy to do that.  I have two more skins I want to develop after that too (but one of those is mostly done). It is taking forever to complete because I'm now also incorporating custom icons into the skins. And each skin is not just 1 skin, but 8 to 12, since I create many variations with numerous alternate images - this increases the workload substantially.  Hah well... nobody's fault of mine.

Maybe after all that (like next year sometime :o) I will dive into MCUtills.
Logged

EnglishTiger

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1001
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2023, 12:34:52 am »

What about a standard tooltip pop up that allowed you to use the scroll button on your mouse.  That would solve the problem - I believe

A tooltip for a tag/field with an Edit Type of Large Value, i.e.Lyrics, will only appear while the mouse is hovering in that field/tag in a list; but if you move the mouse to another line/track in that list the tooltip will change to showing the contents of that field. Since Tooltips are dependent on the position of the mouse adding scrollbars to them would be a waste of time and money because nobody would be able to use that scrollbar.

However there is a possible alternative - modify one of the existing TrackInfo Plugins to display the Large Value fields you want/need.

Or if it's a single Large Value tag/field you want to see open that tag in the modern tag window, unless you give the focus to some other part of the window that tag will remain open to display the contents of the currently playing track.
Logged
Win NUC - VENOEN 11Th NUC Mini PC Core i7 1165G7,Dual HDMI 2.0+Mini DP,Windows 11 Mini Desktop Computer,Thunderbolt 4.0,1 Lan, USB-C,Wifi,Bluetooth 5.0,32GB RAM Toshiba MQ04ABF100 ‎500Gb 5400 RPM ‎eSATA HD, Gigabyte GP-GSM2NE3512GNTD 1Tb NVMe SSD, Samsung 870 QVO 8 TB SATA 2.5 Inch SSD (MZ-77Q8T0) in Sabrent Ultra Slim USB 3.0 to 2.5-Inch SATA External Aluminium Hard Drive Enclosure (EC-UK30)

Apple 2020 Mac mini M1 Chip (8GB RAM, 512GB SSD)
Sabrent Thunderbolt 3 to Dual NVMe M.2 SSD Tool-Free Enclosure with Sabrent 2TB Rocket NVMe PCIe M.2 2280 High Performance SSD + Crucial P3 Plus 4TB M.2 PCIe

ET Skins & TrackInfo Plugins - https://englishtiger.uk/index.html

Moe

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 699
  • Hi
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #20 on: May 23, 2023, 08:32:51 am »

I downloaded MCUtils a year or two ago, but was intimidated by how complicated it seemed to get it up and running.

If you ever feel like taking a break from skinning and want to get MCUtils up and running, contact MrC (the creator of MCUtils).  His contact info is in the docs and he's always happy to help. It can be a bit intimidating at first but once it you have it configured one simple command can get you all the meta data your heart desires.
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2023, 09:46:19 am »

It's not so much that I need to take a break from skinning, it is more about finding the time and energy to do it all. :(

I will probably take a look at MCUtils again sometime in the reasonably near future and try to figure it out on my own. I'm sure I will be able to, but it would probably take me a fair chunk of time and energy.  So perhaps I will reach out to MrC after all.  Thanks for the push Moe.
Logged

lepa

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1985
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2023, 10:00:37 am »

Doing the default configuration is really easy even though it might look hard. MrC has created a very good documentation how to get started. It really tells you everything there

In short basically the steps are:
- Install perl e.g. strawberrypearl (windows)
- run mcutils's install script and it will install all the perl libraries for you
- create new config file
Code: [Select]
.\mccl.pl mcutils newconfig it tells you where the file was created and that you should add your credentials there to get MCWS responding
- create missing fields with --checkfields, --addfields commands
Logged

HPBEME

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1032
  • 1 petard hoisting down, 3 to go - Lock him up!!!
Re: Tooltip Options
« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2023, 10:35:26 am »

That does sound very straightforward.  Perhaps I'll try it this upcoming Memorial Day long weekend.  Thanks lepa.
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up