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Author Topic: Please help: newbie questions for MC32 DSP Studio's "Parametric Equalizer"  (Read 476 times)

NOVOICE

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Hello,

I have just started my free trial of JRiver Media Center 32 (MC32) for Windows yesterday.

Previously, I have been using Windows Media Player 11 (downloaded from Microsoft Store - https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9wzdncrfj3pt) for listening *.WAV audio files purchased from www.hdtracks.com. In the latest version 11.2403.5.0 of Windows Media Player, the smallest increment (GAIN) of its equalizer is still 0.1 dB.

As the smallest increment (GAIN) of MC32 DSP Studio's "Equalizer" is 0.5 dB, what is the smallest increment (GAIN) of MC32 DSP Studio's "Parametric Equalizer" ?

Also is there any difference between MC32 DSP Studio's "Parametric Equalizer" and "Parametric Equalizer 2" ?

Thanks for your kind assistance.

Yours sincerely,
NOVOICE
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Mr Swordfish

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1 db is generally considered the smallest difference people can hear, so I wouldn't stress over .1db vs .5 db.

Don't know the answers to the other questions.
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mwillems

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I think the lowest increment in parametric equalizer is one 10,000th of a db (i.e. .00001 db).  Plenty of precision available!

There is no difference between PEQ and PEQ2, they're just there if you need to do filtering before and after some other DSP block like convolution or an external VST, etc.
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NOVOICE

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Thank you very much for such valuable information! Unfortunately there is another MC32 problem for me - how can DXD audio files (PCM 24-bit 352.8 kHz) be played without external DAC? NOTE: MC32 can successfully decode and directly play all *.AIFF, *.WAV & *.FLAC audio files (PCM 24-bit 192 kHz).

The latest version 11.2403.5.0 of Windows Media Player supports DXD audio files (*.WAV 24-bit 352.8 kHz) and it can directly play those DXD audio files (purchased from www.hdtracks.com) to my LG OLED C2 TV via a HDMI 2.1 cable (without connecting to any soundbar or AV receiver).

But I cannot do the same thing with MC32, please kindly inform me how to solve this DXD problem. Thanks for your help and support again!
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Awesome Donkey

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Windows Media Player goes through Windows' system mixer, so if whatever device you're trying to output to either only supports up to 192 kHz or doesn't support 352.8 kHz it'll silently resample it so it'll never be a bit-perfect output. MC doesn't do this and will display an error when it can't playback a file at the native sample rate of the file. If you get an error while trying to playback a 24-bit/352.8 kHz file in MC, it's a possibility. You should see what your DAC/receiver/renderer/etc. supports over whichever audio output you're using. How are you outputting the audio? USB? HDMI? Optical/Coaxial/SPDIF? DLNA? Some audio outputs have a lower supported maximum sample rate than others.

That said I don't know if MC actually supports DXD, assuming it's some sort of special format like MQA or DSD as I don't have any DXD content to test with. However if DXD is nothing but a downloaded 24-bit/352.8 kHz FLAC file for example, then it'll depend on what the maximum sample rate your DAC/receiver/renderer/etc. supports over the audio output you're using.
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NOVOICE

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Windows Media Player goes through Windows' system mixer, so if whatever device you're trying to output to either only supports up to 192 kHz or doesn't support 352.8 kHz it'll silently resample it so it'll never be a bit-perfect output. MC doesn't do this and will display an error when it can't playback a file at the native sample rate of the file. If you get an error while trying to playback a 24-bit/352.8 kHz file in MC, it's a possibility. You should see what your DAC/receiver/renderer/etc. supports over whichever audio output you're using. How are you outputting the audio? USB? HDMI? Optical/Coaxial/SPDIF? DLNA? Some audio outputs have a lower supported maximum sample rate than others.

That said I don't know if MC actually supports DXD, assuming it's some sort of special format like MQA or DSD as I don't have any DXD content to test with. However if DXD is nothing but a downloaded 24-bit/352.8 kHz FLAC file for example, then it'll depend on what the maximum sample rate your DAC/receiver/renderer/etc. supports over the audio output you're using.

https://positive-feedback.com/reviews/music-reviews/what-we-hear-with-dxd-32-bit-files/
1-18-2024 | By Rushton Paul | Issue 131: What We Hear With DXD 32-bit Files (Free Sample Downloads)

FYI: The above webpage has provided 4 FREE audio files for comparative listening -

1. DXD 32-bit 352.8 kHz [FLOATING POINT] WAV: Track 8, "Funeral March Of A Marionette"
2. DXD 24-bit 352.8 kHz [DITHERED] FLAC: Track 8, "Funeral March Of A Marionette"
3. DXD 24-bit 352.8 kHz [TRUNCATED, NO DITHER] FLAC: Track 8, "Funeral March Of A Marionette"
4. DSF 1-bit DSD256: Track 8, "Funeral March Of A Marionette"

NOTE: Except the last *.DSF audio file, the latest version 11.2403.5.0 of Windows Media Player can successfully decode and directly play those 3 DXD audio files (*.WAV & *.FLAC) without external DAC.
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Awesome Donkey

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All four test files at the link above play fine for me in MC32 at their native bit-depths and sample rates. Here's a screenshot of the audio path when playing back the 32-bit/352.8 kHz WAV file in MC32...



If it works or not without the need for dithering and/or resampling is all going to depend on what the audio output devices supports and how it's connected, so your results may vary. However I can say that over USB using my iFi ZEN DAC 3 all four files play fine.

the latest version 11.2403.5.0 of Windows Media Player can successfully decode and directly play those 3 DXD audio files (*.WAV & *.FLAC) without external DAC.

Because it's resampling them. I opened the three PCM files in Windows Media Player 11.2403.5.0 and it's definitely, absolutely 100% resampling them. My DAC informs me what sample rate it's playing at, and it's not going above 48 kHz so it isn't playing back at native 352.8 kHz like MC32 can.

As I said before, Windows Media Player goes through the Windows system mixer, meaning it's going to dither and/or resample the audio without informing you so playback will always work. Windows Media Player isn't good for testing things like this nor is it a valid test as it'll always resample to whatever bit-depth/sample rate you have it set to in Windows' sound settings for the audio output.

You can achieve the same thing in MC32 by going into DSP Studio > Output Format and setting the output for 352,800 Hz to a lower sample rate like 48,000 Hz or 96,000 Hz or whatever the max sample rate your output supports. It'll play it like Windows Media Player does, but like Windows Media Player it won't be playing it back at the native 352.8 kHz.
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Windows 11 2024 Update (24H2) 64-bit + Ubuntu 24.04 LTS Noble Numbat 64-bit | Windows 11 2024 Update (24H2) 64-bit (Intel N305 Fanless NUC 16GB RAM/500GB M.2 NVMe SSD)
JRiver Media Center 32 (Windows + Linux) | iFi ZEN DAC 3 | JBL 306P MkII Studio Monitors | Audio-Technica ATH-M50x Headphones

dtc

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DXD is just a made-up marketing name for 352 Hz PCM. I believe it was coined to compete with DSD when that first came out.

MC plays DXD fine and if your DAC wants a lower sample rate, then DSP Studio can downscale it to the appropriate sample rate.
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NOVOICE

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All four test files at the link above play fine for me in MC32 at their native bit-depths and sample rates. Here's a screenshot of the audio path when playing back the 32-bit/352.8 kHz WAV file in MC32...

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation of Windows Media Player 11.2403.5.0 and the professional tips of MC32! I have been using Windows Media Player to listen MP3/FLAC/WAV audio files for a very long time because it is the most convenient software to me (with no soundbar or external DAC).

Thanks again for testing those 4 FREE audio files of "Funeral March Of A Marionette" and telling me the unrevealed audio resampling of Windows Media Player. Hopefully I can find a discount coupon of MC32 before the end of its free trial period...
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