INTERACT FORUM

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 [2]   Go Down

Author Topic: Managing DVD's  (Read 14986 times)

Alex B

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 10121
  • The Cosmic Bird
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #50 on: February 12, 2007, 01:28:04 pm »

Well , browsing this topic i cannot not ask

You rip DVD to play them on an Ipod - With a screen as big than a box of fags ?
And you need hours to do it ?
Sorry , but it sounds so weird to me =)

The iPod Dock accessory has composite and S-Video outputs. This makes possible to easily take a few gigabytes of video with you and show them with any standard TV. 640x480 is a suitable resolution setting for that kind of use.
Logged
The Cosmic Bird - a triple merger of galaxies: http://eso.org/public/news/eso0755

Magic_Randy

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 2321
  • I used to be indecisive, but now I'm not so sure..
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #51 on: February 12, 2007, 11:18:19 pm »

Well , browsing this topic i cannot not ask

You rip DVD to play them on an Ipod - With a screen as big than a box of fags ?
And you need hours to do it ?
Sorry , but it sounds so weird to me =)

The DVDs I've ripped are all music DVDs.  I can listen to the music and watch the performance. 
Logged

Rob L

  • Regular Member
  • Galactic Citizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 469
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #52 on: February 13, 2007, 02:38:04 am »

Incidentally, this is what I use most of the time:

http://www.aoamedia.com/dvd_ripper.htm

It looks like it's quite a bit cheaper than DVDFab, though I suspect it does a bit less. Does what you're saying you want though (ripping full copies and ripping for iPod).

It's very simple to use though.

I have found maybe 1 DVD that it didn't like much, but I've found it handles stuff other ones struggle with.
Logged

NickM

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
  • Simplicity isn't always best, but it's easy to fix
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #53 on: February 13, 2007, 11:16:35 pm »

Hi Glynor,
Following your recommendation (as always..) I have installed AutoMKV but no luck yet.
I see that you use DVDDecrypter to rip to an ISO file, but in your screen shot, you show VIDEO_TS.VOB as the selected file for conversion.
I have a DVD in raw format, i.e. all the various .IFO, .VOB & .BUP files.  Which one do I specify for AutoMKV?
Thanks!
Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #54 on: February 14, 2007, 01:09:49 pm »

Hi Glynor,
Following your recommendation (as always..) I have installed AutoMKV but no luck yet.
I see that you use DVDDecrypter to rip to an ISO file, but in your screen shot, you show VIDEO_TS.VOB as the selected file for conversion.
I have a DVD in raw format, i.e. all the various .IFO, .VOB & .BUP files.  Which one do I specify for AutoMKV?
Thanks!

Here's my method:

1. I typically rip the DVD to ISO mode first.  This is only so I can put the DVD safely away in storage, and not have to dig it out again if my rip doesn't go as well as I had hoped.  This isn't really a needed first step, it's just what I do.  This will create a full image of the DVD on your hard drive in ISO format.  Just one big 8.5GB single file (the example below is smaller because it was just a little homemade 11 minute DVD I happened to have on my hard drive today).

2. I then load that ISO into a virtual "drive" on my system provided by Daemon Tools.  If you don't want to rip to ISO mode, then you can skip these two steps and just rip the DVD itself directly in IFO or "Rip Movie Only" mode.  That's probably what I would do if I were you... Just rip directly in IFO/Movie Only mode from the disc itself (sometimes Daemon Tools causes problems with DVD Decrypter for reasons I don't fully understand).



3. Then I re-load DVD Decrypter and re-rip the "DVD" (which is now actually safely back in it's case) in IFO mode.  Actually, anymore I use RipIt4Me and run through the wizard in "Rip Movie Only" mode as I described earlier.  In IFO mode, you're going to select only the "title" (or video clip) that you want to rip and have it save the applicable VOBs, IFOs, and everything else to a folder on your hard drive.  IFO is not ISO.

The reason you need to do this is because in the actual DVD, the video files can be all mixed up.  The VOBs might contain bits and pieces of the main movie, as well as the extra deleted scenes, extra features, and hunks of the menu all in one file (or the movie is more likely broken up across multiple different VOB files).  Ripping in DVD Decrypter's IFO mode uses the DVDs "table of contents" to extract only the bits you want and dump them all into one solid VOB file.  The IFO is basically the index that tells you what stream does what and why and all that...

During this step, I generally just rip all the audio tracks and subtitle streams in the file (it looks like this might be harder with the new versions of RipIt4Me).  Both AutoMKV and AutoGK allow you to choose which streams you want included and let you pick more than one.



or, using just DVD Decrypter...



4. You should then have a new folder with a bunch of VOB, IFO, and BUP files.  I open AutoMKV and load the file called VIDEO_TS.IFO in as the input file.  You can also use the VOB file, it makes no difference really.  This is the rip of ONLY the title you selected in RipIt4Me or DVD Decrypter.



You can then select the audio streams you want, and your compression settings and then go.  One thing I just discovered is that current builds of x264 are no longer Quicktime compatible (because Quicktime doesn't handle stuff correctly), which could be some of the problems listed above.  If you are ripping for iPod, there is an extra step you need to do in addition to picking the iPod profile.  It's discussed somewhat over here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=953936#post953936  EDIT: This was wrong.  See below here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg265235#msg265235

Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #55 on: February 14, 2007, 01:58:31 pm »

One thing I just discovered is that current builds of x264 are no longer Quicktime compatible (because Quicktime doesn't handle stuff correctly), which could be some of the problems listed above.  If you are ripping for iPod, there is an extra step you need to do in addition to picking the iPod profile.  It's discussed somewhat over here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=953936#post953936

To do what the AutoMKV developer suggested in the thread I linked above, reference the screenshot below.  You'd want to use the following settings:

Most NTSC (American) video with a 29.97 frame rate: AssumeFPS(30000,1001)
Film sources with a 23.97 frame rate (many movies): AssumeFPS(24000,1001)


I'm testing it now, but I suspect it will work...

EDIT: It didn't.  See this post below: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38615.msg265235#msg265235
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

NickM

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
  • Simplicity isn't always best, but it's easy to fix
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #56 on: February 15, 2007, 01:13:29 am »

3. Then I re-load DVD Decrypter and re-rip the "DVD" (which is now actually safely back in it's case) in IFO mode.  Actually, anymore I use RipIt4Me and run through the wizard in "Rip Movie Only" mode as I described earlier.  In IFO mode, you're going to select only the "title" (or video clip) that you want to rip and have it save the applicable VOBs, IFOs, and everything else to a folder on your hard drive.  IFO is not ISO.

This is the problem bit for me - I too use RipIt4Me & DVD Decrypter.  Having already ripped the "Full DVD", I need a tool to be able to re-create the VIDEO_TS.IFO for Movie only ( without going back and re-ripping again ).  I now see why you rip to ISO in the first place...
Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #57 on: February 15, 2007, 09:06:51 am »

I now see why you rip to ISO in the first place...

Yep.

You might be able to get DVD Decrypter to re-rip from a directory.  Let me try a few things...
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #58 on: February 15, 2007, 09:34:44 am »

Okay.  I found a way to do it.

DVD Fab Decrypter can handle VIDEO_TS folders on a hard drive, rather than just discs in a drive.  Doom9 has it for download here: http://www.doom9.org/Soft21/Rippers/DVDFabDecrypter3050.exe

It's an old version, but it works (and appears to work free of charge).  I know they charge for newer versions, but the version I grabbed from Doom9 says "free edition" in the "About" dialog (pops up when you click on the ? button in the titlebar of the main UI).  I don't know if it's gonna expire in 30 days, but it gives no indication that it will!  It looks like they're just trying to charge for the DVD conversion features, not the ripping, at least with this version...

Just load it up, put it in Main Movie mode (buttons on left), and then click the folder button next to Source and navigate and find your VIDEO_TS folder and select the VIDEO_TS.IFO file.  Then choose which title you want and any audio tracks/subs (I'd just choose them all) and click Start to extract to a separate Target folder and you should be good.

The other option would be to use vStrip/vStripGUI, which is the real "power" IFO/VOB parser.  Doom9 has a guide here: http://www.doom9.org/index.html?/vstrip.htm

I'd say using DVD Fab Decrypter would be a lot easier though...
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

Temeryx

  • Regular Member
  • Recent member
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Change this by choosing profile
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #59 on: February 15, 2007, 05:15:35 pm »

I use DVD Fab Decrypter,  I am pretty sure it gets updated every time they update the gold and platinum versions, so the ripping engine is always up to date.  I think the official site for it is http://www.dvdidle.com/free.htm that's where I download it at least.

@glynor

I have been playing with encoding movies trying to get as close as possible to DVD quality at the smallest size possible for awhile now.  It sounds like you feel using AutoMKV with ce-highprofile at 1024 MB, keeping the original size of the movie, and changing the interlace settings, give you video that is very close to the same quality as the original DVD?  In AutoMKV do you use any of the filters or did you set it to none?  Any other settings you change? Also, what do you primarily watch your movies on?  I would like to confirm the settings you use, then give it go, and let it do it's thing for the next 12 hours!  So, I want to do right the first time.



 
Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #60 on: February 15, 2007, 06:00:11 pm »

Thanks for the address of the free version!  I couldn't find it earlier, but I didn't spend that long looking since the Doom9 version was only 1-2 builds old.

I'll respond and provide you with all my applicable settings, but probably not till tomorrow.

A couple of notes though quickly:

* I use x264 (obviously)
* CE-Highprofile.xml generally
* RemoveGrain(mode=2) for most stuff for the filter (but not always)
* Resize Filters = used to be lanczos, but the new version has a new default that I'm trying out with good results so far
* Width: always autocrop only (I almost always want full res versions)
* cust matrix (on advanced tab): eqm_avc_hr.cfg

I am by no means an expert -- just getting into x264, since I finally found a converter with a UI I like.  I'm pretty well versed in MPEG-4 ASP stuff (XviD) and I do video editing professionally for my job and deal with streaming servers and do DVD authoring.  I'd call myself semi-pro or a very advanced amateur since I'm almost entirely self-taught.

Like I said... More tomorrow, but yeah I use 1GB for most "regular" movies (less than 2 hour jobs).  For "special" movies where I really care or they're long I'll go up to 1.5GB or 2GB.  (I do re-encode the audio to AAC.) However, I'd say you could probably even go a little lower... My 350MB 1 hour TV shows look spectacular...
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

Temeryx

  • Regular Member
  • Recent member
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Change this by choosing profile
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #61 on: February 15, 2007, 06:47:44 pm »

Thanks glynor, no hurry at all of course, I appreciate any info you feel like sharing.

I would like to consider my self a self-taught semi pro as well.  I have done a lot of video editing as a hobby, and for numerous side jobs.  I have just grown weary of encoding, testing, comparing, then starting all over lately.  I want that one magic "encode perfect copy now" button!  When is that due out again?  ;)

So, I thought I would take advantage of your knowledge this time if you don't mind  :)

You're welcome for the link, I look forward to your more info when have time, and thanks again!   

Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #62 on: February 16, 2007, 09:13:44 am »

Okay... This isn't the full post about all my settings, but I just figured something important out.

If you're trying to use AutoMKV and either the CE-Quicktime.xml profile (for a Quicktime Player compatible MP4) or the PD-iPod.xml profile (for an iPod compatible MP4), you cannot use the eqm_avc_hr.cfg custom matrix (under Advanced Settings) as that will prevent Quicktime from being able to playback the video stream.  I haven't tested other custom matrices either, but I'd guess Quicktime wants none of them, so set that to none and you should be fine.  There is no need to do the AssumeFPS hack I posted about earlier.  That wasn't it...

That doesn't solve the crashing problem with the iPod 5.5G profile, but that's really fine since the vanilla iPod profile woks fine.  EDIT: But the developer of AutoMKV (buzzqw) just figured that out as well...

More here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=955217#post955217
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #63 on: February 16, 2007, 12:51:10 pm »

Okay... Here goes.  These are my typical settings for encoding with AutoMKV.  When I use more than one setting, I've tried to explain as best I can why I use one or the other.  If I don't mention it, I leave it alone.

AutoMKV 0.74e (current build) settings.

Basic Settings tab:

Audio:
Nero AAC - Stereo
Qual: 0.5 (for main track), and 0.4 (for an additional track, if any)
This generally works out to roughly 130kbit AAC VBR.

-or-

Copy Original: to keep AC3 audio from a rip

Container, Codec, and Profile:
Container: MP4 - I generally use this as it is more widely compatible than MKV.  (MKV has some extra fancy features, but I don't use them).

Codec: x264 - That's the reason I use AutoMKV.  Other good options available in it are VC-1 WMV, but I haven't used it.  XviD is also available, but I'd probably just use AutoGK for that.

Profile: depends on purpose...
CE-Highprofile.xml - General purpose high quality encodes for playback on my computer or HTPC.
CE-Quicktime.xml - I only use if I need to support Quicktime player, which I need to do sometimes for work stuff.
PD-iPod.xml - I don't actually have an iPod, but some of my friends do.  If I needed to do an encode for them, I'd use this.  Took me a while to get it working but I figured it out finally...

Generally, the profiles listed as HQ will give better quality than Highprofile, but they take an ABSURD amount of time to complete for a small gain in quality.  CE-Mainprofile.xml is slightly more compatible with players, but really most anything that can handle x264 at all can usually handle Highprofile too (which gives better results) so you might as well just use that.

Resizers:

Resize Filters: Spline36Resize (neutral sharp)  - the new default and works well.  I used to use LanczosResize.
Width Resolution: Auto Crop Only almost always - I generally want full resolution encodes.  If you set this manually, it must be a number evenly divisible by 8.

Filters: RemoveGrain(mode=2) looks great for most things.  It does tend to make video look a little "cellulosy" (sorry, don't know how to describe it really), which is great for stuff that's supposed to look "oldish" or "gritty" anyway, like Band of Brothers or HBO's The Wire.  For other types of movies I sometimes use Convolution3D (movieHQ).  For cartoon sources (anime and south park style stuff) I use Convolution3D (animeHQ).

I haven't spent a lot of time experimenting here.  I haven't tried much other than those I've listed above (and the different versions of those filters).  Asking what's "best" on Doom9.org get's you yelled at, so I'm mostly flying blind.

Output File Size Options:

Generally I like to give it 1024 MB for a regular 90-ish minute movie.
For "special" movies, or longer films, I bump it up to either 1500MB or 2048MB.  These are usually beautiful encodes.
For TV Shows, I usually give it 250MB for a 1/2 hour show and 350-450MB for an hour show.  These too are beautiful encodes, so the movie sizes could probably stand to come down a bit.  Just to explain, the number to the left of the disk size box will let you split the final output file into one or more separate hunks.

Advanced Settings Tab:

The vast majority of this stuff I leave alone.

Deinterlacer: Always Auto unless I happen to know it's a progressive source.  Then I change it to None which saves some time in the encode process (it doesn't have to test it then).  I generally do not check HQ Deint, which makes the deinterlacing a little nicer but takes way longer.  Compare it yourself if you want.

Custom Matrix: These are special ways to improve the color fidelity of the encodes.  They are built specifically for a particular codec.  The user on Doom9 called "Sharktooth" created the eqm_avc_hr.cfg matrix which works very well for high-resolution (640x480 and bigger) encodes to x264.  I almost always use it.  However, as is noted above I just discovered that this breaks compatibility with Quicktime and iPod, so if you need to support them, you must set this to NONE.

Del Temp File: Check this to have it automatically delete the Temp directory after the encode completes.  This happens automatically when you encode in batch mode.

Specify Bitrate: sometimes it's nice to shoot for a specific bitrate instead of a file size target (same goes for specify quality).  This is a target, since it is a VBR encode and it won't be hit exactly.

Language: eng because I'm an American.

Generally, I leave everything else to the defaults.  You can save and load different configuration files on the Advanced Settings tab as well, which is a good way to create different quick "setups" for different media types.

I have not yet used the Episodic DVD/IFO option, as I haven't had many episodic DVDs to do recently.  I'll get into that rotten stuff soon enough though...
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

Temeryx

  • Regular Member
  • Recent member
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Change this by choosing profile
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #64 on: February 16, 2007, 02:23:34 pm »

Thank you very much glynor, I really appreciate you taking the time to write such a great description.  Before this I think the only answer I saw to encoding questions were either, "Depends on the video source" or "You will have to try it yourself and see what you like best"  At worst, you gave an excellent place to start at, so thank you, and I will be testing it out tonight!
Logged

Temeryx

  • Regular Member
  • Recent member
  • *
  • Posts: 38
  • Change this by choosing profile
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #65 on: February 18, 2007, 06:32:16 pm »

Glynor

I did an encode of a Farscape episode, (hour long TV show) I used the settings you suggested, using the convolution3D (movieHQ) except I did set the size for 500 MB.  You were right, the picture looks amazing.  In fact it really looks sharper and brighter then the original DVD!

I had one problem though that I thought you might have an idea about.  I am getting interlacing artifacts in scenes where there is just moderate amount of motion and higher.  I had the deinterlacer set for auto, so I am guessing the Auto deinterlacer guessed wrong.  I tried it on a few different computers and different players including VLC in case a codec was causing the problem, same interlacing problems, so I am pretty sure the problem was with the encode.

Before I gave it another shot, and just set the deinterlacer to none to see happens,  I was curious if you had any thoughts about it.  If I can get rid of that problem it would be perfect, I was amazed how good the picture was.

Thanks again

p.s.  I did use mkv for the container so I could keep the original AC3 audio.  I pretty sure the container would not be the problem, but I am not positive on that one.
Logged

NickM

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
  • Simplicity isn't always best, but it's easy to fix
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #66 on: February 18, 2007, 07:14:53 pm »

Glynor, thatnks for the AutoMKV advice.  I managed to use DVDFab to re-build the .IFO to include the main title only.  But, try as I might, I cannot ge AutoMKV to produce anything else but a log file.  It appears to do lots of work along the way, but no significant output!

But, on the way, I have started using DVDFab - and so far, it's really good.  Version DVDFabDecrypter3050.exe does as you say, allows main selection, but not re-encoding for 'generic' or 'ipod'.  Version DVDFabPlatinum3080.exe allows everything - free for the first month.

I have used the Platinum version to encode some old movies, some new ones and some TV series.  One of the convenient features is to allow multi-titles to be separated (common with bundled season DVD's).  There are some pre-loaded default methods and one that you can play around with yourself.  This is obviously a far cry from AutoMKV, and it has much less sophistication, but is (almost) idiot proof.  I'm also guessing that it's not yet optimised for dual core processors; I set up similar batches to run on a single core and dual core and the encoding times were the same.

Not having a comparison to AutoMKV, I cannot give a realtive assesment, but I'm getting about a 1:1 in terms of timing for single pass encoding ( and double for dual pass ).
Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #67 on: February 21, 2007, 02:29:15 pm »

I've been off skiing and partying in Vermont and am just now getting caught up.  I'll respond more later...
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

JimH

  • Administrator
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 67932
  • where the buffalo roam
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #68 on: February 21, 2007, 02:58:02 pm »

While we were working, building a better world for you....

 ::)
Logged

NickM

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
  • Simplicity isn't always best, but it's easy to fix
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #69 on: February 23, 2007, 05:28:40 am »

Glynor, the DVDFab is working really well... Despite the lack of sophistication in the conversion options, it is doing a really good job.
I was unable to see (or hear) the difference between the original DVD and an episode of 24, encoded at contant bitrate of 900, with original soundtrack on a 42" plasma.

I have started re-coding multi-episode DVD's overnight on a MacBook.  1 DVD with 6 or 7 45 minute episodes, dual pass, 900 bit rate takes 5-6 hours.  The pre-view funtion is good as it allows you to check the film, soundtrack and subtitles.

In an ideal world, there'd be AutoMKV with the DVDFab interface with a 'basic' and 'advanced' user option. (I'm still on basic)
Logged

bspachman

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 877
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #70 on: February 25, 2007, 07:49:38 pm »

I've been following some of these discussion with interest since I've been back, but I have an interesting problem with how my re-codes interact (pun intended) with MC.

Some background...
I generally back up my TV episodes from DVDs with Nero Recode using its AVC profiles/codecs. As I understand it, this is roughly equivalent to using the AutoMKV toolset and encoding with h264.

Several of the episodes have commentary tracks on them, and I usually include those tracks when I recode them.

The resulting mp4 files play back fine in Nero's ShowTime player (using the GUI to select the audio track) and also play back fine in QuickTime 7 on my Macintosh (although I have to manually enable/disable the audio tracks I want).

MC12, however, plays both audio tracks at the same time. I can't seem to find any way to choose which one of the tracks plays.

Again, this is with h264/AAC-encoded files in mp4 containers, not the actual DVDs themselves...

Any ideas?
brad
Logged

glynor

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 19601
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #71 on: February 26, 2007, 01:08:09 pm »

Yep.  Please see this post: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=38553.0

Make sure to read down till you get to my addition to the thread...  ;D
Logged
"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."

Visit me on the Interweb Thingie: http://glynor.com/

bspachman

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 877
Re: Managing DVD's
« Reply #72 on: February 26, 2007, 02:52:59 pm »

Thanks...follow-ups in that thread...

Best,
brad
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]   Go Up