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[ldoodle]

Hiya,

I'm having a play with video bitstreaming, and for DVD it works fine - get the little logo appear on my receiver.

However, when playing Blu-ray discs, I get this error;

"This output format may not be supported by your hardware. You can use DSP-studio to change the output to a compatible format"

My receiver is an Onkyo TX-SR606, which supports all the HD audio formats, so what gives?

Thanks

[Daveyravey]

You need to set audio settings to wasapi

[NickF]

Why do you want to use bitstreaming?  If you do, you bypass all of the MC audio features in DSP Studio and VideoClock which you need to get smooth video playback.  You gain nothing extra from bitstreaming, provided you have installed dtsdecoderdll.dll.

Nick.

[glynor]

You need to set audio settings to wasapi

Bitstreaming means that MC doesn't decode the audio embedded in a video file, but passes it along untouched.  But, it still needs to be able to "pass it along" in a "language" that your sound card driver understands, so that the "sound device" can then talk to your HTR in the HDMI format that it understands.  Even when bitstreaming, MC uses the Options > Audio > Audio Output Mode setting to decide what "language" to use.  I wasn't aware of this myself until recently.

Event Style WASAPI would be the best, if your HDMI output device supports it correctly.  Vanilla WASAPI if not.

Please Note: If exclusive mode is enabled (which it is by default), then you can't use MC while another application is using your "sound card" (in this case, your HDMI output).  So, for example, if you try to play a video or audio file in MC while your web browser is playing (even paused, often) something else, then it will throw that kind of error.

You gain nothing extra from bitstreaming, provided you have installed dtsdecoderdll.dll.

Generally this is true.  You gain basically only the pretty little lights on your receiver.  And you do sacrifice some features in MC to get them, and sometimes some reliability.

I still bitstream on my HTPC, but more and more I'm waffling on it.  I recently disabled bitstreaming AC3 on the HTPC,  but kept the rest enabled. I found that MC was more reliable at decoding certain AC3 streams than my Denon was... With certain of my own recordings from my HD-PVR, only a few individual channels (Comedy Central and sometimes AMC), the Denon would "skip" and drop the audio out randomly throughout the recordings.  MC decodes the AC3 just fine, and plays the files back perfectly.  It was odd that it only happened on a few random channels, but I verified that it happened even if I hooked my cable box up to the Denon directly.

So MC's AC3 decoder is better than the one in my Denon (more error resilient, it would seem).

For now, I've kept MC bitstreaming everything but AC3 in the living room.  But I don't feel like I have a very good reason why I bothered and didn't just turn the whole thing off while I was at it.  My server in the basement doesn't bitstream, and MC handles decoding all the different formats perfectly.

[TMA-1]

I have been born and raised with the notion that bitstreaming is allmost allways preferable to exclude windows in the audio processing as much as possible. I also think that the general feeling is that the reciever almost allways handles audio better then your soundcard and therefore you like it to do the work. Right or wrong, I think thats the reason behind the bitstream popularity.

[NickF]

I have been born and raised with the notion that bitstreaming is allmost allways preferable to exclude windows in the audio processing as much as possible. I also think that the general feeling is that the reciever almost allways handles audio better then your soundcard and therefore you like it to do the work. Right or wrong, I think thats the reason behind the bitstream popularity.

There may be some justification in this for audio only, i.e. listening to music, but it is definitely questionable, depending on the sound card.  For video, the situation is different.  If you choose bitstreaming, you cannot use VideoClock so MC cannot make the adjustments necessary to give you good, smooth payback.  I couldn't do without that.  You also can't use Room Correction or Convolution.

Nick.

[InflatableMouse]

When you let MC do the decoding, the signal is still sent digitally to your DAC or receiver but in multichannel LPCM. It's not like your bypassing your expensive DAC's.

If you ask me, best of both worlds (coming from someone who used to bitstream too ).

[Jong]

And multi-channel PCM over HDMI, using WASAPI does, precisely, bypass all processing by Windows of the audio stream. It is as pure as you want it to be. Unless you do some deliberate JRiver trickery, the only thing the PC is doing is decoding the audio, which in the case of almost all bluray is a lossless conversion, a bit like unpacking a Winzip file (if that wasn't lossless your program's would not run afterwards). Bugs aside (which both PC decoders AND receivers had in the early days, but which are now resolved) it is simply impossible for a receiver to do it any better than a PC

[BartMan01]

You gain basically only the pretty little lights on your receiver.

Hey, I paid a lot for those little lights - and I want to see them.

All kidding aside, I use bit-streaming on my main system and the primary reason is the feedback I get from the receiver on what audio track it is playing.  If MC could be set to display at the start of playback what audio track/format it is currently using, that would solve that.  I really don't want to scroll around with up or down arrow for every single video to make sure it has chosen my preferred audio track.  And yes, I know there are features in MC to remember the last chosen track - assuming this content has been played by MC before and no one changed the track the last time it was played.  I also know it tries to choose the 'best' track automatically for new content, but I have seen that not work the way I want too.  With bit-streaming, a quick glance at my receiver at the start of playback tells me all I need to know.  Eventually my receiver will be moved out of line of sight, but for now it is the easiest way to check.

I guess if I ever had issues with smooth playback or audio glitches that might be a reason to let MC do the conversion - but so far everything has been rock solid on this system.  The only system I can't get smooth playback on 100% is the one where I DON'T use bit-streaming.

One question though.  If you set MC to do the decoding does it only pass the number of channels actively being used - or does it convert everything to 5.1/7.1 LPCM?  For example, if it is a 2.0 track does it just sent L/R LPCM or does it send 5/7.1 LPCM?

[NickF]

One question though.  If you set MC to do the decoding does it only pass the number of channels actively being used - or does it convert everything to 5.1/7.1 LPCM?  For example, if it is a 2.0 track does it just sent L/R LPCM or does it send 5/7.1 LPCM?

Go to Tools > Options > Audio > Settings > DSP & output format > Output Format and for Channels, choose "Source number of channels.

Nick.

[CountryBumkin]

I have been born and raised with the notion that bitstreaming is allmost allways preferable

HA ha, they didn't have bitstreaming when I was born. Didn't even have digital music. Actually I think sound was just being invented. 

[TMA-1]

My first spoken word as a toddler was "Pulse code modulation" while playing with my pacifier. 

[Micromecca]

Glad I found this thread as I've discovered (what appears to be) odd behaviour with bitstreaming 
If I enable bitsreaming for None-HD Dolby Digital & DTS and then play a blu-ray with DTS-HD-MA why does MC bitstream the DTS core instead of uncompressing and sending the LPCM?
(with all bitsreaming disabled DTS-HD-MA is sent as LPCM as expected)

cheers
Marty

[glynor]

DTS-MA bitstreams properly here.

What is your setting under Options > Video > General > Bitstreaming set to, specifically.  Your description of how you have it set up is confusing.

[Micromecca]

Hi, I realise now that my question might not make much sense if your not 'here' lets try this again..

I am not trying to Bitstream DTS-HD-MA, my AV Processor can only handle LPCM HR Audio wise (no DTS-HD-MA or Dolby True HD Support) so I'm quite happy with JRiver unpacking those codecs for me and sending it as PCM over HDMI, my query is why, when I enable bitstreaming for standard DTS does Media Centre stop sending the DTS-HD-MA as LPCM and start bitstreaming the DTS Core instead?

cheers
Marty

[Matt]

I am not trying to Bitstream DTS-HD-MA, my AV Processor can only handle LPCM HR Audio wise (no DTS-HD-MA or Dolby True HD Support) so I'm quite happy with JRiver unpacking those codecs for me and sending it as PCM over HDMI, my query is why, when I enable bitstreaming for standard DTS does Media Centre stop sending the DTS-HD-MA as LPCM and start bitstreaming the DTS Core instead?

This is just how it works.  The bitstreaming setting (even of the DTS core) will take precedence.

I'd recommend not bitstreaming anything.  The computer is the best decoder anyway.

[glynor]

I'd recommend not bitstreaming anything.  The computer is the best decoder anyway.

Agreed.  If your external decoder isn't capable of some formats that you might need to use (particularly the "HD" ones) you are almost certainly best to bitstream nothing at all.

[Micromecca]

This is just how it works.  The bitstreaming setting (even of the DTS core) will take precedence.

Thanks Matt, if it's intended behaviour so be it   I presumed that the option to bitstream only applied if it was a source match.

cheers
Marty

[glynor]

bitstream only applied if it was a source match.

The problem is that DTS-MA does match DTS.  DTS-MA is an extension to the DTS spec, and "looks like" any other DTS stream to the stream parser until it has been decoded.

[Micromecca]

The problem is that DTS-MA does match DTS.  DTS-MA is an extension to the DTS spec, and "looks like" any other DTS stream to the stream parser until it has been decoded.

I fail to understand how it is a 'problem' when my blu-ray player manages to tell the difference and bitstream standard DTS or DD and then send DTS-HD-MA or Dolby True HD as LPCM if set to do so, but I already mentioned that I'm happy with it if its intended behaviour for MC.

Marty