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Author Topic: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help  (Read 6909 times)

timmotte

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hi,

i already looked up the internet but couln`t find much informations. i got 8 analog outputs from pc. i would like to aktivate the front (for stereo purposes) while running in a normal 5.2 cinema setup (movies). could someone write a "how to use mc/p.e. to setup actic speakers and 5.1".

thanks for your time.

jriver is a hell of a software but do not adresses all its "gifts". kinda funny thought.



cheers tim
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natehansen66

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2012, 12:51:00 pm »

With 8 output channels available, and looking to keep a 5.1 setup that leaves you with 4 channels. Just to be clear, are the speakers you want to run active 2-ways?

Do you know anything about designing crossovers? Do you have a microphone? If the answer is no to the last 2 questions I'd suggest starting to learn about speaker design before plunging in, unless this is a learning exercise. If you answered yes, forget my last suggestion  ;D.

The reason there's nothing in the Wiki is AFAIK the PEQ wasn't created with full active setups in mind. There are several of us using it for this though, but no one has gotten around to making an entry. I've got a bit of a how-to that I send to people who PM me on various forums wondering how to do this in MC. I can post it up if you still want to go forward.
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timmotte

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2012, 04:16:34 pm »

hi nate,

i do appriate your thoughts. thank you.

im am very musik ethusiastic and i try to figer out as much as possible by myself. i would love to get the stone rolling, i just need a point where to start from. my frontspeaker are 3-way but i would start with activating just the woofers and delay for mid/hi (of course keeping the passiv crossover for mid hi). those speakers are from the diy brand visaton and called "concord wg" (2 woofer/2mid/1hi , around 1400eur for diy parts) -> http://boxsim-db.de/concorde-wg/    in total i have build 4 stereo pairs of speakers.

i do have a behringer 8000 mic (not yet callibr.) and infrasonicquartett soundcard (with 48v micamp). for measurement i use "arta"-demo. i know the basics about how to do it theoreticaly but i would`t call myself being more then a advanced user. for now i just got 4 analog outputs unbalanced (6.3 klinke) and i would like to experimenting just for stereo. if i get it working i would add as much outputs as needed.

my amp would be a old but good denon avc 11sr with 7 channels (180w/6 ohm) plus 2 subamps.

what kind of hardware would you suggest for analog outputs (unbalanced or switchable).

i hope my backround is worth sharing your knowlege and time. pls write a "how to". thank you

excuse my poor english and ask if i misswrote something.

tim

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natehansen66

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2012, 05:04:54 pm »

You want to learn, cool! Here's a run-down on a 2-way crossover in the PEQ. You may have to use different channels than the Sub and Center I use in the example. It depends on how your soundcard routes it, although I'd bet your card would "see" MC's Sub and Center channels as 3 and 4.

The main thing in doing a crossover with J River is getting the channels routed properly. Go to the DSP Studio-Output Format. Select the number of channels that you need from the drop-down menu on the right. It sounds like you're doing 2-ways so 4 channels will work. Make sure "Mixing" is set to no up mixing or down mixing.

One thing you need to understand, is that the different sub-menus of the DSP Studio that are listed on the left can be moved up and down in order (except for Output Format and Volume Leveling, these are locked). This is important because these are processed in order from top to bottom. If it isn't already third from the top, move the Parametric Equalizer up under Volume Leveling. Then in the PEQ click Commands/Add/Mix Channels. This will allow you to tell JR which channel goes where, because until you tell it otherwise it only sends the signal to L & R. After you click "Mix Channels" choose Left for the "Source", and Center for the "Destination." For "Mode" select Copy. This will copy the Left signal to the Center channel. Now click "Commands" and add another mix channel filter, you'll see another one added to the list of filters. For this one choose Right for the "Source" and Subwoofer for the "Destination." Now you have 2 channels with a left signal and 2 with a right. I'd use the Left channel for your tweeter/mid and the Center channel for your woofer. Your Right channel would then be your other tweeter/mid and the Sub channel would be for your other woofer.

From there you can use whatever filters you like from the Commands button to do your eq/crossover, making sure you assign the filters to the correct channel. The filter list works like the DSP Studio sub menus in that it works in order from top down. You can drag filters up and down in the list. Make sure that any eq/crossover filters are below the channel mix filters in the list. Any filters you put ahead of the channel mix filters will be done globally to the L & R channels, which will affect all 4 channels.

In order to do measurements processed through MC you'll have to use the Loopback feature. This thread: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=70242.0 will tell you how to do that.

As far as soundcards go there's a bunch of PCI cards geared to gamers that should work. I use a 12-channel pro interface, but that's a good bit more expensive then a gamer card. Depends on what you want to spend. I'd wait and see if you can get it to work with what you've got first.....
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timmotte

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2012, 05:27:43 pm »

thank you nate,

i got it so far, good writing. i will try it out.

would you give a example for combined activ cross front and 5.1 setup? because if you copy fr to c and sw these channels are missing for 5.1? or do they jump automatically to the next output in order?

tim
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JimH

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2012, 06:01:23 pm »

Thanks, Nate.  I added this thread to the wiki under Parametric Equalizer.
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natehansen66

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2012, 06:27:06 pm »

thank you nate,

i got it so far, good writing. i will try it out.

would you give a example for combined activ cross front and 5.1 setup? because if you copy fr to c and sw these channels are missing for 5.1? or do they jump automatically to the next output in order?

tim

You could use SL and SR instead of Center and sub since you aren't using the side surrounds. I figured since you only have a 4 channel card we'd start simple, and it would probably "see" MC's Cen and Sub as channels 3-4. Once you've got an 8 channel card you should be OK routing to the side channels, or not. It all depends on how the soundcard does the routing, it may see MC's Side channels as the rears and vice versa. For example my interface routes MC's side channels to 7-8, and the rears to 5-6.
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timmotte

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2012, 01:31:16 am »

you are right, just trying to get a full picture. your post was very helpfull. now its up to me. next thing to do, "loopback"-function.... for now i will stick to 4 channel stereo. btw i i have a few room accoustick treatments like roof and front-absorber. which soundriver and specification do you use. i used to use waspi eventstyle with standart buffer....

could you give a few hardware examples you recmomend or have expirience with  like.

entry class: good gaming cards
mid: m-audio 1010
highclass: rme xxxx

or combined with numbers of channels. i think this would give this thread a good "roundup"

thy tim
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natehansen66

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Re: how to use p. equalizer for activ front and 5.2 setup--need help
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2012, 04:10:15 pm »

I don't have much experience with different soundcards/interfaces. I can tell you that the onboard 7.1 out on my Acer sounds like crap  ::) , but it worked well enough to convince me that PC based speaker management is the way to go.

Check out the "Soundcards, DACs, Receivers, and Speakers" sub-forum, there's some threads there that should give you some idea of what people are using. I use an Echo Audiofire 12, my review thread is there as well.
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