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Author Topic: Any playback issues left?  (Read 36308 times)

Matt

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Any playback issues left?
« on: April 30, 2013, 09:18:50 am »

If anyone is still experiencing audio playback issues (skips, stutters, etc.), please post details in this thread.

Before posting, make sure you're using the latest build of MC in case the issue has been fixed.

When posting details, please include information about what audio hardware you're using and also steps to reproduce the issue.

Thanks for any help.
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scottlf

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2013, 09:55:36 am »

Playback stuttering continues. I can't seem to find anything consistent. Most of the time -- but not always -- it will stop if I stop and restart playback of a particular file. I have also tried turning the "play from memory" feature ON and then OFF. Sometimes it changes the problem in the moment but not permanently.

It *might* be more associated with higher-res files than 44.1/16, but I haven't found that to be true across the board.

One more thing: it tends to start very subtly, just a few minor blips, usually next to inaudible. Then it builds and within 10 seconds or so has become full-on stutters.

Files: FLAC and ALAC. Through USB to VLink-192, hence through coaxial to Audio Research DAC7. 8-core MacPro, 10.8.3. The audio files are on a separate drive from the operating system; both drives are internal.
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mvilla

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2013, 04:49:09 pm »

Hi Matt,
following your request I'm now using your thread (my previous notes are in the thread "Clicks").
Something improved since I had reported this issue to the forum, but I still have problems when I move from a HD file to a redbook one. Below my sequence of actions:

1. Play a high resolution file for some seconds
2. While the playback is in progress, double click on a 44.1 kH file
3. I hear a strong "click" and then the playback starts disturbed (stuttering)
4. I stop the playback, wait a couple of seconds, and then play again. No more noise
5. Then double click on another file, redbook or HD. No more click, no more noise
 
So it seems it happens when you change fro HD to Redbook

I'm using your 18.0.174 release
OS is ML 10.8.3
My hardware is MacMini i5, 8Gb RAM
DAC is ECHO Firewire4.

Many thanks for your support
Massimo
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kiwi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2013, 12:57:55 am »

I hear periodic "pops" during playback.

Most recently they were high rez files played back at 48/24 since my DACs USB input is limited to 48/24.  I'll be moving it to toslink soon, so it will bump up to 96/24.

I'm using your 18.0.174 release
OS is ML 10.8.3
My hardware is MacMini i7, 8Gb RAM

I'm happy to pull logs or otherwise try to get more info to help.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2013, 07:05:23 am »

Can you tell if this only happens when the sample rate changes?

Please specify the DAC or audio output device you're using.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2013, 09:36:59 am »

This wiki topic on sound problems may be useful:
http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Sound_Problems
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2013, 09:37:55 am »

Is USB 3.0 involved in these problems?

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=80298.0
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mvilla

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2013, 10:14:51 am »

Is USB 3.0 involved in these problems?

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=80298.0

Not in my case, Jim.
My DAC is connected via FireWire
Massimo
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2013, 12:07:45 pm »

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mvilla

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2013, 12:17:20 pm »

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scottlf

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2013, 12:59:08 pm »

Apropos my reply #1 above -- I'm using USB 2.0 to connect to my V-Link.
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johnjen

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2013, 03:55:08 pm »

At the start of every track there is a long pause before the audio begins.  At higher sample rates (192, 176, even 96) there is a very short skip ahead while playing the track.  I just updated the firmware (to the latest version) in the PWDII which helped on this issue but did not totally 'fix' it.

Occasionally the audio track will just stop altogether but can be re-started.
This is a random event and thus far I can't tell what is triggering it.

Occasionally the audio track will just stop altogether but can't be re-started.  In fact the app can (but not always) crash.
This is due to the music servers loosing their connection and a couple of dialog boxes pop up saying so.  Again I don't know what causes this but it only happens after several hours of playing.

edit: the app window still disappears when clicking on an AUDIO choice or Services and Plug-ins choice etc. as I have previously mentioned.  This happens during the initial set up to play an album right after starting the app, and also later when switching views or going into different control mode screens (DSP Studio, Playback options, Import, Options etc.)
 
Running the Media Network servers to the PWDII thru my network switch to a single Mac (low traffic).
Mac Pro 10.6.8  x.x.174

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kiwi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2013, 04:15:36 pm »

Is anyone using JRemote?

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=79104.msg546427#msg546427

I am using JRemote, but only generally to control the music, not to play back through the remote.
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kiwi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2013, 04:17:09 pm »

Can you tell if this only happens when the sample rate changes?

Please specify the DAC or audio output device you're using.

I'll try changing the sample rates and see.  Sorry thought I'd mentioned the DAC.

It's an Emotiva XDA-1, via USB.

It is on a USB 3.0 port, but it's OS X, so I don't think that's the issue... or at least windows drivers won't help it :-/
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dfs9393

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2013, 06:16:30 pm »

18.0.176
10.8.3
Windows server, mac client

When playing back any type of music to any sound output, the first 10-30 seconds are clipped off.  The position timer shows 0:00.  Rewinding or stopping and starting again have no effect.
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Matt

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2013, 06:20:22 pm »

18.0.176
10.8.3
Windows server, mac client

When playing back any type of music to any sound output, the first 10-30 seconds are clipped off.  The position timer shows 0:00.  Rewinding or stopping and starting again have no effect.

What audio hardware are you using?

If DLNA, please use a separate thread since that doesn't use the JRiver audio engine.  Sorry for not clarifying this in the original post.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2013, 06:32:12 pm »

I'll try changing the sample rates and see. 
The DAC may have trouble switching, so test a mix of files with different sample rates.  Then test a set of files at a single sample rate.  Start at 44.1 and work your way up.
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DunderXIII

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2013, 09:19:44 pm »

I do have stuttering problems, not always, but often (several times per listening session). When it happens my routine is to turn off all DSP effects (upsampling, reverb and headphone). Playback a file at 44khz (it will stutter), press stop, play again and it will be fine. Then I can go and play a 96khz file, turn on the effects etc. It's really annoying :-) but I can manage to get some continuous playback time. Sometimes though it almost impossible to get it to work, I try different things to no avail. It seems to do it more on 88/96khz files, but I am not sure at all. I upsample everything to 96khz, so maybe the DAC think it's still in 44khz mode?

It may have something to do with 24 bits too. I forced the DAC in 16 bits in Audio MIDI config and it seemed fine after. I put it back to 24 bits and had no sound at all. I put it back to 16 bits and got stuttering again.. anyway.

Seems to be linked with the DAC interface; I use a Hifimediy SABRE 96/24 DAC. It's not the DAC per say (Fidelia, Audirvana etc. don't have that issue) but it's almost certainly linked to it. I use a Macbook Pro '08 and it doesn't have USB 3.0 ports.

Thanks
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DunderXIII

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2013, 09:26:49 pm »

This wiki topic on sound problems may be useful:
http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Sound_Problems

I only see instructions for Windows drivers :-)
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kejm42

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2013, 03:57:42 am »

Hi,

I am still encountering playback stuttering in two scenarios. The first is when following the steps mvilla described, changing from 24/96 to 16/44. The second is when upsampling files to 24/96 (in an attempt to prevent the first issue.)

My sequence of actions:
1. Change the Output Format to play all files at 24 bit with a sample rate of 96,000 Hz.
2. Begin playback. Playing works fine and upsampling initially resolves the issue of switching between sample rates. However
3. Stop playback
4. Begin playback again. At this point, any file I play stutters, regardless of resolution.

Most of the time, I am able to get the stuttering to stop by
1. Stopping playback
1. Unchecking the Output Format box in Playback options
2. Saving changes. At this point, if I start playing again, it continues to stutter.
3. Stopping playback, opening Playback options again, making no modifications, and hitting Ok to close.

File format: ALAC, stored on internal hard drive
DAC: Fiio E10, connected via USB
Hardware: mid-2011 iMac running 10.8.3
Software: Media Center version 18.0.176 alpha

Please let me know if there is any other information I can provide.

KEJM
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alecbarnes

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2013, 03:58:04 am »

Hi guys. First post.

Been having clicks during playback. Unfortunatley it's intermittant and I can't pin it down to any particular sample rate/ or sample rate change. Watching these forums for a while hoping that updates might fix it, but still no joy.

Just realised that the playlist I'm listening to right now has stopped clicking while listening to 96/24. Want back to a 44.1/16 track I was listening to earlier and no clicks! No restart, no change to the playlist. Strange.

Build 18.0.174
Mac 10.7.5 Core i5 2.5GHz 4GB RAM
Classe CP-800 DAC using USB asynchronous connection.
Files stored on 2.5" HDD attached via thunderbolt

No clicks when playback made with Audirvana. Hope this is enough info.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2013, 07:06:45 am »

Been having clicks during playback. Unfortunatley it's intermittant and I can't pin it down to any particular sample rate/ or sample rate change. Watching these forums for a while hoping that updates might fix it, but still no joy.

Just realised that the playlist I'm listening to right now has stopped clicking while listening to 96/24. Want back to a 44.1/16 track I was listening to earlier and no clicks! No restart, no change to the playlist. Strange.

Build 18.0.174
Mac 10.7.5 Core i5 2.5GHz 4GB RAM
Classe CP-800 DAC using USB asynchronous connection.
Files stored on 2.5" HDD attached via thunderbolt
Welcome to the forum.  When you report a problem, please check to see if a newer build is available and try it first.  18.0.176 is available at the top of this board.

We appreciate your help in finding the problem, and thank you for your patience.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #22 on: May 02, 2013, 07:11:45 am »

I only see instructions for Windows drivers :-)
USB 3.0 is new enough that there may also be Mac problems (and solutions).
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #23 on: May 02, 2013, 07:14:04 am »

I do have stuttering problems, not always, but often (several times per listening session). When it happens my routine is to turn off all DSP effects (upsampling, reverb and headphone). Playback a file at 44khz (it will stutter), press stop, play again and it will be fine. Then I can go and play a 96khz file, turn on the effects etc. It's really annoying :-) but I can manage to get some continuous playback time. Sometimes though it almost impossible to get it to work, I try different things to no avail. It seems to do it more on 88/96khz files, but I am not sure at all. I upsample everything to 96khz, so maybe the DAC think it's still in 44khz mode?

This kind of detail is very helpful.  Thank you. 

When it happens next time, try powering down the DAC.  Wait ten seconds and power it up again.

Also try disconnecting and reconnecting.
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Matt

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #24 on: May 02, 2013, 10:08:07 am »

Thanks for all the details so far.

We're going to allow a little more control over audio hardware buffer sizes in the next build.

If you're having clicks, please try the different settings once the build is available.  The new option in Options > Audio > Core Audio > Output mode settings... is called 'Buffer size'.

It will offer:
Maximum (power of two)
Maximum
Hardware default

Please note that 'Hardware default' will only be the default if you haven't used the other two modes during the program run.  Because once you set the buffer size, it seems to stick, even after releasing everything core audio and getting it again.
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alecbarnes

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2013, 10:43:10 am »

I returned home today (extended trip away) and updated before listening - and MC updated to the version I stated. I just updated again, and am currently waiting for the download to complete, however, in the interim I have checked the list of "fixes" in the x.176 build. It states nothing about fixing clicks/stutters.

Please accept that I am trying to contribute to the troubleshooting pool of information, and if you require more info, please ask, and I will try my best to oblige you, given what little spare time I have.

I have contributed to similar development collaborations before, and I sincerely apologise if anything I post has been covered in previous posts. The reason I have been reluctant to contribute until now is that I simply don't have time to trawl through all of the other posts. The problem still persists, and I thought that by listing my configuration - it might be helpful to the cause.
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #26 on: May 02, 2013, 10:49:13 am »

I'm sorry you seem to have taken offense.  But bug reports on versions even a day or two old won't get any attention.

That said, we take this problem extremely seriously.  It will get fixed soon.
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Matt

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2013, 04:02:33 pm »

The buffer settings I mentioned above are now public:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=80338.0

Testing and feedback appreciated.
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DunderXIII

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #28 on: May 02, 2013, 09:10:33 pm »

If you want I could record a video of the playback issue when I get it, it could help you understand what happens by hearing the kind of stuttering. If that would be helpful, is there a section or email adress where I could send it? Sometimes seeing it first hand brings up solutions; it least it works for me when debugging :-)

I use 177 and played with the buffer settings but it doesn't change much.
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DunderXIII

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #29 on: May 02, 2013, 09:13:05 pm »

USB 3.0 is new enough that there may also be Mac problems (and solutions).

Ok maybe, but there's no USB 3.0 on my 2008 MBP ;-) Thanks though
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johnjen

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #30 on: May 02, 2013, 09:30:45 pm »

Could you explain the difference between Max and Max2?

Just curious

JJ

Thanks for all the details so far.

We're going to allow a little more control over audio hardware buffer sizes in the next build.

If you're having clicks, please try the different settings once the build is available.  The new option in Options > Audio > Core Audio > Output mode settings... is called 'Buffer size'.

It will offer:
Maximum (power of two)
Maximum
Hardware default

Please note that 'Hardware default' will only be the default if you haven't used the other two modes during the program run.  Because once you set the buffer size, it seems to stick, even after releasing everything core audio and getting it again.
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Matt

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #31 on: May 02, 2013, 10:04:04 pm »

Could you explain the difference between Max and Max2?

If hardware says "I can support a buffer up to 9000 samples", the maximum is 9000 and the maximum power of two is 8192 (2^13).
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Philthy

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #32 on: May 02, 2013, 11:03:08 pm »

v .177
OSX 10.8.3
Older Mac Mini
Musical Fidelity V-Link Asynchronous USB/SPDIF 24/96 Digital Converter

If I set everything below 96000 to "No Change" and "Source Bitdepth" -  All music still stutters and clicks after a short while. All formats, all resolutions.

I tried all three buffer settings. No change.

I set everything back to 24/96000 locked, plays fine.
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johnjen

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #33 on: May 02, 2013, 11:08:22 pm »

:thumb

JJ

If hardware says "I can support a buffer up to 9000 samples", the maximum is 9000 and the maximum power of two is 8192 (2^13).
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kiwi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #34 on: May 02, 2013, 11:09:06 pm »

v .177
OSX 10.8.3
15" MBP

I was playing with an ODAC for my DAC.  (http://www.jdslabs.com/item.php?fetchitem=39) and 96/24 music output at 96/24... and was noticing some little "clicks" in the output.  These were from HDTracks tracks.

Btw, would it be useful for us to record any of this?

I've cleared my logs to see if I can find anything in the logs.
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kejm42

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #35 on: May 03, 2013, 04:04:53 am »

In my initial testing of v.177, setting the buffer option to "Hardware Default" seems to have resolved both stuttering issues I was hearing (switching from 24/96 to 16/44 and upsampling to 96,000 Hz).

"Hardware Default" was the first option I tried, so I tested the other selections as well. With either "Maximum Supported" or "Maximum (power of two)," I continue to hear stuttering when upsampling lower-res files, as described above. However, when I switched back to "Hardware Default" (closing and reopening the program between tests), playback no longer stuttered.

I'll do some further testing over the weekend and let you know if I'm still having any issues.

- KEJM
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InfernoSTi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #36 on: May 03, 2013, 06:59:25 am »

Per my other thread, DSD playback is intermittent: sometimes it plays flawlessly while other times it plays with no audio output (but the time bar moves and it appears to be playing in every other way). PCM playback is great at 16/44 through 24/192. 

Sonore exD DAC
Build 177 on 10.8.3
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Mikeau

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #37 on: May 03, 2013, 07:52:50 am »

I was having playback (stuttering ) issues when switching from 96/24 tracks back to 44.1/16 tracks..  These persisted until build 177.  I slelected no change for sample rate and source bit depth and in output mode setting selected hardware default. No stuttering when changing from 96/24 back to 44.1/16 . This is the first time for me since using JRiver for MAC that this problem appears to be resolved!
I have not tried extended playing sessions yet and will do so. But so far, so good.
Other settings in output mode resulted in stuttering playback (maximum, maximun squared)

Hardware is 2012 Mac Minin running OSX 10.8.3. Library is on a USB 3 external drive, output to DAC is via USB.  DAC is VALAB dual WM8741 (Wolfson)unit.

Thanks guys for your efforts much appreciated. :)

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InfernoSTi

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #38 on: May 03, 2013, 09:23:13 am »

Also, DSP Studio no longer allows me to change sample rates in Build 177 (worked fine previous builds).

John
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laerm

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #39 on: May 03, 2013, 11:08:58 am »

Build 175 was the first one that felt pretty solid to me when using MC Mac to connect to a Windows server. No giant buffering piles, no starting songs ~1 minute in, no issues with gapless playback. 177 appears to be a step backward in this regard: songs are starting 10-20 seconds in (but timers all say 0:00), gapless playback is iffy, and, worst of all, lots of little pops and glitchy sounds.

10.8.3
mp3s
core audio
wireless connection on client, wired server and music NAS

Thanks –
Micah

EDIT: apparently I am getting lots of "missed" tracks, too. I sent a track to Play Doctor and it's only played 5 of the 8 tracks so far. The other three have the yellow ! next to them, even though I can double-click on them and they will play.
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Philthy

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #40 on: May 03, 2013, 01:45:39 pm »

Also, DSP Studio no longer allows me to change sample rates in Build 177 (worked fine previous builds).

John

It's buggy. If you put a check mark to activate another module, you can then go back and change them. Then you can uncheck that module again.
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mvilla

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #41 on: May 04, 2013, 05:54:33 am »


.... setting the buffer option to "Hardware Default" seems to have resolved stuttering issues I was hearing (switching from 24/96 to 16/44 ......).

"Hardware Default" was the first option I tried, so I tested the other selections as well. With either "Maximum Supported" or "Maximum (power of two)," I continue to hear stuttering ....



Quoted !

This has been the first time since mid March that I do not hear any stuttering. Well done !
It remains a single spike when you change resolution from HD to 44.1 kH and I'm sure you will fix it as well :-)

Massimo
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vq6shadow

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #42 on: July 14, 2013, 04:18:58 pm »

I am getting the "Something went wrong with playback" issue with version 206. I moved my files to a portable hard drive, and MC imported the all but ten of the files ( I'll address that later) but none of the files are playing. I tried playing them through iTunes and no problems. Anything you can suggest would be appreciated.
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GertSterner

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #43 on: July 14, 2013, 04:32:18 pm »

I just started using JRiver today. I downloaded the latest beta. I use a Mac Mini. OS X 10.7.5 with a USB Sound card from M-Audio called Audiophile USB. It has worked for years with iTunes.

I have two problems:
- some times I get a large bang in the speakers when I change album. I fear for the life of my tweeters when it happens. [SOLVED] Thanks to Jim's post I now think it has gone.
- I can't change the volume from my iPhone with JRemote. It words fine with Apple's Remote app on iTunes. [SOLVED] I just needed to change JRiver to use "Internal Volume" instead of default "System Volume". :-)

Sound is better then iTunes so I like JRiver already :-)

Kind regards
Gert Sterner
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JimH

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2013, 05:58:00 pm »

Welcome.  Some DAC's make a noise when switching modes (bitrate or sample rate).  You can use MC's DSP Studio/Output Settings to resample everything to the highest format your DAC will support.
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jtwrace

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #45 on: July 14, 2013, 06:40:44 pm »

You can use MC's DSP Studio/Output Settings to resample everything to the highest format your DAC will support.
Is this advantageous?  I have a Lynx Hilo.

Do you think you will ever do an optimum setup guide for audio on Mac?
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W10 NUC i7 (Gen 10) > (Audiolense FIR) > Motu UltraLite mk5 > (4) Hypex NCore NC502MP > JBL M2 Master Reference +4 subs

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GertSterner

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #46 on: July 19, 2013, 10:33:45 am »

Welcome.  Some DAC's make a noise when switching modes (bitrate or sample rate).  You can use MC's DSP Studio/Output Settings to resample everything to the highest format your DAC will support.


Thanks Jim!

Kind regards
Gert
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rrw

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #47 on: December 29, 2013, 01:41:53 pm »

Hallo

I switched to an iMac 27'' i5 /32 GB/512 SSD because my MacPro had a motherboard issue.
Since the switch, JRiver DOES NOT WORK with my PS Audio PW DAC!!!! (newest iPad version of J remote)
Although I have the data on a WD Duo Thunderbolt drive, J Remote does play he file for some second then stops and freezes.
AWFUL!

Any idea? I use the latest version on Media Center 19 (19.0.100) on MacOS 10.9

Please help! Kind regards René
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Three

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #48 on: January 05, 2014, 01:35:26 pm »

Yes. Sometimes the music stops and the player says "Buffering". I have tried setting pre-buffer from 2 to 20 seconds and haven't solved the problem. I have also tried setting "play from memory" on and off. Still occasionally have buffering issues. I have a mac mini dedicated to music playback. No other uses. In fact, no application software at all but support for music playback.

I suspect the issue may be related to the use of a WD NAS, which contains all my music, and associated network congestion or need to reconnect to the storage device. I would be happy, because it is a dedicated player, if I could somehow buffer an entire song into memory, or even and entire playlist (or the next dozen songs or so) and continue on a rolling basis, and thus network and/or slow storage reconnection issues would have no impact.

BTW, MC 19 is the ONLY media player I've found that really allows me to use my GigaPort HD+ as I want - feeding stereo signals to four different amplifiers I have scattered about the house. Thank you! (Stereo in a 7.1 container with channel remapping works!)

Doug
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Three

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Re: Any playback issues left?
« Reply #49 on: January 05, 2014, 01:39:05 pm »

BTW, I am running MC 19.088 on a dedicated bare-bones mac-mini  - 2.5 GHz processor with 4GB memory. But I dodn't suppose any of that should be a limitation. My NAS is WD "MyCloud". Also dedicated to music.

Three
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