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[JimH]

I posted this on AVSForum a couple of days ago:

Originally Posted by notek View Post

Lutron RadioRA 2 is the more powerful system than Caseta. It has occupancy sensors, keypads, and more, but does not have Cloud (so you can not control it from afar without additional setup, but on the other hand it always works even if internet or Cloud is down).
I have the same RadioRa switches and I love them, but as you say, they're not connected to the rest of the world.

I'm also trying to learn how to connect them and I understand that you can add network control.

I'm interested in others' opinions on what I've learned so far.

ZigBee and Z-wave seem to be the leading mesh networks for device control.

Insteon is also a player.

There are specialized companies in this area like Control4 and Crestron, but they seem less open.

There are some newer companies with some momentum:

Smart Things, which I believe was acquired by Samsung in 2014.

If This Then That or IFTTT (a venture backed control company).

I bought a couple of smart bulbs this week and tried connecting them. LIFX and LG. I didn't do very well. One had a login problem. The other required a Z-Wave controller (and gateway).

I also bought a smart switch from Belkin. Belkin makes a line of consumer devices under the WEMO brand. I plugged a lamp into it and now I can switch it on and off from my phone.

I bought a Nest thermostat and replaced my old one. It ran, but didn't work. On the Nest site, I filled out the compatibility form and I failed. So I unwired it and rewired my old thermostat. Luckily, it worked.

I've seen a couple of Z-wave add-ons for the Raspberry Pi that looked promising.

[glynor]

FYI, the Belkin WEMO devices have had multiple exploits and the company has responded to security researchers poorly, to say the least (despite their lies to the contrary). Breakdowns of the Belkin issues show, at best, an utter lack of care and understanding about the most basic of security requirements (or, perhaps, intentional attempts to insert backdoors into people's networks, at worst).

Others have been almost as bad.

I'd exercise substantial caution with almost all of these devices. Make sure, if they're on a network at all, that they're on a DMZ or Guest Network. Make sure they're updated, regularly. And even so, don't trust them at all (don't share passwords, for sure).

[JimH]

Then I tested a few more devices.

Belkin WEMO LED Lighting Starter Set (two smart bulbs and a control device) -- After 20 minutes, I wasn't able to get it going and I ran out of time.

D-Link Smart Plug DSP-W215 -- I didn't have too much trouble getting it to switch a lamp off and on.  Maybe 20 minutes.  Account signup was required.

Insteon Starter Kit (Insteon Hub and two Dimmer Modules) -- Good setup, no special trouble.

Now here are the problems.

Nobody in their right mind except a nerd like me is going to have the patience to put every new bulb on their system, complete with IP address.  To be fair, some don't require an IP address, but it still isn't easy.

Every package requires an app.  I downloaded the wrong WEMO app the first time because there are several.

Every app works differently.  You have to study them to turn the switch on or off.

They are expensive.  This will improve over time, but how soon?

Tech support on these must be really awful.  OK sir, now turn the light switch off and back on five times to put it into the rescue mode.

Firmware updates were required several times.

For security, these must be a Bad Person's dream come true.  Each manufacturer usually requires an account signup, and then the devices need to connect to your access point, so passwords are littered about freely.

Insteon and others have a different and, in my opinion, better method.  They only require that a single device (a hub) be connected to the LAN, so authentication is only required once.  Their devices are discovered by the hub, so they appear in their app without having to manually connect each one.  Insteon also uses another nice strategy.  The hubs use both the LAN and the power line to communicate.

Mesh networking is important for the devices that use the ZigBee and Z-Wave protocols.  Each device relays what it receives, so bulbs at the other end of the house work.

[JimH]

FYI, the Belkin WEMO devices have had multiple exploits and the company has responded to security researchers poorly, to say the least (despite their lies to the contrary). Breakdowns of the Belkin issues show, at best, an utter lack of care and understanding about the most basic of security requirements (or, perhaps, intentional attempts to insert backdoors into people's networks, at worst).

Others have been almost as bad.

I'd exercise substantial caution with almost all of these devices. Make sure, if they're on a network at all, that they're on a DMZ or Guest Network. Make sure they're updated, regularly. And even so, don't trust them at all (don't share passwords, for sure).

I was typing my second post before I saw this, but yes.  I agree.  Bob tried hooking up the WEMO switched outlet at work and it didn't go well.  He said the same thing about exploits.

[imugli]

FYI, the Belkin WEMO devices have had multiple exploits and the company has responded to security researchers poorly, to say the least (despite their lies to the contrary). Breakdowns of the Belkin issues show, at best, an utter lack of care and understanding about the most basic of security requirements (or, perhaps, intentional attempts to insert backdoors into people's networks, at worst).

Others have been almost as bad.

I'd exercise substantial caution with almost all of these devices. Make sure, if they're on a network at all, that they're on a DMZ or Guest Network. Make sure they're updated, regularly. And even so, don't trust them at all (don't share passwords, for sure).

And here I was thinking of going down the Z-Wave road...

[JimH]

I received a SmartThings Hub yesterday and it was easy to get running.  Like the Insteon hub, I just plugged it into an Ethernet port on my router.  So there was no fiddly wireless LAN setup required and no network passwords shared with light bulbs.

It supports ZigBee, Z-Wave, and Wi-fi and their Android app works pretty well.

So far, it's the best solution I've found.

Samsung bought the company last year .

[KingSparta]

so are you thinking about turning on and off lightbulbs with Media Center or just playing around.

the problem I have is I don't have a cell phone and really don't want one. I don't answer the two phone numbers I have for the house, And with a cell phone that would make three phones I don't answer.

But To lock the house, and turn on lights would be sort of neat, I could do it on my tablet I might just buy some LED lights with the feature.

[JimH]

There is a related thread here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=99149.0

[Mr ChriZ]

I've always liked the idea of starting a movie and having the lights dim.
I have a B&O television/remote that I'm aware can do stuff like that but I'd have to get a new mortgage to buy the dimmer switch I think.
I like the idea of decking out my whole house like that though.

[raym]

I've always liked the idea of starting a movie and having the lights dim.
I have a B&O television/remote that I'm aware can do stuff like that but I'd have to get a new mortgage to buy the dimmer switch I think.
I like the idea of decking out my whole house like that though.

I wrote an article some time back describing how I do this with Z-Wave and an ordinary IR remote.

http://www.rkmsmarthome.com.au/blog/activate-z-wave-scenes-with-your-ir-remote-control

[JimH]

Nice article.

Can you comment on why Z-Wave and not ZigBee?  Both seem well established.

And who is doing home automation software?

Thanks.

[raym]

Nice article.

Can you comment on why Z-Wave and not ZigBee?  Both seem well established.

And who is doing home automation software?

Thanks.

Thanks.

Z-Wave operates in the sub 1Ghz frequency band so less prone to interference and less power hungry. It also offers the biggest choice in products IMO and the best interoperability.

InControl, HomeSeer, Indigo... There's a number of them in this space now. OpenHAB is open source and gaining momentum right now as well.

[gvanbrunt]

I've always liked the idea of starting a movie and having the lights dim.

I wrote a plug in (very basic) for EventGhost that can be used to do this. I capture events from MC with it and send the commands to my hub via another plug in. Might be worth checking out while you are waiting for JRiver's to get off the ground.

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=92375.0

[imugli]

This today re ZigBee, which I believe Samsung among others use...

http://www.engadget.com/2015/08/07/zigbee-security-flaw/

[gvanbrunt]

So there is another thing JRiver could do to step out ahead of the competition: Detect insecure devices and let consumers know the risks they take, suggest alternatives or work arounds etc.