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[pepar]

I have just gotten to the point in my researching JRiver and how to use it with the infrastructure already in place.  unRAID server .. I need to set up a VM and run Media Server/Media Network from there. Check.

My unRAID loads/runs from a USB thumbdrive, so it's not installed, per se.  I know I can set up the VM and have it be part of the unRAID boot, but can I set up JRiver and have it load from the thumbdrive as well?  Presently the drive is 16GB; is that large enough?

Finally, I used a dual core Pentium for what I thought would be a simple file server.  Do in need to upgrade that to run JRiver media server in a VM?  Ditto the present 8GB of system memory?  Are these questions I should ask on the Lime Technology forum?

Jeff

[mattkhan]

I don't think it is possible to partition the usb drive and use the second partition as a cache drive. You would need to check on their forum to be certain of that though.

8G to run unraid and a single VM for jriver is plenty. Whether a dual core Pentium is sufficient depends on how you use it (and which Pentium it is), if the server never transcodes video then i would think it would be fine. In practice, i think this means your server needs to run the same OS as all the clients.

[pepar]

Thanks.  I have begun to wade into the unRAID VM Wiki and will take up the deeper details on their forum.

Jeff

[blgentry]

VMs are great for lots of things.  For a media server I think it's a foolish endeavor.  Bare metal eliminates a lot of performance concerns, driver issues, and general layering concerns.  Just my opinion.

Brian.

[pepar]

VMs are great for lots of things.  For a media server I think it's a foolish endeavor.  Bare metal eliminates a lot of performance concerns, driver issues, and general layering concerns.  Just my opinion.

Brian.

Thanks for the advice.  I already have a large library on a perfectly working unRAID server.  I had been using Popcorn Hour client streaming devices with my movies but found the software inadequate when it came to adding my music to the server. Research lead me to JRiver. I was about to begin a trial when my dive into JRiver took me to Library, Media Sever and Media Network.  So here I am.

[mattkhan]

For a media server I think it's a foolish endeavor. 

There's no problem doing this on a VM and performance should not be an issue.

[blgentry]

this is a rather non specific and IMO unhelpful statement, there's no problem doing this on a VM and performance should not be an issue.

VMs add a layer of complexity and unknown.  Would this be a problem for a system playing 4k video through HDMI?  Would it be a problem streaming 8 streams of 24/192 stereo?  How about turning 4xDSD into PCM via a direct connected USB DAC?

VMs are potentially an issue any time performance is a factor, or real time processing is required. Both are possible with MC, depending up on how the system will be used.

I think my advice is solid because it avoids all of the uncertainty associated with a VM.  For moderate use of MC, a VM is probably fine.  With my history and experience in computing, I tend to simplify things to make my life easy.

Perhaps I should stop opinionating about these and other topics.  <shrug>

Brian.

[mattkhan]

You haven't asked anything about the intended use of this system nor the hardware so you have no idea whether it is likely a problem or not.

He is talking about adding jriver to what sounds like a relatively moderate system just so it can serve the library to clients that will do the actual playback. He is also talking about adding a VM via mechanism (unraid) that basically does all the configuration for him.

[pepar]

VMs add a layer of complexity and unknown.  Would this be a problem for a system playing 4k video through HDMI?  Would it be a problem streaming 8 streams of 24/192 stereo?  How about turning 4xDSD into PCM via a direct connected USB DAC?

VMs are potentially an issue any time performance is a factor, or real time processing is required. Both are possible with MC, depending up on how the system will be used.

I think my advice is solid because it avoids all of the uncertainty associated with a VM.  For moderate use of MC, a VM is probably fine.  With my history and experience in computing, I tend to simplify things to make my life easy.

Perhaps I should stop opinionating about these and other topics.  <shrug>

Brian.

Is there any *other* way for me to use JRiver to stream my media from my unRAID server? 

No transcoding will be done, just 1920x1080 video going to 1920x1080 displays, and bitstreamed codecs to pre/pro or AVR.  No 4k.  I might convert one DSD stream into PCM on the fly.

[pepar]

You haven't asked anything about the intended use of this system nor the hardware so you have no idea whether it is likely a problem or not.

He is talking about adding jriver to what sounds like a relatively moderate system just so it can serve the library to clients that will do the actual playback. He is also talking about adding a VM via mechanism (unraid) that basically does all the configuration for him.

unRAID boots from a small 16GB thumbdrive.  I haven't gotten to that point yet, but I would guess (hope!) the VM configuration would be part of the settings that unRAID stores on the thumbdrive. (It always remembers my configuration.)  Another detail I haven't gotten to yet is if there is a way to also load Media Server/Media Network from the thumbdrive.

[astromo]

Is there any *other* way for me to use JRiver to stream my media from my unRAID server? 

No transcoding will be done, just 1920x1080 video going to 1920x1080 displays, and bitstreamed codecs to pre/pro or AVR.  No 4k.  I might convert one DSD stream into PCM on the fly.

I have media files on a NAS (not a VM) that shares files via samba on my home LAN. Via Windows, I map these shares as network drives. With MC sitting on a Windows box, Linux box or an Id, I pick up media fine.

Pulling audio works to all the mentioned instances without drama. I routinely grab video for the Windows box, again without difficulty, at 1080p.

Conceptually, a VM NAS could work the same way. Would that work for your set up? Give it a go and see how you travel. It might be a simpler option.

[mattkhan]

unRAID boots from a small 16GB thumbdrive.  I haven't gotten to that point yet, but I would guess (hope!) the VM configuration would be part of the settings that unRAID stores on the thumbdrive. (It always remembers my configuration.)  Another detail I haven't gotten to yet is if there is a way to also load Media Server/Media Network from the thumbdrive.

The VM config file is stored inside an img file (domain.img) that is written to flash drive, the vm image itself is stored on the share on the cache drive that you use to host the images. You don't really need to know the details though, you just need a working unraid setup that supports virtualisation (as described in http://lime-technology.com/wiki/index.php/UnRAID_Manual_6#Virtualization_Host_2)

[pepar]

I have media files on a NAS (not a VM) that shares files via samba on my home LAN. Via Windows, I map these skates as network drives. With MC sitting on a Windows box, Linux box or an Id, I pick up media fine.

Pulling audio works to all the mentioned instances works without drama. I routinely grab video for the Windows box, again without difficulty, at 1080p.

Conceptually, a VM NAS could work the same way. Would that work for your set up? Give it a go and see how you travel. It might be a simpler option.

Uhhh, I have been reading here and the wiki that Media Server (or Media Network - haven't sorted that out yet) needed to be running on the box that stored and served the media files.  You're saying you are not doing that and it works fine?

[pepar]

The VM config file is stored inside an img file (domain.img) that is written to flash drive, the vm image itself is stored on the share on the cache drive that you use to host the images. You don't really need to know the details though, you just need a working unraid setup that supports virtualisation (as described in http://lime-technology.com/wiki/index.php/UnRAID_Manual_6#Virtualization_Host_2)

This helps and the page you linked helps a lot ... a way to easily check my hardware for support, what I might need to beef up. Thanks.

[pepar]

@astromo, @mattkhan - Does JRiver need to run on my unRAID server or not for it to serve my media to my JRiver clients?  Or is it optional with benefits for doing so?  I need to get this answered before I dive deeper into virtual machines.

[mattkhan]

@astromo, @mattkhan - Does JRiver need to run on my unRAID server or not for it to serve my media to my JRiver clients?  Or is it optional with benefits for doing so?  I need to get this answered before I dive deeper into virtual machines.

no, it doesn't need to run on the same box as unraid, this is just a convenient way to use a box that is already on 24/7

fwiw I use my main HTPC as the library server which has unraid user shares mounted as network drives. I leave this on 24/7 and have various machines as clients of that library server. One of those instances happens to run in a vm on the unraid box but that's purely because that server happens to be located near the relevant audio device so it is convenient to do so. If I were starting from scratch now, I would consider running the HTPC as a windows VM in unraid rather than a separate box (but I probably still leave them separate to avoid having one machine going down taking everything out).

[pepar]

Thank you! The big picture of how JRiver works and how it could be used in my scenario is becoming clearer.

Follow-up: Is there a benefit from running JRiver 24/7 other than it is ready to be used any time a user desires? 

[pepar]

I remember what got me to this line of question: For me to have a single library database, I need to have the database on the media file server?  And, if so, I need to run Media Server/Media Network on the file server?  If yes and yes, then I need to continue looking at setting up the virtual machine in unRAID.

Jeff