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[stricko]

Hi there.

I'm pleased to say that between MC24, Windows and nVidia, I now have (mostly) working support for 4K HDR titles. Final bit in the puzzle seems to have been the Optimize Hardware Decoding for Performance option and possibly the recent LAV filters update. All way over my my head, I'm afraid, but thanks for getting this issue sorted.

So now that I've got the whole system running in glorious 4k, I then have a different question. 3d movies are in 1080p and my projector will only allow me to switch into 3d mode if it detects a 1080p input. Is there a way for MC24 to automatically switch screen resolution when it sees a trigger to tell it that a movie is 3d? I'm not aware of any automatic way to determine whether a file is 3d or not, so I'm assuming that the trigger would be a field value (i've got a "3d flag" that I set manually, but could be based on location etc.).

I'm guessing that it would be some sort of custom Display Setting, but any advice on setting this up would be greatly appreciated.

[wer]

Use ZoneSwitch based on the tags, and setup the display modes you need for that zone.  (Create a zone just for 3D playback)

[rec head]

Last I checked I had 3D and UHD working automatically.

I'm pretty sure I have it set to switch in Options->Video Settings->Display Settings.

There are also settings within MadVR.

Here's a couple threads on it:

https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,113893.msg807931.html#msg807931

https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,115543.msg806006.html#msg806006

[TheShoe]

i have all this working.

key for me was setting up madvr profiles, one for 2D and one for 3D.   for the 3D profile i set specific resolutions it would support, eg 1080p23, 1080p24, and so on....

then a simple expression to look at a substring in the filenane for presence of “3D” and choose the right profile.

i think the threads referenced in above reply will help.   happy to share my config and screenshots if you need it

[RoderickGI]

I have all this working automatically and I didn't have to set up any madVR profiles. I just set madVR to decide, and it works.

I'm pretty sure all that is described in the above two threads, but a summary would be nice. I don't have one.

If someone writes up a summary, I will put it in the Wiki somewhere.

[tij]

I assume we are talking about frame pack 3D.

I use MadVR profiles like @TheShoe simply because long time ago there were some issues with Windows 10 unable to switch NVidia cards to 3D mode … and MadVR profiles was the only solution I could find at a time to make it work automatically (coupled with some other workaround tricks)

But now … I think Windows 10 sort this thing out … but I still keep MadVR profiling for 3D just in case.

Before I start … here are my system configuration … Windows 10 Version 1803 (OS Build 17134.345) … NVidia 1070 with GeForce Game Ready Drive 416.34 … MC 24.60 (64 bit) ... 2016 LG OLED65E6T

Desktop set at 2160p@60 ... HDR is off and 3D is off

Just to test what works now … I reset my MadVR profile using [restore default settings.bat] located in MadVR folder (ofcourse I backup my original settings [settings.bin]) here are results:

Step 1
[Tools]->[Options]->[Video]->[General Video Settings]->[Video mode] Red October HQ
[Tools]->[Options]->[Video]->[General Video Settings]->[Enable 3D Blu-ray and MKV 3D decoding] ticked
[Tools]->[Options]->[Video]->[Display Settings]->[Display Settings automatic change mode] ON

3D playback:
3D is SideBySide (SBS)
render resolution 2160p@23 D3D11(8 bit)
output resolution 1080p@23 8 bit
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

4K playback:
render resolution 2160p@23 D3D11(10 bit)
output resolution 2160p@23 8 bit, NV HDR
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

HD playback:
render resolution 2160p@23 D3D11(10 bit)
output resolution 2160p@23 8 bit
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

Step 2
[Tools]->[Options]->[Video]->[General Video Settings]->[...Open madVR Settings (Advanced)...]

in MadVR options

[rendering]->[stereo 3D]

[enable stereo 3D playback] ticked
[wnen playing 2d content] ticked [disable os stereo 3d support for all displays] ticked
[wnen playing 3d content] ticked [enable os stereo 3d support for all displays] ticked
[restore os stereo 3d settings when media player is closed] ticked

3D playback:
3D is detected by TV
render resolution 3360x1890p@23 D3D11(3D)
output resolution 1080p@23 8 bit
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

4K playback:
render resolution 2160p@23 D3D11(10 bit)
output resolution 2160p@23 8 bit, NV HDR
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

HD playback:
render resolution 2160p@23 D3D11(10 bit)
output resolution 2160p@23 8 bit
after playback:
returns to 2160p@60 on stop

So for my sytem ... doing Step 1 and Step 2 enables automatic switching to 3D and 4k and HDR ... so no profoling in MadVR is needed for this to fork for now (i sill use profiling myself simply because i wanna push my system to max for different type of content ... arguably the increase in picture quility is marginal ... but then i would not be using JRiver if quality was not my priority

PS. while watching 3D movie ... if i use TV remote to switch to 2D mode (aka watching 3D movie in 2D ... not all my family is crazy about 3D), automatic switching to 3D will be gone ... ie i have to press 3D button on TV remote to engage 3D (until i switch TV off)

[tij]

I wanted to keep this separate from previous post, which was just plain how to make 3D to autoswitch. Nevertheless some might find what follows interesting.

Note in previous post … once 3D is working … madVR scales my 3D 1080p to some weird resolution (in may case 3360x1890) but TV will still receive 1080p … that's Windows DPI for you (my DPI is set to 175% Scale and Layout). While this might not bother some … it bothered me a lot (since I was not able to set chroma upscaling to max for my 3D) … a walkaround is

1.  go to MC installation folder … find Media Center 24.exe and MC24.exe
2. right click on them ... choose [Properties]->[Compatibility]->[Change high DPI settings] tick [Override high DPI scaling behavior. Scaling performed by:] [Application]

this might introduce some weird DPI results on MC window once movie stops playing (mine works fine now … but I don't exactly recall how I tamed it)

also note that while rendering 2D stuff … madVR renders in 10bit … but TV gets 8bit … this might not bother some too … it bothered me a lot (didn't pay for 12bit TV to watch 8bit on it lol) … so in NVIDIA control panel I set my desktop to 2160p@23 and set output color depth to 12bit (my TV supports it) … then watch 2D movie through MC … and <puff> it output at 12bit (MadVR still renders in 10bit) … then quit MC … reset my desktop to 2160@60 (color depth will drop back to 8bit as 12bit is not supported at 60Hz) … BUT going back to MC and it still gets 12 bit output when watching 23fps content

have to do this "tweaking" for 12bit crap every time I restart my PC (reminds me of 3D problems in the past)

[Hendrik]

a walkaround is

1.  go to MC installation folder … find Media Center 24.exe and MC24.exe
2. right click on them ... choose [Properties]->[Compatibility]->[Change high DPI settings] tick [Override high DPI scaling behavior. Scaling performed by:] [Application]

Please don't recommend doing that. It'll screw over a lot of things in DPI behavior.

[tij]

Please don't recommend doing that. It'll screw over a lot of things in DPI behavior.

I am sorry if I said something wrong ... I did mention that messing with MC DPI will likely screw with MC DPI (fonts either too big or too small ... possibly other layout problems) ... I should have mention though that ppl should not do it unless they absolutely sure they know what they are doing

I just hoped it saved some ppl time to figure what’s happening (took me fair bit of time) ... this problem affects only few (most likely 3D playback only) ... so fix is unlikely to come soon

However, it is a problem ... MC should ignore DPI settings when rendering videos ... scaling video up because of DPI setting then scaling it back down to match output is counterproductive ... not to mention loss of quality

I know the quality issue is highly subjective ... but this would be equivalent to upping sampling rate for music and then reducing it back for output ... pretty sure audiophile will complain (even if most of them cannot hear the difference)

I don’t think madVR report on scaling is misleading as rendering times increase is substantial enough to cause frames to drop ...

[RoderickGI]

Okay, I am going to have to absorb this and do some testing, to confirm what I see. Thanks for posting tij.

A couple of comments:

I understand 1920x1080p @ 175% is 3360x1890p. I use 200% for Windows Scale and Layout, and get the proper 3840x2160 rendering with output at 1080p for 3D. Have you tried 200% to avoid the issue Hendrik raised? I found just using font adjustments was enough to make MC look right. I'm using a Sony 65" TV at about 3.5 metres viewing distance.

I did set the override to high DPI scaling behaviour once, but I don't have that set now, as every upgrade is a new executable and hence doesn't have it set. At least I assume that is why the setting disappeared. Anyway, since leaving it unset I haven't had issues. But I need to check as I haven't played 3D for a while now as well.


Finally, Hendrik I found it quite difficult to extract from forum threads the correct way automatic switching for 3D and 4K should be achieved. I think the settings tij posted in Steps 1 & 2 above are all that is required, except for the Windows Scale and Layout setting, and perhaps nVidia settings and driver versions. Are you able to bullet point your thoughts so I could pull this into a Wiki Article?

[tij]

I understand 1920x1080p @ 175% is 3360x1890p. I use 200% for Windows 175% Scale and Layout, and get the proper 3840x2160 rendering with output at 1080p for 3D. Have you tried 200% to avoid the issue Hendrik raised? I found just using font adjustments was enough to make MC look right. I'm using a Sony 65" TV at about 3.5 metres viewing distance.

I did set the override to high DPI scaling behaviour once, but I don't have that set now, as every upgrade is a new executable and hence doesn't have it set. At least I assume that is why the setting disappeared. Anyway, since leaving it unset I haven't had issues. But I need to check as I haven't played 3D for a while now as well.

Now that you mention it ... 3360x1890p is 175% ... so one way to avoid this DPI scaling without resorting to “compatability” mode is setting Scale and Layout to 100%

Just so that you understand the problem correctly, RoderickGI ... if you let MC dance to DPI tune ... have 2160p desktop ... when playing 3D movie, madVR will report scaling 1080p to some resolution depending on Scale and Layout setting (at 200% that would be 2160p as you correctly point out)

I was over the roof happy thinking my  3D now is scaled to 4K ... BUT ... hit info button on your TV and it will tell you, TV is only receiving 1080p ... so ... due to DPI, MC or/and madVR decide to scale 3D ... but when outputting to TV it is scaled back down (by Windows?) ... both scaling up and scaling down is lossy process ... again arguably the loss in “quality” is not noticable ... but still annoying lol

[TheShoe]

I too have "Override High DPI Scaling Behavior", set to Application.  Without it madvr always scaled by output which I don't want.

given the number of possible configurations for HTPCs including various drivers, OS patch levels, and any number of other possible applications and processes running, I don't think we can ever say "don't do that".  YMMV

I've had it all working perfectly now:

3D Renders 1080p now, not scaled anymore
4K + HDR renders 4K, 10 bit color
1080p, 720p all render in their correct resolutions.

I do think I can probably remove the madVR profiles, but they work, it all works in harmony, and I'm not about to mess with it anymore   @tlj really came through here testing the various combinations.  Aside from the nVidia card (I have a 1080Ti), we have almost identical setups.   Even then I had to diverge from his (assuming) setup to get it working

Interestingly, madVR Full Screen Exclusive no longer works for me; used to in the past when that was all I could do to get 3D MVC working.

Recently I changed the color profile for the nVidia driver to use 422, 12bit, and I leave Windows HDR+WGC on all the time.  Display looks great once I calibrated the TV.  Been playing around with this a little as of late.  Finding this change removed color banding that I was seeing in video playback

[tij]

1080p, 720p all render in their correct resolutions.

I do think I can probably remove the madVR profiles, but they work, it all works in harmony, and I'm not about to mess with it anymore   @tlj really came through here testing the various combinations.  Aside from the nVidia card (I have a 1080Ti), we have almost identical setups.   Even then I had to diverge from his (assuming) setup to get it working

Interestingly, madVR Full Screen Exclusive no longer works for me; used to in the past when that was all I could do to get 3D MVC working.

For 2D stuff, I scale all my videos to 4K (that's the whole point of MadVR lol)

I also keep my MadVR profiles ... just in case ... and Windows 10 does not have true FSE (from what i gathered from various forums)