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Author Topic: Lost my main hard drive  (Read 2179 times)

mpg732

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Lost my main hard drive
« on: June 20, 2019, 09:42:54 pm »

I lost my main hard drive and had to reinstall MC.  I had to re import my movies, over 500.   For about half the movies, the Auto Movie and Television Info look up doesn't work. 

If I import the same library into PLEX and KODI I only have to correct about 5 to 6 movies, not the 250+ like I do in MC. 

Plus manually looking up the movies is very slow.  On top of that this also happens a lot, if I have a movie the has a squeal, for example, I have the movie Hancock.  Every time I run the auto importer it puts it as Hancock 2.  Where does it even think its part 2.  Nowhere in the file title says its part two.
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2019, 11:48:10 pm »

Describe your workflow, because this just doesn't happen, unless you import lots of obscure movies. The combination of CARNAC and "Get Movie & TV Info" during import is always very accurate for me, on mainstream movies that TheMovieDB has good records for.

For a start, Auto Import won't change a movie such as "Hancock" to "Hancock 2" when it runs, if the movie has already been imported and metadata collected for it. If you are, for example, running "Get Movie & TV Info" across all your movies each time you import a new movie, you are doing it wrong.

Also, now you know to back up all your data, including your backups of the MC Library. Do it. Now. Don't put it off. Set your PC up so that it happens often, automatically.


PS: Your post probably got deleted because you are complaining, instead of asking for help with an issue. Stop complaining. Keep it positive.
PPS: Free applications typically don't pay licence fees to access metadata on programs, so they can get it from "better" sources such as the IMDB. MC, as a commercial, paid application, is not allowed to retrieve data from the IMDB, unless they pay a large fee. So for some obscure movies and TV Shows, MC doesn't always find the correct info as the first result, which it needs to do when you are importing or updating metadata for multiple files. If you want to use those other programs and get better metadata, but have a worse overall experience than with MC, go for it.

PPPS: The above is my understanding and opinion as a user. I don't work for JRiver.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2019, 12:07:32 am »

I only run it when I import new movies.  I go to recently added movies in MC, highlight every thing thats new right click and run "Get Movie & TV Info".  I would say 85% are MKV, I mostly used MakeMKV to rip.  Over the years though I have seen some strange meda data under properties/details tab of some of the video files.  I just ran a script that removed all titles.  I verified the file was changed.  This helped a lot but about 75 videos, MC still pulled some crazy titles.  As for changing Hancock to Hancock 2 this does happen on about a dozen movies.  No Idea on where its getting that data from.  Keep Hancock 2 has never been released so I could never had already imported it.     
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2019, 12:50:12 am »

You ran a script to delete the Titles? What?! If you mean you deleted the [Name] tag in MC, that would be bad. Very bad. MC relies on that tag extensively. Don't delete that tag. Update it as required, sure, but never delete it. Then you say deleting the title changed the file? What do you mean, renamed the file? What!!! MC wouldn't do that.

You are doing stuff outside MC, using scripts. No wonder MC isn't working as expected. You need to explain in more detail what you are doing if you want this perceived problem fixed.

Oh, I see. It isn't "Hancock 2". Is the file is being duplicated somewhere along the line, so the suffix is being added, like Windows Explorer will add " (1)" to a file name if you copy it into a directory that already has that file name? More information required.



Importing and then using the Recently Imported View to select imported files and run "Get Movie & TV Info" is a reasonable process. But you can turn on "Get Movie & TV Info" under the Auto Import settings, so that you don't have to run it again later. It sometimes just takes a while to complete, after the file initially appears in MC. Test using that.

If you name you ripped MKV files with Movie title and year included, CARNAC will get the movie correct almost every time. i.e. "The Matrix (1999).mkv" would be identified correctly, and the correct metadata would be collected.

Perhaps provide some sample file names for movies that don't work, so that we can look at what happens in our installations.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2019, 01:04:12 am »

You didn't understand me correctly.  If you right click on an individual video files out side of MC and go to properties, then to the details tab, you can see title, some times the file will have some strange data, for example it may say Disc 1 instead of the title of the movie.  This must have been added to the file when it was ripped from disk.  So I believe MC reads that info and imports that as the title for the movie instead of reading the file name.  This is what I believe all the other media centers out there do, like KODI and PLEX they read the file name.   That's is what I believe to be part of the problem.  That data can not be changed through Windows 10.  Its locked in.  You have to run a special program with a .BAT file to delete those titles/tags.  Again this is all out side of MC.  Then when I import the movies into MC, I would say 80% now import correctly.  The Hancock example is not being duplicated, it is being tagged wrong by MC and have to manually change the title from "Hancock 2" to "Hancock".   No idea on why it would label it as Hancock 2.

How can I use auto import/any thing with MC when it fails to do it properly so often.     

I am not familiar with CARNAC.  What is that?

All of my movies are label as the full movie title for file name, Like the movie Creed file is labeled as "Creed.mkv".  I do not use any thing like _ in file names or . to separate words.  so Big Hero 6 file name would be "Big Hero 6.mkv"
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2019, 01:46:10 am »

Okay, you are deleting incorrect metadata out of the files before you import them into MC. That is fine. If you have already imported them into MC, then delete them from MC, then delete the metadata externally, then import them, that won't work as MC remembers metadata for previously imported and later deleted files. That can be fixed of course, but requires extra steps.

The example of "Hancock" changing to "Hancock 2", if it is the [Name] tag in MC, is an indication of some other problem though. It is possible that a value in another tag is being used for the [Name] tag in MC, as that can happen for some metadata. It is supposed to for certain data. The only way I can comment further on that is if you provide more information about the source file, or a copy of it to look at.

Also if you are ripping discs using MakeMKV and the Title is being set to "Disc 1", then you need to fix your settings in MakeMKV. I'm not a MakeMKV user, but my understanding is that MakeMKV has started to save the Title tag into ripped files, and that it is often wrong, as settings aren't correct. It would perhaps be best to set MakeMKV to never save the Title tag, and let MC use the file name to work out what the program is. Either that or get it to save the correct tags in the first place.

Again, you would need to provide more information before we can help you with the above. You haven't actually said where you see "Hancock 2". Within MC? In a tag? Which tag? When does it change?

CARNAC: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Carnac
You should read that, and also search the forum for "CARNAC". You will find a lot more information and gain a better understanding of the import process. Search the Wiki for related information as well, such as Import, Auto Import, etc.

When you rip movie discs to MKV files I strongly advise that you include both the movie name and year released in the file name. There are often movies released with the same name, and that is very often what causes MC to find the incorrect metadata. There are even a few movies with the same name released in the same year, but that is quite rare and must be handled by a human selecting the correct movie when the "Get Movie & TV Info" function is run on a single file.

So name the file "Creed (2015).mkv" or  "Creed.2015.mkv", for example. You will get far better lookup results.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

lepa

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2019, 04:20:47 am »

After reading the information you have provided I think that your problems most probably happens because you have something in the mkv files title tag as RoderickGI also mentioned.

When importing new file MC prefers title tag inside matroska file instead of filename. So even if your filename is something reasonable like "Hancock (1999).mkv" and MC's parsing system could get [name] and [date] tags from it BUT then if title inside file is set to something like this "Hanckock.1999.blah.blah.something" the mkv title is stored as a [name] tag in MC and the Get Movies info can't find anything with that "Hanckock.1999.blah.blah.something" name.

Also if you do "update file info from tags" the [Name] tag will be overwritten by what is saved in the file's title tag and also rating will be erased (I don't know reason for the latter)

To prevent problems like this you could use mkvtoolnix tool to check and remove title tags from matroska file.
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mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2019, 09:02:33 am »

So the script I ran was using mkvtoolnix  to remove the title tags.  I comfirmed they were all removed, but still a large number still imported incorrectly where MC assigned the wrong name to the movie and I had to manually correct.

If the title tag is blank, I see no other tags in the file, so what does MC use to title the movie? 

So a bit more explanation, after reinstalling MC, I imported my movies, saw that most of them did not import correctly with a proper title.  I deleted the library in MC, shut it down MC and then deleted all the .Jpeg's, and the text files for each movie that MC DL that were located in the movie folder in windows.  Then I ran my script to remove the title Tags.  Confirmed all the title tags were blanked out.  Opened MC back up and imported from that folder.  Saw that most imported correctly but not all.  Still a large number were not. 

I switched back to the folder with my movies, and looked at the tags for the ones that did not import correctly,  all the tags are blank.  As stated before all file names are correct for the movie title.  So there must be some tags that windows doesn't show that MC must use, any suggestions on how to change the tags in the file so I don't keep having issues?  The few movies that were tagged as a part two or three or four, all of them are movies were part two is no even released, like Hancock, for hancock 2 is not released yet, if I remember correctly I think Expendables 3 was labeled as Expendables 4, so on and so on.  Does that make sense? 

 
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BryanC

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2019, 12:56:42 pm »

It's probably using the IMDb ID tag.
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lepa

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2019, 02:17:23 pm »

When you import new file "Expendables 3 (2014).mkv" MC will fill up name as "Expendables" and date as "2014". These two fields are then used to movie info search. If your file is just "Expendables 3.mkv" then MC can only get name field as search criteria and doing mass search for movie info could choose wrong movie IF there are more than on Expendables 3 entries in the TMDb database. Otherwise it should work but that is the reason why it is good to have year also in the filename.

For already imported files can also use imdb id field which individual for every movie and I think that if imdb id field is filled then that is used to get info from TMDb. So if you would have sidecar file for the movie MC could get imdb id value from there even if you deleted your library and then get it wrong again when you are doing the movie info search.

So check that you don't have sidecar xml-files if you want to start fresh and of course it would help to identify the problem if you could provide filename for file which fails and also how the tags look like BEFORE you start movie info search when movie is freshly imported.

One place where CARNAC filename parsing fails are movies where there is 2160p (or 1080p) in the filename. MC will determine these files as TV Show and info query fails to get results
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mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2019, 04:54:34 pm »

When I deleted the library in MC to start over, I also deleted all the sidecar XML-files.  I understand about not having the year in the file name, so that shoudl fix that, but there where still plenty that did not import correctly, still trying to figure where MC pulled the wrong names from.
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lepa

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2019, 05:44:00 pm »

You could try to fetch info for just one file which got it wrong (i.e. not batch processing) so you can see what MC is suggesting. Beforehand move the file in question to some other directory which you haven't yet used to import that particular file so MC shouldn't think that this is old file. Maybe files aren't actually deleted from database completely if you just remove files from the database. Creating new database should start everything from scratch
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2019, 02:35:01 am »

When you "deleted the library", how did you do that?

Did you just delete the contents of the Library by selecting all records and deleting? I ask because it isn't possible to delete the default Library in MC. So if you were using a Library stored in the default location, which is by design the default Library, then you could not have deleted it. If you created a new Library in a non-default location, then that could be deleted, which would completely remove everything related to the Library.

If you just selected all the records in the Library and deleted them, that doesn't delete all contents of the Library. MC maintains a "Removed Database" in its Library, which is a record of all items that had been imported at some time, and later deleted. If a file is later imported again, MC uses the metadata from the Removed Database for that item.

So, importing a file and finding that it has incorrect metadata, then deleting it, fixing the tags in the file, and then re-importing it will result in the old, bad metadata being used. I mentioned that back here:
Okay, you are deleting incorrect metadata out of the files before you import them into MC. That is fine. If you have already imported them into MC, then delete them from MC, then delete the metadata externally, then import them, that won't work as MC remembers metadata for previously imported and later deleted files. That can be fixed of course, but requires extra steps.

The extra steps that are required to fix the metadata are to delete the records in the "Removed Database". That is easy to do. Just create a View that shows all media types (uncheck the "Use parent scheme rules for file display"), restrict the View to the Removed Database ("Set rules for file display" > Modify Rules > Limit database to > Removed), then delete the affected movies from MC again, find any movies you have deleted in the Removed Database (or set a rule in the View to only show files that do not exist in the Library), then delete the records from the Removed Database. You would then be able to import the files again and MC would use the filename and tags in the file to identify the program.

The alternative is to use clear Library function and start all over again. You can do that by selecting the Library under Playing Now, and then clicking the "Clear Library" button. That removes everything from the library so that it is empty, but that would mean that you have to start again importing everything. Usually not a good option. If you want to do that, then for those movies that have the correct metadata, make sure that you write the correct data to the file tags first. See below.

Windows does not show all tags that MC uses, not by a long shot. It also uses slightly different naming for some tags, such as using "Title" where MC uses [Name]. If you want to see all tags actually in the files you could use a third party application, or you could look at the "Options > Library & Folders > Manage Library Fields" dialogue, and select "Show only field saved in tags". That will show you which Library field are saved to file tags by MC when they change. You should also look at the "Tag Dump" area in the MC Tag Window, which will show the fields MC has saved to the file, plus any tags in the file that MC hasn't imported into its Library.

If you want MC to write updated metadata to tags in the file, make sure that the setting "Options > General > Importing & Tagging > Update tags when file info changes" is checked. To update tags for files that have already been imported and had metadata corrected, select all files, right-click on one, and then select "Library Tools > Update tags (from library)". Note that MC will only write those Library fields to tags in the file that have been set to be saved, as defined in the "Options > Library & Folders > Manage Library Fields" dialogue. But the defaults should be fine for what you are doing.

However, note that MC doesn't write tags to a file for video files. It writes them to the Sidecar XML file. So when you check in Windows, the tags that you have cleared will remain empty.


Nothing about "Hancock" being changed to "Hancock 2" makes sense. That just doesn't happen in normal use of MC. Particularly if a file has already been imported into MC, as Auto Import won't change metadata for an existing file unless tags have been changed in the file by an external process, and Auto Import was set to "Update for external changes", which it usually is. We are missing some information required to work that issue out, such as perhaps Kodi or Plex being run at some time, and one of those two programs updating the Title tag to "Hancock 2", which will then flow into MC when Auto Import is next run.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2019, 09:39:06 pm »

Thanks for all your suggestions, now that I have it down to a more reasonable number I have to manually modify, I went ahead and did just that.   The latest MakeMKV does not write any tags to file so new movies are not a problem for import.  It really was an issues with much older rips, some from over 4 years ago that I had issues with.  Still wish MC would change how they look up Movie info, as stated in my first post, did not have this issues with PLEXX or KODI.   Not to mention a lot fast too at looking up the info.  I have brought this up before and others seemed to agree but no changes have been made.  With that being said still love MC, gives the best picture quality and handles 4k HDR for me.
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2019, 10:26:36 pm »

Still wish MC would change how they look up Movie info, as stated in my first post, did not have this issues with PLEXX or KODI.

Sure, but as I said above, Plex and Kodi don't have the legal constraints that a commercial application such as JRiver MC has. Free software is allowed to get away with more, and access more sites, because the creators aren't making money out of it, and access is considered as an individual using the service, rather than a commercial corporation. Sites like IMDB want a share of the money commercial organisations make before allowing access to their data.

While the lookup can be a bit slow, that is down to your internet connection speed, the target web site connection speed and capacity for connections, and the interface speed used for the site. There are various technologies used for different interfaces, and not all are available to JRiver.

I rarely have issues with the incorrect metadata for movies being retrieved, though some movies are just a bit stubborn, it is usually as a result of the source site data. I sometimes have issues with TV Shows, but not often.

Anyway, it sounds like you are fixed.

Backup your MC Library backups. Make sure tags are being written to your files. Backup your main hard disk, regularly.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

mpg732

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2019, 12:05:43 am »

I appreciate your input but have to disagree on a few things.  Plex and KODI are commercial application.   They pull there data from the same places. As for the speed I use multiple program, Plex for the family, I hate Pexx myself plus I don't like transcoding for quality loss and speed of playback.  I have gone back and forth between KODI and a few other media centers out there and MC on the same PC and same internet is at least 3 times slower.   Your "legal constant" is not a factor.  Using a name of a file vs Tags with in the file has not legal constraints.  So maybe you need to look into other options on where you pull your data from if your saying that's the problem.  Besides you pull from the same places KODI does, or should I say you have the option to pull from in KODI.  Listen I'm not here to bash any thing or any one, just think its time for some changes.  AS a paying customer I am saying there is a part of the product I bought into that can have some improvement done.  I still love MC, for it has the best picture quality and audio quality.  I have spent a lot of hours trying many options and none comes close.  That is why I continue to pay for upgrades and support MC.     
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RoderickGI

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2019, 01:20:44 am »

Just to clarify, again, I don't work for JRiver, so I have no influence over where data is pulled from.

MC primarily uses the [Name] tag to collect metadata, and does not use the filename at all. It also uses other tags such as [Media Sub Type] to identify whether a file is a movie or TV show. I'm sure it uses other tags as well.

Kodi is free: https://kodi.tv/
"Kodi (formerly XBMC) is a free and open source media player application developed by the XBMC/Kodi Foundation, a non-profit technology consortium. Kodi is available for multiple operating-systems and hardware platforms, featuring a 10-foot user interface for use with televisions and remote controls. It allows users to play and view most videos, music, podcasts, and other digital media files from local and network storage media and the internet."

Kodi isn't a commercial application. Some third-party Kodi add-ons may be paid software and/or services. Hence it can use IMDB, which is probably the best source of metadata.
https://kodi.wiki/view/Add-on:IMDB_Scraper_Library
https://www.addictivetips.com/media-streaming/kodi/imdb-on-kodi/
https://www.comparitech.com/kodi/imdb-kodi/


Plex is free, for core functions: https://support.plex.tv/articles/202526943-plex-free-vs-paid/

Service add-ons that provide content, through the Plex Pass subscription, are paid. As the Plex server is free, as are many client apps, it isn't considered a commercial application, although it is a more grey definition than with Kodi.

Still, Plex users can access IMDB metadata, even if the relationship is thorny.

https://www.howtogeek.com/300743/how-to-add-imdb-or-rotten-tomatoes-ratings-to-your-plex-media-server/
"While tweaking the Plex scraper works fine now, historically Plex has had a thorny relationship with IMDb, because IMDb has argued that Plex’s use of the ratings is commercial use (even though the rating data is downloaded by individuals at home and not the actual Plex company)."
https://support.plex.tv/articles/200241558-agents/

etc. A few quick Google searches confirm all I said.


JRiver is a 100% commercial application. It doesn't have free access to metadata on IMDB. JRiver would have to pay for that access, and it would not be cheap.

So I'm sorry, as I don't want an argument either, but you are wrong in most of what you wrote in that last post.


But I do agree that it would be nice if the metadata lookup was faster, and maybe if it was a bit more configurable in which tags are used for the lookup, such as including [Name] and [Year] or [Date]. That would be very useful for bulk lookups. But actually, I don't know what the code is doing when multiple files are selected and the "Get Movie & TV Info" function is run. MC may use the extra tags in that case. But for individual file lookups the search criteria can be easily changed to include additional data, such as Year.

Enjoy the movies!  :D
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

JimH

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Re: Lost my main hard drive
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2019, 07:34:59 am »

I'm closing this now.

If you still have problems or suggestions, start a new thread, but try to focus on the problem rather than Kodi/Plex.
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