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[beholder]

Hello.

I experience the following problem with the playback: when playing certain DSD sources (ISO, dsf, wm files) the track starts the playback and stops after few seconds (usually 15-40 seconds, different for different tracks even of the same source/album; constant every time for the same track).

Other sources of the same format play without issues (I have just few sources that experience this issue, most of the sources play without problems. I had this issue  for a while but didn't bother to resolve it as it was fairly rare).

The correct length of the track is shown before the playback starts; once the playback starts, the length of the track changes to those 15-40s.

The problem does not change when I switch from one renderer to another.

If I convert the tracks to PCM (FLAC), they play without problems.

I use JR 25 that runs on Windows 10, the renderer that I usually play is Lumin A1.

Thank you in advance for your help.

[JimH]

If you're playing DSD, the files are large, sometimes very large.  It can break down for lots of reasons.   Try converting to PCM.

[TheShoe]

If your DAC handles native DSD, I’d try to figure out why this occurs and not convert.

I have well over a hundered DSD (dsf) files and the source ISOs, stereo, multichannel and all play fine for me.  What options exist to configure your ASIO zone (assuming you are using ASIO) in Media Center?  I have an exasound e38 DAC and there are specific settings exasound needs for Media Center which they provide as part of their setup guide.  Wondering if something similar happens here?

[beholder]

If you're playing DSD, the files are large, sometimes very large.  It can break down for lots of reasons.   Try converting to PCM.

Thanks.

DSD files (wm, dsf) have approximately the same size as FLACs (PCM) at the same bitrate - the size is not a concern. It is largely a nuisance problem - I indeed can convert into PCM if I am interested in the content. I'm also curious - I don't have problems with most of the DSD files except few.

[beholder]

If your DAC handles native DSD, I’d try to figure out why this occurs and not convert.

I have well over a hundered DSD (dsf) files and the source ISOs, stereo, multichannel and all play fine for me.  What options exist to configure your ASIO zone (assuming you are using ASIO) in Media Center?  I have an exasound e38 DAC and there are specific settings exasound needs for Media Center which they provide as part of their setup guide.  Wondering if something similar happens here?

Thank you.

The DAC plays native DSD. I don't use ASIO - the renderer is connected to the JRiver media server via a local network, as a DLNA client.

I have also hundreds of DSD tracks in various formats - dsf, wm, as well as SACD iso's - most of them play without problems except very few (several ISOs and few wm/dsf files). It is largely a nuisance for me, but I'm also curious why these few files don't play without a reason that I understand.

I had once a situation when the client didn't play newly acquired DSD's. I realized that those where DSDx2 (the client plays only DSDx1), I set JRiver server to downsample them to DSDx1 and they play without problems.   

[JimH]

The DAC plays native DSD. I don't use ASIO - the renderer is connected to the JRiver media server via a local network, as a DLNA client.

It's common that a DAC supports certain formats when directly connected and different ones when connected via network and UPnP / DLNA.

[JimH]

DSD files (wm, dsf) have approximately the same size as FLACs (PCM) at the same bitrate - the size is not a concern. It is largely a nuisance problem - I indeed can convert into PCM if I am interested in the content. I'm also curious - I don't have problems with most of the DSD files except few.

The above isn't correct.  DSF should be much larger than FLAC.  Take a closer look.

Assuming you mean Windows Media by wm.

[beholder]

The above isn't correct.  DSF should be much larger than FLAC.  Take a closer look.

Assuming you mean Windows Media by wm.

I meant .WV (WavePack), not WM - I mistyped.

A dsf and a FLAC with comparable bit rate (say, a ~5400kbps dsf and a 24bit/192kHZ FLAC/PCM) have comparable file sizes (depending on the FLAC (lossless) compression settings) in my experience - I just looked up and a see that a 5min record is an approx. 210MB file in both cases. .WV files are smaller - I assume that they use better (lossless) compression algos.

The size doesn't bother me much as there's plenty of storage these days - we're storing 4h 4K movies and audio files are tiny comparing to those regardless the resolution :-)

I'm still hoping to get to the root of the strange behaviour in my system.   

[beholder]

It's common that a DAC supports certain formats when directly connected and different ones when connected via network and UPnP / DLNA.

This client/DAC plays natively DSDs over DLNA. The tracks start playing and play well, they just don't play to the end (only a 15-30s of the track are played). I assume that it's an "indexing" problem, i.e. the system "thinks" that the track is shorter than it really is (the client shows that the length of the track is 15-30s once the playback starts, while the control application and the server show the correct length of the tracks).

[dtc]

This client/DAC plays natively DSDs over DLNA. The tracks start playing and play well, they just don't play to the end (only a 15-30s of the track are played). I assume that it's an "indexing" problem, i.e. the system "thinks" that the track is shorter than it really is (the client shows that the length of the track is 15-30s once the playback starts, while the control application and the server show the correct length of the tracks).

Are the files on a local disk or a NAS or a usb? There may be a timing issue at work. If so, try putting the problem files on an internal disk as a check.

You can also try loading the files in memory (load full file into memory option in the Audio section).

You mention iso and dsf. Does the problem happen just with iso files, or with stand alone dsf files also?

[JimH]

The size doesn't bother me much as there's plenty of storage these days - we're storing 4h 4K movies and audio files are tiny comparing to those regardless the resolution :-)

Size is also relevant if the bandwidth of your network is saturated.

[beholder]

Are the files on a local disk or a NAS or a usb? There may be a timing issue at work. If so, try putting the problem files on an internal disk as a check.

You can also try loading the files in memory (load full file into memory option in the Audio section).

You mention iso and dsf. Does the problem happen just with iso files, or with stand alone dsf files also?

The files are on a network drive. I never worked with a directly connected USB storage - I may try out of curiosity but it doesn't fit my set up.

The problem was with ISOs until the latest occasion when it happened with stand-alone .vw (WavePack DSF) files. I converted them to .dsf - the problem persisted. I converted the files to PCM (same bitrate) - they work.

I'll check the loading files in memory option (I assume that there's a MC option to pre-load files into RAM, correct?) - we'll see. By the way, this gave me an idea - I have Minim server installed on the NAS - I'll try to play the same .dsf files. Minim server doesn't play ISOs by it plays dsf. Will report results :-)

Thanks again.

[beholder]

Are the files on a local disk or a NAS or a usb? There may be a timing issue at work. If so, try putting the problem files on an internal disk as a check.

You can also try loading the files in memory (load full file into memory option in the Audio section).

You mention iso and dsf. Does the problem happen just with iso files, or with stand alone dsf files also?

Network load can be a concern - I think that it is not in this case: it's a home network (i.e. few users), it's fairly new and has ok equipment, i.e. it's unlikely that any audio stream will hit the capacity limits.

Thanks.

[dtc]

Network load can be a concern - I think that it is not in this case: it's a home network (i.e. few users), it's fairly new and has ok equipment, i.e. it's unlikely that any audio stream will hit the capacity limits.

Thanks.

With network disks, I am usually more concerned about timing of the devices and the interface on the PC than with the raw network speed.  Problems can happen when there is a sudden demand for a big chuck of data and there is a slight delay in one of the interfaces. The activation times and buffering scheme sometimes are not fast enough.  That's why I suggested a test of one of the problem files from an internal disk. Same with the load file into memory option (Tools - Options - Audio).  It might help to determine if any of those issues are causing the problems you see.

[Manfred]

I had a similar problem with my Devialet. The Devialet AIR driver or playing DLNA from the MC Server to the Devialet, if connected to 1Gb Ethernet, playing white noise after a certain time (from a few seconds to a minute or more) or stopped working. Playing over Wifi worked for pcm files. I a new Firmware release Devialet has solved the problem for most users.

The only way to find out if the network or Lumin DLNA Client is a problem is to connect the server via USB to the Lumin and check if the problem is still there.

In general 1Gb Ethernet should be fine. I can play up to DSD512 over the network to my media renderer (I don't us Devialet AIR any more).

[dtc]

The Lumin A1 is a networked device. It has a usb connector, but I believe that is only for direct attach disks, not computers.  The only hard wired input is Ethernet.

[beholder]

The Lumin A1 is a networked device. It has a usb connector, but I believe that is only for direct attach disks, not computers.  The only hard wired input is Ethernet.

You're correct - Lumin is designed as a network client and I always used it that way. One can connect a drive via USB - I never tried this, and it's a moot point for me as I don't intend to use it that way even if it works. I find the networks server-client configuration is so convenient and also beautiful from the engineering point of view - I am a convert since the times of SlimDevices' Transporter and Logitech Music Server :-)