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[teodorom]

There is a subtle bug in version 28.0.32.
Sometimes, when converting to 4xDSD, I hear a vinyl-like "click".
This doesn't depends on the rest of my chain: I'm now listening with HQPlayer 4.12.1 and there is no "click".
Thanks

[Awesome Donkey]

While there has been some DSD-related changes in the last few builds unless I'm mistaken and this is what I think it is, I'm pretty sure this is considered "normal" unfortunately, as it's been this way for years now since DSD support was first added. It happens because of the PCM conversion stage in the middle of all DSD conversions. It's reminiscent of a DSF bug in sacd_extract involving zero handling padding at track transition creating an audible click/pop when the song changes, but it's likely different from that issue. Or are you talking about a new issue that recently popped up in the last few builds?

It's worth noting the track transition pop/click issue has been brought up multiple times over the years. It's easy to reproduce by doing any sort of DSD to PCM or PCM to DSD conversion and listening to an album like Pink Floyd's Dark Side Of The Moon or Wish You Were Here where tracks seamlessly segue into each other, which during the track transition you'll hear a click/pop. And this is one of the main reasons why DSD to DSD conversions without a PCM conversation step (if even possible) has been requested several times for MC28 already.

[teodorom]

It's a new issue. The "clicks" are present during the play.
It was not present in version 27.
I'm not sure, but it seems to me that it was not present even in the first version of "28" I downloaded (upgraded promptly).
Thanks

[Awesome Donkey]

Maybe try downgrading a couple of MC28 builds and see if it still occurs.

[dtc]

Some info that might help sort this out.

What types of files are you converting to 4x DSD?

Do you hear the click with 4x DSD files from other sources or is it only on converting with MC?

Is the click reproducible when converting a given file?

If you convert one of the files to a 4X DSD file and play that directly do you get the same click?

Does it just happen with 4x DSD or do you hear it if you convert to 1x or 2x DSD?

[teodorom]

I have just listened "The Dark Side Of The Moon". Two times.
I have two versions: 16/44.1 (1973) and 24/96 (2011).
I get this issue only on the 24/96 (2011) version, converted to 4xDSD.
The noise is a lot similar to the noise of a damaged vinyl.
This happens randomly (not always in the same instant). Once per song.

[teodorom]

No problem with the 24/96 (2011) version, converted to 2xDSD.

[Matt]

It's possible it's just a CPU shortfall.  It takes a lot of horsepower to convert to 4x.

I have a fast computer and even converting to 2x (all my DAC supports) isn't the easiest.

[teodorom]

Really?
This is only an i3, but, please, don't try to climb on the mirrors. The noise of the nails can be heard up to here.

[Manfred]

I have no problems to convert 24/96 in real time to 4xDSD (native DSD not DSD over DoP) to my ADI-2 DAC FS using rme USB Madiface ASIO drivers (i7, 16 GB RAM) CPU Load is ~ 13%. MC 28.032.

[dtc]

What does the CPU usage look like with HQPlayer?  It typically is thought of as having high CPU utilization, yet does not seem to exhibit the problem you are reporting.

[teodorom]

The CPU usage of HQPlayer is highly dependent of the chosen modulator and filter.
For example this is what happens with shaping=ASDM5, filter=poly-sinc-long-mp-2s, rate=11289600.
However, when HQPlayer has problems, what you have is drop-outs, not "vinyl-like "click". More: I don't see any correlation among what I hear with MC and what I see in perfmon.
I realized the issue of version 28.0.32 immediately when I installed it. Let me wait next one. I have some more days to decide if upgrade or not.
It's not my doctor that advised me to do it. I can live without.

[zybex]

Just a generic note on CPU usage - a single percentage number for CPU usage often doesn't tell the whole story. It depends on how many threads are in use.
Often when you see 13% usage, it's actually a single-thread application using 1 core of an 8-core CPU at 100% load (100/8 = 12.5), or 2 threads of an 16-core CPU.
One saturated thread on a quad-core CPU often shows up at 25% CPU usage.

So it depends on the application - if the conversion task is single threaded and that thread is at 100% load... it doesn't matter that your task manager is showing only 13% CPU usage, the bottleneck is in fact the CPU. Even with multi-threaded applications where thread 1 is doing X, thread 2 is doing Y and thread 3 is doing Z, if ONE of those threads is maxed out (CPU-limited) then the other threads will have to wait for it - so in effect it just takes ONE thread to stall an entire multithreaded application.

I'm not saying this is the case here (I don't do DSD), I'm just saying it's not clear cut. You need to look at the per-core CPU usage to see if one of them is maxed out. Though even if IT IS maxed out, that also doesn't necessarily mean there's a problem - it might be just converting and buffering the entire track, and will eventually drop back to 0 when it's done. If the processing is faster than realtime, then there's no clicks/stutter; otherwise, there will be stuttering as the buffer isn't filled quickly enough.

[teodorom]

I agree completely. Ooops! I forgot to do this analysis.
This is JRiver Media Center:

This is HQPlayer:

Let me guess that the "modulator" of HQPlayer is multi-threaded, while the "modulator" of JRiver Media Center is single-threaded.
I guess, since I don't know the details of the processes.

[teodorom]

Found the reason and the solution!
In MC "27" I had lowered the "buffering" as much as I could (you suggest 50 ms, -still).
The transition from one version to another keeps the settings, it seems however that "28" needs more resources.
With a buffer of 1000 ms everything works fine, so fine that I hardly distinguish MC from HQP (I have a "poor", $4,500, setup).
You should advise the "humanity".

[Matt]

Happy 😊. Thanks 👍

[David Sydney]

Where is the buffering setting for future reference? Can't find it in settings.

[teodorom]

Tools -> Options -> Device Settings