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[dtc]

I cannot reproduce this.  "set volume to..." sets the volume for me as expected using Internal Volume or Application volume. Are you using some kind of digital output that might be causing unexpected behavior?

The problem is caused by having Volume Protection turned on. I guess it only allows a limited change in volume at one time. Volume Protection is a nice feature, so it would be nice to figure out how to still have it on and have Set Volume work when increasing the volume.

[cncb]

The problem is caused by having Volume Protection turned on. I guess it only allows a limited change in volume at one time. Volume Protection is a nice feature, so it would be nice to figure out how to still have it on and have Set Volume work when increasing the volume.

It seems that Volume Protection is working as intended and it would not be good to bypass this in Alexa.

[dtc]

It seems that Volume Protection is working as intended and it would not be good to bypass this in Alexa.

Volume protection is not meant to stop you making normal changes to the setting.  With Volume Protection on, you can click anywhere on the slider and the volume is changed. If the volume is at 20% and you click on 80%, the volume goes to 80%. even if volume protection is on. Seems like the Set Volume command should behave the same as clicking on the volume slider.  My guess is that whatever mechanism you are using to set the volume is different than clicking on the slider and is getting caught by volume protection as an unintended side effect.

Volume Protection is a pretty commonly used feature. I think the Set Volume command needs to work with it enabled, just like clicking on the slider does.

[Matt]

If the volume is at 20% and you click on 80%, the volume goes to 80%. even if volume protection is on.

Volume Protection will stop you from making a big change like that.  That's the entire reason behind volume protection.

I have used it for many years and really appreciate it.

[dtc]

Volume Protection will stop you from making a big change like that.  That's the entire reason behind volume protection.

I have used it for many years and really appreciate it.

But shouldn't is function the same as clicking on the volume slider?  This is not an uncontrolled increase, it is just the same as on the volume slider.

[Matt]

But shouldn't is function the same as clicking on the volume slider?  This is not an uncontrolled increase, it is just the same as on the volume slider.

If you click way in advance, it increases just a little and moves your mouse.  It seems that the same with Alexa makes sense.

[dtc]

If you click way in advance, it increases just a little and moves your mouse.  It seems that the same with Alexa makes sense.

You are right. My mistake.  I have it set on my main system but not on my other systems and was confusing them. Sorry.

[cncb]

JTalk is now available in the UK, Canada, and Australia.

"Higher" is now working for volume and "what is playing" now works too (had to remove "what/which zone is playing" because Alexa was not able to distinguish these).

[dtc]

Thanks. Most of this is very solid.

What is the upgrade strategy and mechanism? Do changes like this take effect automatically or do people need to update the Alexa skill? Will there be an ongoing update process like MC, or will  changes be accumulated and done as one big update? Thanks.

[cncb]

What is the upgrade strategy and mechanism? Do changes like this taken effect automatically or do people need to update the Alexa skill? Will there be a ongoing update process like MC, or with changes be accumulated and done as one bigger update? Thanks.

The skill is hosted online, so you are automatically using the latest without any action required.

[dtc]

Thanks. That is awesome.

[dtc]

It seems like Play Artist has changed its selection criteria. It used to randomly select tracks. Now, it seems to select an album and play all of that, then continue on to another album and play all of that, etc. I am not sure why this change happened. It seems like playing random tracks is the preferred option.  That would be consistent with how other online services work.

Play Artist also seems to include Christmas songs. Most services do not include them in a Play Artist type command.  Can they be excluded from Play Artist?

[cncb]

It seems like Play Artist has changed its selection criteria. It used to randomly select tracks. Now, it seems to select an album and play all of that, then continue on to another album and play all of that, etc. I am not sure why this change happened. It seems like playing random tracks is the preferred option.  That would be consistent with how other online services work.

Play Artist also seems to include Christmas songs. Most services do not include them in a Play Artist type command.  Can they be excluded from Play Artist?

It has always sorted like this.  Append "with options shuffle" to the command if you want random.

There is not an easy general way to exclude certain genres.

[dtc]

It has always sorted like this.  Append "with options shuffle" to the command if you want random.

There is not an easy general way to exclude certain genres.

I am pretty sure Play Artist used to select songs from different albums.  I am pretty sure one of my artist selections always started with one Christmas song then skipped to other songs. That has been one of my test cases.  In any case, random seems like it should be the default.   Having to add a shuffle command every time is a bit of a deal breaker for my family, given it is not necessary on other services.

Having to explicitly exclude Christmas music with the Play Artist command seems like a limitation. I think it should be the default. That is standard in other online services.  I think people are going to be surprised when Christmas music starts playing.

Please consider these changes to Play Artist.

[JimH]

We could probably safely assume the list should be shuffled by default and even omit Christmas music by default.

[dtc]

"Higher" is now working for volume and "what is playing" now works too (had to remove "what/which zone is playing" because Alexa was not able to distinguish these).

Higher works.

How about a simple Where command to tell you the zone.  Maybe Alexa will allow that.

[dtc]

We could probably safely assume the list should be shuffled by default and even omit Christmas music by default.

Thanks Jim.

Play Artist also sees to always start with the same song. It would be nice to randomize that also.

[cncb]

Play Artist also sees to always start with the same song. It would be nice to randomize that also.

It may be that you have a Christmas compilation album so there would only be one song by that artist from that album and then it would move on to their other individual albums.  Shuffle will randomize the first song.

[vairulez]

@cncb if you need help for the french translation you can count on me

[JimH]

Just thinking ...  what about shuffling artist by default, but allowing an "unshuffled" option?

Christmas is an odd one.  I don't think you'd ever want to play a little Christmas music.  It's all or nothing.

[dtc]

It may be that you have a Christmas compilation album so there would only be one song by that artist from that album and then it would move on to their other individual albums.  Shuffle will randomize the first song.

It seems like if the genre is Christmas it should be excluded.  If it is a Christmas song but with another genre, then I would expect it to be played.

I believe the idea of Play Artist is to play a random list of songs. Starting at the same song every time only works if it is a well known hit from that artist and after that things are randomized. Some services try to do that. I guess you could always start with the song with the highest rating, if there are ratings. Other than that, I really think it should be a random starting point. Adding a shuffle option each time you use Play Artist is really not an option.  I like the unshuffle option, although I am not sure it will be used much.

Thanks.

[cncb]

It seems like if the genre is Christmas it should be excluded.  If it is a Christmas song but with another genre, then I would expect it to be played.

I believe the idea of Play Artist is to play a random list of songs. Starting at the same song every time only works if it is a well known hit from that artist and after that things are randomized. Some services try to do that. I guess you could always start with the song with the highest rating, if there are ratings. Other than that, I really think it should be a random starting point. Adding a shuffle option each time you use Play Artist is really not an option.  I like the unshuffle option, although I am not sure it will be used much.

I was just trying to explain what was probably happening.  It always starts with the same song because it is not shuffling by default.

I will try shuffling "play artist" and "play genre" by default.  I will also try excluding Christmas, but we probably need a way of setting that since people might be using a different genre name.

[cncb]

@cncb if you need help for the french translation you can count on me

Thanks.

[dtc]

I was just trying to explain what was probably happening.  It always starts with the same song because it is not shuffling by default.

I will try shuffling "play artist" and "play genre" by default.  I will also try excluding Christmas, but we probably need a way of setting that since people might be using a different genre name.

Thanks! And, yes, I use XMAS for a genre so it goes to the bottom of any genre sort. Others may use other names. Maybe a new Christmas tag (Y or N) would help, like the Playability tag. Or maybe a Playability Alexa tag, like the current Playability tag. Or maybe an Include modifier which could include any Genre you specify.

EDIT : I did turn off Playability on all my Christmas albums and that works. Christmas albums are excluded from Play Artist. That may be a temporary work around.

[cncb]

EDIT : I did turn off Playability on all my Christmas albums and that works. Christmas albums are excluded from Play Artist. That may be a temporary work around.

I just was about to write this as I didn't see your edit.  I think you are saying the same thing.  If you uncheck the "Playable" tag for your Christmas files, then they don't play with other artist tracks.  Is this sufficient or would you prefer a new library field specifically for the JTalk Play Artist?  We could potentially use the "Custom" tag for this.

[dtc]

I just was about to write this as I didn't see your edit.  I think you are saying the same thing.  If you uncheck the "Playable" tag for your Christmas files, then they don't play with other artist tracks.  Is this sufficient or would you prefer a new library field specifically for the JTalk Play Artist?  We could potentially use the "Custom" tag for this.

Ideally I would like a way to play albums and songs at any time on my own but not have them included in commands which do a random selection of tracks, like Play Artist and Play Doctor. The Playability tag turns off all playing, which means I would have to toggle it at Christmas time or if a family member wanted to play a Christmas album off-season. I would prefer a mechanism that, once set, does not need to be reset, and that only applies to the random commands.  I know that is pretty picky, but having to change tags should be avoided if possible. I think (not sure) Play Doctor may already have a mechanism for not playing Christmas, but that is probably built into the MC Play Doctor code.

People already use the Custom tag, so I would suggest not using it for these specific Alexa commands.

Thanks for working on this.

[cncb]

Matt came up with a good idea to use the Users feature to exclude certain genres from playback for JTalk.  So, go to "View | User | Add user..." and put this in the Files To Show field:  -[Genre]=[XMAS]

Select this new user in the "View | User" menu and when you use JTalk it won't attempt to play any Christmas music.  When you want to be able to play Christmas music, simply select the original Administrator user in the same menu.

Note that this won't work completely until the next version of the skill and MC30 build.

[dtc]

Matt came up with a good idea to use the Users feature to exclude certain genres from playback for JTalk.  So, go to "View | User | Add user..." and put this in the Files To Show field:  -[Genre]=[XMAS]

Select this new user in the "View | User" menu and when you use JTalk it won't attempt to play any Christmas music.  When you want to be able to play Christmas music, simply select the original Administrator user in the same menu.

Note that this won't work completely until the next version of the skill and MC30 build.

The idea is to be able to play Christmas music directly, but have it not play in commands like Play Artist.  I have not been a big Play Doctor user, but I believe it excludes Christmas. Can you incorporate that logic into a Play Artist implementation?  Excluding Christmas is probably enough. I would not worry about Xmas.

Unfortunately,  Matt's solution is just too complicated for the average user and I do not believe it addresses playing Christmas directly but not include it in Play Artist.  If I want to exclude Xmas from playing, then setting Playability is probably easier, but again not particularly user friendly for the average user.

I just trying to reproduce what other online services do by default.

Thanks.

[JimH]

This may now work (or soon will work) with MC29.0.86 if you have installed an MC30 license.

The license install lets you remove the old license and install the new one if necessary.  Help > Registration

[dtc]

It looks like Play Artist now plays a random selection of tracks and excludes Christmas music. I need to do more testing, but this looks great.

THANKS.

[dtc]

Alexa has a feature that allows you to define your own routines that execute a command using your own trigger. I have been experimenting with it with JTalk and it looks very promising.

For example, I have implemented

J River Pause               Ask J Talk to Pause
J River Play                 Ask J Talk to Continue
J River Playing Now      Ask J Talk to Display Playing Now
J River Collins              Ask J Talk to Play Artist Judy Collins on Zone Player

I am finding these routines very nice for some routine commands, although you cannot customize them on the fly for specific artists, etc. You need the full JTalk implementation for that. And you have to be sure that Alexa sees your routines as unique. For example, Alexa  plays using the default music server rather than using J Talk for the routine trigger J River Judy Collins. But these routines may be useful for some common tasks, including common playlists or commonly used Play Doctor commands.

Routines can also be used to do a set of tasks at a given time, like bedtime, and even when you get home or leave using geo-fencing.

[JimH]

Neither JRiver nor JTalk have a space.

[dtc]

Neither JRiver nor JTalk have a space.

Please see the first post in this thread. The J Talk command clearly has a space in it.  I am just using what is in the instructions.

The space in my use of J River as a routine name is to not confuse Alexa.

[JimH]

The names of the skill and the application have no space.

Since Amazon requires two words, the skill must be pronounced as if it is two words.

I realize that's a little confusing, but leaving the space out of the product names is important for an Internet search.

[cncb]

The new version of JTalk has been accepted by Amazon with the following changes:

- Works with MC29 if the user has an MC30 license installed
- Playing by search automatically shuffles if an album is not specified
- Added "sort" to options to avoid automatic shuffle
- Playing by search ignores Christmas/holiday music if album or genre is not specified
- Added "unmute" command

[kevin_marchant]

The new version of JTalk has been accepted by Amazon with the following changes:

- Works with MC29 if the user has an MC30 license installed
- Playing by search automatically shuffles if an album is not specified
- Added "sort" to options to avoid automatic shuffle
- Playing by search ignores Christmas/holiday music if album or genre is not specified
- Added "unmute" command

Hi Craig, @cncb

Our private message exchange has fallen foul of some sort of 3 messages per hour limit so in answer to your questions, yes all devices on same Amazon account, JTalk skill is not recognised via voice from either Alexa on Dot or phone.  I reckon that link I sent you might be worth reviewing.

Question to curious others.  I’m in the (UK) and the skill will open and works just fine when typed at from the Alexa app on my iPhone but wont open via voice.

[cncb]

I’m in the (UK) and the skill will open and works just fine when typed at from the Alexa app on my iPhone but wont open via voice.

I will keep looking for a cause, but JTalk is certified in the UK with the same launch name as the US: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0BCX6FST8

[comox]

4) Tap Home in the Alexa app and tap the little keyboard icon in the top left corner. You have to type in the setup commands.  Voice will not work.

Android on Samsung Note 9.

I don't see the keyboard icon and I have tried everything I can think of to enter typed commands.

Google did not help.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[dtc]

Android on Samsung Note 9.

I don't see the keyboard icon and I have tried everything I can think of to enter typed commands.

Google did not help.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

When I have the main Alexa screen up, I have a blue and white circle in the upper left. This is the icon to do voice commands. When I hit it that, at the bottom of the screen there is a little keyboard icon. When I hit that I get the keyboard to enter commands. At least, that is now it works for me.  May depend on the version of Android and Alexa.

Assuming you see the keyboard in other apps.

[comox]

When I have the main Alexa screen up, I have a blue and white circle in the upper left. This is the icon to do voice commands. When I hit it that, at the bottom of the screen there is a little keyboard icon. When I hit that I get the keyboard to enter commands. At least, that is now it works for me.  May depend on the version of Android and Alexa.

Thank you. Must be a quirk of the Note 9. I dug out my old Samsung S7 and was able to see the keyboard and configure JTalk.

Now I have another problem. It reports "MC Server did not respond. Check that's it's running and accessible from the internet."

I confirmed JRemote is working ok with the same credentials.

Perhaps this is the problem?

1) Make sure your MC 30 server is running and accessible from the Internet. Note that MC's built-in SSL will NOT work so you will have to make the non-SSL port available.

What is SSL and how do I make the non-SSL port available?

[JimH]

Use Google to learn about SSL.  It's a security layer for the connection.  By default, MC doesn't use it.  Read about Media Server on the wiki.

You may have a typo in the login / password.  Use it without until you have it  working.

[JimH]

Question to curious others.  I’m in the (UK) and the skill will open and works just fine when typed at from the Alexa app on my iPhone but wont open via voice.

You have to separate J and Talk a little when you speak.  Alexa often mistakes what I say for another skill whose name is at all similar other than it starts with a J.  Speak loudly also.

[comox]

Use Google to learn about SSL.  It's a security layer for the connection.  By default, MC doesn't use it.  Read about Media Server on the wiki.

You may have a typo in the login / password.  Use it without until you have it  working.

I have 3 Alex devices and have automated much of my house including lighting, appliances, heating, and my AV system using a Logitech remote control.

I have used many Alexa skills and created many sophisticated routines.

JTalk is an order of magnitude more confusing and complex to set up than anything else in the Alexa ecosystem.

[JimH]

Thank you. Must be a quirk of the Note 9. I dug out my old Samsung S7 and was able to see the keyboard and configure JTalk.

That problem wasn't with JTalk.  That was Alexa.

[dtc]

I confirmed JRemote is working ok with the same credentials.

I turned off authentication just to make sure there was no issue with that check. Worth a try.

[dtc]

I have 3 Alex devices and have automated much of my house including lighting, appliances, heating, and my AV system using a Logitech remote control.

I have used many Alexa skills and created many sophisticated routines.

JTalk is an order of magnitude more confusing and complex to set up than anything else in the Alexa ecosystem.

Typically Alexa devices can be "discovered" by the Alexa skill. That automatically creates the connection between Alexa and the device. JTalk does not use that method. It requires the user to enter an access code/login information that is then sent to Media Center. That process makes the initial setup more complicated.  If JTALK used the standard Alexa discover method, it might make the whole setup process easier. Hopefully that will be considered in the future.

[cncb]

We hope to make the setup process easier in the near future (although there will be no automatic "discovery", you will still have to enter your server info and credentials like everywhere else).

[dtc]

Thanks for working on making it easier.

Discover would be nice. That is the standard in the Alexa world. Sort of like the wps key on a modem - send a signal and let the devices connect to each other and exchange information. Just turn on a signal in MC and let Alexa discover it.  Manual entry can always be an option, but people who are used to Alexa will find it primitive.

[cncb]

It's not really an Alexa device, more like a service.  Think of Spotify where you have to link your account manually by typing in your account details for setup.

[dtc]

MC is not a service like Spotify.   My PC is a physical device that I can touch and control. But whatever you want to call it, it seems like discovery would be a much better way to do the connection - push a button on MC and it connects to JTalk. Something to consider.