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[ferrarabrainpan]

I know about the Customize View tickbox to "Always show files" but I'm wondering if there is another way to bring up the files view in a library view displaying album thumbnails, other than mousing down to the little arrows at the bottom of the view window? Not a big deal, but I'd use a keyboard hotkey or toolbar button if there is one.

[HPBEME]

If the view in question is not a "Panes" style view, AND you are not browsing directly in the left-hand tree, double-clicking on the album thumbnail will bring up the file list.

If it is a Panes view OR you are tree browsing, Ctrl+Shift+I will switch thumbnails to a detailed list, and Ctrl+Shift+P goes from details to album thumbnails.  See https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Keyboard_Hot-keys  for other MC hotkeys.

I have mentioned in another thread how I use a free mouse gesture program (https://www.strokesplus.net/) to transform hotkeys into simple mouse flicks (I find a mouse flick to be far easier than holding down three keys simultaneously). I have 14 gestures specifically for MC operations, two of which allow me to easily toggle between thumbnails and detailed list view.  I can provide my config file to anyone who is interested, which has approximately 50 gestures altogether (see pics below). 

Here is another thread where I talk about how I use Strokes+ to set any window to be always on top, which I personally find to be an invaluable tool: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,133514.msg924962.html#msg924962

You of course have to download the mouse gesture program and become familiar with it.  It is extremely powerful so there is a bit of a learning curve to understand everything it can do, but the payoff is immense.

[ferrarabrainpan]

If the view in question is not a "Panes" style view, AND you are not browsing directly in the left-hand tree, double-clicking on the album thumbnail will bring up the file list.

If it is a Panes view OR you are tree browsing, Ctrl+Shift+I will switch thumbnails to a detailed list, and Ctrl+Shift+P goes from details to album thumbnails.  See https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Keyboard_Hot-keys  for other MC hotkeys.

Thanks for the detailed response. I may try the Strokes+ app but for now I am not sure what is meant by tree browsing. Below is a screenshot of the album thumbnail view that shows up in most of my library views. I just wanted a shortcut so I don't have to mouse down to one of the two tiny arrows at the bottom of the view window in order to bring up the files view. Ideally, I wish there was a custom toolbar button I could pin to the top toolbar that would toggle between thumbnail and file views, of some other quick hotkey to do that. The Ctrl+Shift+I doesn't do anything.

[HPBEME]

I just wanted a shortcut so I don't have to mouse down to one of the two tiny arrows at the bottom of the view window in order to bring up the files view.

Did you not try my first suggestion? To simply double-click on the album thumbnail? That will open the file list (without having to click on the tiny splitter arrows).

For the view you show in your post, the shortcut keys I mentioned do not apply, and will not work (as you discovered).  Those shortcut keys are for Panes View and Tree Browsing, because in those situations, double-clicking on the album thumbnail does not show the file list.

[ferrarabrainpan]

Did you not try my first suggestion? To simply double-click on the album thumbnail? That will open the file list (without having to click on the tiny splitter arrows).

For the view you show in your post, the shortcut keys I mentioned do not apply, and will not work (as you discovered).  Those shortcut keys are for Panes View and Tree Browsing, because in those situations, double-clicking on the album thumbnail will not show the file list.

Okay yes, that works, thank you. 

[markf2748]

I just wanted a shortcut so I don't have to mouse down to one of the two tiny arrows at the bottom of the view window in order to bring up the files view. Ideally, I wish there was a custom toolbar button I could pin to the top toolbar that would toggle between thumbnail and file views, of some other quick hotkey to do that.

+1 I wish the same.

Another "shortcut" you may find useful:  Mouse-over anywhere on the somewhat imaginary horizontal "pane divider line" that contains those two tiny arrows you mention until you see the mouse pointer change into a two-headed vertical arrow.  Double left click the vertical arrow to toggle visibility of the bottom list pane.
Notes:
1) This feature works even when a Tree category has multiple sub-categories.  Unfortunately, I find double clicking the thumbnail image does not have the same effect in this case.

2) Similarly, a double headed horizontal arrow appears with mouse-over anywhere on the vertical divider line between Tree and Standard View.  Double clicking it toggles Tree visibility.

3) For the Tree there is a nice Custom Toolbar Button "Toggle Tree".  What we need is a similar Custom Toolbar Button (and maybe keyboard shortcut) for "Toggle Bottom List Pane".  [Additional:  Give this button a unique icon resource.]

4) Puzzled, I ask myself why in practice I prefer such a button over hunting for a line?  I conclude (a) I'd rather aim for a clearly visible stationary target than hunt for a moving, long thin, fussy invisible one which is more subject to overshoot.  It might help if there was a just-visible hairline border to target (Thunderstorm skin is better than Black on Black in this particular respect) with a larger response area. Same for those two tiny arrows - they would also improve if slightly larger and mouse-over made them light up a little. (b) I greatly prefer the buttons' immediate single click action to the border line's double click action. (c) A toolbar button would be fixed right there alongside other buttons as expected and consistent with the Toggle Tree button.  All human interface factors - somewhat personal, but likely broadly applicable.

MC 30.0.41, currently preferred skins: Black on Black and ThunderStorm, custom icons.     Win 11 Pro (64-bit) desktop with 1920x1200 display

[ferrarabrainpan]

3) For the Tree there is a nice Custom Toolbar Button "Toggle Tree".  What we need is a similar Custom Toolbar Button (and maybe keyboard shortcut) for "Toggle Bottom List Pane".

4) Puzzled, I ask myself why in practice I prefer such a button over hunting for a line?  I conclude (a) I'd rather aim for a clearly visible stationary target than hunt for a moving, long thin, fussy invisible one which is more subject to overshoot.  It might help if there was a just-visible hairline border to target (Thunderstorm skin is better than Black on Black in this particular respect) with a larger response area. Same for those two tiny arrows - they would also improve if slightly larger and mouse-over made them light up a little. (b) I greatly prefer the buttons' immediate single click action to the border line's double click action. (c) A toolbar button would be fixed right there alongside other buttons as expected and consistent with the Toggle Tree button.  All human interface factors - somewhat personal, but likely broadly applicable.

MC 30.0.41, currently preferred skins: Black on Black and Thunderstorm.     Win 11 Pro (64-bit) desktop with 1920x1200 display

Well said. Hopefully someone on staff will see this suggestion... or is there a thread where we can post suggestions for feature requests?

[HPBEME]

I took another/closer look at the JRiver wiki hotkey page https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,133514.msg924962.html#msg924962, and whaddya know... There is a Hotkey to open the bottom file list panel! Simply select an album thumbnail (or thumbnails), and hit enter on your keyboard to open/close the file list panel (relevant page location in attached pic below).

Unfortunately, having to first click on a thumbnail before hitting enter for this to work makes this approach slower than simply double-clicking on an album thumbnail to open the file list. Also unfortunately, as noted in Mark's post, for multilevel categories double-clicking thumbnails drills down without showing the file list, until it gets to the album itself, and then the file list will show - same is true if you use the enter key approach.

So in the end, double-clicking the splitter works for all scenarios. But depending on the skin, those splitters can be pretty thin and difficult to double-click. It is far preferable to have a bigger target, such as a toolbar button, so that precision is not paramount and a double-click is not required.

One thing I have thought about requesting myself, is instead of having to double-click the splitter, a single click will open/close the panel.  I find that when I double-click, I often times move my mouse slightly between the clicks. This results in the panel barely being open after the double-click, which forces me to manually resize the panel. And to be clear, the current single click-and-hold behavior that allows you to drag/resize the splitter would be unchanged.

So with the above approach, instead of having to zero in on and click those tiny arrows to open/close panels, you activate anywhere along the entire splitter bar with a single click! So what about when a splitter has dual direction arrows? Then simply click one-half of the splitter bar to move in one direction, and the other half to move the other direction.  Which side to click is obvious, given the arrowheads are symmetric about the splitter centerline.

To satisfy all parties, all three approaches could be incorporated without any conflict:

• Change splitter's double-click activation to single click, and recognize dual directions per splitter bar halves
• Update the "enter hotkey" to open the file list regardless of the level you're at in a multilevel category view
• Add a dedicated toolbar button to open the file list

Winner winner python dinner.

[ferrarabrainpan]

I took another/closer look at the JRiver wiki hotkey page https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,133514.msg924962.html#msg924962, and whaddya know... There is a Hotkey to open the bottom file list panel! Simply select an album thumbnail (or thumbnails), and hit enter on your keyboard to open/close the file list panel (relevant page location in attached pic below).

Unfortunately, having to first click on a thumbnail before hitting enter for this to work makes this approach slower than simply double-clicking on an album thumbnail to open the file list. Also unfortunately, as noted in Mark's post, for multilevel categories double-clicking thumbnails drills down without showing the file list, until it gets to the album itself, and then the file list will show - same is true if you use the enter key approach.

So in the end, double-clicking the splitter works for all scenarios. But depending on the skin, those splitters can be pretty thin and difficult to double-click. It is far preferable to have a bigger target, such as a toolbar button, so that precision is not paramount and a double-click is not required.

One thing I have thought about requesting myself, is instead of having to double-click the splitter, a single click will open/close the panel.  I find that when I double-click, I often times move my mouse slightly between the clicks. This results in the panel barely being open after the double-click, which forces me to manually resize the panel. And to be clear, the current single click-and-hold behavior that allows you to drag/resize the splitter would be unchanged.

So with the above approach, instead of having to zero in on and click those tiny arrows to open/close panels, you activate anywhere along the entire splitter bar with a single click! So what about when a splitter has dual direction arrows? Then simply click one-half of the splitter bar to move in one direction, and the other half to move the other direction.  Which side to click is obvious, given the arrowheads are symmetric about the splitter centerline.

To satisfy all parties, all three approaches could be incorporated without any conflict:

• Change splitter's double-click activation to single click, and recognize dual directions per splitter bar halves
• Update the "enter hotkey" to open the file list regardless of the level you're at in a multilevel category view
• Add a dedicated toolbar button to open the file list

Winner winner python dinner.

I just want a toolbar button to toggle between show files and hide files when showing the library with thumbnails. Clicking on a thumbnail for an album and hitting enter brings up the files for that album, not all albums in the library view. There can be multiple keyboard and mouse actions for doing a selected procedure but a one-click easily mouseable button at top is simplest. If they will add this to the customize toolbar buttons then I will be satisfied for now.

[HPBEME]

Clicking on a thumbnail for an album and hitting enter brings up the files for that album, not all albums in the library view.

After double-clicking a thumbnail or using the enter to open the file list panel, scroll to the end of the thumbnails. If a thumbnail does not occupy every spot the very last row, just select the open space to show all files. If a thumbnail DOES occupy every location in the bottom row, there will still be a thin "blank" strip just below the last row where you can click to deselect any thumbnails previously selected, and then it will show all files in the file list.  Granted, not as convenient as just having toolbar button, but at least you have a workaround in the event a toolbar button is never added to MC.

I get that you would prefer toolbar button, but I prefer the splitter bar single click approach. This is because it's convenience extends well beyond just hide/show the file list.  There is also a splitter bar next to the tree, a splitter bar below the panes, a splitter bar in the playing now window, and multiple splitter bars for optional split view layouts.  In every one of these cases, being able to hide/show panels with a single click anywhere along the splitters length would be highly desirable IMO.

The splitter functionality/efficiency is something I have thought a lot about over the years, and my hope is that Matt will incorporate all three unique approaches (updated hotkey, toolbar button, single click splitter).

[markf2748]

After double-clicking a thumbnail or using the enter to open the file list panel, scroll to the end of the thumbnails. If a thumbnail does not occupy every spot the very last row, just select the open space to show all files. If a thumbnail DOES occupy every location in the bottom row, there will still be a thin "blank" strip just below the last row where you can click to deselect any thumbnails previously selected, and then it will show all files in the file list.  Granted, not as convenient as just having toolbar button, but at least you have a workaround in the event a toolbar button is never added to MC.

De-selecting any selected thumbnail with <CTRL><LMB> on it accomplishes the same thing without scrolling all the way down, which can sometimes be more efficient.  In any case, deselecting all thumbnails in the upper window results in all albums listed alphabetically by artist in the Bottom List Pane.  If we ever get a shortcut or Toolbar Button to switch style, it should leave the existing selections unchanged; and if nothing selected, then respect the tab ordering in the Bottom List Pane.

In summary, I think two Custom Toolbar buttons/shortcuts (and a menu fix) are in play here:
(1) Toggle the current tab's List Style between Thumbnails <--> Details.  Similar to the tab's hover menu List Style, except it should always preserve the contents and visibility state of the Bottom List Pane.  Currently this menu switches style of the upper main window (good), but unfortunately opens the Bottom List Pane if it is closed (bad), and furthermore overwrites its contents with a complete artist-ordered listing (doubly bad).  If the Bottom List Pane were left unchanged, it could survive as a <CTRL><LMB> selection accumulator.
(2) Show <--> Hide Bottom List Pane

If I understand correctly, HPBME in Reply #7 above suggested (2) always be covered by double clicking any thumbnail.  However that implies giving up on the current action "drill down into Tree sub-categories" when sub-categories are defined.  Occasionally I find the drill down to be useful, and the thumbnail double click action (or Enter), as is, works nicely to get there.   Not sure what the best trade-off is here.

[HPBEME]

I think selecting any single thumbnail and then <CTRL><LMB> on it accomplishes the same thing without scrolling down.

Hah... You are 100% correct! Double-clicking a thumbnail to open the file list, and then CRTL+LMB the same thumbnail will deselect it, which then populates the file list for all thumbnails. That approach is certainly faster than scrolling to the bottom first, even if you use a hyperscroll wheel mouse.

If I understand correctly, HPBME in Reply #7 above suggested (2) always be covered by double clicking any thumbnail.  However that implies giving up on the current action "drill down into Tree sub-categories" when sub-categories are defined.  I find the drill down to be useful, and the thumbnail double click action, as is, works nicely to get there.

I think were in agreement on this?  I too, find double-clicking thumbnails to drill down highly useful. For example, double-clicking a genre thumbnail begets artist thumbnails, double-clicking on a specific artist thumbnail begets that artist's album thumbnails, and then finally clicking on a specific album thumbnail begets the bottom panel file list.  To me, this makes complete sense. I want the full display area to show thumbnails until I get to the album I am interested in, and only then do I want to see the file list.

If you want to show a detailed list for all artists/albums and have it respect the defined grouping, categories, sort order, etc., then why not just make a dedicated list style view? Or switch the thumbnail display to list via the tab menu? Those are rhetorical questions… No need to explain why - everybody wants what they want for how their workflow flows.

All that said, when I originally responded to this thread, I was only trying to explain how the OP could (sort of) achieve what they wanted.  Then Mark responded about how you can double-click the splitter bar to open the panel (I noted this as well in another thread several months back https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,132594.msg918736.html#msg918736, post #5). That dovetailed nicely into my desire for single-click splitter bar activation, so I included that as another feature enhancement in my reply (which as I stated previously, the benefits go well beyond just opening the bottom file list panel).

So to be clear, I think what you're suggesting for enhanced toolbar button functionality is great. I only hope that multiple enhanced approaches are implemented. 

Oh… And one last thing.  All of us have missed something incredibly obvious.  If you hover over a thumbnail, a text link to open the file list pops up at the bottom of the thumbnail - I feel like an idiot for not having mentioned that in my very first reply!

[ferrarabrainpan]

All these responses are good and helpful, some I already knew and some I did not. I'm still hoping for a single-click custom toolbar button to toggle between hide/show files, but in the meantime I like the double-click splitter bar arrows the best and will use that.

[Matt]

Suggestion noted.

[Matt]

Next build:
NEW: Added an MCC (MCC_LIST_TOGGLE_FILES / 26033) to show and hide files in a library view.
NEW: Added a toolbar button to allow showing and hiding files the same way.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[ferrarabrainpan]

Next build:
NEW: Added an MCC (MCC_LIST_TOGGLE_FILES / 26033) to show and hide files in a library view.
NEW: Added a toolbar button to allow showing and hiding files the same way.

Thanks for the suggestion.

  Thank You