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[JimH]

We're about to begin the transition to MC31 so I'm thinking about where we go next.  I'd be grateful for your thoughts as well.

With a few exceptions, we now have a comprehensive digital media solution. 

OS's:  Windows, Linux, MacOS

Remotes:  iOS, Android, WebApp

Network:  UPnP/DLNA and Library Server

Formats:  100+ audio, video, image

TV:  Complete coverage of global formats

Metadata:  CD, BD, Wikipedia, Google, etc.

Streaming:  Cloudplay


And so on.  You know what a massive task it's been to build this.  Thanks to this great team.

Where to go next?

One obvious path is to absolutely perfect what we do.  There are too many times when I feel like we're there but something breaks or we take a step backward.  Some of that is normal given the shifting sands we build on.  But some of it is just a failure to perfect on our part.  The team is excellent at taking ownership of various parts, but we have a few strays cats that nobody wants to own. 

Another (and these are not in any order) is to add video to Cloudplay.  We could start with documentaries and small studios.  Maybe it works for photos as well.

We could focus on ease of use.  Adding a search to the options page was a big improvement that didn't take too much work.  We could provide links from features to instructions, for example.

We could improve the website. 

We could improve the graphics.

Evangelism by our community on other sites is extremely helpful.  Maybe we could reward it or recognize it better.  We don't get as much exposure on other sites as we could.  I think that's partly because this forum is so strong that users rely on it and not other forums.

DSP is an area where we're pretty good but there's a lot of room to grow there.

Database cleaning and repair?

[mattkhan]

my 2p... no particular order

cross platform (or at least more than just windows) feature parity
* JRVR is making a big step forward here so possibly there is not that much left to do here but there are 2 obvious remaining gaps that seem quite small on the surface, one is the lack of WDM equivalent (despite something like snd-aloop making loopback trivial on linux) and the other is the oft requested local playback capability (basically making the library being able to translate back and forth between linux/macos paths and windows paths)

"completing" JRVR
* basically all the features already discussed on JRVR threads

media network user friendliness
* being able to see/manage the network as a network of devices & markedly better communication when things go wrong (currently it's basically comes across as either "computer says no" or "computer is not saying anything and is just doing nothing for no obvious reason") are the most obvious points to my mind here

DSP
* I wrote https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,129609.0.html because MC is/was just too tedious & hard to use for complex DSP configurations, a piece of that was solved with the fixes in MC29 but it's still painful imo, the major gap here include: the types of low/high pass filters supported + lack of interoperability with other filter design software + a big list of filters being a really hard to keep track of when creating multiway speaker setups + no visualisation of the filter chain. Note that nearly all of this work is UI work (you can see from what I implemented that it's possible to do pretty much everything with the core dsp features available already, it's just really unfriendly to do it in MC itself)
* I would add to this the ability to let dsp studio be used with remote zones

[SamuriHL]

I would agree that enhancing the already awesome JRVR would be a good area of focus.  I have a MacBook Pro in addition to my HTPC and it's awesome to be able to have so much functionality there.

As for evangelizing on other sites, I try as much as I can to bring awareness to JRiver whenever I can.

[kr4]

How about integrating an ability to create/manage virtual audio output devices (that incorporate/synch multiple physical devices) in the way that ASIO4ALL/VoiceMeeter/Mac can do?

[lello]

We could focus on ease of use. 

and
We could improve the graphics.
 

I think many people would be interested in better ease of use, especially when importing a new film or TV series if you are interested in metadata, as well as in the graphic aspect (I only improved it thanks to the lepa template and Zrating), but I have the impression that this is already planned.

[JimH]

I would agree that enhancing the already awesome JRVR would be a good area of focus.  I have a MacBook Pro in addition to my HTPC and it's awesome to be able to have so much functionality there.

As for evangelizing on other sites, I try as much as I can to bring awareness to JRiver whenever I can.

JRVR is at the top of the list.  Hendrik will have more to say soon.

I've seen your comments elsewhere.  Thanks!  It's extremely helpful.

[SamuriHL]

JRVR is at the top of the list.  Hendrik will have more to say soon.

I've seen your comments elsewhere.  Thanks!  It's extremely helpful.

That will be a huge selling point.  I know the goal isn't to necessarily replace madvr, but I would argue the closer you can get to that goal, the more people will be willing to pay for this awesome product.  There's a very large appetite in the HTPC crowd for something to replace madvr given the state of things.  JRVR has a STRONG foundation as it stands.  I can't wait to see it evolve further.  It'll make the job of evangelizing it on other forums that much easier.

[JimH]

When Hendrik starts a new thread on it, please give us advice on what's still missing.

[SamuriHL]

Absolutely.  Would love to help it improve.  It already does a great job.  Some of the improvements depend on how much time/resources you want to dedicate to it, so we can discuss all that when Hendrick's ready.

[leezer3]

Dangerous...

Video / photo on Cloudplay sounds an interesting carrot with the other changes, but it's of no real use to me.

Graphics are nice, but have been muttered about before, and not too much happened.
Basically, by the public announcement if going down this road, you need a big 'something'

Remotes-
These are largely decent, but really could do with work in some areas. (I've posted before about image support in JRemote for Android for example)
Trouble is that they're not part of the main program, and are a little hidden and with an extra cost to entry

Database cleaning / repair?
Yuck 
We see very few to no reports of corrupt databases / missing changes, so don't push what you don't need.

[jmone]

A "smart" video server may be interesting. 

As background I was running my own file server (NextCloud) from home in a DMZ but ended up decommissioning it due to:
- Hassle of Maintaining it (I "broke it" several times during upgrades thanks to my lack of Linux knowledge)
- Limited functionality (eg I could upload a single video but there was no selective transcoding based on the client device, so to cater for both SDR and HDR I'd have to render out various versions)

I also tried to use the MC inbuilt "share" function but found it:
- hard to keep the SSL cert up to date
- Issues with some users not able to access the site due to Let’s Encrypt SSL certificate not being "trusted" by their setup (they got warnings that the certificate could be dodgy). 
- limited control & stats on views etc
- not running in the DMZ
- Poor connection speeds and latency from geographically remote users

I'm currently testing just using YouTube (most a "private" links) and what +'ve and -'ve I've found so far is:
+'ve: I can upload my finished UHD HDR video that I would use with MC, and Youtube will create multiple renders for different clients (different resolutions, bitrates, SDR, HDR)
+'ve: All the stats on # of views, permissions, comments etc
+'ve: Once uploaded I don't have to worry about bandwidth, storage etc (not that any are every going to be a big hit)
+'ve: It's Free
-'ve: It's Free, but Alphabet is monetizing my "Stuff" somehow
-'ve: No control over what they render my videos out at (it is all VP9)

Given you are worried about hosting costs, I'm not sure expanding Cloudplay into the world of Video delivery will be a great idea unless it becomes some form of charged services.  The other option is to let us host our own Cloudplay Video Server.  Regardless of where it runs it would need to support:
- Trusted SSL, with an easy SLL install and maintenance (if self hosted)
- Recognition of client render capabilities and their "quality" preference for the delivery of the "correct" stream
- Either render versions OR fast enough Realtime rendering to satisfy the above
- User access mgt
- Comments etc

[jmone]

Other ideas:
- JRVR:  I agree with the comments regarding the expansion of JRVR.  The madVR base is .... well.... discerning. You are not going to please them all, but as JRVR develops many will migrate across

- Other Front Ends:  I don't know why on earth some users run other Front Ends but then use MC for the video playback.  What do these other Front Ends have that is appealing to them?  No idea, but it might be worth some investigation with these users.

- EDID mgt:  I know this is a hardware thing, but is there anyway of having JRVR manage EDID persistence?  Eg: when MC detects that the HTPC display becomes available, set it back to your "default" (resolution, framerate, bitdepth, HDR/SDR) and restore MC's window and focus?  Too often, poorly implemented EDID HW leaves the screen in the "basic" config with MC minimised in the task bar.

- Smarter Auto Upgrade:  Similar to the above, I've had to turn off Auto Upgrade as MC tries to do this when there is no screen attached (eg the AVR is off or on another source).  This upgrade then fails as the UAC does not seem to like the no screen being attached and MC at some point must crash.  You come back to a Windows desktop and MC is gone.  When you then run MC again, you get the dialog saying MC did not start correctly with the options to "load default"

[JimH]

Here's why knowing where to spend our time is sometimes difficult.  Google is stopping support on five year old devices made by Lenovo and others:
https://gizmodo.com/google-smart-home-third-party-displays-android-things-1850320510

I just bought a Lenovo clock yesterday.   The clock is ticking.

[JimH]

When Hendrik starts a new thread on it, please give us advice on what's still missing.

The thread on JRVR is here:  https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,135621.msg939644.html#msg939644

[mattkhan]

one area where I think you have a serious gap regards regression testing in your DSP engine, there have been multiple regressions and feature breaks in this area when changes have been made, which are only detected by users performing their own testing but which should never have escaped because there should be automated tests to verify that the DSP behaves as expected. I think it's a serious gap given the potential to do damage to audio equipment (and, in the worst case, hearing) if bugs escape.

I think you could potentially turn this into a selling point if you were to extend this to cover jrvr in order to be able to objectively demonstrate correctness (which is one doubt I've seen raised elsewhere, that jrvr is not behaving correctly in certain scenarios)

[lepa]

Although not currently acute for me but what I think could be good addition would be more user management. Like it said in v19 wiki that possibilities are many. So one direction i could suggest would be making a better multi-user experience.

First baby steps for me would be just to have user specific fields for rating/playback stats. Read access to the values wouldn't even have to be restricted IMO. Vice versa in addition to show current user ratings those could be used in the views to show each family member's rating or combined average for example.

Then next step could be that remotes (MC client / MCWS clients) could log in as specific user account.

[tzr916]

....next step could be that remotes (MC client / MCWS clients) could log in as specific user account.

+1

Other thoughts:
-make theater view "custom tool tips" a standard click-to-enable option. Or a complete revamp of theater view (seems to be requested by many year after year).
-something else is that constantly requested is updating/completing the WIKI. Perhaps it's time to employ a dedicated person to re-do and/or update every page of the WIKI with more tutorials, screenshots, video tutorials, etc. Not just links to the Forum.
-more detailed JRiver website with clear and complete list of all features, formats, platforms, system requirements, screenshots, etc. Not just links to the Forum or the WIKI.
-add video playback slow motion controls to the theater view OSD (similar to Subtitles/LipSync/Zoom). More importantly, prevent the "DSP Tempo dialog" from popping up when slow motion is enabled/disabled (perhaps add an option to mute or disable audio when slow motion is used).

[park]

For me the areas of improvement i would like to see are all in interface an experience.

• touch based standard view.all tree items would be touch friendly sizes and selecting sub items like nested playlists should be easier. Touch scrolling wouldnt select items. Tagging as a touch experience would be great.
• features like 'watchlist' 'continue where you left off' from apps like netflix would be good in theater view. Leverage our play history to suggest 'play again' suggestions
• other discovery features that leverage your spotlight feature to preview/buy new albums based on what you are listening to now or have recently played. Maybe even a spotify integration with the ability to buy albums you discover on spotify and add them to your real library.

I would also like to see media center for android tv work as a media center client for video playback.
I know it would be hard, but the addition of some stores so that we can legally buy and own music and movies/tv would be great. I think that with all the streaming service fragmentation there will something of a movement back to itunes style purchasing of content. Or ultra cheap rentals might be the future, like $1 rentals of movies so that you can still binge watch whatever you like.

[mattkhan]

example of the documentation problem that jriver has

Hendrik pointed me to https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,133480.0.html which is, as far as I can see, the only place that a key feature of a brand new actively developed renderer is described

i.e. buried on a dead board

have you thought about adding a board that collects these sorts of threads (there are quite a few dotted through old boards) into a single child forum so it's easy to browse through key features? you might say "use the wiki instead" but the wiki very often just points back to a thread so might as well go straight to the source

[JimH]

Did you use Google to search?  I get the wiki topics.

[mattkhan]

Did you use Google to search?  I get the wiki topics.

With MC, I often find that i only find or notice the right info once I look after already finding out that info via some other route (if you see what I mean). I think it's because the info is scattered around in different places (multiple threads, wiki pages) but certainly I have had that experience many times.

Put another way, I can find stuff once I know it exists somewhere but discovery is a challenge

[JimH]

I sometimes feel the same way.  It's a big program with lots of moving parts.

[mattkhan]

Evangelism by our community on other sites is extremely helpful.  Maybe we could reward it or recognize it better.  We don't get as much exposure on other sites as we could.  I think that's partly because this forum is so strong that users rely on it and not other forums.

I don't think I've seen MC31 formally mentioned anywhere, do you want to see any comments on other sites referencing some of the features coming up or wait til you have publicly announced it first?

[JimH]

I don't think I've seen MC31 formally mentioned anywhere, do you want to see any comments on other sites referencing some of the features coming up or wait til you have publicly announced it first?

Oddly, new versions are somewhat contentious.  People who bought recently are sometimes miffed.  So wait a little bit.  In another week or two, we may have something public.  Thanks for the thought though.

[mattkhan]

make a concerted effort to expression language less obscure/more intuitive

I would think this has to be one of the bigger barriers to entry for users doing stuff with MC

a really trivial example, it makes you jump through obscure hoops if your value isn't a string.

If I can write an expression that interprets a numeric field as a number, your expression parser can compile the same and do it automatically

[darichman]

Just installed 31 (I cannot believe we are at a number that high!)

In all honesty, MC is already perfect to me for audio and video media. There are some longstanding issues I continue to have with photos/personal videos. I would like to continue using MC for my primary import, tagging and organisation of personal media (photos and home vids). My goal has always been MC as the source of truth for this media, which launches into other paradigms (adobe, google photos mainly).

Limitations for this continue to be inconsistent storing of metadata across these programs, and I'll quote some previous requests that still top my list!

Almost at MC30!

For me, some attention to photos and home videos would be a big win. I have some old requests here and here.

But namely

• More control over EXIF date handling (I can tag date in a scanned photo but still stored/read in other programs as the file date)
• Revisiting tag mapping to improve integration with other platforms (lightroom, google photos)
• Cleaning up date reading in camera/phone video files when imported (details in the linked threads above)
• Fix/move/add geotags could be cool

[JimH]

darichman,
Could you start a thread with a title like "Image Change Requests" and use your old posts as the starting point?  Let's see how much interest there is.

I use the image handling as much as anything else so I'm aware of its importance.

And you deserve some attention for all your contributions to the forum.  21 years now!

[darichman]

darichman,
Could you start a thread with a title like "Image Change Requests" and use your old posts as the starting point?  Let's see how much interest there is.

I use the image handling as much as anything else so I'm aware of its importance.

And you deserve some attention for all your contributions to the forum.  21 years now!

Thanks Jim. I have just done this here. Sorry it took me a while - I had a trip down memory lane and dredged up some of my old threads!

I appreciate any attention, but do not expect it! If anything my contributions have waned in the past decade (I certified as a clinical geneticist) and then again last few years (I have two small boys keeping me very busy). This is also because my audio and video needs are largely now met! But I do use MC for photos/home videos just about every weekend. MC has always been a fixture in my household and I'm thankful for the community (and the software!) Let me know if I can clarify or troubleshoot any of the requests in that thread.