Topic: Smartlists (Read 3467 times)

nila · « **on:** December 17, 2003, 06:34:56 am »

Hiya,

Hadn't made a smartlist in ages so they hadn't effected me at all but thanks to a great screen shot & instructions from Marko I can create fake grouping by date so I started trying to create a few smartlists.

I've been using MC for years and at first when I clicked 'new smartlist' and it made the new one and I named it I was then searching for where to enter the smartlist filter info. It took me like 5-10 seconds to realise I had to use the standard search box.

I think a beginner would find this VERY un-intuitive and wouldn't know what they were meant to do.
I agree with previous posts I've read that this search bar is too small for creating smartlists.
I remember one build had the smartlist search box the whole width of the columns - in my opinion that was a much more obvious and easier to use setup.

Last point - Ctrl+X does not cut when I tried to use it in the search bar - it wont cut the text for me

Jaguu · « **Reply #1 on:** December 17, 2003, 06:44:04 am »

I think the position of progress bar and the search field could be exchanged. In my opinion the progress bar does not really need that large amount of space.

NoCodeUK · « **Reply #2 on:** December 17, 2003, 07:02:32 am »

Jaguu,

try using a progress bar that size when playing a 2hour video and you'll see why the progress bar is as long as it is

Adam

gpvillamil · « **Reply #3 on:** December 17, 2003, 08:12:44 am »

I think we need to get away from the idea of editing smartlists in the search box, and give them a dialog of their own. Right now, right-clicking on a smartlist gives you the option to "edit selected item" but this basically only lets you rename the smartlist, not edit it.

It might be a lot easier if right-click led to an option to "edit smartlist" which would allow you to rename, use a wizard, etc. Right now Winamp 5 and iTunes are showing the way in this area...

nila · « **Reply #4 on:** December 17, 2003, 09:14:27 am »

Gotta agree that the 'edit smartlist' is deceptive.
I right clicked and tried to 'edit smartlist' only to find it was just going to let me rename it.

Def. agree on the Wizard/GUI implementation.

Sam · « **Reply #5 on:** December 17, 2003, 12:04:19 pm »

I've been trying to use more features of MC, and I began wondering about the need for smartlists. I remember being confused about this many months ago.

Are smartlists essentially the same as view schemes, but without the panes/trees? Is there a reason to have both? That is, if you allow view schemes to have no panes, wouldn't you eliminate the need for a separate feature called smartlists?

Warlock · « **Reply #6 on:** December 17, 2003, 12:21:34 pm »

Quote

I think we need to get away from the idea of editing smartlists in the search box, and give them a dialog of their own.

I strongly agree. This is especially necessary for very long smartlist queries.

markp99 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 17, 2003, 12:45:39 pm »

Nila,

I ran into this very same issue just yesterday. I was creating a new Smartlist to capture some Christmas tunes. Took me forever to realize the I had to use SEARCH box tucked away at the top of the screen...

I had to RTFM to figure it out...! D'oh!

I agree, this could be confusing to a novice user (or not so novice, like me) to figure out.

I had expected to be PROMPTED for the Smartlist "rules" immediately after naming the new Smartlist...

ThatAdamGuy · « **Reply #8 on:** December 18, 2003, 02:48:30 am »

Ah, thank goodness for me finding this thread! It took me QUITE a while to figure out how smartlists worked; I thought I had found a beta bug, actually, and then when I realized what was going on, I felt kinda dumb. I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who found this to be a rather unintuitive aspect of MC.

And I'd like to reiterate the question of an earlier poster here; what exactly is the distinction between views and smartlists, aside from the additional pane? I was literally just wondering about this 10 minutes ago.

Gotta love this forum!

nila · « **Reply #9 on:** December 18, 2003, 03:08:24 am »

View Schemes are a way of browsing any collection of files.

Smart Lists are a way of creating a collection of files meeting a specific criteria.

ThatAdamGuy · « **Reply #10 on:** December 18, 2003, 03:30:24 am »

But isn't their functionality pretty much identical? I can create filters in the Views as well, basically mimicking the smart playlists.

Why not just do away with smart playlists entirely, and reserve playlists for static (manual) lists of songs?

Marko · « **Reply #11 on:** December 18, 2003, 04:07:07 am »

Quote from: ThatAdamGuy on December 18, 2003, 03:30:24 am

But isn't their functionality pretty much identical? I can create filters in the Views as well, basically mimicking the smart playlists.

Why not just do away with smart playlists entirely, and reserve playlists for static (manual) lists of songs?

Because if you did away with smartlists, you couldn't create smartlist based viewschemes. What are they? There are many applications for it, you're limited, for the most part, only by your imagination. The smarlists handle the filelisting, while the viewscheme lets you view that list in any way you see fit. Have a look at this screenshot...
http://foc.no-ip.com/pics/import.jpg
and if you're curious how that came about, read on in the link below...
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?action=display;board=5;threadid=17560;start=0#msg121935
I may be wrong, but to the best of my knowledge, this is not possible without smartlists.

NoCodeUK · « **Reply #12 on:** December 18, 2003, 04:16:34 am »

Their functionality isn't identical at all...There are many things you can do with smartlists that cannot be done with VS...What about picking a random hour of rock songs rated 3 or above that have not been played in the last month and that contain blue in the title...tell me how you could do that with a VS

Adam

rocketsauce · « **Reply #13 on:** December 18, 2003, 05:07:53 am »

I think ThatAdamGuy's point is that since smartlist rules can be entered in the Filter box of the View Scheme properties, what is the point of having smartlists appear under a different tree node. I've actually wondered the same thing myself. Whenever I come up with an idea for a new smartlist, I actually build it as a View Scheme instead so that all my schemes/lists appear together in the same node.

Quote

What about picking a random hour of rock songs rated 3 or above that have not been played in the last month and that contain blue in the title...tell me how you could do that with a VS?

You do it by creating a new View Scheme and entering the smartlist rules in the View Scheme properties Filter box.

Rob

NoCodeUK · « **Reply #14 on:** December 18, 2003, 05:10:59 am »

LOL okay I see your point but then the VS is merely a container for the smartlist...it doesn't replace the smartlist...maybe that is the difference there...VS are a container for files. This can be either be files that have been chose according to the criteria set in their panes or a smartlist. The VS therefore is the mechanism to view the files...the smartlist and the panes are what dictates which files are available to view

Adam

ThatAdamGuy · « **Reply #15 on:** December 18, 2003, 05:16:35 am »

Rocketsauce, thanks for clarifying my confusion!

You definitely hit the mark on what I was getting at.

And Adam, maybe it's just semantics, and I'm not trying to be a troublemaker, but what you're calling 'smartlists'... isn't that just filters applied within the views?

Lastly, returning to Rocketsauce's commentary... this again makes me wonder out loud: why have a separate section for Smartlists at all?

ThatAdamGuy · « **Reply #16 on:** December 18, 2003, 05:28:07 am »

Ah, marko, now after playing a bit, I'm better understanding your example, and I apologize for not trying to grok it earlier.

Still, frankly, this seems a bit inelegant... not the manner in which you've gone about achieving the specific example you highlighted, but rather the fact that this requires separate smartlists and filtered views to achieve.

I can't shake the feeling that, especially for new users, this is more complicated than it should be or could be.

Sam · « **Reply #17 on:** December 18, 2003, 09:25:09 am »

Marko,
I tried to recreate your example. I was able to include the individual smartlists in the view scheme, but I wasn't able to select the playlist group as a pane. How do you do this?

Re smartlists vs. view schemes, Can MC be made easier to use (without losing any capability that it currently has) by unifying the two features? Or would that make things worse?

Marko · « **Reply #18 on:** December 18, 2003, 02:49:27 pm »

Sam, I don't quite follow. The info below is for 10.0.18 and assumes you have created a playlist group called Import List and populated it with the 4 smartlists.

Right click on Media Library and choose New View Scheme.
On the left side of the new dialogue is an empty box under the view heading.
Click the "Add" button.
Where it says type, drop it down and choose playlist. Now, you should see a new drop down that lets you choose which playlist group. Choose Import List.
Done.

Notes
if you want a "Location" pane, add the "Filename" type and leave base directory empty.
if you want access to this view scheme when using media modes other than "All" then you need to split up and add each media specific Import List viewscheme to the appropriate node in the tree.

Sam · « **Reply #19 on:** December 18, 2003, 03:30:52 pm »

That works.
It didn't occur to me that the Add button gave you a choice beyond what was in the drop-down list (labeled "presets").

Thanks Marko.

rocketsauce · « **Reply #20 on:** December 18, 2003, 07:46:15 pm »

I followed Marko's directions for his Recently Imported View Scheme from his post in this thread and it works great:

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?action=display;board=5;threadid=17560;start=0#msg121935

So, I thought I'd try to do something similar using several time-limited smartlists. I created a Playlist Group called Random. Under that I put 4 smartlists:

+Random
1 Hour ---> Limit: 60 minutes
2 Hours --> Limit: 120 minutes
3 Hours --> Limit: 180 munutes
4 Hours --> Limit: 240 minutes

They all work correctly, choosing a random selection of tracks according to the time limit. The problem arises when I use this Playlist Group in a View Scheme.

I created a new View Scheme named Random/Album/Artist. In the Filter I specified Media Type: Audio. Under View I specified the Random playlist group/Album/Artist, so I end up with 3 panes:

Random | Album | Artist
--------------------------------
1 Hour | |
2 Hours | |
3 Hours | |
4 Hours | |

Now, choosing the 1 Hour item in the Random pane always selects approximately 2:45:00 to 3:00:00 of tracks, not 1 hour. The other 3 items all work correctly, choosing 2, 3 and 4 hours respectively.

I've been trying to figure this out for a couple of hours and no luck. Anyone have any ideas what the problem could be?

Rob

Listening to: 'The Girl With The Sun In Her Head' from 'In Sides' by 'Orbital' on Media Center 10

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Author Topic: Smartlists (Read 3467 times)

nila

nila

nila

Marko

Marko