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[Health Nut]

Hi,

I just purchased an iPOD 60 GB for use exclusively in my car to be controlled by the Pioneer AVIC Z1 navigation system which has 7" touch screen control for the iPOD.  I would like to use lossless compression simply because I have a higher end car audio system.  So I will have to live with the 60 GB limitation. 

In any case, I have my entire music collection ripped to APE lossless.  I am assuming that the only lossless format the iPOD can use is the Apples Lossless.  Does Media Center have Apples Lossless, or can I import Apples Lossless?  I would like the least painful way of transferring 60 GB of songs from my APE collection to the iPOD 60 GB using Apple's Lossless. 

Suggestions?

[LonWar]

Check out the Rockbox firmware that is available for the IPOD.

Support for MP3, Ogg Vorbis, AC3, AAC, Musepack, Midi, AIFF, ALAC, FLAC, Shorten, WAV, and Wavpack Sound Codecs


If you  can get it to work, you can convert to FLAC and use the IPOD>

www.rockbox.org

[Yaobing]

Take a look at this thread

[GHammer]

Check out the Rockbox firmware that is available for the IPOD.

Support for MP3, Ogg Vorbis, AC3, AAC, Musepack, Midi, AIFF, ALAC, FLAC, Shorten, WAV, and Wavpack Sound Codecs


If you can get it to work, you can convert to FLAC and use the IPOD>

www.rockbox.org

Just as soon as MC has good support for Wavpack, I'm getting an iRiver that Rockbox runs on.

[Health Nut]

So you mean do this?

The way to use iTunesEncoder (see above for link) with MC11 is to go to:
Tools->Options

Select Encoding from the left menu

Choose Encoding for: File conversion or CD ripping

Select External Encoder

Click on Advanced

Browse to the ItunesEncoder.exe file for the EXE path
-e "Lossless Encoder" -i %IN -o %OUT -d for the parameters line
m4a for extension
check the "supports long filenames" box
Hit Ok.

When you convert a file or rip a CD, MC will pop up a command window and call iTunes to encode the stream. When finished, the song will be removed from the itunes library (remove the -d if you don't like this). 

[Health Nut]

I do not want to use rockbox becasue I am afraid the Pioneer AVIC Z1 controller will no longer recognize the iPOD. 

I want to use ALAC... 

Assuming the above method works, do I have to convert my APE files to WAV and then from WAV to ALAC?  Or can I simply convert APE to ALAC on the fly while transferring to the iPOD?

[Health Nut]

I installed the latest iTUNES and Quick time.

I tried the above method and a "DOS BOX' opens up when I chose to convert the APE file and tranfer it to the iPOD.  I wasn't sure what destination to pick, but I picked the main iPOD root drive.  So the 'DOS box' opened up and it said t was converting the file.  Well, I looked on the iPOD drive and the file is there, but it is still says APE.  Since it says APE I tried to play it from J Rivers, but it wouldn't play.  Maybe it is converted to m4a, but didn't rename it? 

How do I do I transfer an APE file from MC to the iPOD converting it to ALAC?  I tired the above method but I must be doing something wrong.  I filled out all of the advanced settings of the external decoder correctly.

??

[Health Nut]

The only thing I know for sure should work is if I do the following:

1) Convert 60 GB of APE files back to wav...
2) Import the wav files into iTunes
3) convert the wav files to ALAC using iTunes
4) import the ALAC compressed files into the iPOD 60 GB

I'm assuming this is a given to work?  Any comments?  Will I lose the tag info?
Any better/easier/faster way?  I must have missed the correct way to do this all in one step (Convert and transfer) ?

[Health Nut]

Ok,  I tried converting a bunch of APE files to wave... 

I went into iTunes and tried to import the songs with the option of converting the imported songs to Apple's Lossless. 

I got an error: "..... can not be imported. An unkown error occured."

Why is this so F'n painful ?  Any ideas?

[Osho]

I want to do this as well. I currently have a bunch of CDs ripped as APE and want to convert them all to Apple Loseless. I am ripping all new CDs with Apple Loseless and it would be good to keep all albums in one format.

I know one could probably do it manually by converting APE -> WAV and then using iTunes or iTuneEncoder to convert from WAV -> ALAC. But, is there a way to mass process many albums.

thanks,
Osho

[Health Nut]

No.  That is what I just wrote above your post.  I can't even do it manually.  I get an error.  iTUNES will not import the wav file.  I used the convert method and checked the move file as well as leave the old file intact: thereby copying the file and making the converted wav copy go to another folder.  I checked the converted wave files and they are labled WAV when I double click on the files and they play fine under MC.  However, the converted WAV files will not import into iTUNES. 

So no, for some reason, the APE files converted back to WAV are not working in iTUNES.  I don't even mind doing it this way, but even this won't work.

[Alex B]

As a test, I just dragged a couple of 16-bit 44.1 kHz stereo wave files to iTunes. They worked fine. Also, you can use WMA losless. Windows iTunes converts it automatically on import and WMA losless can hold file tags.

In general, this is not a proper place for iTunes support questions. Please, try to find help at Apple forums. Personally, I couldn't care less about iTunes.

[Health Nut]

Considering I am trying to get this to work, and this seems to be a popular request...  I'd appreciate the help.  I do not like iTunes either, but this is a problem that needs to be figured out one way or another.  I invested many months converting my music to APE, and I am committed to MC, so I think you should look at it as such.  I invested many thousands of dollars on my car system and I can't help it iPOD control by Pioneer and other car manufacturers is so popular.  It was too complicated currently to make a car PC work, and the integrated Pioneer support with touchscreen LCD control is amazing.  I need to get lossless quality on this iPOD but cannot use ROCKBOX becasue the Pioneer unit needs to recognize the iPOD for control purposes. 

Perhaps the tagged wav files are a problem since that is the only difference I can think of...  Perhaps I will try WMA Lossless.

[Health Nut]

I'm trying the WMA Lossless method now...

By the way, does MC conversion process convert the APE to WAV and then WAV to WMA?  Or can it take the APE file and covert it directly to WMA?

[Health Nut]

No good...

It doesn't matter if I use WMA or WAV.... iTunes will not import the APE to WAV or APE to WMA converted files, same error code:

"..... can not be imported. An unknown error occured."

[GHammer]

The joy of getting outside Apple's universe...
It >may< be that the tagging is not as the iPod expects.

But, I'd take Alex's advice and go forth to an iPod forum and find out how others get 'foreign' material into an iPod.

God bless their proprietary hearts.

[Health Nut]

Well, I certainly don't mind using the method described previously using MC and the extrenal encoder method...  I think I need more guidance in this as I posted above. 

The way to use iTunesEncoder (see above for link) with MC11 is to go to:
Tools->Options

Select Encoding from the left menu

Choose Encoding for: File conversion or CD ripping

Select External Encoder

Click on Advanced

Browse to the ItunesEncoder.exe file for the EXE path
-e "Lossless Encoder" -i %IN -o %OUT -d for the parameters line
m4a for extension
check the "supports long filenames" box
Hit Ok.

When you convert a file or rip a CD, MC will pop up a command window and call iTunes to encode the stream. When finished, the song will be removed from the itunes library (remove the -d if you don't like this).

I tried the above method and a "DOS BOX' opens up when I chose to convert the APE file and tranfer it to the iPOD.  I wasn't sure what destination to pick, but I picked the main iPOD root drive.  So the 'DOS box' opened up and it said t was converting the file.  Well, I looked on the iPOD drive and the file is there, but it is still says APE.  Since it says APE I tried to play it from J Rivers, but it wouldn't play.  Maybe it is converted to m4a, but didn't rename it? 

[Alex B]

Perhaps the tagged wav files are a problem since that is the only difference I can think of...  

MC does not make tagged wave files. There are no common standard for tagging them and many programs don't like tagged wave files.

By the way, does MC conversion process convert the APE to WAV and then WAV to WMA?  Or can it take the APE file and covert it directly to WMA?

Each and every converter decodes the files before re-encoding. A converter can use a temp file or pass the data directly to the encoder's input. (I suppose MC does not use a temp file in this case). The useful difference between Wave and WMA Lossless is file tagging.

It doesn't matter if I use WMA or WAV.... iTunes will not import the APE to WAV or APE to WMA converted files, same error code:  "..... can not be imported. An unknown error occured."

There shouldn't be any difference between a converted and a directly ripped file. The APE source format has nothing to do with that.

I suppose your iTunes is not working properly. You could try to verify that with some other program. For example, rip a few tracks with Windows Media Player 10 in wave and WMA Losless formats.

[Alex B]

I tried the above method and a "DOS BOX' opens up when I chose to convert the APE file and tranfer it to the iPOD.  I wasn't sure what destination to pick, but I picked the main iPOD root drive.  So the 'DOS box' opened up and it said t was converting the file.  Well, I looked on the iPOD drive and the file is there, but it is still says APE.  Since it says APE I tried to play it from J Rivers, but it wouldn't play.  Maybe it is converted to m4a, but didn't rename it?

It worked when I converted a file to a folder. The resulting file was ALAC/m4a (you need to configure iTunes to use ALAC before using iTunesEncode). I don't have an iPod to test.

EDIT:

Did you use the HandHeld Sync? You cannot use MC's file converter directly (with a standard iPod firmware).

[Health Nut]

No, I did not use handheld sync...  Not sure what that means...

[Health Nut]

FWIW:

If you use "ADD File to Library" instead of import, the previous method works.  I am now converting all of my 5 star ranked music in APE format to WMA lossless by using the convert tool.  I unselected all of the options so that this ends up being a simple "convert and copy" (leave original alone, do not update library, etc). 

Once I have a folder of all these converted files, I will highlite them all and simply chose add to library in iTunes...  I will have to undergo a nother long conversion process while it imports and converts the entire list again to Aplle Lossless.  Finally, I suspect it will then just be a matter of transferring the files to the 60 GB iPOD.

This is very long method, but at least it will work.  This is very painful!!  Certainly far from ideal, but until I figure something else out, it will get some lossless quality songs into my car without having to drag my CD collection around. 

I seriously hope car PC's take off sooner than later... 

[Alex B]

No, I did not use handheld sync... Not sure what that means...

Check the Portable Digital Players forum for advice.

FWIW:

If you use "ADD File to Library" instead of import, the previous method works. I am now converting all of my 5 star ranked music in APE format to WMA lossless by using the convert tool. I unselected all of the options so that this ends up being a simple "convert and copy" (leave original alone, do not update library, etc).

Once I have a folder of all these converted files, I will highlite them all and simply chose add to library in iTunes...

This is very long method, but at least it will work. This is very painful!! Again, at least I know this will work...

Perhaps someone from JRiver could try to find out if MC and iTunesEncode could be used directly for synchronizing an iPod. Besides ALAC the same system could also be used for encoding AAC files with iTunesEncode.

[bob]

Well, I certainly don't mind using the method described previously using MC and the extrenal encoder method...  I think I need more guidance in this as I posted above. 

I tried the above method and a "DOS BOX' opens up when I chose to convert the APE file and tranfer it to the iPOD.  I wasn't sure what destination to pick, but I picked the main iPOD root drive.  So the 'DOS box' opened up and it said t was converting the file.  Well, I looked on the iPOD drive and the file is there, but it is still says APE.  Since it says APE I tried to play it from J Rivers, but it wouldn't play.  Maybe it is converted to m4a, but didn't rename it? 

I think you got that because it can't convert directly from .ape. It should work if you first convert them all to .wav (it works for me).

Browse to the ItunesEncoder.exe file for the EXE path
-e "Lossless Encoder" -i %IN -o %OUT -d for the parameters line
m4a for extension
check the "supports long filenames" box
Hit Ok.

Note that -d in the command line? If you leave it out you'll get the selection added to the itunes library.

[Alex B]

But it can convert directly from APE. MC's External Encoder plugin always decodes the compressed file before passing the data to the external application. I tried also the "folder as a Handheld" option. It worked fine.

The question is do the iPod specific functions work properly with the External Encoder. I mean, is the encoder available and can MC pass the library info to the iPod database? I suppose MC uses always library data instead of file tags so that should work (or be relatively easy to make to work). That would allow standard AAC m4a too.

[Alex B]

It would be great if the External Encoder plug-in could pass tag info too.

These templates are available with iTunesEncode

Usage: iTunesEncode.exe [options] -i <input.wav> [-o <output.m4a>]

  Tagging Options:
  -a <Artist>      Adds an artist tag to the file
  -l <Album>       Adds an album tag to the file
  -t <Title>       Adds a song title tag to the file
  -g <Genre>       Adds a genre tag to the file
  -y <Year>        Adds a year tag to the file
  -n <TrackNum>    Adds a track number tag to the file
  -m <TrackCount>  Adds a track count tag to the file
  -b <BPM>         Adds a BPM tag to the file
  -c <Comment>     Adds a comment tag to the file
  -u <Grouping>    Adds a grouping tag to the file
  -x <Compilation> Adds a compilation tag to the file
  -p <Composer>    Adds a composer tag to the file
  -j <DiscNumber>  Adds a disc number tag to the file
  -k <DiscCount>   Adds a disc count tag to the file
  -r <filename>    Adds artwork to the file

Tag option notes:
-Options y,n,m,b,e,f should be numeric.
-Option x is a boolean and can be 1,true,yes,T,Y,on,enable...

That would make command lines like this possible:

-e "Lossless Encoder" -a %[Artist]% -l %[Album]% -n %[Track #]% -t %[Name]% -i %IN -o %OUT -d

The External Encoder would then replace the %[field name]% strings with the corresponding library field data.

[lpr]

I do not want to use rockbox becasue I am afraid the Pioneer AVIC Z1 controller will no longer recognize the iPOD. 

I want to use ALAC... 

I understand your concerns...  Don't forget you can always uninstall Rockbox if you have compatibility problems.

The main reason I'm using Rockbox is because iPod doesn't support gapless playback. If this is not essential for you, ALAC is a good choice and I would have done the same thing with my collection.

Take care.

[bob]

It would be great if the External Encoder plug-in could pass tag info too.

These templates are available with iTunesEncode

That would make command lines like this possible:

-e "Lossless Encoder" -a %[Artist]% -l %[Album]% -n %[Track #]% -t %[Name]% -i %IN -o %OUT -d

The External Encoder would then replace the %[field name]% strings with the corresponding library field data.

It doesn't do this because the external encoder assumes the tag data is in the library. Seems like for this example anyway it would be nice to have the option.

[GHammer]

It doesn't do this because the external encoder assumes the tag data is in the library. Seems like for this example anyway it would be nice to have the option.

For this and a few other situations it would be nice to be able to pass parameters to an external encoder.

[dlmax63]

I use dbPoweramp for all of my Ape or Flac to M4A conversions. I then use MC as my library manager. (use dcBass filter to allow analysed file tags to be passed to the IPod for the "Sound Check" feature on the IPod)

160G Classic