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[lpcalcaterra]

After a long fight trying to MC to play DVDs I have finally had some sucess thanks to the many informative post by glynor. DVD decoder problems where killing me!

A couple of issues have now suffaced, however.

 1) I get an error this error when trying to play DVD from optical drive:
KEY Exchange for DVD copy protaction failed.
Can not playback this DVD-video disk.
For now I am just ripping with DVDdecyptor and playing back from hard drive.

2) when playing the from the drive DVD I can not access the DVD Menu with the remote. The various selections (main menu, chapters, special feature etc) are never highlighted for selection. I can use my mouse to click, but there is never an indication as to which is currently "selected".  Did that make any sense? 

[lpcalcaterra]

After going through all the trouble shooting steps at Unable to show DVD video decorder properties[/i]  ?

GLYNOR... anyone? Help.     Not panicing here... just frustrated 

Larry

[glynor]

Sorry... I'm no help.  I have lots of problems with MC's DVD playback (not the key thing but all sorts of menu problems, including the button thing you mentioned and some menus not appearing at all).  My solution isn't much of a solution for you probably...

I don't play DVDs.  I rip them all to either straight muxed MPGs (if I want to keep them in MPEG-2 format) or I compress them to XviD AVIs (using AutoGK).  I keep these on my RAID5 media library volume generally until I've watched them, and then they either get deleted or burned onto DVD-Rs (I can usually fit 4-5 movies on a single-layer disc).

For those once in a eon times when I really, really need to play an actual DVD I keep MPC (or WinDVD) at the ready...

Perhaps this will be improved when MC12 comes out.  I haven't been able to test it there yet...

[lpcalcaterra]

Glynor, thanks for responding. 

 I have started to use AutoGK thanks to one of your other posts.  The conversion to XviD is long and CPU intensive process especially with my current PC (P4 1.7G - 768KRam).  Although my DVD (ripped with DVDDycrptor) collection is not expansive at 120+ titles it would take considerable time to convert. The good thing is that the XviD is easily played by MC.

I did have WinDVD & PowerDVD installed with Girder commands for both.  Worked great, BUT there was no way to browse the DVD collection by cover art like MC promised. So I uninstalled both of the above because MC did not play nice with their codec & installed CCCP/FFdShow with no change in playback results.  As you said, it looks like we are going to have to wait for MC 12 for any reliable DVD playback.

[glynor]

I'm going to try to test it out tonight and see what I can figure out.  It's always bugged me that I can't play DVDs in MC reliably, but since I very rarely need to do it, I've never bothered to try to figure it all out.

It could be that the FFDSHOW MPEG-2 decoder works well for playing transport and program streams (meaning MPEG-2 files like .mpg and .m2v), but doesn't handle CSS key extraction properly and so on and so forth.  Perhaps you do need a separate "paid" decoder for it to work well... (I've heard nVidia's is pretty good, and I also have a copy of ATI's kicking around).

I'll see what I can come up with!

As far as DVDs... I rip mine as the first step when they come home from the store, and just run AutoGK overnight (and I have for quite some time so I don't have a big back catalog to deal with).  Of course, it helps that I have 4 computers at home (not counting my IPCop firewall) so temporarily "donating" a machine to video compression isn't a huge deal.  Plus, my main PC is a Athlon64 3200 with 2 GB RAM and that helps... 

[lpcalcaterra]

I will continue, out of pure stubbornness, to work on this situation as well. I will reinstall my paid PowerDVD software and decoder tonight & test. 

As for my PC it has been a work horse. It has been running Homseer (Automation app)  24/7 since 2002. Along the way I changed video card to Radeon 9600 for the DVI & VGA output. DVI goes to 42" Sony Grand Wega III LCD projection TV. This required the use of Powerstrip to create a custom timing for the display panel because the DVI input was not meant to handle PC connectivity.  VGA out to Dell touch screen. Added RAID0 card for audio library & M-Audio Delta 410 for my zoned audio. Of course, I have done a couple of fresh installs of XPPro "just to keep it clean".  Only now with MC (ripping, encoding & IPod transfering) is the CPU being taxed. I am looking forward to getting a new PC, but I am kinda' attached to this one.   

Due to time constrains I will not be building a new PC. The PC must have be a destop case and not a tower because it sits in an eqipment rack. I have been looking at CyberPowerPC but there desktop case system all come MCE 2005.  I do not want to pay more for an OS with functionality that, HOPEFULLY, I will never use beause I got MC. Any recommendations?

Larry

[glynor]

Due to time constrains I will not be building a new PC. The PC must have be a destop case and not a tower because it sits in an eqipment rack.

Too bad, cos Lian Li makes some beautiful HTPC cases (Zalman makes some really nice ones too)...



Anand did a "comparison" review a while back on 4 HTPC cases:

http://www.anandtech.com/casecooling/showdoc.aspx?i=2614&p=1

And, it's also quite old but here's a review of a Shuttle pre-built system (about a year ago, but it'll give you an idea of what to look for):

http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=2568&p=1

[glynor]

A few notes...

On my "work" machine, which has the following installed:

• Intervideo WinDVD 5.0 DXVA (this is the one that appears it is being used)
• CCCP (current version)
• Nero 6.3.1.20 OEM (MPC)

DVD playback does work in both MC11.1.199 (and the current MC12 build).  However, I have experienced some "glitches":

1. Button highlighting does not work (no highlights are visible at all).  The DVD menu was designed by Apple DVD Studio Pro 4 and uses "Simple-style" button color overlays.  (I can get the button overlays to work in MC12 by using the "Use VMR9 if available" option, but not in MC11.1).

2. Full screen is flaky in MC11.1.  If I send the fullscreen to my secondary monitor, it plays, but briefly "restarts" the DVD from the first-load item before then resuming to where it was before going full screen.  Also, if the Fullscreen resolution is set to anything higher than the desktop, the DVD image only fills part of the screen (with the remainder being a corrupted version of the desktop wallpaper).

It appears that MC11.1 is usign the WinDVD video decoder and the FFDSHOW audio decoder for playback.  I've only really tested with one disc thus far.  Playing the disc in WinDVD directly does show the button highlighting overlays, as does MPC (though I can't figure out how to use the arrow keys to navigate in MPC).

[glynor]

On my "Main" PC at home I have the following installed:

• ATI/Cyberlink DVD Decoder 4.0
• FFDSHOW 20051129 SSE
• Nero 6 Ultra (6.6.1.4)
• Nero Digital (3.1.0.25)
• Sonic Cinemaster MCE Audio Decoder (part of Sonic DVDit Pro 6)
• DirectVobSub
• A variety of other unrelated codecs (XviD, HuffyUV, DirectShow OGG Vorbis Filter, etc)

DVD Playback generally works well in MC11.1 and MC12 on tested discs.  Menus work correctly (including button overlays).  Fullscreen playback works well (without restarting disc unless I switch from Primary to Secondary as the fullscreen destination).  I do have audio problems though.  Sometimes the audio stops working all together (for no apparent reason) and PCM menu audio doesn't seem to play.

FFDSHOW is being used for the audio decoding, and the ATI/Cyberlink Video Decoder is being used for Video.

In MC12 enabling "Use VMR9 if possible" causes DVD Playback to halt before the DVDs main menu is displayed (it doesn't crash, the playback just "freezes" and won't go any further).  Manually selecting the ATI/Cyberlink Audio Decoder (or the Nero Digital Audio Decoder v1.6.6.2) causes the Menu audio to work properly, so I would guess this is an FFDSHOW problem.

I'm going to try fixing the codec set on this machine to use CCCP, as I've been meaning to do that anyway.  We'll see...

NOTE:  Jim, if posting this type of stuff about MC12 here is not cool, just delete it and let me know.  I'm trying to keep specifics to an absolute minimum (especially regarding any functionality), but since I'm trying to systematically test it, I thought it'd be best to post it all in one place.

[glynor]

Still on my Main PC...

I've removed all my extraneous codecs: FFDSHOW, XviD, HuffyUV, DirectVobSub, the DirectShow Ogg filters, etc).  Now I just have:

• ATI/Cyberlink Decoder
• Nero 6 Ultra (6.6.1.4)
• Nero Digital (3.1.0.25)
• Sonic Cinemaster MCE Audio Decoder (part of Sonic DVDit Pro 6)

DVD playback works well.  Audio works, including menu sounds.

[glynor]

Again, still on Main PC, with these changes:

• Installed XviD (Koepi's XviD-1.1.0-30122005.exe build)
• Installed CCCP (current build)

Same results as above, only now FFDSHOW is being used again for the audio decoding (but works correctly).   ;D

Works well in both MC11.1 and MC12.  Manyally switching to MPV Decoder (included with CCCP) works fine.

[glynor]

On my HTPC...

I have installed:

• CCCP
• Intervideo WinDVD 6 Platinum
• ATI/Cyberlink Decoder

Again, when using the Intervideo Video decoder, the Video renders fine mostly, but the button highlight overlays don't work.  If I switch to the ATI/Cyberlink or the MPV (included with CCCP) filters then all is good with the world.  CCCP's version of FFDSHOW works fine with the DVD Audio again here.  However, if I change to "Use VMR9" mode with this filter selected on this machine, MC refuses to play the DVD at all, throwing up the "failed to render streams" error (and actually it's hard to turn that option back off again).

By the way, an easy way to change your filter's merit value (or "priority" -- which is how MC decides which filter to use for any particular compression type) is using a cool free app called RadLight Filter Manager.  You can grab it here:

http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=RadLight_Filter_Manager

And there's a cool tutorial on changing the merit values here:

http://thehtpcrecord.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=39&Itemid=99999999

[glynor]

Now that I've investigated it seems I've found that:

1) Intervideo WinDVD's decoder doesn't play very nice with other applications (the button overlay problem seems to be related to this).

2) FFDSHOW 20051129 seems to have some audio decoding issues.  Full DVD decoding doesn't seem to be ready for primetime yet (which is probably why CCCP doesn't use it).

3) CCCP's FFDSHOW version works well for audio decoding.  The free Gabest MPV decoder (included with CCCP) should work for DVD playback so if it is set to highest priority you should be good.

4) If you get a Decoder free with your video card (like ATI) you might see better performance and/or lower CPU usage using that one as your default.  For nVidia cards, it isn't free (but you can buy their decoder for $25 I believe).  With modern CPUs though, MPEG-2 decoding (especially for standard-def content) is very mild so this isn't a big concern.

After this testing, I'm now using:

Video: ATI/Cyberlink Video Decoder (for my ATI machines)
           Gabest MPV Decoder (for my nVidia machines)

Audio: FFDSHOW version included with CCCP

and all seems to be working pretty well.  I'm going to continue to test a bit, to make sure that these results don't change with different discs, but all seems good as gold.  Until MC12 comes out, I'd recommend grabbing the RadLight Filter Manager mentioned above and manually choosing the playback filter that works best (by dropping the Merit value for any other filters you have on there and bumping the one you want up).

As a side note, MPC makes it's own determination as to which playback filters are "best" and doesn't necessarily use the filter's merit score.  This means that MPC might not use the same filters as MC does for DVD playback (in practice MPC seems to favor the MPV decoder).  You might want to try bumping the merit score on that one to MERIT_PREFERRED if you're having difficulty with DVD playback (again, MPV comes with CCCP and the CCCP FFDSHOW filter seems to work better than the 20051129 version so I'd grab it).

[glynor]

After a long fight trying to MC to play DVDs I have finally had some sucess thanks to the many informative post by glynor. DVD decoder problems where killing me!

A couple of issues have now suffaced, however.

 1) I get an error this error when trying to play DVD from optical drive:
KEY Exchange for DVD copy protaction failed.
Can not playback this DVD-video disk.
For now I am just ripping with DVDdecyptor and playing back from hard drive.

I just found this page in the FAQ for Zoom Player about this issue:

http://www.inmatrix.com/zplayer/faq/faq_entry0067.shtml

It says that this error is often caused by one of two things.  Either a) corrupt/invalid DirectX install (so make sure you have DirectX 9.0c installed), or b) stupid, evil, and useless Packet Writing software running.

Packet Writing software is those packages that let you drag-drop files onto CD much like you would a hard drive.  They never work well though!  Some examples of these applications are:

Nero InCD, Roxio DirectCD or Drag-to-Disc, Sony abCD, and Veritas DLA (part of Record Now MAX).  If you have any of these craptastic CD burning apps installed, I recommend you uninstall them (as they're stinky anyway).  Reboot, and you'll probably be all set.

[lpcalcaterra]

glynor,
thanks for all your work. I have not forgotten nor have I given up!
I got FFdShow video codec to work intermitantly. I do not know why it works one time and not again. When it did work, I tested with MPClassic / Windows MP/ ZoomPlayer. Unfortunately the aspect ratio was off in MC.  So I put the use of FFdShow & CCCP off for now. but I will go back because of the additional functions / filters / & tweaks available with FFdShow.

At this time I have DVD playback capability.  I have uninstalled all video codecs in Control Panel. Are you removig any codecs from Device Manager?  CCCP Insugent show no video codec installed & CCCP (uninstalled) & Microsoft Xp video decoder checkup utililty show Cyberlink/Sp Decoder (ATI) Version 3.5.0239. This decoder came will my Radean 9600 video card. it is an older verison of the CLVSD.ax file that was part of the my purchase PowerDVD software.

This work fairly reliably, but  as you said, but I had the same issues as you

2. Full screen is flaky in MC11.1. If I send the fullscreen to my secondary monitor, it plays, but briefly "restarts" the DVD from the first-load item before then resuming to where it was before going full screen. Also, if the Fullscreen resolution is set to anything higher than the desktop, the DVD image only fills part of the screen (with the remainder being a corrupted version of the desktop wallpaper).

I just found this page in the FAQ for Zoom Player about this issue:

http://www.inmatrix.com/zplayer/faq/faq_entry0067.shtml

It says that this error is often caused by one of two things. Either a) corrupt/invalid DirectX install (so make sure you have DirectX 9.0c installed), or b) stupid, evil, and useless Packet Writing software running.

No packet writing software & DirectX is 9.0c. This PC has a fresh OS install. No junk.

On my HTPC...

By the way, an easy way to change your filter's merit value (or "priority" -- which is how MC decides which filter to use for any particular compression type) is using a cool free app called RadLight Filter Manager. You can grab it here:

http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=RadLight_Filter_Manager

And there's a cool tutorial on changing the merit values here:

http://thehtpcrecord.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=39&Itemid=99999999

I will install the above along with CCCP and "play" a little bit more. 


Larry