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Author Topic: Flickr-like Tag support  (Read 2300 times)

stellsmi

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Flickr-like Tag support
« on: October 27, 2006, 02:41:43 pm »

I dj music of different types and I find myself wanting to put multiple genres down for different songs.  "this is tango, this is tango swing blues, etc"  I wonder if there is support now or planned for tags the way flickr uses them.  maybe a plugin?

if not, is there a workaround that would let songs act as if they had multiple genres?
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jeffspl311

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2006, 08:10:01 pm »

I'm in the same boat. The closest I've gotten is to use the "keyword" tag... but it's a far cry from what I think of as MS Outlook "categories". (I don't use flickr, but it sounds like analogous functionality)

Cheers,
Jeff
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benn600

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2006, 08:14:37 pm »

In the field configuration, you can set certain fields to have certain properties.  I recall an option to set an item to a list so you could have multiple items.  You enter items separated by ";" but genre might not be editable.  I'm going to look just for fun.

Addition: you can't edit genre directly but you probably could create a new field...what a hassle!
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runemail

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2006, 03:53:38 am »

something like this?

http://www.last.fm/user/M_Mickey/tags/

Would be really cool if we could do something like this (tag-cloud) in interaction with last.fm.

hit_ny

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2006, 09:49:54 am »

What media do you use to dj with ?

If its mp3, then IDv3.2 is user configurable, no reason why you can't input your own there. You are limited to just one entry tho, ie its not list.

Otherwise you will need to make a custom field called sub-genre.

So Genre : Tango and Sub-Genre : Swing Blues

or create your own custom list field like Genres say

Genres : Tango;Swing;Blues

..and watch in amazement as it shows up in viewschemes with a Genres column for the above 3 genres.

..just don't expect those custom fields  to show up in a non-MC app.
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rebootjac

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2006, 10:45:16 pm »

I need to start being more vocal with my ideas. I've wondered this for a long time now (tag-based clouds generated with keywords) http://morpheus.cs.umbc.edu/bloglines/ is a great example of what I would like the cloud to look like.

The truth is, MC badly needs a way for the user to see at a glance which keywords are most used. As far as I know, there is no way for MC to "count" anything and rank it that way. It would be cool if you could toggle this functionality at will or as a seperate viewing mode (much like when you switch to list to album thumbnails.)

What also would be a good idea is to borrow the idea from del.icio.us's bookmarking extension for Firefox tool which when you bookmark a website and begin to tag it.. it will bring up a popup and show a listing of popular tags associated with that given website and then the user just has to click on what tags they would like to apply for that site.
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hit_ny

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2006, 02:13:06 am »

The truth is, MC badly needs a way for the user to see at a glance which keywords are most used. As far as I know, there is no way for MC to "count" anything and rank it that way. It would be cool if you could toggle this functionality at will or as a seperate viewing mode (much like when you switch to list to album thumbnails.)
It was suggested here and experimented with here but needs a better implementation.

Any ideas would be welcome :)
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GreggP

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2006, 12:01:32 pm »

I'd also like to see formal support for sub-genres or styles. I'm amazed that some of the codecs don't have a metadata tag defined for this. At least there isn't one in WMA and it was pretty comprehensive. I can't find the spec for IDv2 or IDv3, so don't know if that's the same.

It would be great if we could use something like the system AMG uses to classify music. They have a standard genre and then you can have multiple styles and moods. So for example, the genre could be 'rock' and the styles are a list: 'hard rock', 'British rock', 'psychedelia'. The moods are also a list: 'rousing', 'exciting', 'passionate'...

Take a look at http://www.allmusic.com and navigate to any artist's album and you will see what I am talking about.
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rebootjac

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Re: Flickr-like Tag support
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2006, 01:54:07 am »

Any ideas would be welcome :)

That's the spirit that keep me coming back to this community.

I have plenty ideas ;) I would implement something like the tag cloud for the keywords field because keywords are supposed to be just that.. a starting place to look for more relevant content. Del.icio.us does something extremely cool, and that is when you click on a tag from a cloud (i.e. larger font size for tag words mean more items tagged as that item), you can also click a "+" next to another relevant tag to keep narrowing down to exactly what you want.

For example, say you have a picture of an apple that is tagged with "apple;fruit;red;close-up" which defines the separate tags, "apple", "fruit", "red", "close-up" in MC. This is fine but what if I also have a picture of the computer Apple IIe. See the problem? I have a problem if I want to just see pictures of the fruit assuming I tag both pictures with the tag, "apple". Del.icio.us gets around this problem by putting a "+" next to each further tags I want to search for.

So, MC could render a tag cloud showing me available tags for my items... I'm drawn to the tag, "apple" as a major tag because it is bigger in size...curious  I click on that.. then I click on "+ fuit" to further define I just want apple+fruit tags.. or in other words, I want only items that are tagged with both tags, "apple" and "fruit" in their keywords field. Bingo! I then only see pictures of the fruit, apple.

If you are interested, I highly recommend installing Firefox 2 and the new Del.icio.us bookmarks Firefox extension to see more of what I'm talking about. Tagging individual bookmarks with del.icio.us is fun because del.icio.us will automatically recommend me tags that others have already given that website.. so all I have to do is either adopt another user's categorization (tags) or I can delete theirs, come up with my own tags, or add to theirs!

That's what makes social software on the web so powerful. If you think about it, tagging media items in software like MC this way makes sense because everyone will have a different opinion on how to categorize their content. With tags, we are not limited to predefined subsets.. we are only limited to our imagination.

I like MC especially because you can do tricks like make a generated calculated field from your file-path. That means suddenly, if I go back to my apple picture example.. and I store the picture in my computer under "(root)\pictures\red\fruit\apple" I can then copy that file-path text to the keywords field and then from there.. use MC's built in replacement text tools to replace all of the "\'s" with ";".  I now have created separate tags for that picture from my file-path automatically. Sure, you could say it's not an efficient way to tag one item this way but what if I had thousands of pictures of fruit already categorized like that?  It's yet another way to grab metadata in mass quantities.

I did it with my whole folder of movies which is meticulously organized in lots and lots of subfolders. I would have gone nuts if I had to tag each movie file under categories or folders that I knew already existed. I just borrowed my system I setup already.

Tags have their quirks though. You gotta make sure things are not misspelled otherwise things don't go where they are supposed to.. however, if the tag cloud is also sorted alphabetically, you would be able to see your mistake fairly quickly just as you do with any other sorted field.

One idea I have had I haven't mentioned so far is that I wish MC had an option in their text replacement utility to strip foreign characters / numbers out of replaced text. That would make things so much easier if you were specifically harvesting keywords!

Another idea I have had for a long time is to not only have a calculated field that automatically copies from field to another but also automatically both copies and effectively strips all erogenous characters out of the input text including spaces and inserts semi-colons in between each extracted word. E.g. a file with a path such as "(root)\downloaded pictures\icons from internet\Winxp themes\large" would result in output text as "downloaded;pictures;icons;from;internet;winxp;themes;large" This would be ideal for people like me that not only grab tags this way but also let MC keep an eye on changed directory structures and files and thus change the tags automatically! ;)  Oh, that would be so ridiculously cool! 
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