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[robydago]

Hi,
can anyone explain to me why to have MC12 (any version up to 12.0.203) play a VOB file I have to rename it to .AVI?
The .VOB is a single file (>1GB) created by DVD Decrypter ripping a DVD.

If i try to play the VOB file, I get the following message:
"Media Center encountered errors while trying to play the last several files. Please make sure the path in your media library points to the right location."

If I rename the same file to .AVI, MC is able to play it.
I guess that .VOB is not an extension MC (or DirectShow?) manages like all the other ones because under the DirectShow Filters section of the DirectShow Playbak Options in MC the .VOB extension is not present.
Also, MC assigns an unreal filename extension in the database when the same VOB file is imported: as far as MC is concerned "*.vob" files are "*.dvd".

[Osho]

You may try to import the .ifo file that DVD Decrypter rips rather than .VOB file. That works for me always.

Osho

[robydago]

Osho,
the .IFO file is there: same directory and same name (excluding extension) as the .VOB file. Trying to play both of them give me the same result.

I had mixed results with .vob + .ifo files. Sometimes MC is able to play the movie, sometimes not.
It's a bit frustrating because a free program like VLC is always able to play all of them....

I still have to find out what goes wrong. Can it be the program I use for ripping or the file renaming I perform?
Sometimes I use DVD shrink instead of DVD decrypter and sometimes I rename the resulting .vob and .ifo files to give them more meaningful names.

I'll run some tests and let you know.

Thanks.

[jmone]

Like you I have many small chapter rips that were made using DVD Decrypter.  I have renamed them as "Title.MPG" and they play perfectly (note: VOBs are MPEG files with some extra bits....but I have found that MPG support is much more flexible than VOBs). 

This way I have a folder under Video with the title of the say TV Series or Music DVD, and each MPG file the titled using the Episode (eg S01E01 - Episode Name.MPG) or Track (eg 01 - Song Name.MPG).

[robydago]

jmone,
are you able to switch sub or audio tracks? when MC is able to play .IFO+.VOB files, it recognize them as a DVD, giving me access to alternative audio and subtitle languages.
When I rename the .VOB to .AVI I loose that option.
I tried to change the DirectShow filters associated with .AVI files, hoping that one of them could let me control audio and sub tracks, but to no avail...

[glynor]

I strongly suspect that the reason your VOB/IFO playback isn't working is because you don't have appropriate DirectShow filters installed to allow the playback.  Renaming the files to AVI probably tricks some filter into trying to play them (when it really shouldn't be) and then they're able to play.

What filters are you using to handle MPEG-2 decoding on the system?

If you don't know what the heck I'm talking about, then I strongly recommend that you read Yaobing's excellent DirectShow FAQ and look into installing CCCP to handle DirectShow playback of a wide variety of codec types on the system.  Assuming I'm right, the reason that VLC can handle it when MC can't is because VLC is not a DirectShow player (like most other Windows media players, including MC and Windows Media Player, are) and has it's own version of the libavcodec built in.  CCCP will install a DirectShow version of libavcodec (FFDSHOW) and set up the filters and splitters you need to properly handle DVD, MPEG-2, and MPEG-4 (including ASP and AVC) file types.

If you decide to install CCCP, be very sure to carefully follow the installation instructions provided by the authors of the application here: http://www.cccp-project.net/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page#Latest_CCCP_.28aka._Download_Here.21.29  Be sure to run CCCP Insurgent and uninstall (via Add/Remove Programs in the Control Panel) any conflicting filters and codecs it finds.  Many old versions of filters can cause problems if they're left lying around...

CCCP includes all the filters and splitters you need to properly handle Subtitles, alternate audio streams, DVD playback, and pretty much everything else you'd likely need for those files...

[mesue]

I have some VOB files that were saved from my TiVo using Tivotool (Mac program) and I get the same error as robydago when I try to play them in MC--even with the CCCP installed. I tried his trick of renaming them to AVI and now I can play them in MC... hmmm.

What I'm really looking for is something to edit these VOB files but nothing I have seems to take them.

[gappie]

can you play them using the windows media player classic that is included in the cccp pack?

ive had my fight with ifo/vobs and have now most of them converted to mkv files. maybe some of you can get some ideas from this thread.
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=39604.0

[robydago]

glynor,
I have CCCP installed, but I also had another codec pack that I just removed. I'll run cccp insurgent and let you know if this solves my problems.

gappie,
yep, mpc included with cccp can play it, but no access to the multiple audio tracks and subtitles.
mkv is great and if you have the time to make them apparently (I tried only a couple of times) MC manages them correctly, including multiple audio and subtitles.

[glynor]

gappie,
but no access to the multiple audio tracks and subtitles.

Go to Start --> Programs --> Combined Community Codec Pack --> Haali Media Splitter Settings.  In the Haali config dialog, switch to the Options tab, then open the Compatibility node.  Set Autoload VSFilter to Yes.

Then go to Start --> Programs --> Combined Community Codec Pack --> VSFilter Configuration.  Switch to the Misc tab, and check the Hide subtitles box (otherwise the subs will ALWAYS display -- even when you don't want them).

This will give you access to enable/disable the Subtitles, via right clicking on the VSFilter task tray icon (the green arrow which shows up when you play video files back which contain subtitle streams).  I'd be interested in figuring out why your VOBs aren't working right... Mine certainly do.  When you rip them from the disc, exactly what steps did you take?

For the record.... Converting to MKV is simple and fast.  Here's what I do:

1. Rip the DVD using DVD Fab Decrypter in Main Movie mode.  I used to use DVD Decrypter but it's no longer being developed, and most new DVDs include newer copy protection that it doesn't handle.  RipIt4Me+DVD Decrypter is another option, but I find DVD Fab Decrypter easier to use (though slightly less powerful -- but you don't need it for this process).

2. Merge the multiple VOB files created using DVD Shrink.  I think Gappie actually figured this out, but it's a great way to re-merge the VOBs into one big VOB file.  First, you need to fix an option in DVD Shrink.  Open up DVD Shrink, and go to Edit --> Preferences --> Output Files tab.  Uncheck Split VOB files into 1GB size chunks.  Then, with DVD Shrink in Full Disc mode, open the folder where you decrypted the files to in step 1 (hit the Open Files button).  Then switch the Compression setting from Automatic to No Compression (this will make it so DVD Shrink doesn't recompress the video and reduce the quality).  Hit the Backup button (answer yes to the reminder) and then, instead of burning to disc, save to a new folder on your hard drive by selecting Hard Disk Folder as the backup target and selecting an appropriate target folder.  This process should only take a few minutes since it's not recompressing the video or decrypting the disc.

3. Take the resulting files, and mux them into a MKV using MKVToolnix.  This is simple, you just open mkvmerge.  Then, drag-drop the VOB file into the Input Files box on the Input tab.  MKVmerge should detect and recognize all the appropriate streams and whatnot and then just hit "start muxing".  Again, since you're not re-encoding the video, this works very quickly.

EDIT:  I think I might have just figured out a better way... Hold on.   

EDIT AGAIN: Actually, I'm having all kinds of weird issues...   

[InflatableMouse]

Nice explanation Glynor.


One of these days I think I'm gonna bug you with all sorts of questions about Avi's, Mpegs, Wmv's and Subs!

 

[robydago]

glynor,
thanks but I know that both dvd decrypter (stream processing) and dvd shrink (dvd re-authoring) can produce a single .VOB file (and related .IFO) of whatever you select. I usually select only the main movie and two audio and two subs.
MKVToolnix is nice but when I load the .VOB file the subtitles are not recognized. I have to ripe them with VobSub and then use VobSub produced .idx. I wonder why MKVToolnix can't do what AutoMK can: load a .IFO and parse correclty all streams. But again AutoMK has no "No video compression" option so is can't be used as a pure container changer.


Going back to DVD Decrytper and Shrink, the differnce between them is apparently only the files you get.

DVD Shrink:
VIDEO_TS.BUP
VIDEO_TS.IFO
VTS_01_0.BUP
VTS_01_0.IFO
VTS_01_1.VOB

DVD Decrtyper:
VTS_01 - Stream Information.txt
VTS_01_0.IFO
VTS_01_1.VOB


So I wanted to perform some tests with theses files in MC.
But before doing my tests I unistalled all codec pack including CCCP, rebooted and reinstalled CCCP (run insurgent but it didn't fine any issue)

I performed a test with 3 different movies:

I ripped them with both dvd decrypter (stream processing) and dvd shrink (re-authoring, no compression), selecting two audio tracks and two subtitile tracks. I didn't rename or delete any resulting file.

The directories were imported in MC and... MC is able to play correctly all DVD Shrink produced .VOBs and I can even switch audio and subs. All DVD Decrypted produced .VOBs are not playable by MC and I get the error I quoted in the first post of this thread.

UPDATE - look like MC is not very good at importing .VOB+.IFO files. As soon as I find out how to include images... I will post them.

[gappie]

exactly, glynor. that is how i do it (step 2 and 3, and the haali splitter). it takes dvd shring 2 minutes max to join the vobs together. but it does take mkvmerge more time to convert to mkv from a vob (20 to 30 minutes), then when you ripped a dvd with the video and audio demuxed using dvd decryptor.
i use external subs in srt format wich gives me more control over them and a better quality (subs on dvd are bitmaps, and sometimes very bad bitmaps)

[robydago]

just to clarify: the DVD shrinked .VOBs seemd to make MC behaves as if a "real" DVD disc is being played.
The right-click menu is the same you get when you play DVD discs. It shows even the chapters (but those don't work); anyway what matters to me is that you can switch audio and subs via RightClick>DVD options>Language.

[glynor]

The directories were imported in MC and... MC is able to play correctly all DVD Shrink produced .VOBs and I can even switch audio and subs. All DVD Decrypted produced .VOBs are not playable by MC and I get the error I quoted in the first post of this thread.

One consideration...

DVD Decrypter cannot, on its own, decrypt most DVDs produced and released over the past 1-2 years properly.  Is it possible that you are running into copy protection issues?  It's certainly possible, if you're using VLC or MPC as your comparison player, that those players include capabilities to ignore stream errors in VOB files caused by improper ripping (which MC doesn't have).  Now, if you're comparing to using Windows Media Player than we're talking about something different.  Still, be sure you're not just running into discs protected with Archos or the other new copy protection mechanisms that DVD Decrypter (and DVD Shrink) cannot handle.  That's why I tend (since investigating it with Gappie earlier) use DVD Fab Decrypter or RipIt4Me.

To answer other questions...

When I rip DVDs that I have, with either DVD Decrypter+RipIt4Me or DVD Fab Decrypter on my system (in "Main Movie"/IFO mode but nothing else special), and then I open the resulting VTS_01_0.IFO file with MC12, they work perfectly well.  I'm able to see and hear them, FFDSHOW launches, and I can right-click and choose different audio tracks and enable/disable Subtitles from inside the MC display window.  The subs and chapters and alternate audio tracks and everything work.  If they're not for you, then something else is going on because they should.

If I want to manage those as a single file, instead of as a folder of IFOs and VOBs, then I'd go about wrapping them in a MKV file.  To answer your question about AutoGK... It just uses VobSub Rip to accomplish it's subtitle magic.  If you want subs included, you'd likely just need to rip the subs and include them in the MKV in a format compatible with the MKV file type.  I initally intended to include some additional instructions about on how to include Subs and whatnot in the MKV files above -- and I will -- but I'm still running tests.

I'll post back when I have something more concrete.  As I mentioned (I believe) previously.  I don't do this myself at all.  I typically use AutoMKV to compress the resulting files from DVD Fab Decrypter to X264 MKVs.  This provides pristine quality (by my eyes) and saves me tons of storage space.

[glynor]

exactly, glynor. that is how i do it (step 2 and 3, and the haali splitter). it takes dvd shring 2 minutes max to join the vobs together. but it does take mkvmerge more time to convert to mkv from a vob (20 to 30 minutes), then when you ripped a dvd with the video and audio demuxed using dvd decryptor.
i use external subs in srt format wich gives me more control over them and a better quality (subs on dvd are bitmaps, and sometimes very bad bitmaps)

I'd be interested in seeing a step-by-step description of what you've been doing Gappie.  I've been trying to come up with an easy and workable method today and I've been hitting some walls...

[glynor]

I just posted a request over there... We'll see what Buzzqw says.

[gappie]

I'd be interested in seeing a step-by-step description of what you've been doing Gappie.  I've been trying to come up with an easy and workable method today and I've been hitting some walls...

i can do that. though it would take me some time to do it in propper english. but it would be, in short. what was already said here, open the map with the vobs using dvd shrink, write it to an ther place and pull that vob into mkvmerge, of it goes.
problems are there with subtitles. if there are subs in the vobs make sure that dvd shrink takes them out. when they are still in, it can stop the merge process. mkv files can not include sub files. i just get the srt files, when needed, from the internet and match them, if necesary, using subtitle workshop and then they can be included into the merge of mkv. i leave them outside in a special folder. in the vs filter in cccp you can tell where you store them.
when i want to have chapters i need to rerip the dvd with dvd decrypter (i use any dvd to get rid of the protection, and it seems to work well), or make a virtual drive and let the vobs point to it, and use dvd decripter. i demux the chapters in ogg format. when i want the chapters to have names i change them (nice for concert dvd's). and include the chapters in the mkv via the global tab.

the downside a this moment, is that to change chapters or hide subtitles, i have to go to the haali icon or directsubvob icon. i can not do that from within mc12. with ifo/vob that was not a problem. but i understood that the chapter part is on mc's list.
the pros are in this and the other thread.

[glynor]

Ah-ha!  That helps a lot Gappie!  I think I'm onto something...

[gappie]

just to clarify: the DVD shrinked .VOBs seemd to make MC behaves as if a "real" DVD disc is being played.
The right-click menu is the same you get when you play DVD discs. It shows even the chapters (but those don't work); anyway what matters to me is that you can switch audio and subs via RightClick>DVD options>Language.

i remember that i had problems with vobs and chapters/subtitles when i started to import them. using the ifo file instead solved it. recently, in my search to get the subtitles and chapters i used a programm to see what was in the ifo files (cant remember what programm though) and there is some info in there about one or the other, and i guess, mc uses that to play the vob. but im not sure about it.



and glynor.. im curious.

[robydago]

gappie\glynore,

details of my tests:

- I first rip the DVD discs with DVD Decrypter in ISO mode
- Then I use DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink using as a source the ISO

DVD Shrink -> no compression, single VOB output, re-authoring selecting only the main title and two audio + two subs

DVD Decrypter -> IFO Mode, single VOB output, selecting the main title then Stream processing\Direct Stream copy selecting only the main title and two audio + two subs


With DVD Shrink I get:
-VIDEO_TS.IFO
-VTS_01_0.IFO
-VTS_01_1.VOB
(+ 2 IFO backups)

With DVD Decrtyper:
-VTS_01 - Stream Information.txt
-VTS_01_0.IFO
-VTS_01_1.VOB


Judging by some quick tests I did yesterday, but I will double check asap, the magic is performed by the VIDEO_TS.IFO file, that is missing with DVD Decrypter.
Just to be sure that is not my PC the culprit here, if I have the time and will, I'll create in a VMWare virtual machine a clean install of XP SP2 + CCCP + MC12 and nothing else (not even an antivirus!) and I'll play the .VOBs+.IFos and see what happen

[glynor]

Before you try that, attempt to use this procedure instead:

1. Rip using DVD Decrypter in ISO mode.  (I always do this first too).

2. Mount the ISO and rip it using the DVD Fab Decrypter (which is free -- I linked to it above) in Main Movie mode.  This will allow you to select the specific PGC (title) that you want, and it'll rip including the various IFO files and whatnot.  The other good thing is that DVD Fab can handle the new-style copy protections that DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink cannot.

3. Try to open the VTS_01_0.IFO file created by the DVD Fab Decrypter rip in MC.  This should work fairly well.

4. DVD Fab Decrypter does not have an option to not "split" the VOB files at the 1GB mark (unfortunately) so if you want to re-merge the VOBs, you'll need to then open the files created by DVD Fab in DVD Shrink and run through that process to merge them back into one solid VOB.  This isn't really necessary, as MC can (with most machines) handle the split VOBs without skipping, but if you want you can do it.

[robydago]

Glynor: my goal is to have:

- a single .VOB
- access to all audio and subtitle tracks I've selected while creating the single .VOB
- no compression\format-reconversion of anything
- doing all the above spending (both me and my PC) the less effort and time

I still have to double check, but till now the solution seems to be:

- ripping the DVD to a ISO with DVD decrypter
- using DVD shrink for re-authoring the ISO to a single .VOB file, no compression, with the audio\sub tracks I want (I get two .IFO files instead of only one, but I don't care)

Loading the DVD Shrink generated VIDEO_TS.IFO seems to make MC happy and it lets me select the audio\subs tracks via the standard DVD menu (via right-click in the MC display area).

[glynor]

I understand.  Please try the procedure I outlined above.  DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink CANNOT properly decrypt the vast majority of movies or other DVDs released by the major studios over the past year and a half plus.  It will appear to work, but they will not play properly due to errors in the file stream.  DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink have not been updated to deal with the newer copy protection mechanisms being employed by the MPAA.

DVD Fab Decrypter can handle the new methods, which is why I want you to try it.  It's too bad that it can't rip to a single VOB, but it can't.

If you want the single VOB, simply use DVD Shrink on the already decrypted (via DVD Fab) files to re-join the VOB into one solid VOB.  I just want to see if this solves your original problem, or if there's something else going on...

EDIT:  Actually I just re-read your post and it seems like your problem might be solved.  So, if you're happy, then nevermind.  Be aware though, that some discs (just about all of them anymore) will no longer work with just DVD Decrypter+DVD Shrink.  If you run into some that don't play (or that error out half-way through) then you'll likely need to either switch to using RipIt4Me+DVD Decrypter as the first step, using DVD Fab Decrypter, or buying AnyDVD and using it with DVD Decrypter.

[glynor]

@gappie -

So... I figured out a "lossless" convert to MKV procedure, which includes working subtitles.  The subs have to be decoded by VSFilter though, so you have to use the task tray icon to enable/disable them.  To save time (and headaches) they aren't OCRed, so they're just the original bitmapped ones, but it works pretty well.  It sounds like you already got yourself basically the same procedure, but I thought I'd post my findings for everyone else who might be interested...

Turns out you were right.  The problem with getting the files into MKV was because when I was merging the VOBs using DVD Shrink, I was including the subtitle streams.  For some reason this caused the MKV building process to fail always right around the 520MB mark (it thought it succeeded but the MKV would be truncated).

I posted it back over in our original "Lossless Video" thread here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=39604.msg271816#msg271816

[robydago]

glynor,
I was happy... 'till I found out a stability problem, but that must be related do DirectShow 'cause MPC provided with CCCP has the same probelms:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=39872.msg271800#msg271800